Remarkable comments by Ryan Burns on recruiting versus the MAC

[THEsocalledfan]

http://scout.com/college/north-dakot...1317-107379439

Go to about 7:10 in. He says two MAC coaches tell him on why they offer so few kids in WI, MN, IA, ND, SD, and NE, paraphrasing, "We know that if NDSU offers them, we are not likely to get them, and we don't want to be embarrassed on the recruiting trial by an FCS school." (BTW, Ryan is by no means an NDSU rube; he certainly has business interested tied to the NDSU fan base, but he stays fairly objective, IMHO.)

I found the quote curious and a makes me skeptical even if they really believe what they told Ryan.

So.....
1. I know they get their butt kicked by NDSU on the trail, but is it really "embarrassing?" Does it really harm them severely when they lose out to NDSU? (I admit, I get how embarrassing it had to be to Bohl to lose the top kid in WYO, but that is a very different situation since MAC does not have flagship schools.)
2. Or is the truth it is more like recruiting against a P5 school than they want to admit.......is that what is "embarrassing." (ie, they are ceding ground much like NDSU would not bother working hard on a top tier recruit in MSP with a solid B1G offer)

Discuss; really interesting comments from Mr. Burns. I may be reading way too much into it.

[HerdBot]

1) most of the mac schools are pretty meh and we've never lost to one

2) our facilities / game day atmosphere is way better

3) Wednesday night ESPN games in front of a few thousand fans are terrible

4) we can offer full cost of attendance

5) in state tuition rates for the 3 states couples with full cost of attendance gives partial scholarships more bang for the buck

6) Tradition

[23Bison]

^^^^^ this

[abc123]

http://scout.com/college/north-dakot...1317-107379439

Go to about 7:10 in. He says two MAC coaches tell him on why they offer so few kids in WI, MN, IA, ND, SD, and NE, paraphrasing, "We know that if NDSU offers them, we are not likely to get them, and we don't want to be embarrassed on the recruiting trial by an FCS school." (BTW, Ryan is by no means an NDSU rube; he certainly has business interested tied to the NDSU fan base, but he stays fairly objective, IMHO.)

I found the quote curious and a makes me skeptical even if they really believe what they told Ryan.

So.....
1. I know they get their butt kicked by NDSU on the trail, but is it really "embarrassing?" Does it really harm them severely when they lose out to NDSU? (I admit, I get how embarrassing it had to be to Bohl to lose the top kid in WYO, but that is a very different situation since MAC does not have flagship schools.)
2. Or is the truth it is more like recruiting against a P5 school than they want to admit.......is that what is "embarrassing." (ie, they are ceding ground much like NDSU would not bother working hard on a top tier recruit in MSP with a solid B1G offer)

Discuss; really interesting comments from Mr. Burns. I may be reading way to much into it.

I think part of it is that those states aren't really in the MAC's footprint at all and instead they tend to look east and south because of the population density. Logically, why skip over Illinois, Michigan and Indiana, who are in the footprint and have a population base that is over 60% more than the states you named, if it isn't necessary? I would also guess the schools closest to those states (NIU) isn't one of the ones he talked with since they have 20+ players from their roster from the ones that were listed, mainly Wisconsin. Iowa is also an interesting inclusion as I don't think NDSU really hits there that hard, though I would guess UNI cleans up a lot of whatever Iowa and Iowa State don't take.

Not saying there isn't some truth to it and that these schools don't look out of the footprint for players (and missing on some very good ones when they don't), but I think they are fewer and far between, especially when your recruiting trips can be more efficient going into more heavily populated areas with more talent to choose from.

[THEsocalledfan]

1) most of the mac schools are pretty meh and we've never lost to one

2) our facilities / game day atmosphere is way better

3) Wednesday night ESPN games in front of a few thousand fans are terrible

4) we can offer full cost of attendance

5) in state tuition rates for the 3 states couples with full cost of attendance gives partial scholarships more bang for the buck

6) Tradition

Yes, which is exactly why I started this thread. Why would it be embarrassing unless they are embarrassed about all the things you mention? I'd bet they don't even realize how much of a slam it is on their own programs......

[tjbison]

I think part of it is that those states aren't really in the MAC's footprint at all and instead they tend to look east and south because of the population density. Logically, why skip over Illinois, Michigan and Indiana, who are in the footprint and have a population base that is over 60% more than the states you named, if it isn't necessary? I would also guess the schools closest to those states (NIU) isn't one of the ones he talked with since they have 20+ players from their roster from the ones that were listed, mainly Wisconsin. Iowa is also an interesting inclusion as I don't think NDSU really hits there that hard, though I would guess UNI cleans up a lot of whatever Iowa and Iowa State don't take.

Not saying there isn't some truth to it and that these schools don't look out of the footprint for players (and missing on some very good ones when they don't), but I think they are fewer and far between, especially when your recruiting trips can be more efficient going into more heavily populated areas with more talent to choose from.

you dont think we recruit Iowa?? LOL



just more annoying UND fan input

[abc123]

you dont think we recruit Iowa?? LOL



just more annoying UND fan input

I never said they didn't recruit it, I said it appears they don't really hit it hard. I think that's a fair assessment considering there are only two players on NDSU's roster from Iowa (Dunn and Godfrey). I guess the alternative that you're trying to present is that they do recruit it hard but if that is the case, they aren't getting commits to show for it. I don't think is the case and it would go against what was originally presented.

[tony]

Yes, which is exactly why I started this thread. Why would it be embarrassing unless they are embarrassed about all the things you mention? I'd bet they don't even realize how much of a slam it is on their own programs......

I heard the same comments and was kind of surprised too.

The MAC is spending a ton of money for the FBS label and trying to sell their brand as being at a much higher level than FCS. NDSU spanking them on the recruiting trail kind of ruins that message. So basically they're avoiding NDSU on the recruiting trail for the same reason that they've avoided scheduling NDSU for the last decade.

[THEsocalledfan]

I heard the same comments and was kind of surprised too.

The MAC is spending a ton of money for the FBS label and trying to sell their brand as being at a much higher level than FCS. NDSU spanking them on the recruiting trail kind of ruins that message. So basically they're avoiding NDSU on the recruiting trail for the same reason that they've avoided scheduling NDSU for the last decade.

BINGO. Pretty much echos my thoughts. The best part being, they are perpetuating the problem they have with NDSU's stature, to NDSU's benefit by helping make NDSU better!

[SDbison]

I am am all for NDSU moving up to FBS, but heaven forbid we ever consider joining the MAC.