A new and better FBS thread

[56BISON73]

Well we could join the Big Sky, then we know for sure we will be FBS......it's set in stone



How's that for a viable option?

Ohhh I see what you did there. Did you use the vulcan mind meld to channel SV?

ps well played!!!!!!!

[BisonNeil]

Honestly, that's not too much of a hindrance. If NDSU felt they absolutely needed to go FBS, I have no doubt they could wrangle an invite within a couple/few months. They'd just need to pull a UCONN: Go to the MAC and buy an invite. Get a football-only invite to the MAC and agree to forgo all conference money for something like 5 to 10 years, and also pay some stupid-large entrance fee of a million or three. Then agree to part ways within 5 years. All the while staying in the Summit. It's ugly, but it gets your foot in the door. In principle, it's not all that different from the initial DI move; no invite? find another way to kick down the door until someone wants you.



That being said, it's something that should only be considered as a last resort. Just saying that the "no invite, no discussion argument" isn't really all that valid.

For sake of discussion let's say this is true (I doubt very much it is because ND is too far away from most G5 conference teams to be seriously considered much less wanted by anyone). Where the fuck is this money going to come from? NDSU is still short about $3 million (or so) to finish the goddamn BSA for cripes sake, and you think that money can easily put together to get a buy in?

I call double bullshit on the whole post.

[runtheoption]

For sake of discussion let's say this is true (I doubt very much it is because ND is too far away from most G5 conference teams to be seriously considered much less wanted by anyone). Where the fuck is this money going to come from? NDSU is still short about $3 million (or so) to finish the goddamn BSA for cripes sake, and you think that money can easily put together to get a buy in?

I call double bullshit on the whole post.

Tony and SamsRams will make a huge donation out of their profits from their new "pay" Bisonville/Bisonation website.

[Strongman]

The other option is the formation of a new conference with the elite teams from the Big Sky and the MVC. The commissioner of the Big Sky had already indicated the whole conference might move up. Very unrealistic. But the elite teams from both conferences have the resources, stadiums, and can satisfy the 15,000 attendance requirement. Additionally, right off the bat is would be the top G6 conference or right near the top.

Not saying it will happen. But if Montana, Montana State and Eastern Washington are jumping ship, I highly doubt that NDSU, SDSU, would not strongly considering joining the move up especially if they were granted a waiver for post season playoffs/bowl games. (Whether this would be in the "second" tier or just FBS.)

[56BISON73]

Tony and SamsRams will make a huge donation out of their profits from their new "pay" Bisonville/Bisonation website.

And Longhorn will finally join Teammakers which will put us over the top.

[Hammersmith]

For sake of discussion let's say this is true (I doubt very much it is because ND is too far away from most G5 conference teams to be seriously considered much less wanted by anyone). Where the fuck is this money going to come from? NDSU is still short about $3 million (or so) to finish the goddamn BSA for cripes sake, and you think that money can easily put together to get a buy in?

I call double bullshit on the whole post.

Apparently you missed at least part of my point. I'm not saying it would be a good idea. I'm not saying NDSU would be able to accomplish it money-wise. I'm just saying that there is a theoretical way around the invite problem. The reason I think it's possible is because UCONN just did it. They wanted to go FBS and get into CUSA or the old Big East(now AAC), but neither of those conferences was willing to invite them. So they went to the MAC and asked for a football-only invite to satisfy the NCAA FBS requirement. After a few years in the conference, UCONN and the MAC agreed to part ways with no apparent hard feelings on either side.

So there's a way to do it, it just would cost a s**t-ton of money. For that kind of money, a conference would use the entrance fee to subsidize travel for the existing conference members. Say a $2M entrance fee split over 4 years. The conference could give each of the four schools that would need to travel to NDSU a $100k to cover travel expenses and still have $100k left over. If all parties knew the arrangement was only going to be for 4 years, don't you think a G5 like the MAC would go for the deal? It's not like we're talking about travel costs for all sports; it would only be four FB games a year.

Whether NDSU could ever afford it is another question altogether. I doubt it. Heavily, heavily doubt it. The only situation I could see where it could happen is if the alternative is even worse. If we reach a situation where it's clear that the only two options are a move to FBS(and no conference wants us) or a slow death spiral due to FCS as we know it falling apart. Not unlike what DII was looking like circa 2003. In that case, the funds could be found somewhere, even if it means institutional funds. It could be somewhat justified as a one-time cost. This is a last, last, last resort situation and meant more as a thought exercise than any real kind of plan.

[FargoBorne]

Apparently you missed at least part of my point. I'm not saying it would be a good idea. I'm not saying NDSU would be able to accomplish it money-wise. I'm just saying that there is a theoretical way around the invite problem. The reason I think it's possible is because UCONN just did it. They wanted to go FBS and get into CUSA or the old Big East(now AAC), but neither of those conferences was willing to invite them. So they went to the MAC and asked for a football-only invite to satisfy the NCAA FBS requirement. After a few years in the conference, UCONN and the MAC agreed to part ways with no apparent hard feelings on either side.

So there's a way to do it, it just would cost a s**t-ton of money. For that kind of money, a conference would use the entrance fee to subsidize travel for the existing conference members. Say a $2M entrance fee split over 4 years. The conference could give each of the four schools that would need to travel to NDSU a $100k to cover travel expenses and still have $100k left over. If all parties knew the arrangement was only going to be for 4 years, don't you think a G5 like the MAC would go for the deal? It's not like we're talking about travel costs for all sports; it would only be four FB games a year.

Whether NDSU could ever afford it is another question altogether. I doubt it. Heavily, heavily doubt it. The only situation I could see where it could happen is if the alternative is even worse. If we reach a situation where it's clear that the only two options are a move to FBS(and no conference wants us) or a slow death spiral due to FCS as we know it falling apart. Not unlike what DII was looking like circa 2003. In that case, the funds could be found somewhere, even if it means institutional funds. It could be somewhat justified as a one-time cost. This is a last, last, last resort situation and meant more as a thought exercise than any real kind of plan.

You seem to be confusing UMass with UConn. UCOnn was a member of the Big East and chose to upgrade their FCS to FBS, and never had to switch conferences to do it.

The MAC added UMass to be an eastern partner for Temple. Neither worked out, so the MAC doesn't want to fool with affiliates again. The MAC has stated there is no need to go beyond their 12 members anymore.

NDSU would have to buy their way in at a very high cost (>$5 mill) to make it work for the MAC. Otherwise hope and pray that one of the MAC teams leave for the American or CUSA. Ill St has a much better shot if that happens.

[unbison]

You seem to be confusing UMass with UConn. UCOnn was a member of the Big East and chose to upgrade their FCS to FBS, and never had to switch conferences to do it.

The MAC added UMass to be an eastern partner for Temple. Neither worked out, so the MAC doesn't want to fool with affiliates again. The MAC has stated there is no need to go beyond their 12 members anymore.

NDSU would have to buy their way in at a very high cost (>$5 mill) to make it work for the MAC. Otherwise hope and pray that one of the MAC teams leave for the American or CUSA. Ill St has a much better shot if that happens.

If Illinois st. Moves that allows a chance possibly for a full mvfc membership which would be a win in my book

[BisonNeil]

Apparently you missed at least part of my point. I'm not saying it would be a good idea. I'm not saying NDSU would be able to accomplish it money-wise. I'm just saying that there is a theoretical way around the invite problem. The reason I think it's possible is because UCONN just did it. They wanted to go FBS and get into CUSA or the old Big East(now AAC), but neither of those conferences was willing to invite them. So they went to the MAC and asked for a football-only invite to satisfy the NCAA FBS requirement. After a few years in the conference, UCONN and the MAC agreed to part ways with no apparent hard feelings on either side.

So there's a way to do it, it just would cost a s**t-ton of money. For that kind of money, a conference would use the entrance fee to subsidize travel for the existing conference members. Say a $2M entrance fee split over 4 years. The conference could give each of the four schools that would need to travel to NDSU a $100k to cover travel expenses and still have $100k left over. If all parties knew the arrangement was only going to be for 4 years, don't you think a G5 like the MAC would go for the deal? It's not like we're talking about travel costs for all sports; it would only be four FB games a year.

Whether NDSU could ever afford it is another question altogether. I doubt it. Heavily, heavily doubt it. The only situation I could see where it could happen is if the alternative is even worse. If we reach a situation where it's clear that the only two options are a move to FBS(and no conference wants us) or a slow death spiral due to FCS as we know it falling apart. Not unlike what DII was looking like circa 2003. In that case, the funds could be found somewhere, even if it means institutional funds. It could be somewhat justified as a one-time cost. This is a last, last, last resort situation and meant more as a thought exercise than any real kind of plan.

Yes, you are right, I did miss that point. However, UConn didn't "just do it". They moved their football team to FBS 15 years ago. The landscape has changed a lot since then with conference realignments. Which brings up the other point that I think the FBS enthusiasts tend to disregard. Consider this:

SEC- 14 members
Big 10- 14
Big 12- 10
PAC 12- 12
ACC- 15

MAC- 12
MWC- 12
CUSA- 14
SunBelt- 13
American- 11

You see the trend here? Conferences want an even number of teams. Everyone thinks the MAC and MWC are the obvious choices for NDSU to join, all the President needs to do is lobby them. Pure triple distilled bullshit. They have an even number of members and would have to want two more outside their travel range. I just don't see that happening. I realize that the MAC will be down one with UMass leaving, but again, NDSU is outside of the range of travel for them and is a completely differnt instituition. SunBelt could be an option I suppose, but they would have to be absolutely nuts to take an outlier like NDSU.

Unless one or two of the P5 conferences want more members, such as the ACC or Big 12, and accomplish that by robbing a G5 conference member (like NIU), I just don't think there is any impetus for any conference to seek much less want new members. It's a pipe dream that I am not particularly interested in participating in quite frankly.

[Hammersmith]

You seem to be confusing UMass with UConn. UCOnn was a member of the Big East and chose to upgrade their FCS to FBS, and never had to switch conferences to do it.

The MAC added UMass to be an eastern partner for Temple. Neither worked out, so the MAC doesn't want to fool with affiliates again. The MAC has stated there is no need to go beyond their 12 members anymore.

NDSU would have to buy their way in at a very high cost (>$5 mill) to make it work for the MAC. Otherwise hope and pray that one of the MAC teams leave for the American or CUSA. Ill St has a much better shot if that happens.

You're right, I confused the two. I meant UMass. My bad.


And to make it clear one more time for everyone, I don't think NDSU should or will do any of what I said. Just that I believe that it would be possible if faced with two terrible choices. We are nowhere near that point, and I strongly doubt things could ever get to that point.