Summit Expansion?

[nodak651]

You are saying that by going D1 Augie will be worthy of more coverage. Thumper's point is why do you need to go D1? You already get pretty much equal coverage the way it is as a D2 school. That's the point many of us are trying to make, Sioux Falls media coverage is mind boggling. They do a lot of HS sports coverage, which I guess is good, but when it comes to Augie and USF they get coverage on par with USD and SDSU, which is crazy.

As to the question of whether a D1 Augie would be successful? I highly doubt it. First reason is that it appears Augie is going D1 for all the wrong reasons. The driving reason is so that Sioux Falls can have a D1 school to call their own. Reason #2 is so the local SF media has a SF school to cover at the SLT. If the driving force behind a D1 move is so that Augie can be repped at the SLT then this move will fail and fail miserably.

Augustana does not have the enrollment to provide the institutional support necessary, they don't have the resources to put the necessary support in place, they don't have the endowment necessary to sustain success. You realize that moving to D1 is a lot more than just adding some scholarships and declaring yourself D1, right? As much as you need to put into adding scholarships you also need to put in just as much in support and compliance personnel.

Moving to D1 is something that goes beyond the athletic department, it has a transformational effect on the entire institution, as the 4 Dakota schools that have made the transition have come to realize. I hear some of that speak coming out of Augustana, about how athletics are the front porch to the school and a means to showcase it. I hear some of that speak, but not enough. I also don't hear much about how a move like this fits into the overall mission of Augustana. For the 4 Dakota schools it was clear, it was done because our peer institutions were Division 1 schools, and a move to D1 would help to increase the school profile and drive enrollment increases, which has happened at all 4 schools.

I don't see that happening at Augustana. I see some people in Sioux Falls and the SF media wanting their own team. I see Augustana thinking that because they have had some success now in D2 that they are ready to move to D1. Reality is that the only reason Augie has had success in D2 is because the 4 Dakota schools moved out of that division, if the Vikings move to D1 they will back to bottom feeder status, it will just be as a more expensive bottom feeder.



ETA: It would be great that if instead of debating this on Bisonville, GoYotes, SiouxSports, SDSUFans, or AGS we could all go to the appropriate place, the Augustana message board, and have this discussion there.

Augi would be better off in the MIAC than the Summit.

[Yote 53]

Augi would be better off in the MIAC than the Summit.

There is a lot of truth to that statement. They do fit the profile of a MIAC school.

[tony]

There is a lot of truth to that statement. They do fit the profile of a MIAC school.

Augi to the MIAC, St. Thomas to the Summit?

[MrAugustana]

You are saying that by going D1 Augie will be worthy of more coverage. Thumper's point is why do you need to go D1? You already get pretty much equal coverage the way it is as a D2 school. That's the point many of us are trying to make, Sioux Falls media coverage is mind boggling. They do a lot of HS sports coverage, which I guess is good, but when it comes to Augie and USF they get coverage on par with USD and SDSU, which is crazy.

As to the question of whether a D1 Augie would be successful? I highly doubt it. First reason is that it appears Augie is going D1 for all the wrong reasons. The driving reason is so that Sioux Falls can have a D1 school to call their own. Reason #2 is so the local SF media has a SF school to cover at the SLT. If the driving force behind a D1 move is so that Augie can be repped at the SLT then this move will fail and fail miserably.

Augustana does not have the enrollment to provide the institutional support necessary, they don't have the resources to put the necessary support in place, they don't have the endowment necessary to sustain success. You realize that moving to D1 is a lot more than just adding some scholarships and declaring yourself D1, right? As much as you need to put into adding scholarships you also need to put in just as much in support and compliance personnel.

Moving to D1 is something that goes beyond the athletic department, it has a transformational effect on the entire institution, as the 4 Dakota schools that have made the transition have come to realize. I hear some of that speak coming out of Augustana, about how athletics are the front porch to the school and a means to showcase it. I hear some of that speak, but not enough. I also don't hear much about how a move like this fits into the overall mission of Augustana. For the 4 Dakota schools it was clear, it was done because our peer institutions were Division 1 schools, and a move to D1 would help to increase the school profile and drive enrollment increases, which has happened at all 4 schools.

I don't see that happening at Augustana. I see some people in Sioux Falls and the SF media wanting their own team. I see Augustana thinking that because they have had some success now in D2 that they are ready to move to D1. Reality is that the only reason Augie has had success in D2 is because the 4 Dakota schools moved out of that division, if the Vikings move to D1 they will back to bottom feeder status, it will just be as a more expensive bottom feeder.



ETA: It would be great that if instead of debating this on Bisonville, GoYotes, SiouxSports, SDSUFans, or AGS we could all go to the appropriate place, the Augustana message board, and have this discussion there.

1) Again, I would bet a good amount of money that, if we asked for the actual statistics from the Argus and local news stations, they would contend that they cover substantially more of the D1 athletics than USD and SDSU fans would like to think. But, obviously, until someone actually asks people at the news outlets and gets answers, it's just a couple of fan bases arguing about a subjective matter. So while I don't agree that Augie gets equal coverage to the D1 sports, I'm guessing everyone is tired of reading this element of the conversation. So sure--they're covered totally equally and Augie fans should shut up about it. Hope that suffices for everyone.

2) If Augie's administration and athletic department decides to try to make the jump to the Division I level based solely on the point in your second paragraph, then they are dumb and should be held accountable for that in a few years. My guess is those are the only reasons you think Augie is considering going D1. I'm willing to bet Stephanie Herseth-Sandlin isn't sitting around a table with people saying, "Hey, it sounds like the Sioux Falls media wants a Sioux Falls school to cover at the Summit League Tournament. You guys think we should go D1 to accommodate that need for them?" If she and others in the administration are making decisions based only on that line of reasoning, then that's an embarrassment to them as leaders and to our school as a whole.

3) If your points in paragraph #3 aren't also being considered before a decision like this is made, then my previous comment applies to this line of reasoning as well. Regardless of what I do or don't realize about going D1 (which, to be clear, I never assumed was as simple as you are projecting on to me by saying, "You realize..." as if I'm a 9-year-old or something), my hope as an alum is that the administration in charge of this is thinking things through effectively before making a decision. That's why they are in charge of the school and athletic department and I'm an alum who posts on a message board from time to time.

4) Augie has always had desires to raise enrollment. They seem to have just had some extremely financially conservative presidents who didn't really pursue it with aggression. It seemed the last 2-3 presidents were more focused on maintaining than growing, despite recognizing that, at our rate of tuition, we need higher enrollment. If Stephanie's goal is to see Augie grow, maybe she'll be the one who actually starts taking steps to bring that to fruition by taking some risks that actually accomplish it.

5) Every anti-Augie fan from the Dakota 4 has said, "The only reason Augie is winning is because we're gone." I get it. I'm sure that is responsible for a reasonable amount of Augie's success the past few years. But as I've said before, I don't know that Augie was investing in athletics back then to even a fraction of the degree they have been for the last 10 years or so (it's possible they had been...but I doubt that's the case). And, surprise surprise, since investing more in athletics, the school has seen more recognition and success. In 2017 Augie had its highest freshman enrollment since 1978. My guess is that the overall success in athletics the past few years played at least some role in that. So if the Vikings get the funding that has been discussed as being necessary to compete, and they actually continue investing in athletics to a degree that they never did back in the NCC days, I'm not sure I'm seeing the reasons it's a dead-set guarantee they will be bottom-dwellers again. Maybe I'm blind to the obvious. But I feel like I'm the only one on here saying, "I acknowledge that Augie sucked in the past, but I'm not 100% convinced they will have to suck again moving forward." It could just be me though.

All in all, as I've said before, I'm not even advocating for Augie to go D1. I don't care if the Vikes stay D2 and keep winning at this level. Winning National Championships has been fun. I just happen to be someone who thinks that, if Augie's administration makes this jump for the right reasons and with the right reasoning behind it, the Vikes may actually find some success at the D1 level after the transition is over. Would I enjoy it if Augie went D1 and eventually became a competitive program at the Summit League's level? Sure. Would I be fine if they just stay D2? Yes. I'm just concerned Augie might not be as relevant in 15-20 years if they stay D2 compared to making the jump and finding a way to win at the D1 level.

I appreciate the conversation. It's fun to have something to discuss and debate like this in the offseason.

[ByeSonBusiness]

That is like saying another team that should not be in D1 is a great reason why another team that does not belong in D1 should be D1.

With that said, we have a larger enrollment than Notre Dame, so we should play as a FBS independent, with a scheduling alliance with the B1G, and get a free pass into the CFP if we have a good year.....

Why shouldn't Wofford be in D1? Tough to judge private schools against public schools, particularly on enrollment. Wofford has been to the big dance a few times. Been pretty solid at football.

I'm not saying Augustana should be D-1. I'm saying other small privates seem to be fine despite their size. If Augie's big goal is to play division 1 olympic sports and they can get funding lined up, good for them. They'd suck at football per usual I'd imagine.

[THEsocalledfan]

Why shouldn't Wofford be in D1? Tough to judge private schools against public schools, particularly on enrollment. Wofford has been to the big dance a few times. Been pretty solid at football.

I'm not saying Augustana should be D-1. I'm saying other small privates seem to be fine despite their size. If Augie's big goal is to play division 1 olympic sports and they can get funding lined up, good for them. They'd suck at football per usual I'd imagine.

I am not a fan of small private schools being D1. I understand if you disagree since this is all arbitrary, but to me, D1 was never really intended for them. Yes, I know small privates have done well; and I still don't think they belong.

[IndyBison]

I am not a fan of small private schools being D1. I understand if you disagree since this is all arbitrary, but to me, D1 was never really intended for them. Yes, I know small privates have done well; and I still don't think they belong.

Would you say that for Georgetown, Villanova, Temple, Duke, Notre Dame, and Butler just as some examples. Some of those are a little bigger and have graduate schools but they are still relatively small.

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[THEsocalledfan]

Would you say that for Georgetown, Villanova, Temple, Duke, Notre Dame, and Butler just as some examples. Some of those are a little bigger and have graduate schools but they are still relatively small.

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As I stated, it is all arbitrary and the line is impossible to draw. And is it enrollment? Graduate program? I don't know, but there are a lot of schools out there with no business in D1 just like Augie.

[Christopher Moen]

As I stated, it is all arbitrary and the line is impossible to draw. And is it enrollment? Graduate program? I don't know, but there are a lot of schools out there with no business in D1 just like Augie.

I'm not understanding the issue with private schools. I personally don't like them because the fleece student and parents out of huge amounts of money for a degree that might or might not get used. In regards to athletics, if they can compete, let them. There are quite a few private schools that are better funded than public schools.

[Thumper 76]

Wofford and Augie are the same size....just sayin'

Go compare the $$$$ each school has. Fairly certain it’s not even a little bit close. I could be wrong though.


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