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Thread: Rule Change

  1. #61
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by bisonaudit View Post
    who's disputing that kids can learn valuable skills from participating in sport?

    on the CTE front, you don’t know anymore than they do. In fact, I’m pretty sure you know less, as you’re not actively engaged in research. Have some media reports been a bit hyperbolic about the potential dangers? Sure. That’s how media works. Would the NFL prefer if no one knew the potential brain damage their game can inflict on participants? Sure. Corporations only act in their own interest. There’s a lot of uncertainty right now but tests are coming for CTE in the living. We’re going to learn a lot in the next decade or so.
    How though? That is where I disagree. The only way to definitively study it is to do a randomized, controlled prospective trial. (kids are randomly assigned to play or not play football with no choice in the matter once assigned.) That will not happen. Next best option is to do a prospective cohort trial trying your best to match demographics. That will take at least 20 years to get results, not to mention if you want autopsy results, longer. (most object to brain samples when living) So, no, we will not get better data even if the media and stupid people try to pass off stuff as good data. We will get lots of crap, uncontrolled restrospective data folks who want glory will try to pass off as quality research. (granted, not much different than surgical data.....hope folks can sleep at night)

    Rule #1 of this kind of research; you have to do it prospectively with some kind of decent control to knock out the weeds. The rest is crap and I will remain skeptical and keep my kids in football and mock the hysteria.

  2. #62
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by THEsocalledfan View Post
    How though? That is where I disagree. The only way to definitively study it is to do a randomized, controlled prospective trial. (kids are randomly assigned to play or not play football with no choice in the matter once assigned.) That will not happen. Next best option is to do a prospective cohort trial trying your best to match demographics. That will take at least 20 years to get results, not to mention if you want autopsy results, longer. (most object to brain samples when living) So, no, we will not get better data even if the media and stupid people try to pass off stuff as good data. We will get lots of crap, uncontrolled restrospective data folks who want glory will try to pass off as quality research. (granted, not much different than surgical data.....hope folks can sleep at night)

    Rule #1 of this kind of research; you have to do it prospectively with some kind of decent control to knock out the weeds. The rest is crap and I will remain skeptical and keep my kids in football and mock the hysteria.
    There’s a blood test coming.
    I have the honor to be Your Obedient Servant - B.Aud

    We all live in stories... It seems to me that a definition of any living vibrant society is that you constantly question those stories... The argument itself is freedom. It's not that you come to a conclusion about it. Through that argument you change your mind sometimes... That's how societies grow. When you can't retell for yourself the stories of your life then you live in a prison... Somebody else controls the story. - S. Rushdie

  3. #63
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by bisonaudit View Post
    There’s a blood test coming.
    Couldn't someone trying to do a study without "assigning" people randomly to "play football" or "not play football." There are lots of kids who play football. There are also lots of kids who do NOT play football. Couldn't these two populations work as a control and experimental groups. If we are worried about confounding variables such as kids who do not play football but might be subject to similar injuries in other ways they could be left out of the survey. Or left in to balance things out and possibly show that there are LOTS of things that can cause these injuries in young people, not just football.

    I am not a scientist and I may be way off base here and this may be infeasible. But if so please tell me how.

  4. #64
    totoinfl is offline Senior Member Gets their mail at the West Parking Lot
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by NoDak View Post
    Couldn't someone trying to do a study without "assigning" people randomly to "play football" or "not play football." There are lots of kids who play football. There are also lots of kids who do NOT play football. Couldn't these two populations work as a control and experimental groups. If we are worried about confounding variables such as kids who do not play football but might be subject to similar injuries in other ways they could be left out of the survey. Or left in to balance things out and possibly show that there are LOTS of things that can cause these injuries in young people, not just football.

    I am not a scientist and I may be way off base here and this may be infeasible. But if so please tell me how.
    Ok, so not scientific, but life based observation. Our oldest son played football and soccer in HS (Soccer is a winter sport in Florida). I can guarantee he had concussions from both. I only remember one concussion from football. Funny story, senior homecoming night, he was named homecoming king...doesn't remember it (concussion came about 3 plays before the half). He was a sweeper in soccer. I know for certain of 3 concussions in HS playing soccer. Two were head to head going for a ball in the air, the third was a nasty elbow to the temple.

    No traditional sport is safe from the injury or concussion if you play a truly competitive level, except maybe table tennis or badminton. The most important for a parent to do is not ignore the little events, the headaches, etc. Take your kid to the doc, don't think "it will pass".

    If I had young ones again, I would do the same again. If they want to play football, fine, just not until high school...period.

  5. #65
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    IMO, physical exercise is a really good thing, especially for adolescent males. Physical interaction seems to be a part of our DNA. Sports like football are a good way to let young guys be aggressive, while having oversight, rules and protective equipment. Not every young man needs/wants this, so be it. But, for those that do, football seems like a good alternative. If studies are the basis, then include history of steroid, drugs, alcohol, other sport injury, family history, ect...
    Hey Barkeep, another round of the green stuff for me and my buddies!

  6. #66
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Dont see anyone trying to ban soccer, boxing, MMA etc etc etc. Wheres the outrage?????
    If we concentrated on the really important stuff in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles"

    When you play football, you gotta like the taste of blood, And 50 percent of the time, it's your blood.

    It is characteristic of the unlearned that they are forever proposing something which is old, and because it has recently come to their own attention, supposing it to be new.

    "The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."

  7. #67
    OrygunBison's Avatar
    OrygunBison is offline Senior Member Gets their mail at the West Parking Lot
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by 56BISON73 View Post
    Dont see anyone trying to ban soccer, boxing, MMA etc etc etc. Wheres the outrage?????
    If need be, I will jump on the "Ban Soccer" bandwagon. Just tell me when and where to meet...
    Insert something clever here...

  8. #68
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by OrygunBison View Post
    If need be, I will jump on the "Ban Soccer" bandwagon. Just tell me when and where to meet...
    Gastropub?
    If we concentrated on the really important stuff in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles"

    When you play football, you gotta like the taste of blood, And 50 percent of the time, it's your blood.

    It is characteristic of the unlearned that they are forever proposing something which is old, and because it has recently come to their own attention, supposing it to be new.

    "The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."

  9. #69
    OrygunBison's Avatar
    OrygunBison is offline Senior Member Gets their mail at the West Parking Lot
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by 56BISON73 View Post
    Gastropub?
    Is that the place where we met Twitchy and you wasted some protoplasm or some shit?
    Insert something clever here...

  10. #70
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    Default Re: Rule Change

    Quote Originally Posted by OrygunBison View Post
    Is that the place where we met Twitchy and you wasted some protoplasm or some shit?
    http

    Bingo...............
    If we concentrated on the really important stuff in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles"

    When you play football, you gotta like the taste of blood, And 50 percent of the time, it's your blood.

    It is characteristic of the unlearned that they are forever proposing something which is old, and because it has recently come to their own attention, supposing it to be new.

    "The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."

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