Summit Expansion?

[MAKBison]

Also the MVC is into chasing markets now. It is idiotic thinking but it is what it is. Somebody on a valley board said they covet Northern Kentucky University because it would bring Cincinnati to the valley, which is ridiculous nobody in Cincy cares about NKU. The MVC added a school in Loyola to give them a Chicago presence, Loyola basketball isn't even broadcast on a Chicago radio station, it is online only. How do you get a big market presence from a school that nobody cares about is something I've always wondered.

These conferences see the bigger conferences doing it but I am not sure they realize that the bigger conferences are adding schools that people care about. The Big 10 can add Rutgers and then sell the Big 10 Network to the NY and NJ cable providers and make a killing. Nobody is buying Loyola or NKU, but they will buy success. Look at Boise State, not exactly in a major market but ESPN televises almost all of their games and what games that ESPN doesn't televise CBS Sports Network picks up.

Is there an example out there where markets trumps success? Sure there is but I am of the mind that success typically wins out. Not that I am hot to get into the MVC. You gotta pay to play...did you see what those coaches get paid $,$$$,$$$.$$ Not sure what the Summit range is?

[unbison]

Is there an example out there where markets trumps success? Sure there is but I am of the mind that success typically wins out. Not that I am hot to get into the MVC. You gotta pay to play...did you see what those coaches get paid $,$$$,$$$.$$ Not sure what the Summit range is?

With our basketball success we need to raise the bar pay wise....

[Bison 4 Life]

Mark Few for little old Gonzaga gets almost 1.2 mil a year. That's men from boys territory.

[wow]

Also the MVC is into chasing markets now. It is idiotic thinking but it is what it is. Somebody on a valley board said they covet Northern Kentucky University because it would bring Cincinnati to the valley, which is ridiculous nobody in Cincy cares about NKU. The MVC added a school in Loyola to give them a Chicago presence, Loyola basketball isn't even broadcast on a Chicago radio station, it is online only. How do you get a big market presence from a school that nobody cares about is something I've always wondered.

These conferences see the bigger conferences doing it but I am not sure they realize that the bigger conferences are adding schools that people care about. The Big 10 can add Rutgers and then sell the Big 10 Network to the NY and NJ cable providers and make a killing. Nobody is buying Loyola or NKU, but they will buy success. Look at Boise State, not exactly in a major market but ESPN televises almost all of their games and what games that ESPN doesn't televise CBS Sports Network picks up.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but in your previous post you mentioned that a rising tide lifts all boats. Being in the MVC raises Loyola's profile, maybe in a few years they get on radio, then TV, and BAM, Chicago media market presence. Sure its a stretch and seems like a pipe dream, but NDSU DOMINATES a small market. Not a lot of room to grow.

I'm sure many here will now tell me why the MVC is dumb, and that might be the case, but no amount of beating our (NDSU & SDSU) chests will change their way of thinking. IMO, there is no amount of success that will make the xDSU's attractive to the MVC. They need to be humbled before we get a sniff (losing WSU and probably others), and at that point it isn't someplace we want to be anyway. At that point, the Summit might raid them.

[HerdBot]

Is there an example out there where markets trumps success? Sure there is but I am of the mind that success typically wins out. Not that I am hot to get into the MVC. You gotta pay to play...did you see what those coaches get paid $,$$$,$$$.$$ Not sure what the Summit range is?

Doubtful. Heck Northern Iowa is a much smaller than Drake yet they seen to have more fans and more success.

NDSU and SDSU are much smaller than Omaha, UMKC, IUPUI, Oral Roberts, anf Denver yet they have better programs overall and draw better.

How about Wyoming in basketball?

The perception that NDSU is just a small city of 100k people with no growth potential is absolutely ridiculous. Our metro is a quarter million and one of the fastest growing in the nation. Not only that but NDSU fans cover the entire freaking state plus all of western Minnesota.

We compete with nobody so the entire state follows us. That's not the case for a team like Omaha who plays 3th fiddle to Nebraska and Creighton yet has such a small fan base, they are irrelevant in a state that is much larger than North Dakota. And not only that Nebraska doesn't have a pro team.

Or how about Boise? No pro teams.

If I was a conference, I would look at it like a normal business expansion. Saturation and growth.

[Tatanka]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but in your previous post you mentioned that a rising tide lifts all boats. Being in the MVC raises Loyola's profile, maybe in a few years they get on radio, then TV, and BAM, Chicago media market presence. Sure its a stretch and seems like a pipe dream, but NDSU DOMINATES a small market. Not a lot of room to grow.



I'm sure many here will now tell me why the MVC is dumb, and that might be the case, but no amount of beating our (NDSU & SDSU) chests will change their way of thinking. IMO, there is no amount of success that will make the xDSU's attractive to the MVC. They need to be humbled before we get a sniff (losing WSU and probably others), and at that point it isn't someplace we want to be anyway. At that point, the Summit might raid them.

I agree with this post in its entirety. MVC likes being a bus league, and the private schools want less than nothing to do with large football playing land grant schools from far far away messing up their little utopia.

[NDSUstudent]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but in your previous post you mentioned that a rising tide lifts all boats. Being in the MVC raises Loyola's profile, maybe in a few years they get on radio, then TV, and BAM, Chicago media market presence. Sure its a stretch and seems like a pipe dream, but NDSU DOMINATES a small market. Not a lot of room to grow.

I'm sure many here will now tell me why the MVC is dumb, and that might be the case, but no amount of beating our (NDSU & SDSU) chests will change their way of thinking. IMO, there is no amount of success that will make the xDSU's attractive to the MVC. They need to be humbled before we get a sniff (losing WSU and probably others), and at that point it isn't someplace we want to be anyway. At that point, the Summit might raid them.

Honestly I don't care if NDSU is ever in the MVC, NDSU doesn't exactly fit into the MVC. Sure I think we could go there and have success much like UNI has but we are what we are. A football school that is damn solid in athletics across the board, we should be striving for an FBS/G5 league or building one if need be. Football needs room to grow and a chance to compete at a higher level. The program has more than proved it, unfortunately it has no place to go.

As for the MVC and Loyola. Chicago doesn't care about college hoops, it is a pro sports city(all the MVC had to do to see that was look at DePaul). The MVC should have brought in Valpo, Belmont or Murray State, a school with solid support that has had success and was ready to take a step up. Not a school that can't even put more than 2,000 fans in their gym when a ranked UNI team comes to town. The MVC is honestly just lucky that WSU has no football and thus nowhere to go. If they had football the MWC, CUSA and AAC would be beating down their doors by now.

The Summit will never raid the MVC, when push comes to shove the MVC will take what it wants if need be. Even without a WSU it is still a strong league with good schools.

[NDSUstudent]

With our basketball success we need to raise the bar pay wise....

Completely agree, not saying we need to go huge but $250-300k puts Richman in the middle-to-upper middle of DI. He more than proved this year that he is a capable coach.

[IzzyFlexion]

Doubtful. Heck Northern Iowa is a much smaller than Drake yet they seen to have more fans and more success.

NDSU and SDSU are much smaller than Omaha, UMKC, IUPUI, Oral Roberts, anf Denver yet they have better programs overall and draw better.

How about Wyoming in basketball?

The perception that NDSU is just a small city of 100k people with no growth potential is absolutely ridiculous. Our metro is a quarter million and one of the fastest growing in the nation. Not only that but NDSU fans cover the entire freaking state plus all of western Minnesota.

We compete with nobody so the entire state follows us. That's not the case for a team like Omaha who plays 3th fiddle to Nebraska and Creighton yet has such a small fan base, they are irrelevant in a state that is much larger than North Dakota. And not only that Nebraska doesn't have a pro team.

Or how about Boise? No pro teams.

If I was a conference, I would look at it like a normal business expansion. Saturation and growth.

Last week someone in Omaha told me that Creighton packs the Century Link Center for all of their home games. I found it hard to believe but upon looking it up...I was surprised. This season the Blue Jays averaged 17,048 (capacity 17,390). That is a HUGE number for a mid-major.
Drove by UNO's new arena construction site. It looks like it's gonna be very nice.

[wow]

Doubtful. Heck Northern Iowa is a much smaller than Drake yet they seen to have more fans and more success.

NDSU and SDSU are much smaller than Omaha, UMKC, IUPUI, Oral Roberts, anf Denver yet they have better programs overall and draw better.

How about Wyoming in basketball?

The perception that NDSU is just a small city of 100k people with no growth potential is absolutely ridiculous. Our metro is a quarter million and one of the fastest growing in the nation. Not only that but NDSU fans cover the entire freaking state plus all of western Minnesota.

We compete with nobody so the entire state follows us. That's not the case for a team like Omaha who plays 3th fiddle to Nebraska and Creighton yet has such a small fan base, they are irrelevant in a state that is much larger than North Dakota. And not only that Nebraska doesn't have a pro team.

Or how about Boise? No pro teams.

If I was a conference, I would look at it like a normal business expansion. Saturation and growth.

That's part of the problem, IMO. Even with the unbelievable market penetration NDSU has, there is no earth shattering TV deal (that I'm aware of). Some of your home games are broadcast via a cable company headquartered in another state, and when they are they might get on ESPN3.

I'm not banging on NDSU, because SDSU is in the same (worse) boat. Its freaking Chicago. Any TV deal in Chicago is going to be worth 10 times the best possible TV deal in Sioux Falls or Fargo. I don't blame the MVC for chasing it, no matter how unlikely. 10 years ago nobody would have believed that the Summit League could host a successful conference tournament in Sioux Falls.