Return Rule Question

[Hammersmith]

This is my same question? The player ran with the ball trying to get out of the endzone and was tackled which I thought resulted in a safety. If he takes a knee then fine.

If the player takes possession of the ball outside the end zone, then enters the end zone and is tackled, then it's a safety(unless the ball was caught inside the 5 and the momentum of the catch takes the player into the end zone). But if possession begins inside the end zone, then the outcome is a touchback no matter how much the player moves around inside the end zone. I think the only way it might become a safety is if the player takes possession within the end zone, then steps out of bounds beyond the goal line. I'm not sure if that would be a safety or a touchback.

Think of it like an interception in the end zone(both are changes of possession inside the end zone). Player runs around, gets tackled. Touchback, not safety. I believe a safety requires possession to be established in the field of play, followed by entry into the end zone. The muffed punt did not establish possession, it only created a live ball situation.

But I'm probably wrong about all the philosophy(but not the application).




edit: started post before indy's; yep, wrong about philosophy, right about application

[IndyBison]

If the player takes possession of the ball outside the end zone, then enters the end zone and is tackled, then it's a safety(unless the ball was caught inside the 5 and the momentum of the catch takes the player into the end zone). But if possession begins inside the end zone, then the outcome is a touchback no matter how much the player moves around inside the end zone. I think the only way it might become a safety is if the player takes possession within the end zone, then steps out of bounds beyond the goal line. I'm not sure if that would be a safety or a touchback.

Think of it like an interception in the end zone(both are changes of possession inside the end zone). Player runs around, gets tackled. Touchback, not safety. I believe a safety requires possession to be established in the field of play, followed by entry into the end zone. The muffed punt did not establish possession, it only created a live ball situation.

But I'm probably wrong about all the philosophy(but not the application).

edit: started post before indy's; yep, wrong about philosophy, right about application

Pretty good understanding and explanation though. You would make a good official! The muffed punt did not create a "live ball situation" either. Semantics and definitions are critical when discussing rules. I know what you meant though. The touching by the receiving team just means if the kicking team recovers it they will be awarded a new series.

[NDSUSR]

Refs are generally idiots. Thus the career path. Proof?

http://www.theacc.com/news/acc-announces-11-01-2015

GREENSBORO, N.C. – The Atlantic Coast Conference has announced the suspension of the on-field officiating crew as well as the replay official and communicator following the Miami at Duke game on Saturday, October 31.

The announcement follows the league’s weekly review of game footage, as well as reports and interviews with officials and administrators.

The series of errors during the final play of the game will result in the suspension of the entire crew for two ACC games.

The errors that occurred during the last play of the game are:

The replay official erred in not overturning the ruling on the field that the Miami player had released the ball prior to his knee being down. If called, this would have ended the game.
The on-field officials erred by failing to penalize Miami for an illegal block in the back at the Miami 16-yard line. If called, the ball would have been placed at the Miami 8-yard line and the game would have been extended for an untimed down.
A block in the back foul was called at the Duke 26-yard line. After the officials conferred, which is appropriate, they correctly determined that the block was from the side, which resulted in the flag being picked up. The replay official was not involved in the decision to pick up the flag; however, the referee did not effectively manage communication and properly explain why the flag was picked up.
In addition, the on-field crew failed to penalize a Miami player for leaving the bench area and entering the field prior to the end of the play. This foul would not have negated the touchdown because it would have been enforced as a dead ball foul.
“The quality of our officiating program is of the highest importance to the league and its schools, and the last play of the game was not handled appropriately,” said ACC Commissioner John Swofford. “Officiating is an extraordinarily difficult job but our players, coaches, programs and fans deserve the best that can be offered. We will continue to strive to meet that standard.”

[Bison"FANatic"]

It appears that you didnt see the play. Whats even funnier to me is your attempt to explain something that you didnt see.
Ahhh referees.....

Refs are generally idiots. Thus I]

In my experience when people call professionals idiots they usually have just enough knowledge of something to be dangerous but they themselves are the ones who need more educating . Your attacking Indy for trying to educate us and you make you look like a fool

[NDSUSR]

In my experience when people call professionals idiots they usually have just enough knowledge of something to be dangerous but they themselves are the ones who need more educating . Your attacking Indy for trying to educate us and you make you look like a fool

Im not attacking anyone. I just found it hilarious that he tried to explain what happened without seeing the play. Calm down.

[NorthernBison]

Im not attacking anyone. I just found it hilarious that he tried to explain what happened without seeing the play. Calm down.

I didn't get that from his post.. He explained how the rules are interpreted. The answer was there for anybody who saw the play.

So, did you think they got it wrong? I've not seen an opinion.

[NDSUSR]

I didn't get that from his post.. He explained how the rules are interpreted. The answer was there for anybody who saw the play.

So, did you think they got it wrong? I've not seen an opinion.

No, I think they got it right, but the rule is flawed.

[RonMexico]

No, I think they got it right, but the rule is flawed.

flawed how?

[NDSUSR]

flawed how?

The return team is allowed to go out of bounds, then return and be the first player to touch the ball.

[IzzyFlexion]

I like watching you guys try to explain and interpret rules. It's definitely an honest attempt.

and.............I like it when referees think that they are bigger than the game.