Question for Indy on the Fargodome play clock issue that hurt JMU

[IndyBison]

I think that's when I saw Entz trying to take a timeout and when he finally got there attention they saw the zero and just through the flag instead of giving the timeout. The refs and all the fans were just in shock that he actually called the timeout. Took him 3 tries to form a T. I'm sure it was frustration I saw and not actually a grown man not knowing the timeout sign.

If a coach calls a timeout anywhere near a potential delay he's going to get the timeout. The guy granting the time out is going to be the R or L on the Bison sideline and the guy flagging the DOG is the back judge on the end line. Neither of them know the sequence of the flag or time out request so that's why they usually get the time out. Why would the refs be shocked he called a time out? They are often called when the play clock is about to expire. They are likely looking toward the sideline expecting it when nobody is at the line of scrimmage.

If he's doing that with 6 seconds he's easily going to get the time out. Everything I've seen and heard makes it likely they all expected a play clock reset and had no idea why it wasn't getting reset. That's what it appears he's screaming about after the play. Pure speculation on my part.

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[CAS4127]

If a coach calls a timeout anywhere near a potential delay he's going to get the timeout. The guy granting the time out is going to be the R or L on the Bison sideline and the guy flagging the DOG is the back judge on the end line. Neither of them know the sequence of the flag or time out request so that's why they usually get the time out. Why would the refs be shocked he called a time out? They are often called when the play clock is about to expire. They are likely looking toward the sideline expecting it when nobody is at the line of scrimmage.

If he's doing that with 6 seconds he's easily going to get the time out. Everything I've seen and heard makes it likely they all expected a play clock reset and had no idea why it wasn't getting reset. That's what it appears he's screaming about after the play. Pure speculation on my part.

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Alternatively—>the refs fucked up and were completely out of their league for this game. It happens, and this game is EXHIBIT A!

Lakes apparently called an “ugly game” on the JMU board, and he was correct. I struggled with the win and the kind of game it was, but, reflecting, it was an ugly game, and in large part because of how terrible the refs were.

[BigHorns]

Alternatively—>the refs fucked up and were completely out of their league for this game. It happens, and this game is EXHIBIT A!

Lakes apparently called an “ugly game” on the JMU board, and he was correct. I struggled with the win and the kind of game it was, but, reflecting, it was an ugly game, and in large part because of how terrible the refs were.

Do we know what conference the refs came from this game? Have a feeling we'll see Southland ones in Frisco since SLC officially hosts it and you have Big Sky vs MVFC teams.

[IndyBison]

Correct on Southland but it has nothing to do with who is hosting. Crews are assigned from various conferences the first 3 weeks and observed and graded. The semifinal and final crews were assigned after the Quarterfinal round based on those ratings and remaining teams. MVFC, CAA and Big Sky crews were not eligible because they had teams remaining. The MVFC has not had a crew work the championship in at least 11 seasons because they have had a team in the championship game every year the other 11 seasons. There is a very good chance the next time a MVFC team is not in the semifinal their crew will be assigned a championship game.

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[CoachFSCB]

The non call on a JMU delay of game was because the operator didn't reset the play clock from the prior play. As you can see on this clip, look at the play clock. On the 3rd and 1, JMU snapped the ball with approximately :23 left on the play clock. After the first down, the clock should have reset to :40, but it paused at :22, and then began counting down from :22 instead of 40 seconds. The play clock ran down to :00 and stayed there for a full three seconds before the ball was snapped and the play was run. So, even though the play clock expired and sat at :00 for a full three seconds, actually JMU got the play off in about 25 seconds total from the end of the previous play, so ultimately they really didn't deserve to get hit with a delay of game penalty. I have absolutely no idea why the back judge in charge of throwing a flag for delay of game didn't do so -- if his job is to look at the play clock and then if it is zero look at the center to see if the ball is snapped and if not, call a penalty -- why didn't he? The ball certainly had not been snapped at :00. Very bizarre officiating.

https://youtu.be/NFDtEeXqJ_o?t=5738

[IndyBison]

The non call on a JMU delay of game was because the operator didn't reset the play clock from the prior play. As you can see on this clip, look at the play clock. On the 3rd and 1, JMU snapped the ball with approximately :23 left on the play clock. After the first down, the clock should have reset to :40, but it paused at :22, and then began counting down from :22 instead of 40 seconds. The play clock ran down to :00 and stayed there for a full four seconds before the ball was snapped and the play was run. So, even though the play clock expired and sat at :00 for a full four seconds, actually JMU got the play off in about 26 seconds total from the end of the previous play. I have absolutely no idea why the back judge in charge of throwing a flag for delay of game didn't do so -- if his job is to look at the play clock and then if it is zero look at the center to see if the ball is snapped and if not, call a penalty -- why didn't he? The ball certainly had not been snapped at :00. Very bizarre officiating.

https://youtu.be/NFDtEeXqJ_o?t=5738

Great find! The BJ should have stopped the play during the dead ball since the play clock wasn't reset (assuming the one on the screen was synced with the stadium play clock). But he may have just gotten on the O2O and told the crew to ignore the visible play clock since it wasn't accurate. I timed it at 29 seconds but either way it was well below 40. He would have never gotten to a visible signal for the QB. It's also possible they didn't stop to reset it because it was obvious JMU was going quick enough for it to not become an issue. This could be a mechanics downgrade for the BJ, but there were no rule issues on the play.

[IndyBison]

I found the press conference and Coach Entz was asked about this play. The only issues he mentioned were the placement of the ball and pumping the play clock. If he asked for the ball to be moved I assume it happened after the play clock was at already at 25. And if he expected the play clock to be pumped he probably didn't realize or remember the standard 40 second play clock was used in that case. He said nothing about requesting a time out. If the requested a different hash location before the play clock hit 25 he has a valid complaint. But it appears the ball was likely placed with no delay so there was no reason to reset the play clock.

[Gully]

Correct on Southland but it has nothing to do with who is hosting. Crews are assigned from various conferences the first 3 weeks and observed and graded. The semifinal and final crews were assigned after the Quarterfinal round based on those ratings and remaining teams. MVFC, CAA and Big Sky crews were not eligible because they had teams remaining. The MVFC has not had a crew work the championship in at least 11 seasons because they have had a team in the championship game every year the other 11 seasons. There is a very good chance the next time a MVFC team is not in the semifinal their crew will be assigned a championship game.

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so probably never

[Bisonator98]

I found the press conference and Coach Entz was asked about this play. The only issues he mentioned were the placement of the ball and pumping the play clock. If he asked for the ball to be moved I assume it happened after the play clock was at already at 25. And if he expected the play clock to be pumped he probably didn't realize or remember the standard 40 second play clock was used in that case. He said nothing about requesting a time out. If the requested a different hash location before the play clock hit 25 he has a valid complaint. But it appears the ball was likely placed with no delay so there was no reason to reset the play clock.

So they can't move the ball under 25 seconds on the play clock? Was a really weird sequence and appeared Entz was quite pissed at one of the assistants on the sideline for something.

[gavin2126]

Another question for Indy. I saw on AGS where they were talking about this play SDSU ran at the end of the Sac State game:

https://media.giphy.com/media/aeCu0y...ized-large.gif

And I found this post:

Chris put his hands under center. That instantly means he is the only one allowed to take the snap - long been the rule. He wouldn't even be able to go back into gun without a full audible to take the snap. Once your hands are under center you're locked there for taking the snap

Peyton (Manning) always made sure, and there is well known footage of it, to tell the refs to "Make sure to watch my hands"

I had never heard the rule about the QB being the only one allowed to take a snap once his hands are under center, is that accurate?