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Thread: Summit Expansion?

  1. #781
    Honeybooboo is offline Senior Member Gets their mail at the West Parking Lot
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yote 53 View Post
    Actually, USD had the option of which conferences to join as they had a Big Sky invite in hand, and they chose the MVFC. So yeah, USD did get help from the SU's to get into the MVFC, but that was out of a bit of self preservation on the SU's part too as the Summit would have imploded. Either way, USD had secured a D1 conference invite on their own from a pretty good FCS conference. Ironically, if USD had chosen the Big Sky the Summit would have imploded by now, UND would have stayed in the BSC, and NDSU and SDSU would be in a BSC East division along with USD and UND and there would be zero talk coming out of Augustana about D1 because there would be no Summit League Tournament in Sioux Falls to lure them to D1.

    As for blue prints, USD was one of the schools in favor of moving the NCC up to D1 en masse in the 90's. When NDSU and SDSU made the move, regardless of what you heard in public, USD was making preparations behind the scenes to move as well. We just weren't ready on the same timetable the SU's were and needed a few more years to prepare, but it was inevitable we were moving up as well.

    USD and UND both did do it on their own. I really don't see how you can debate that. We both spent our entire transition years in the far flung Great West, both secured Big Sky offers on our own merits with no inside help from the State schools. The State schools did it on their own too. Just saying we all followed our own paths to get to the point where we are today and had to pay our dues in the process, and that's the point of my post. Could Augustana do that? No way.
    Which schools started that Great West so you would have a home?

  2. #782
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yote 53 View Post
    Actually, USD had the option of which conferences to join as they had a Big Sky invite in hand, and they chose the MVFC. So yeah, USD did get help from the SU's to get into the MVFC, but that was out of a bit of self preservation on the SU's part too as the Summit would have imploded. Either way, USD had secured a D1 conference invite on their own from a pretty good FCS conference. Ironically, if USD had chosen the Big Sky the Summit would have imploded by now, UND would have stayed in the BSC, and NDSU and SDSU would be in a BSC East division along with USD and UND and there would be zero talk coming out of Augustana about D1 because there would be no Summit League Tournament in Sioux Falls to lure them to D1.

    As for blue prints, USD was one of the schools in favor of moving the NCC up to D1 en masse in the 90's. When NDSU and SDSU made the move, regardless of what you heard in public, USD was making preparations behind the scenes to move as well. We just weren't ready on the same timetable the SU's were and needed a few more years to prepare, but it was inevitable we were moving up as well.

    USD and UND both did do it on their own. I really don't see how you can debate that. We both spent our entire transition years in the far flung Great West, both secured Big Sky offers on our own merits with no inside help from the State schools. The State schools did it on their own too. Just saying we all followed our own paths to get to the point where we are today and had to pay our dues in the process, and that's the point of my post. Could Augustana do that? No way.
    And you got that invite from the Big Sky because the SU's had done well and thought they could get four very strong Division I programs.


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  3. #783
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by MNLonghorn10 View Post
    yep. Im also not overreacting that a team cant reach YSU and UNI's plateau of mediocrity. especially if they get a transfer or 2 that make a difference.
    If it's so easy than why doesn't it happen all the time. There are not that many transfers who have THAT big of an impact on the FCS level. Strevler is the exception but he finished up his career with the Gophers as a WR and they still didn't go very far in the playoffs. What do you think a guy like Randy Moss is going to transfer to Augustana.
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jacksfan29 View Post
    If they plan to play scholarship football they will need a lot more then $5 million per year.
    If they plan to play in the MVFC, NDSU is going to put an end to Kelby's DI Augie pipe dream quickly.
    NDSU to the FBS always. In all ways.

  5. #785
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    ...when I talk about Augie going D1, I'm always working off of the assumption that the Augie administration is going to do it right and put the right financial support, institutional support, etc. into going Division I. As I've said more than once, I can understand how if Augie comes in with the same lackluster support of athletics that they suffered from in the 90s and early 2000s, I'd be disappointed as an XDSU or UXD fan too. And as an Augie fan.
    Quote Originally Posted by HerdBot View Post
    USD, UND, and SDSU have always been rivals. Not trying to sound like a jerk but when Augie was in the NCC with the other 3 Dakota schools, they weren't very competitive. Check out the all time win records vs NDSU, SDSU, USD, and UND. That's when all things were EQUAL and we were all D2

    https://static.goaugie.com/custompag...m/HISTRESU.HTM

    Since 1990
    NDSU 6-24
    UND 8-32
    SDSU 6-26
    USD 11-30



    As far as costs rising to add western teams go, that's what you gotta do with D1 basketball. Not only are your costs going up, everything goes up. Your coach is awesome but what if SDSU loses their coach and then offers him double or triple? Can you afford to match? Dont they pay him like 300k? As far as recruiting goes, you need to offer full cost of attendance to all your player because most teams already do. Facilities?
    Your point (in bold) is exactly why I said the following in my previous post:

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    ...when I talk about Augie going D1, I'm always working off of the assumption that the Augie administration is going to do it right and put the right financial support, institutional support, etc. into going Division I. As I've said more than once, I can understand how if Augie comes in with the same lackluster support of athletics that they suffered from in the 90s and early 2000s, I'd be disappointed as an XDSU or UXD fan too. And as an Augie fan.
    I can't argue with the numbers you've posted. But as I've said in the past, that was in an era when Augie was putting an embarrassing (literally embarrassing) lack of emphasis on athletics. The whole point I'm making is that if they DON'T put financial support behind it like they have to, then yes, we are going to suck like we did in the 90s. Except worse, because we'll already be taking a hit by going D1 and having to transition and stuff as it is.

    So when you say, "That's when all things were EQUAL and we were all D2," yes, we were all D2, but I disagree that things were "equal." And the blame for that falls on Augie. Like I said a couple of weeks ago, if Augie's administration goes into this with a failure to plan appropriately and the money isn't there like it needs to be, then everyone involved will be to blame. But if the money IS pulled together like it needs to be, we will have a much better chance to be competitive than we EVER had in the 90s and early 2000s when Augie wasn't putting money toward athletics.

    Regarding the last section of your post, here are some quick thoughts:

    1) Yes, they'll have to increase the coaching salaries (for all sports), and I have no idea whether or not they'll be able to match a better offer from other schools, even if it's a rival Summit League school. At the same time, as I've read on every local D1 school's message board over the past 3-4 years, "That's the life of being a mid-major" when you lose your coach to a higher paying school. I would hope we wouldn't lose good coaches to other schools, but that's part of it.

    2) As far as recruiting goes, yes, FCOA is probably a big deal, but I don't believe all schools in the Summit League offer it fully for all sports, right? If they do, I'll gladly be corrected, but I don't get the impression they do. So if it just needs to be offered for the key sports like men's/women's basketball in order to remain competitive, it'll be more manageable, especially in the beginning. And I'm not sure how it would work if the football team goes non-scholarship (obviously most likely option). Do Pioneer League schools offer FCOA too? I don't know, just curious.

    3) As far as facilities go, I would imagine some of the corporate sponsors rumored to be interested in supporting the D1 jump would want to move the Vikings into a better venue (possibly the Pentagon?). That being said, the Vikings have managed to make the Sioux Falls Arena a pretty solid venue for conference games (details here: http://www.goaugie.com/facilities/?id=5), and even if that's unavailable in the future, I would imagine they'd have a plan in place for where they'd go. Again, if they don't have a plan for a potential issue like that, shame on the Augie administration for not being prepared enough. And the Vikes currently have a high-level, $1 million+ practice facility (details here: http://goaugie.com/facilities/?id=36) that gives players 24/7 access to a private gym and allows them to schedule team practices without competing for floor space with other activities/teams on campus. I don't know anything about locker rooms and that kind of thing as I've never seen those, but I can't imagine they are a dump. Overall, I don't think the Vikings are as far behind on facilities as some might think. At least not in basketball, baseball (details here: http://goaugie.com/facilities/?id=4), and at least a few other sports.

    To be clear, I'm not saying, "So obviously we're totally ready to go D1." I'm just trying to contribute some info/facts that I can provide as the only Augie fan/alum on here based on the questions you raised in your post.

    It's possible the administration will come out tomorrow or in a week or in a month and say, "After lots of research and careful consideration, we just can't see our institution making the jump to Division I successfully" and I'd think, Yep, that makes sense. Or they could say, "Due to the path we're envisioning and substantial commitments for sponsorship and alumni support, we feel we're prepared to succeed at the Division 1 level," and I'd think, Sweet. Let's go annoy the Dakota 4 fans.

  6. #786
    Honeybooboo is offline Senior Member Gets their mail at the West Parking Lot
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by NDSUstudent View Post
    If they plan to play in the MVFC, NDSU is going to put an end to Kelby's DI Augie pipe dream quickly.
    there isn's a snowballs chance in Hell they get the votes for the MVFC, unless someone is jumping ship, also how the hell do people think they are a lock into the Summit?

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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    Your point (in bold) is exactly why I said the following in my previous post:



    I can't argue with the numbers you've posted. But as I've said in the past, that was in an era when Augie was putting an embarrassing (literally embarrassing) lack of emphasis on athletics. The whole point I'm making is that if they DON'T put financial support behind it like they have to, then yes, we are going to suck like we did in the 90s. Except worse, because we'll already be taking a hit by going D1 and having to transition and stuff as it is.

    So when you say, "That's when all things were EQUAL and we were all D2," yes, we were all D2, but I disagree that things were "equal." And the blame for that falls on Augie. Like I said a couple of weeks ago, if Augie's administration goes into this with a failure to plan appropriately and the money isn't there like it needs to be, then everyone involved will be to blame. But if the money IS pulled together like it needs to be, we will have a much better chance to be competitive than we EVER had in the 90s and early 2000s when Augie wasn't putting money toward athletics.

    Regarding the last section of your post, here are some quick thoughts:

    1) Yes, they'll have to increase the coaching salaries (for all sports), and I have no idea whether or not they'll be able to match a better offer from other schools, even if it's a rival Summit League school. At the same time, as I've read on every local D1 school's message board over the past 3-4 years, "That's the life of being a mid-major" when you lose your coach to a higher paying school. I would hope we wouldn't lose good coaches to other schools, but that's part of it.

    2) As far as recruiting goes, yes, FCOA is probably a big deal, but I don't believe all schools in the Summit League offer it fully for all sports, right? If they do, I'll gladly be corrected, but I don't get the impression they do. So if it just needs to be offered for the key sports like men's/women's basketball in order to remain competitive, it'll be more manageable, especially in the beginning. And I'm not sure how it would work if the football team goes non-scholarship (obviously most likely option). Do Pioneer League schools offer FCOA too? I don't know, just curious.

    3) As far as facilities go, I would imagine some of the corporate sponsors rumored to be interested in supporting the D1 jump would want to move the Vikings into a better venue (possibly the Pentagon?). That being said, the Vikings have managed to make the Sioux Falls Arena a pretty solid venue for conference games (details here: http://www.goaugie.com/facilities/?id=5), and even if that's unavailable in the future, I would imagine they'd have a plan in place for where they'd go. Again, if they don't have a plan for a potential issue like that, shame on the Augie administration for not being prepared enough. And the Vikes currently have a high-level, $1 million+ practice facility (details here: http://goaugie.com/facilities/?id=36) that gives players 24/7 access to a private gym and allows them to schedule team practices without competing for floor space with other activities/teams on campus. I don't know anything about locker rooms and that kind of thing as I've never seen those, but I can't imagine they are a dump. Overall, I don't think the Vikings are as far behind on facilities as some might think. At least not in basketball, baseball (details here: http://goaugie.com/facilities/?id=4), and at least a few other sports.

    To be clear, I'm not saying, "So obviously we're totally ready to go D1." I'm just trying to contribute some info/facts that I can provide as the only Augie fan/alum on here based on the questions you raised in your post.

    It's possible the administration will come out tomorrow or in a week or in a month and say, "After lots of research and careful consideration, we just can't see our institution making the jump to Division I successfully" and I'd think, Yep, that makes sense. Or they could say, "Due to the path we're envisioning and substantial commitments for sponsorship and alumni support, we feel we're prepared to succeed at the Division 1 level," and I'd think, Sweet. Let's go annoy the Dakota 4 fans.
    That practice facility looks worse than Moorhead High's fieldhouse. I'm not joking.
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  8. #788
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by EndZoneQB View Post
    That practice facility looks worse than Moorhead High's fieldhouse. I'm not joking.
    My guess is a reply from me on this message board isn't going to change your mind, so sure, it's probably a super crappy practice facility.

    Unless you're saying Moorhead High has a ridiculously awesome fieldhouse.

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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    My guess is a reply from me on this message board isn't going to change your mind, so sure, it's probably a super crappy practice facility.

    Unless you're saying Moorhead High has a ridiculously awesome fieldhouse.
    Honestly, it looks like 2 high school gyms next to each other with fairly nice locker rooms. Maybe there is something I'm missing there, but it looks like a gym.
    check neg rep

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    Quote Originally Posted by RowdyRabbit View Post
    I'm tired of seeing the old Belushi clip from Animal House..."over? it's not over..." in the waning seconds of another loss to NDSU.

  10. #790
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    Default Re: Summit Expansion?

    Quote Originally Posted by EndZoneQB View Post
    Honestly, it looks like 2 high school gyms next to each other with fairly nice locker rooms. Maybe there is something I'm missing there, but it looks like a gym.
    Gotcha. Yeah, I mean it's not like it has a spa and robot butlers and whatever other stuff Duke and Kentucky have in their practice gym, but I would imagine for a 24/7 access practice facility, there can't be a ton of Summit League teams offering options that completely blow this out of the water, right? If I'm wrong, someone should correct me. Does every Summit League school have substantially nicer/better practice facilities already?

    The point of the conversation was discussing whether or not Augie has legitimate facilities to be competitive in the Summit League. My reply was just to point out some areas they might have covered that could surprise some of the non-Augie fans. But if the points I'm making are really mistaken, I have no problem acknowledging I'm wrong on that.

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