Brock Robbins

[Vet70]

Agreed. Also, whoever was the 'someone inside the NDSU organization' - if there was a someone - should be held accountable too. A student athlete - whether unwitting or not when he took whatever substance is involved - is paying a big price, is being held accountable. Don't wish for NDSU to end up looking bad in all this if it turns out there was a 'someone', but if fairness is a higher value than protecting NDSU, then it is important that the 'someone' be held accountable just as Brock is.

If that 'someone' is a student-athlete as ML contends any accountability cannot be revealed because of the Family Education Rights and Privacy Act.

[Professor Chaos]

Uh, no.

It's not the job of the NCAA to put in guidelines, when the FDA doesn't.

People need to stop putting sh#t in their bodies.

On the contrary, I'm really good at getting shit out of my body. I've made some epic shits in my time.

[yopaulie]

On the contrary, I'm really good at getting shit out of my body. I've made some epic shits in my time.

Good to know...

#friendorenema
#enemaofthestate

[StL Bison Fan]

On the contrary, I'm really good at getting shit out of my body. I've made some epic shits in my time.

Too. Much. Info.

[Hammersmith]

Ultimately, yes. But if someone inside the NDSU organization provided a substance that caused a member of the team to test positive, then I certainly think that is an issue that needs attention. The NDSU athletic department needs to put safeguards into place to make sure this never is allowed to happen again.

I would say it depends on if caffeine was the substance or not. If it was caffeine, and if properly using the supplement doesn't result in a positive test, then I don't think this is as big an issue as you're suggesting. Otherwise you need to bar the doors to the Coke/Pepsi distributor and kick out anyone who brings in a bag of Folgers. I would suggest this is more akin to handing Tylenol to someone. Give them 2, and you're helping them with aches and pains; give them 20, and you're killing their liver. But just because overuse can cause damage, it doesn't mean you throw them away; you just use them properly.

Now if there are studies showing 250mg levels of caffeine are detrimental to a person's health, then ban these types of supplements from the locker room for that reason. But don't do it just because overuse can cause a positive test.

[IzzyFlexion]

I would say it depends on if caffeine was the substance or not. If it was caffeine, and if properly using the supplement doesn't result in a positive test, then I don't think this is as big an issue as you're suggesting. Otherwise you need to bar the doors to the Coke/Pepsi distributor and kick out anyone who brings in a bag of Folgers. I would suggest this is more akin to handing Tylenol to someone. Give them 2, and you're helping them with aches and pains; give them 20, and you're killing their liver. But just because overuse can cause damage, it doesn't mean you throw them away; you just use them properly.

Now if there are studies showing 250mg levels of caffeine are detrimental to a person's health, then ban these types of supplements from the locker room for that reason. But don't do it just because overuse can cause a positive test.

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you (and I am quite certain that I've never done that before).

-If a supplement company declares that they "don't need it (caffeine)", then why in the heck are they adding it to their product?
Caffeine is an addictive stimulant. Addicted customers are repeat customers.

-Labeling their products with words such as "RECHARGE", "VICTORY", "FUEL".
These glittering generalities are very attractive to potential customers.

-Extra Strength Tylenol has a clear warning (an FDA recommendation) conspicuously found on their product containers speaking to the dangers of too much acetaminophen.
Labels on workout supplements don't warn NCAA athletes that too many servings may put them at risk. (to either fail a drug screen or be medically contraindicated)

Finally, (and this seems to be one the biggest concern of many on here) if supplements are being made readily available to student athletes by someone who stands to gain financially as a result of the use of said products...….well, that's a HUGE problem.

I don't think that workout supplements should be in any of the athletics buildings.

[Buffalo.Rider]

If that 'someone' is a student-athlete as ML contends any accountability cannot be revealed because of the Family Education Rights and Privacy Act.

Good point. It could be handled internally w/o revealing the person, if that is the case.

[Farmer63]

I would say it depends on if caffeine was the substance or not. If it was caffeine, and if properly using the supplement doesn't result in a positive test, then I don't think this is as big an issue as you're suggesting. Otherwise you need to bar the doors to the Coke/Pepsi distributor and kick out anyone who brings in a bag of Folgers. I would suggest this is more akin to handing Tylenol to someone. Give them 2, and you're helping them with aches and pains; give them 20, and you're killing their liver. But just because overuse can cause damage, it doesn't mean you throw them away; you just use them properly.

Now if there are studies showing 250mg levels of caffeine are detrimental to a person's health, then ban these types of supplements from the locker room for that reason. But don't do it just because overuse can cause a positive test.

Bottom line here is that NDSU lost a fantastic fullback in what should have been his senior (and likely best) season. We don't know from exactly what, and we don't know from exactly who... but we do know we lost him. And apparently due to a mistake in something he took or dosage he took. It's a problem we should not have had, and certainly should not have again. So I stand by my comment... "The NDSU athletic department needs to put safeguards into place to make sure this never is allowed to happen again".

We can't completely guard against an athlete taking a banned substance, but we certainly should be able to provide the proper direction to all our athletes so they can avoid making this kind of mistake again.

[Vet70]

Bottom line here is that NDSU lost a fantastic fullback in what should have been his senior (and likely best) season. We don't know from exactly what, and we don't know from exactly who... but we do know we lost him. And apparently due to a mistake in something he took or dosage he took. It's a problem we should not have had, and certainly should not have again. So I stand by my comment... "The NDSU athletic department needs to put safeguards into place to make sure this never is allowed to happen again".

We can't completely guard against an athlete taking a banned substance, but we certainly should be able to provide the proper direction to all our athletes so they can avoid making this kind of mistake again.

These statements strike me as being contradictory. There are no safeguards that will absolutely guarantee this never happens again. All the proper information and direction in the world can be given, but there will be young men who make young men mistakes.

[Farmer63]

These statements strike me as being contradictory. In addition, there are no safeguards that will absolutely guarantee this never happens again. All the proper information and direction in the world can be given, but there will be young men who make young men mistakes.

My meaning was.... there is no way we can keep athletes from deliberately using controlled substances, or deliberately taking wrong dosages. But I don't believe that's what happened here. We had an athlete that believed what he was doing was within the rules, and it apparently wasn't. So whatever system to make sure that we are giving our athletes correct information needs to be put in place. NDSU can't ultimately control what the athlete uses, but certainly should have someone that can determine if a product might cause a problem.

I guess what it comes down to is... I simply don't think BR deliberately took something or dosed something that he thought was an issue. He believed that he was legal. NDSU should have a system in place to catch the problem and let him know he wasn't. If not, we could potentially run into this problem again.