Bison Fatigue

[Bisonator98]

Yeah the Sunbelt and MAC are so daunting. I mean everyone of those schools would go undefeated and be FCS champs if they played in FCS.

[heffray]

This is correct.

Defend staying in FCS- there are many reasons to stay. but "better competition in the FCS" is bat shit insane

Again, no one is saying we have better competition in the FCS than G5. I am saying that its not that big of a step up in competition, and even if it were, it doesn't really get us anywhere in terms of national exposure or better recruiting.

[MankatoBison]

Again, no one is saying we have better competition in the FCS than G5. I am saying that its not that big of a step up in competition, and even if it were, it doesn't really get us anywhere in terms of national exposure or better recruiting.

All available evidence says recruiting would improve dramatically. Unless of course you believe that we wont have success at the "next level". Believe me, I think we do a hell of a job recruiting here, but to say that even moderately successful G5 programs dont have better recruiting classes than us is delusional. But I agree- if we assume that we will suck at the next level, our current recruiting classes are probably better.

There is a legit argument to be made about exposure. Our current exposure is BONKERS. It would be tough to get MORE exposure at G5. But it all comes down to how good do you think we would be at G5? If we suck- we will absolutely, no doubt about it, get LESS exposure and it will hurt badly. But if we win 10-12 games a year, this would assume that we are getting into Fiesta or cotton bowl games every 2-4 years, and playing and presumably beating a P5 team or two every year or so- and I cant imagine ESPN will be like "nah, this would be cooler they were playing Colgate".

The exposure question is fascinating. That is a legitimate concern of jumping. Maybe its oversimplifying it, but I really do believe it comes down to "how competitive do you think we'll be?". If we're good, I think it increases. If we are just above average, or worse, Its a mistake, IMO

[heffray]

All available evidence says recruiting would improve dramatically. Unless of course you believe that we wont have success at the "next level". Believe me, I think we do a hell of a job recruiting here, but to say that even moderately successful G5 programs dont have better recruiting classes than us is delusional. But I agree- if we assume that we will suck at the next level, our current recruiting classes are probably better.

There is a legit argument to be made about exposure. Our current exposure is BONKERS. It would be tough to get MORE exposure at G5. But it all comes down to how good do you think we would be at G5? If we suck- we will absolutely, no doubt about it, get LESS exposure and it will hurt badly. But if we win 10-12 games a year, this would assume that we are getting into Fiesta or cotton bowl games every 2-4 years, and playing and presumably beating a P5 team or two every year or so- and I cant imagine ESPN will be like "nah, this would be cooler they were playing Colgate".

The exposure question is fascinating. That is a legitimate concern of jumping. Maybe its oversimplifying it, but I really do believe it comes down to "how competitive do you think we'll be?". If we're good, I think it increases. If we are just above average, or worse, Its a mistake, IMO

I don’t know if the recruiting question is a slam dunk either. I’m no expert, but the group of guys we go after either changes or it doesn’t. If it doesn’t, then no step up. If it does, then we run into more battles with area schools like U of Mn or Iowa, etc... I don’t think we win many of those battles now, and I don’t think that changes much if we’re G5.

I think you might be right about exposure, but I think the line to maintain our current level of exposure is much higher than double-digit win seasons. I think we would need to dominate our conference every year, go undefeated or only allow a single loss, and have a very difficult non-Con schedule (and win all those games, too) to continue the level of exposure we have now. Look at Boise State. They did this for a few years and were in the National title conversation a few times, I think... but in the last decade they have really fizzled out. I barely think of them anymore.

I think the bar to remain nationally relevant is much much higher in a G5 conference than it is in the unique position NDSU has right now. This is just my opinion and I’m open to having my mind changed.

[MankatoBison]

I don’t know if the recruiting question is a slam dunk either. I’m no expert, but the group of guys we go after either changes or it doesn’t. If it doesn’t, then no step up. If it does, then we run into more battles with area schools like U of Mn or Iowa, etc... I don’t think we win many of those battles now, and I don’t think that changes much if we’re G5.

I think you might be right about exposure, but I think the line to maintain our current level of exposure is much higher than double-digit win seasons. I think we would need to dominate our conference every year, go undefeated or only allow a single loss, and have a very difficult non-Con schedule (and win all those games, too) to continue the level of exposure we have now. Look at Boise State. They did this for a few years and were in the National title conversation a few times, I think... but in the last decade they have really fizzled out. I barely think of them anymore.

I think the bar to remain nationally relevant is much much higher in a G5 conference than it is in the unique position NDSU has right now. This is just my opinion and I’m open to having my mind changed.

Damn. I appreciate this post so much. I would say we are at lest 80% in agreement, probably more. Good, good comment in the recruiting spot- there are unique challenges that legitimately may to too difficult to meet. I'm just going off the the "star ratings" 247, and scout etc. According to them (and we all know who would win on the field), virtually every FBS school has "better" recruiting classes than us. If we were to go by the same standards, there is no way we are a bottom 10 recruiting class in the FBS if we wer G5. That's what I was suggesting

[El_Chapo]

if NDSU is FBS we scoop the top 3-4 recruits at UNI SDSU usd, etc and bite into many many more Minn/Iowa/Wisc lower end recruits

[Scooter1]

if NDSU is FBS we scoop the top 3-4 recruits at UNI SDSU usd, etc and bite into many many more Minn/Iowa/Wisc lower end recruits

Serious question...
If NDSU goes FBS, why would they be concerned about scooping the top regional FCS recruits or lower end MN, Iowa or Wisconsin recruits?

[El_Chapo]

Serious question...
If NDSU goes FBS, why would they be concerned about scooping the top regional FCS recruits or lower end MN, Iowa or Wisconsin recruits?

to continue dominating this 5 state Region in addition to reaching new recruiting areas.

[heffray]

Damn. I appreciate this post so much. I would say we are at lest 80% in agreement, probably more. Good, good comment in the recruiting spot- there are unique challenges that legitimately may to too difficult to meet. I'm just going off the the "star ratings" 247, and scout etc. According to them (and we all know who would win on the field), virtually every FBS school has "better" recruiting classes than us. If we were to go by the same standards, there is no way we are a bottom 10 recruiting class in the FBS if we wer G5. That's what I was suggesting

...which basically renders that rating system moot, I guess... again, uniquely as it pertains to NDSU.

[heffray]

Serious question...
If NDSU goes FBS, why would they be concerned about scooping the top regional FCS recruits or lower end MN, Iowa or Wisconsin recruits?

I don’t think they would or should change much in a G5 conference, therefore I don’t think there is much concern there. I don’t totally disagree with Lakes, but I don’t think much would change except for a few guys committing to FCS coming to NDSU instead. That, my friends, is almost impossible to predict or prove. Literally all we have here are opinions.