This is last week's video for your viewing enjoyment. I'll try to share these each week.
https://youtu.be/H5G5s31_75s?si=ZjemPQRVloergsQR
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This is last week's video for your viewing enjoyment. I'll try to share these each week.
https://youtu.be/H5G5s31_75s?si=ZjemPQRVloergsQR
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Hell yes! I know what I'm doing over lunch at work today..... These are always so good.
Thanks, Indy, for doing this! This is a great watch. I look forward to more of them! Thanks for trying to keep us at least quasi-smart about things official!Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
The game is much less frustrating if you know the rules. Or at least know if you don't. I watch other sports and realize I don't understand their rules as well as I should. So i assume they are right and don't worry about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeBeach
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Indy...got a question for you. So the last play of the video on field goals. It was said the ball has to go through the uprights before touching an opposing player or the ground. I get the ground...but if the opposition touches the ball but it still goes off that player and makes it through the uprights, it isn't good? Just doesn't seem right...if it was just the player, that doesn't feel like a block. I know in the video it was the ground and player...just thinking if it was only the player.
The video said "kicking team player." If the ball is tipped by a defensive player and goes through, it's still good.Quote:
Originally Posted by TransAmBison
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Wait. So you’re telling me that when I scream ‘over the back’ until I’m blue in the face at my 10 year-old’s basketball game I’m not providing a public service?Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
I realized about 10 years ago how completely skewed and misinformed my understanding of basketball rules were due to the incorrect language constantly used to describe fouls by the media and play by play guys of the past.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU_grad
*Sent from my iPhone where autocorrect is definitely not my friend*
I don't expect announcers to be rules experts, but they are the #1 reason most fans (and many players and coaches) don't understand the rules correctly. I use over the back and reaching in as examples all the time when showing how fans base their rules knowledge on the wrong sources. That was the biggest thing I learned quickly when I started learning rules. Having rules analysts helps, but many people choose to dismiss those comments as "covering for the officials" if they disagree with the call or use it as evidence the officials must be terrible if they aren't perfect.Quote:
Originally Posted by TAILG8R
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Hahaha...I'm stupid. :rofl: Missed that little bit...makes much more sense now.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
I do like the additions of the rules experts and think that has been a positive addition to major college and NFL calls. I've seen those guys point out directly when they think the official is wrong or don't agree with the call!Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
And even those "rules analysts" or "experts" can have an outdated or incorrect interpretation or understanding. Sport other than football, but there's one "rules expert" out there on a major network who is a retired official and it's painfully obvious that he quit staying current after his retirement and routinely provides incorrect information that's 5-10 years outdated and incorrect.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
SDSU is going to run out of timeouts by the end of the 1st quarterQuote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
There is a football guy who must have left jaded. Many of his comments are very critical of the officials, and some of his philosophies are counter to what is true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bisonguy
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Week 1 video. I haven't watched this version yet. There is a training version for us that often has a lot of the same plays.
https://youtu.be/yecgrxRd37k?si=uwjnmTMpawb_MXtf
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Man, great stuff as always. Really appreciated the kickoff sideline stuff. Also interesting on the screen pass that the 3 yard cusion if from when the QB throws. Is there anything different in rules if the pass is caught behind the LOS?Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
If the pass is caught behind the LOS then linemen can be way downfield, receivers can block downfield, etc. That's often why we have to huddle after plays or have late flags. One official may know the lineman was 5 yards downfield when the pass was released, but he has no idea where the pass was first touched. Another official knows where the pass is touched. They get together to share that information and determine if there is a foul.Quote:
Originally Posted by THEsocalledfan
Sometimes the first official will ask the second where the pass was touched, and the response is "shit, I don't remember." If nobody knows you aren't going to guess and flag it. You just have to take the downgrade if you are wrong. In most cases, the downgrade is bigger if you flag something the grader feels isn't a foul than if you don't flag something the grader feels should have been called.
More often than not, if I see something that may have been a foul, but I pass on it, I'm exonerated when I watch the video. That's why I generally err on the side of not flagging something unless I'm 100% certain. This is what it supervisors and graders want as well. Fewer flags are better for everyone involved in the game.
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Indy, regarding the expanded neutral zone and the screen pass; the pass must be caught behind the LOS, correct? There is no "cushion" like catching the pass in the expanded NZ.....2 yds in HS football.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
The rules are very similar. The ENZ in these plays only exists for the linemen. In both cases, the ball has to be caught in or behind the NZ. The difference is 2 yards in HS and 3 yards in NCAA. And we have to use touching and not the spot of the catch because touching could be a tipped pass by either the offense or defense. In NCAA by philosophy, if the play was an apparent screen pass thrown to a back who is behind the NZ, but the pass is overthrown and falls incomplete, then disregard the IDP foul. Same if the passer throws the ball away outside the tackle box and beyond the NZ. The offense gains no advantage in either case so let them live with the down and no yardage.Quote:
Originally Posted by southcliffbison
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Thank you. Also one other point: On a scrimmage kick where the ball has crossed the NZ and has come to rest beyond the NZ (no touching by K or R), when should the BJ blow the ball dead? I'm asking if a BJ should blow it dead after a second or two (it has stopped rolling) or wait for some dickhead R team member to pick it up and start running?
They'll blow it dead after a second or two of the ball stopping if nobody is going to touch it. Kicking teams will often try to sit there for a long time with nobody trying to recover. The intent is to burn more time which we won't allow.Quote:
Originally Posted by southcliffbison
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Here's a weird part from my college game Saturday. Visitors score with 1 minute left but miss the extra point to still trail 7-6. They live up for an obvious onside kick. They try to dribble one to the right that only goes about 4 years before it starts spinning and going backward. It came to rest on the 33 yard line where a kicking team player picks it up. They lost 2 yards on an onside kick.
In my high school game Friday night, the home team kicked a 44-yard FG that would have been good from 55. When I came out after halftime, the kicking coach was with the kicker warming up. I asked him if he taught the kicker everything he knows. If he did, the kid will be great. The coach was a former SDSU kicker who had some success in the NFL.
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Oh, I think we know who that kicker is. He was pretty darn good! SDSU has a dumpster fire at placekicker right now.....they could use him.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
I'm seeing a lot of shorter pants and/or no knee pads this year. Has there been a rule change, or just a new fashion trend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeBeach
It's not a fashion trend in HS football; it's all college and professional football. In HS, you pull the pant leg down far enough to cover the knee cap (plus you need a pad to cover the knee cap); or you don't get to play. You don't return to play until the problem is rectified. Coaches know this covering the knee cap business was a Point of Emphasis this fall.
The rule hasn't changed in college either. They are supposed to enforce it, but in general, the conferences don't want the officials to be fashion police. You don't see it in the NFL either because they fine players for equipment violations. I wonder if we'll start seeing that at the FBS level now that they are getting paid. We can enforce it better at the D3/NAIA level, but we try to work with them as much as possible. For example, I had a player Saturday who had his one brace on the outside of his pants. It was late second quarter, and he had probably played the entire half that way. I told him to take care of it at halftime. I completely forgot to check him in the second half and didn't think of it until I got home. I just checked the video, and he fixed it. I hate being the fashion police.Quote:
Originally Posted by southcliffbison
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You guys have been avoiding this issue for 3 years with the same excuse. You dont want to be the fashion police. If you would have enforced the rules from the get go we wouldnt see this problem now.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
The uniform rules have existed for decades. They are addressed at some level every year, but players come up with new things every year as well. The latest is the second dangling moth piece. There is nothing practical about it, but players seem to think it looks cool. We are supposed to have them correct the issue. If they can do it without leaving, great. If not, we are supposed to send them out until they correct it.Quote:
Originally Posted by 56BISON73
What if it's 3rd and 3 at +30 and Cole Payton's pants have ridden up so the knee isn't covered. You really want the officials to send him out for a play? Nobody wants to see that on an Alabama Georgia game either. Another dumb example is player towels are required to be white only. Nobody wants us sending out a player with a green towel. I tell the player to correct it the next time he comes out but I'm not going to make that my focus when he reforms fit the next series. I have 100 more important things to worry about.
The uniform rules are largely just about appearance. The NFL addresses it with fines for the players, so it's largely a non-issue there. That's the only way we are going to get it addressed at the FBS/P4 level. We have fewer issues at the small college level and those games aren't governed by the number of eyeballs watching the game. Trust me, you don't want us getting nit picky on uniform rules. The game would be annoying and unwatchable.
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The new rules body is out. Our training video often has many of the same plays. This week's training video includes a play from the SDSU MSU game, so I was hoping it would appear here. Late in the game MSU had 12 players on defense. As the play clock ran down, SDSU had to call time out. In that situation, the foul for illegal substitution was correctly called and SDSU retained their time out.
https://youtu.be/eT0pDKG6Egw
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No comments from last week. I guess people are getting bored with these. For those still watching, here is this week's version. Some good rules examples here.
https://youtu.be/0lQbNGD6tHE?si=6yL2LjGHyO3dbCd6
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Not bored at all, Indy! Thank you for posting them. They're informative. I'm just quiet. LolQuote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
I work with an official and I generally have calls I send him from bison games and get his opinion. So I always watch these. Matter of fact I just watch this one with him.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
I likewise like these videos. Keep it up!
Keep these coming, Indy. They are much appreciated.
Love seeing this stuff. Its amazing how you guys keep all of this straight in the middle of the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
That's different than players who wear pants that look like bike shorts that don't reach anywhere near the knees.
https://platform.sbnation.com/wp-con...00%2C100&w=750
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
Lots of hours of video review, study groups, crew meetings, quizzes, etc. Even harder when you do high school and college and have to keep the differences separate. But I love it. I probably spend 20-30 hours each week working on football stuff. This week, i have a high school game tonight, a college game tomorrow in Louisville, and a college JV game Monday night. Next week is a high school/college varsity/college JV game combination over 3 days. That's 6 games in 10 days. As the referee in 5 of them, I have to reach out to the athletic director and/or head coach to arrange for logistics of arrival, pre-game schedule, special activities, etc. And then communicate those plans with the rest of the crew. We arrive 2 hours before the high school games and 2.5-3 hours before the college games. My Saturdays are often 12 hour days from when I leave to when I get home. For 200-$300. That doesn't include all the prep work in the week leading up to the game. But I love doing it.Quote:
Originally Posted by 56BISON73
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Thank you for doing this. It's becoming hard to find new refs.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
Is it realistic to expect an FBS opportunity & put a 7x in front of those numbers?
I'll never with an FBS game on the field. Replay is a possibilityif I ever decide to go that route. It's hard to find and retain new HS officials. Advancing in college is still very competitive. It's hard to get to the FCS and FBS level. They aren't hurting at all for qualified officials. Many of the guys I work D3 with editor be very capable of working those games, but they have to be hired by a D2 conference first, work at least a couple years there (often more), and then get a break to get into FCS. The MVFC, MAC, and B1G have a consortium where you get hired until that group and then move up. Many end up staying in the MVFC or MAC. Age and fitness have a lot to do with it. Many of the officials you saw at Bison games a few years ago are now in the B1G or NFL now.Quote:
Originally Posted by NI4NI
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Just catching up. I so love players hot dogging going into enzones being featured when they fumble. I was surprised they included it since a pretty straight forward call, but I glad such a non-team thing to do was featured.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison