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Thread: Fargodome officially getting new turf

  1. #91
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    Default Re: Fargodome officially getting new turf

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyBison View Post
    Probably too wordy and most people skip it when they see how long it is. I'm fine if they skip it or dismiss it. But those who read it will hopefully take something away from it. It may seem like the officials who work the games just show up, make some calls and go home, but there is so much more to it. Especially at the level where the Bison play. Most college officials especially treat this as an avocation rather than a hobby and they have more passion for doing this well than their full paying job.

    I was at a college study group meeting this week where we spent an hour with about 30 officials reviewing a variety of plays from D3 games. There were some great discussions about forward progress on a potential fumble, false start on a fake handoff before the ball was snapped (that was strange!), and legally consuming time at the end of a game by running around before taking a knee. The discussion was lead by a D1 referee many of you would recognize. He didn't have to spend his evening doing that but he did because he wants officials at all levels to be the best they can be. Then we went to the bar and watched a MACtion game making fun of our friends who were working the game. That was the fun part.
    Engineers have a similar tradition.

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    Default Re: Fargodome officially getting new turf

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyBison View Post
    Probably too wordy and most people skip it when they see how long it is. I'm fine if they skip it or dismiss it. But those who read it will hopefully take something away from it. It may seem like the officials who work the games just show up, make some calls and go home, but there is so much more to it. Especially at the level where the Bison play. Most college officials especially treat this as an avocation rather than a hobby and they have more passion for doing this well than their full paying job.

    I was at a college study group meeting this week where we spent an hour with about 30 officials reviewing a variety of plays from D3 games. There were some great discussions about forward progress on a potential fumble, false start on a fake handoff before the ball was snapped (that was strange!), and legally consuming time at the end of a game by running around before taking a knee. The discussion was lead by a D1 referee many of you would recognize. He didn't have to spend his evening doing that but he did because he wants officials at all levels to be the best they can be. Then we went to the bar and watched a MACtion game making fun of our friends who were working the game. That was the fun part.
    Those of us on this board who officiate football appreciate your takes on various officiating topics. In South Dakota, we lost a football officiating legend in Buck Timmons last year due to covid. After he retired from officiating, he became the supervisor for basketball and football officials for the SDHSAA.......he is missed. One other thing, the Minnesota state high school league had the umpires on football crews behind the offense across from the referee. It's a one year thing and umpires will be surveyed at the end of the season for their thoughts. The reason/ purpose was to prevent injury caused by on rushing linemen or crashing linebackers. I worked 3 times behind the offense as an umpire and I didn't feel comfortable or confident back there.......did feel safer though, Do know of other states that are doing similar experimentations like this?
    Last edited by southcliffbison; 11-04-2021 at 10:46 PM.

  3. #93
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    Default Re: Fargodome officially getting new turf

    Quote Originally Posted by southcliffbison View Post
    Those of us on this board who officiate football appreciate your takes on various officiating topics. In South Dakota, we lost a football officiating legend in Buck Timmons last year due to covid. After he retired from officiating, he became the supervisor for basketball and football officials for the SDHSAA.......he is missed. One other thing, the Minnesota state high school league had the umpires on football crews behind the offense across from the referee. It's a one year thing and umpires will be surveyed at the end of the season for their thoughts. The reason/ purpose was to prevent injury caused by on rushing linemen or crashing linebackers. I worked 3 times behind the offense as as umpire and I didn't feel comfortable or confident back there.......did feel safer though, Do know of other states that are doing similar experimentations like this?
    There are a couple plus sometimes local associations will do it as well. The Big Sky has done it for a few years with 7-man crews. I'm curious to see if it sticks and gets expanded. I personally think there are pros and cons to it, but ultimately what you gain being back there does make up for what you lose being on the other side. Plus you need to be in a lot better shape doing it. I've done CJ for some D1 college scrimmages and I really like the view and feel much safer back there, but I had an umpire to help on the stuff over the middle. You see any holds so much better especially since you can now see better what's happening with the hands. I am also able to see things like hands to the face much better. I miss that from the other side because I'm so focused on the feet/hands. For some reason I see things higher form the offensive side. Maybe it's because you are further back.

    The cons are you lose a lot of your ability to help manage the stuff after the play. You are further away, especially on those 5-10 yard gains. I get a lot done with the defense talking to them before the snap. Things like ineligible linemen downfield gets much harder since the wings are solely responsible for that. They have enough to do on those plays. Those quick passes over the middle now also don't have an inside out view.

    I have a good friend who is a referee in SW Minnesota (he does some Iowa and SD games too). He hates it and says none of the officials in his area like it. I would love to try it for a couple games to see how I like it. I got drilled twice in the first half of my game Friday night (Vinatieri said he saw one of them and we also had an NFL official there watching his daughter on the dance team). The offense ran a very good triple option so you never had any idea where the ball was. On the first one the QB faked the handoff and rolled right but cut up the middle quickly and suddenly appeared out of the pile. I tried to get to my left as he was running to my right but one of the pursuing defenders hit my shoulder. The runner scored on the play. The other was a well sold draw. The interior line took 2-3 steps back for a pass read. I'm moving toward the line of scrimmage like we are supposed to when the QB gave the ball to the RB on a delayed draw up the middle. I side stepped to my left and two defenders drilled me trying to get to the runner. I was in the middle of everything and had no place to go. My "block" sprung him for a 20-yard gain and the coach was pissed. I still felt that one the next morning. At that point I was voting to get moved to the other side.

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    Default Re: Fargodome officially getting new turf

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyBison View Post
    There are a couple plus sometimes local associations will do it as well. The Big Sky has done it for a few years with 7-man crews. I'm curious to see if it sticks and gets expanded. I personally think there are pros and cons to it, but ultimately what you gain being back there does make up for what you lose being on the other side. Plus you need to be in a lot better shape doing it. I've done CJ for some D1 college scrimmages and I really like the view and feel much safer back there, but I had an umpire to help on the stuff over the middle. You see any holds so much better especially since you can now see better what's happening with the hands. I am also able to see things like hands to the face much better. I miss that from the other side because I'm so focused on the feet/hands. For some reason I see things higher form the offensive side. Maybe it's because you are further back.

    The cons are you lose a lot of your ability to help manage the stuff after the play. You are further away, especially on those 5-10 yard gains. I get a lot done with the defense talking to them before the snap. Things like ineligible linemen downfield gets much harder since the wings are solely responsible for that. They have enough to do on those plays. Those quick passes over the middle now also don't have an inside out view.

    I have a good friend who is a referee in SW Minnesota (he does some Iowa and SD games too). He hates it and says none of the officials in his area like it. I would love to try it for a couple games to see how I like it. I got drilled twice in the first half of my game Friday night (Vinatieri said he saw one of them and we also had an NFL official there watching his daughter on the dance team). The offense ran a very good triple option so you never had any idea where the ball was. On the first one the QB faked the handoff and rolled right but cut up the middle quickly and suddenly appeared out of the pile. I tried to get to my left as he was running to my right but one of the pursuing defenders hit my shoulder. The runner scored on the play. The other was a well sold draw. The interior line took 2-3 steps back for a pass read. I'm moving toward the line of scrimmage like we are supposed to when the QB gave the ball to the RB on a delayed draw up the middle. I side stepped to my left and two defenders drilled me trying to get to the runner. I was in the middle of everything and had no place to go. My "block" sprung him for a 20-yard gain and the coach was pissed. I still felt that one the next morning. At that point I was voting to get moved to the other side.
    I only got wiped out as an umpire behind the defense once this season; and it was in a JV game to boot !!!! What really helps out umpires behind the offense on those 5 to 10 yard runs is a very active young backjudge who knows his keys and CAN RUN !!! Did I mention "can run"? Unfortunately, what we are seeing are over-weight, middle-age men who are quite content to spend the game 40 yards back from the line of scrimmage in the middle of the field; and who only come close to the LOS during TO's and ends of quarters. Having youngsters as back judges is a real blessing and I thank them profusely for their efforts. End of rant.

  5. #95
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    Default Re: Fargodome officially getting new turf

    Quote Originally Posted by southcliffbison View Post
    I only got wiped out as an umpire behind the defense once this season; and it was in a JV game to boot !!!! What really helps out umpires behind the offense on those 5 to 10 yard runs is a very active young backjudge who knows his keys and CAN RUN !!! Did I mention "can run"? Unfortunately, what we are seeing are over-weight, middle-age men who are quite content to spend the game 40 yards back from the line of scrimmage in the middle of the field; and who only come close to the LOS during TO's and ends of quarters. Having youngsters as back judges is a real blessing and I thank them profusely for their efforts. End of rant.
    I wouldn't want the back judge coming up to get those spots. He's better staying back to mind the store from that side. It's best to keep the players boxed in. If the I goes in you still have the R to stay back.

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