A new and better FBS thread

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 56BISON73

Ahhhh are you really that stupid????

---

Have you ever answered a direct question in your life? Literally at any point?

Do you take this women to be your wife?
"Havent I made that clear?
Is that a yes or a no?
"ahhh are you really that stupid?"
Just say yes or no please
"QUIT SCREAMING, FBS NEEDS MONEY!"
....wut?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El_Chapo

are you serious right now?

"Hey, Just gauging your interest in NDSU as a potential future Football Only member of your illustrious conference."

KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid.

---

Ok. That conversation will go one of two ways.

Option 1: AAC Commish guys says (diplomatically): "Ok, we'll take it under consideration and let you know. Don't call us. We'll call you." *click* (diplomacy off) "Well that was a waste of 30 seconds."

Option 2: AAC Commish guys says: "Interesting notion. How would you suggest I sell my league presidents on the possibility of NDSU as an affiliate member?"

So how do you make that pitch in the (unlikely IMO) event that AAC Commish guy is receptive to this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

lol this argument again. I'm old enough to remember when people said "yeah we've won one championship but there's no way we'll be in the title hunt forever! I'll bet you'll change your tune once we lose 3-4 games a year!"

Everything about this team COMPETITIVELY has proven history wrong over and over and over again and will continue to do so. there are so many reasons you could chose to argue against FBS, but NDSU not being able to sustain success is probably the stupidest one, and the one that matters least in the grand scheme. virtually everything else matters more when considering jumping- competitive success is probably in the bottom half of the list

---

I am happy I could provide you with a stupid argument. If you read what went before my post you would see the statement was made that the jump could be made based on sustained success. Thus the argument you ridicule came from a FBS now supportér. Being satisfied with a competitive team sounds like you are from UND. Many fans at NDSU measure the term in the number of championships. You need to look at 21years of history before the current run.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

Vet- NDSU wont be good forever- stay in the FCS
me- we are unprecedentedly good and it aint changing any time soon- besides, it doesnt even matter since on the field competition isnt that important in this conversation
you- yeah, what HE said
Me- wait, so now you think on field competition IS important?
You- How dare you, Sir! How Dare you!

---

Show me where I say stay in FCS.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

Have you ever answered a direct question in your life? Literally at any point?

Do you take this women to be your wife?
"Havent I made that clear?
Is that a yes or a no?
"ahhh are you really that stupid?"
Just say yes or no please
"QUIT SCREAMING, FBS NEEDS MONEY!"
....wut?

---

Let's be honest for a moment.

Do we really think that in an age where Universities are struggling to make ends meet that the rest of the FCS will "up its game" when it is very likely that FCS football funding at most schools will decline over the next 5-10 years? If i had to bet the gap between the top 2-3 FCS schools and the rest of the pack will bigger not smaller.

If this is true, where do we think that the FCS will be in 10 years? Will it be something that we want to be a part of? Does anyone actually believe that if it comes to that and we are finally ready to make a move that any P5/G5 conference would want us? Especially if there is more money for each conference due to expanded playoffs? I would bet that the conferences will NOT be adding to dilute the money more.

That is why I believe it would be in the best interest of NDSU in the long run (even with all the money, conference, stadium issues) to make a move so that when that day comes where we are ready we can look to move up even higher instead of being stuck in the FCS with no place to go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

So now competitive success IS a reason to go FBS? havent you agreed multiple times in this thread that is ISNT important- that instead, all the other factors are more important?

Just trying to keep track of all the goal posts youre moving

---

its what "the squad" does. move goalposts. they are the crabs at the bottom of the bucket.

The world of athletics administrators is very small. They all know each other. I guarantee at least casual conversations have taken place over a beer at a hotel bar at an NCAA event between our administration and those associated with schools and/or conferences where the Bison could land. They all know who NDSU is and what they could do for their conference. If any of the G5 conferences discuss expansion I'm sure NDSU is at least a part of the conversation. They may not rank high due to proximity but as far as an educational institution, athletic performance, and possibly even market are not likely negatives.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IndyBison

The world of athletics administrators is very small. They all know each other. I guarantee at least casual conversations have taken place over a beer at a hotel bar at an NCAA event between our administration and those associated with schools and/or conferences where the Bison could land. They all know who NDSU is and what they could do for their conference. If any of the G5 conferences discuss expansion I'm sure NDSU is at least a part of the conversation. They may not rank high due to proximity but as far as an educational institution, athletic performance, and possibly even market are not likely negatives.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

---

Yup.

And these guys do this as their J-O-B-S. They know what talks and what walks when it comes to conference realignment better than any of us do.

the gap will increase and this dynasty isn't going to just end anytime soon.. what are we now 128-8 or something when the dynasty began? lets say 50 odd games left in treys career- what's the over under on record even with the fbs schools? 45-5? so that puts us with at least 10 out of 12 titles and roughly a 170-15 in 12 seasons

NDSU will remain the only serious option for talent to go to. so we wont just drop off like the 1980s when know one outside the tristate ever heard of us after all those titles in D2.

Treys senior year 2022-23 at the worst they need to have a plan to jump even if its independent.. we will for sure have done everything remotely possible in FCS at that time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IndyBison

The world of athletics administrators is very small. They all know each other. I guarantee at least casual conversations have taken place over a beer at a hotel bar at an NCAA event between our administration and those associated with schools and/or conferences where the Bison could land. They all know who NDSU is and what they could do for their conference. If any of the G5 conferences discuss expansion I'm sure NDSU is at least a part of the conversation. They may not rank high due to proximity but as far as an educational institution, athletic performance, and possibly even market are not likely negatives.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

---

maybe but there are a lot of admin people in this world that are scared to take chances.. how much job pressure is there on a AD with a football team that goes undefeated every year? not saying that our guys are like that and don't know them but things like that happen everywhere in business.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fmfantasy

maybe but there are a lot of admin people in this world that are scared to take chances.. how much job pressure is there on a AD with a football team that goes undefeated every year? not saying that our guys are like that and don't know them but things like that happen everywhere in business.

---

How much pressure was there on Larsen to make the right decision and do it quickly last December in regards to where to go with a football head coaching hire? He aced that test.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Professor Chaos

How much pressure was there on Larsen to make the right decision and do it quickly last December in regards to where to go with a football head coaching hire? He aced that test.

---

stress? aced test? the incumbent was right in the wings waiting for the opportunity. now, if all of the coaches left and he had to find a non-ndsu guy then that would be acing the test. this...not so much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NDSUguy

stress? aced test? the incumbent was right in the wings waiting for the opportunity. now, if all of the coaches left and he had to find a non-ndsu guy then that would be acing the test. this...not so much.

---

It's easy to say that in hindsight. He did this in all in about 48 hours the week of a semifinal playoff game. I didn't think Entz was as no-brainer of a hire as you apparently did. I admit I was wrong but Larsen deserves credit for steering the program through an incredibly seamless coaching transition in an incredibly short timeframe.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NDSUguy

stress? aced test? the incumbent was right in the wings waiting for the opportunity. now, if all of the coaches left and he had to find a non-ndsu guy then that would be acing the test. this...not so much.

---

Entz could of went to Kansas St and made 500k a year as defensive coordinator? Instead he is making 380k as a head coach. Entz had to make the choice also.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fmfantasy

the gap will increase and this dynasty isn't going to just end anytime soon.. what are we now 128-8 or something when the dynasty began? lets say 50 odd games left in treys career- what's the over under on record even with the fbs schools? 45-5? so that puts us with at least 10 out of 12 titles and roughly a 170-15 in 12 seasons

NDSU will remain the only serious option for talent to go to. so we wont just drop off like the 1980s when know one outside the tristate ever heard of us after all those titles in D2.

Treys senior year 2022-23 at the worst they need to have a plan to jump even if its independent.. we will for sure have done everything remotely possible in FCS at that time.

---

How many times does it take to explain to you that winning/dominating has fairly little to do with the decision to move from the FCS to the FBS? NDSU could win all its games for the next decade or century and still be FCS if the actually problems for NDSU being stuck at this level don't change. Don't blame the winning (and therefore, degrading the players and staff's achievements), administration or loyal fans for why NDSU is FCS. Blame the lack of support and funding.

Solving problems aren't done by blaming the results.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Christopher Moen

How many times does it take to explain to you that winning/dominating has fairly little to do with the decision to move from the FCS to the FBS? NDSU could win all its games for the next decade or century and still be FCS if the actually problems for NDSU being stuck at this level don't change. Don't blame the winning (and therefore, degrading the players and staff's achievements), administration or loyal fans for why NDSU is FCS. Blame the lack of support and funding.

Solving problems aren't done by blaming the results.

---

I would agree- Just because you're good at football- doesnt mean you're ready to jump as a program (funding facilities conference etc). however I think success is an indicator that you DO have those things. We do have good funding, and facilities (no conference). To this point, we are in a better spot with funding and facilities than MANY who have jumped before us- many of which who have been successful and many more who have NOT been successful. Even the most successful Programs in FCS who had moved up moved up with less funding, and less success on the field (BUT THEY HAD A CONFERENCE).

Success on the field doesnt necessarily mean you're ready, but it is a symptom of having the right "vitals" to jump. There's defnitely not a lack of support and funding. Out of pocket donations to the athletic program are virtually the best in the FCS, correct? Last I heard, we would be top half of the MAC right now when it comes to Booster club donations. If we had just a median Student fees for athletics (not suggesting we should, just stating a fact) our athletic budget would be more than sufficient for MAC.
People act like we're light years away from the funding side, and its simply not true.

To me it all comes down to a conference- and thats the hardest one to fix because we dont have control. NDSU has done a great job of improving the rest of the "vitals" over the last decade to make us more attractive for a potential jump.

I dont think the P5 will break off, but I think once the playoff expands there will be a conference shuffle that will likely affect NDSU. who knows

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IndyBison

The world of athletics administrators is very small. They all know each other. I guarantee at least casual conversations have taken place over a beer at a hotel bar at an NCAA event between our administration and those associated with schools and/or conferences where the Bison could land. They all know who NDSU is and what they could do for their conference. If any of the G5 conferences discuss expansion I'm sure NDSU is at least a part of the conversation. They may not rank high due to proximity but as far as an educational institution, athletic performance, and possibly even market are not likely negatives.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

---

Been say this for years.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 56BISON73

I remember Gene Taylor telling me the biggest surprise he had in the transition was all of the administrative and academic changes and duties that needed to be done. All of the internal work that nobody really sees or knows about.

---

I remember that too. People have to think about that. Universities are here for a reason. Not just to field athletic teams. Eventhough that is what most of us old timers see when we interact with our alma mater these days. Public Universities are pretty damn vital to the growth and innovation of our State and region.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

I would agree- Just because you're good at football- doesnt mean you're ready to jump as a program (funding facilities conference etc). however I think success is an indicator that you DO have those things. We do have good funding, and facilities (no conference). To this point, we are in a better spot with funding and facilities than MANY who have jumped before us- many of which who have been successful and many more who have NOT been successful. Even the most successful Programs in FCS who had moved up moved up with less funding, and less success on the field (BUT THEY HAD A CONFERENCE).

Success on the field doesnt necessarily mean you're ready, but it is a symptom of having the right "vitals" to jump. There's defnitely not a lack of support and funding. Out of pocket donations to the athletic program are virtually the best in the FCS, correct? Last I heard, we would be top half of the MAC right now when it comes to Booster club donations. If we had just a median Student fees for athletics (not suggesting we should, just stating a fact) our athletic budget would be more than sufficient for MAC.
People act like we're light years away from the funding side, and its simply not true.

To me it all comes down to a conference- and thats the hardest one to fix because we dont have control. NDSU has done a great job of improving the rest of the "vitals" over the last decade to make us more attractive for a potential jump.

I dont think the P5 will break off, but I think once the playoff expands there will be a conference shuffle that will likely affect NDSU. who knows

---

If you don't believe the reasons why I have stated for being the reasons why weren't not getting FBS conference invites, then I can't help you.

FBS conferences aren't asking NDSU to join because they're afraid of them. Like the Jimmy Buffett song (If the Phone Doesn’t Ring, It’s Me) alludes to, the State of North Dakota has work to do if NDSU is ever going to be a viable candidate to get an invite.

In regards to the P5 break off, again, as I have stated numerous times, it has already been done.

The plan in summary:

1. Fund and build the IPF
2. Grow basketball funding/program
3. Lay the ground work for the next football stadium

Those are occurring currently to various degrees and we are progressing. No disagreement from me there. However, these are major investments that will take time and money to come to fruition.

Where I do have more concerns is that I believe the market is changing faster than the current administration or anyone, including myself, was expecting. It is being dismissed that the past two games were an anomaly because of hunting/harvest/cold weather. That is plausible and a definite possibility. However, the trend goes back further than that. Professor Chaos, you were on this forum last year pointing out the dip in playoff attendance last year specifically. This isn't something that is only caused by hunting/harvest/cold weather. This is a result of the perceived lack of competition in FCS. How does the administration address this and find ways to overcome that perception. Step 1 above can likely be achieved with or without any major changes as it sounds like a fair amount of the fundraising for the IPF is in place. However, Step 2 and Step 3 are absolutely contingent on continued fan support, fundraising, and buzz around this program. What happens if the perceived lack of competition contributes to a quicker decline in fan support and fundraising resulting in Steps 2 and 3 not being achieved. No one here is questioning the commitment of the current supporters/donors of the program. My concern is that CAS, 56BISON73, Professor Chaos and others like them have helped to build what we see now, Thank you. However, they are not the ones that will take us to the next level alone. We need the newly acquired fans that hopped on the bandwagon in the past decade to continue to grow their loyalty in order to push the schools academic and athletic brand to new heights. I'm worried that is not possible with FCS in it's current state. We better hope that SDSU, UND, JMU, Montana, Montana St. and others are willing to chase us down. If they are not, unfortunately this trend is going to continue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El_Chapo

Scottie. Plenty of options out there .

Legacy fund has 6.5 Billion in it. Wouldn't giving money to a state funded on campus 42,000 football stadium help the state?

---

If there were 100 ideas of how to spend the Legacy fund money, I guarantee this idea would be ranked dead last.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigLakeBison

The plan in summary:

1. Fund and build the IPF
2. Grow basketball funding/program
3. Lay the ground work for the next football stadium

Those are occurring currently to various degrees and we are progressing. No disagreement from me there. However, these are major investments that will take time and money to come to fruition.

Where I do have more concerns is that I believe the market is changing faster than the current administration or anyone, including myself, was expecting. It is being dismissed that the past two games were an anomaly because of hunting/harvest/cold weather. That is plausible and a definite possibility. However, the trend goes back further than that. Professor Chaos, you were on this forum last year pointing out the dip in playoff attendance last year specifically. This isn't something that is only caused by hunting/harvest/cold weather. This is a result of the perceived lack of competition in FCS. How does the administration address this and find ways to overcome that perception. Step 1 above can likely be achieved with or without any major changes as it sounds like a fair amount of the fundraising for the IPF is in place. However, Step 2 and Step 3 are absolutely contingent on continued fan support, fundraising, and buzz around this program. What happens if the perceived lack of competition contributes to a quicker decline in fan support and fundraising resulting in Steps 2 and 3 not being achieved. No one here is questioning the commitment of the current supporters/donors of the program. My concern is that CAS, 56BISON73, Professor Chaos and others like them have helped to build what we see now, Thank you. However, they are not the ones that will take us to the next level alone. We need the newly acquired fans that hopped on the bandwagon in the past decade to continue to grow their loyalty in order to push the schools academic and athletic brand to new heights. I'm worried that is not possible with FCS in it's current state. We better hope that SDSU, UND, JMU, Montana, Montana St. and others are willing to chase us down. If they are not, unfortunately this trend is going to continue.

---

We also need to our academic buildings and academic prestige. This is important in increasing our National Brand academically and athletically.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fmfantasy

the gap will increase and this dynasty isn't going to just end anytime soon.. what are we now 128-8 or something when the dynasty began? lets say 50 odd games left in treys career- what's the over under on record even with the fbs schools? 45-5? so that puts us with at least 10 out of 12 titles and roughly a 170-15 in 12 seasons

NDSU will remain the only serious option for talent to go to. so we wont just drop off like the 1980s when know one outside the tristate ever heard of us after all those titles in D2.

Treys senior year 2022-23 at the worst they need to have a plan to jump even if its independent.. we will for sure have done everything remotely possible in FCS at that time.

---

That's the reason why talent is coming here vs going MAC or MW. Athletes want to win championships. They want rings and they want banners and they want to hoist trophies. They want to be considered the best. They dont want to go to Akron Ohio or Dekalb Illinois or Las Cruces New Mexico and win 24 games in their whole college carrier when they can come here and win 15-16 games a year and leave with multiple natty rings. And they'll cherish those rings and show them off and hold them near and dear to their heart because the only thing those rings signify is that they were the best.

Im sure CAS wears his rings from his DII titles (as he damn well should). I know Scott Fuchs had his out on display, as well as the ones he won with SIU. Those things mean a shit load to athletes and they dont really GAF is someone they dont even know in another area of the country knows who they are or where they play.

Kids are coming to NDSU because they want to be the best.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigLakeBison

The plan in summary:

1. Fund and build the IPF
2. Grow basketball funding/program
3. Lay the ground work for the next football stadium

Those are occurring currently to various degrees and we are progressing. No disagreement from me there. However, these are major investments that will take time and money to come to fruition.

Where I do have more concerns is that I believe the market is changing faster than the current administration or anyone, including myself, was expecting. It is being dismissed that the past two games were an anomaly because of hunting/harvest/cold weather. That is plausible and a definite possibility. However, the trend goes back further than that. Professor Chaos, you were on this forum last year pointing out the dip in playoff attendance last year specifically. This isn't something that is only caused by hunting/harvest/cold weather. This is a result of the perceived lack of competition in FCS. How does the administration address this and find ways to overcome that perception. Step 1 above can likely be achieved with or without any major changes as it sounds like a fair amount of the fundraising for the IPF is in place. However, Step 2 and Step 3 are absolutely contingent on continued fan support, fundraising, and buzz around this program. What happens if the perceived lack of competition contributes to a quicker decline in fan support and fundraising resulting in Steps 2 and 3 not being achieved. No one here is questioning the commitment of the current supporters/donors of the program. My concern is that CAS, 56BISON73, Professor Chaos and others like them have helped to build what we see now, Thank you. However, they are not the ones that will take us to the next level alone. We need the newly acquired fans that hopped on the bandwagon in the past decade to continue to grow their loyalty in order to push the schools academic and athletic brand to new heights. I'm worried that is not possible with FCS in it's current state. We better hope that SDSU, UND, JMU, Montana, Montana St. and others are willing to chase us down. If they are not, unfortunately this trend is going to continue.

---

My worry is that if everything you're saying is true how long before fans become bored with New Mexico, Akron, Nevada, Bowling Green, etc? Maybe they'd already be bored with those teams? Are fans becoming bored with winning or are they just becoming bored with going to live college football and/or the increasing costs associated with it (ticket prices have gone up considerably in the last 6 years)? I pointed out earlier in this thread that App St and Georgia Southern had higher attendance averages their last year as postseason eligible FCS schools in 2012 than they did last year.

Your point about needing a new wave of fans/donors is a valid one but that needs to comes from young alumni correct? Student interest is waning even more than general fan interest is and that's a problem everywhere even in places like Alabama. I don't think FBS is the cure all for this and if it isn't you've just invested even more into a product whose returns are leveling off or diminishing from a fan interest/investment standpoint.

That's why I'd really like to see a new venue before an FBS move is made. Flood the market with lower price point seats allowing younger fans with more easily attainable and affordable opportunities for tickets. I think a right sized stadium is one that'll accommodate demand for the biggest games not one that'll still sell out even for the least hyped games. In that scenario you've got potential to really grow ticket revenue and donation revenue. Without that you're going to have to make up the gap with student fees and school funds and good luck trying to crack that egg.

But, if an opportunity arises to join a conference like the MWC or AAC, NDSU needs to put themselves in the best position to be able to make that jump. If that opportunity comes next year there's going to need to be some hard conversations about increasing revenue streams from fans, donors, students, and the school. If that opportunity doesn't come for 10 years then we've got plenty of work to do in the meantime in order to position ourselves better to make that jump.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MankatoBison

I would agree- Just because you're good at football- doesnt mean you're ready to jump as a program (funding facilities conference etc). however I think success is an indicator that you DO have those things. We do have good funding, and facilities (no conference). To this point, we are in a better spot with funding and facilities than MANY who have jumped before us- many of which who have been successful and many more who have NOT been successful. Even the most successful Programs in FCS who had moved up moved up with less funding, and less success on the field (BUT THEY HAD A CONFERENCE).

Success on the field doesnt necessarily mean you're ready, but it is a symptom of having the right "vitals" to jump. There's defnitely not a lack of support and funding. Out of pocket donations to the athletic program are virtually the best in the FCS, correct? Last I heard, we would be top half of the MAC right now when it comes to Booster club donations. If we had just a median Student fees for athletics (not suggesting we should, just stating a fact) our athletic budget would be more than sufficient for MAC.
People act like we're light years away from the funding side, and its simply not true.

To me it all comes down to a conference- and thats the hardest one to fix because we dont have control. NDSU has done a great job of improving the rest of the "vitals" over the last decade to make us more attractive for a potential jump.

I dont think the P5 will break off, but I think once the playoff expands there will be a conference shuffle that will likely affect NDSU. who knows

---

I am waiting for you to show where I said stay FCS. In lieu of that I will just take it as a tacit admission you made it up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vet70

I am waiting for you to show where I said stay FCS. In lieu of that I will just take it as a tacit admission you made it up.

---

Hes our new drama queen. Its what they do.

If we are seeking a full acceptance into a conference, we also have to meet the academic standards. Which include research dollars, research facilities, and overall academic ranking. While football is on forefront, all of the behind the scenes requirements have to match up as well.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kingbison

If we are seeking a full acceptance into a conference, we also have to meet the academic standards. Which include research dollars, research facilities, and overall academic ranking. While football is on forefront, all of the behind the scenes requirements have to match up as well.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

---

100%.........

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Professor Chaos

My worry is that if everything you're saying is true how long before fans become bored with New Mexico, Akron, Nevada, Bowling Green, etc? Maybe they'd already be bored with those teams? Are fans becoming bored with winning or are they just becoming bored with going to live college football and/or the increasing costs associated with it (ticket prices have gone up considerably in the last 6 years)? I pointed out earlier in this thread that App St and Georgia Southern had higher attendance averages their last year as postseason eligible FCS schools in 2012 than they did last year.

Your point about needing a new wave of fans/donors is a valid one but that needs to comes from young alumni correct? Student interest is waning even more than general fan interest is and that's a problem everywhere even in places like Alabama. I don't think FBS is the cure all for this and if it isn't you've just invested even more into a product whose returns are leveling off or diminishing from a fan interest/investment standpoint.

That's why I'd really like to see a new venue before an FBS move is made. Flood the market with lower price point seats allowing younger fans with more easily attainable and affordable opportunities for tickets. I think a right sized stadium is one that'll accommodate demand for the biggest games not one that'll still sell out even for the least hyped games. In that scenario you've got potential to really grow ticket revenue and donation revenue. Without that you're going to have to make up the gap with student fees and school funds and good luck trying to crack that egg.

But, if an opportunity arises to join a conference like the MWC or AAC, NDSU needs to put themselves in the best position to be able to make that jump. If that opportunity comes next year there's going to need to be some hard conversations about increasing revenue streams from fans, donors, students, and the school. If that opportunity doesn't come for 10 years then we've got plenty of work to do in the meantime in order to position ourselves better to make that jump.

---

I agree with you. Again, I'm not advocating for a move to FBS at all costs. The new wave of donors comes from young alumni, relatively speaking. Yes we need to get students engaged in NDSU Athletics. But we also need to keep others who have been brought back into the fold over the past decade engaged. I have mentioned previously that the move to FCS and the success over the past decade plus is what re-connected me with the school. I'm not alone in that group. I have probably reconnected more than some and I'm not planning on going anywhere. However, I have friends who 5 years ago would absolutely go to a watch party with me or try to attend a game a year with me. They have begun to lose interest. Is that because of ticket price increases? Yes. Is it because it is hard for some who don't have season tickets to get tickets on August 1st? Yes. Is it difficult for them to change their plans last minute on a Friday if tickets become available? Yes. However, they were just a few short years ago doing all of those things. I think the combination of those items along with the perceived lack of competition in the FCS creates a storm of events that are contributing to the recent decline. Maybe it will end up being temporary. I hope so, but I fear that this is more of a long term trend unless something changes. I would like to believe there are things that can be done that don't involve a move to FBS.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by roadwarrior

If there were 100 ideas of how to spend the Legacy fund money, I guarantee this idea would be ranked dead last.

---

Idk road... I could come up with some pretty bad ideas.

Like building a 25 acre splash pad or maybe a 7th youth hockey arena in West Fargo... maybe Chapo still wins.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigLakeBison

I agree with you. Again, I'm not advocating for a move to FBS at all costs. The new wave of donors comes from young alumni, relatively speaking. Yes we need to get students engaged in NDSU Athletics. But we also need to keep others who have been brought back into the fold over the past decade engaged. I have mentioned previously that the move to FCS and the success over the past decade plus is what re-connected me with the school. I'm not alone in that group. I have probably reconnected more than some and I'm not planning on going anywhere. However, I have friends who 5 years ago would absolutely go to a watch party with me or try to attend a game a year with me. They have begun to lose interest. Is that because of ticket price increases? Yes. Is it because it is hard for some who don't have season tickets to get tickets on August 1st? Yes. Is it difficult for them to change their plans last minute on a Friday if tickets become available? Yes. However, they were just a few short years ago doing all of those things. I think the combination of those items along with the perceived lack of competition in the FCS creates a storm of events that are contributing to the recent decline. Maybe it will end up being temporary. I hope so, but I fear that this is more of a long term trend unless something changes. I would like to believe there are things that can be done that don't involve a move to FBS.

---

I don't think we disagree on much of anything here. As someone who doubled/tripled/quadrupled down on my fandom in the 2006/2007 timeframe I can say that the main reasons for me was seeing the men's basketball team beat Wisconsin and Marquette and seeing the football team compete with and beat Minnesota (along with Ball St and Central Michigan).

So I can understand the benefits of being FBS and beating those higher profile opponents can have on the casual fan. But that shock/elation factor has worn off to some degree because I think most Bison fans would expect to beat those teams in Year 1 of FBS. I guess you can aim for the bigger fish like the Ohio St's and the Oklahoma's of the world as a G5 squad but that's also a much much bigger undertaking than beating Minnesota and Ball St.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Professor Chaos

I don't think we disagree on much of anything here. As someone who doubled/tripled/quadrupled down on my fandom in the 2006/2007 timeframe I can say that the main reasons for me was seeing the men's basketball team beat Wisconsin and Marquette and seeing the football team compete with and beat Minnesota (along with Ball St and Central Michigan).

So I can understand the benefits of being FBS and beating those higher profile opponents can have on the casual fan. But that shock/elation factor has worn off to some degree because I think most Bison fans would expect to beat those teams in Year 1 of FBS. I guess you can aim for the bigger fish like the Ohio St's and the Oklahoma's of the world as a G5 squad but that's also a much much bigger undertaking than beating Minnesota and Ball St.

---

You're absolutely correct. I mentioned this in the Bison Fatigue thread. Bison fandom is contagious when the passion of the fanbase is on full display. I don't believe it has been on display much recently and that concerns me. Just like you, I'm not sold that an FBS move will solve that. However, I don't want to see that passion decline and we end up in a place where the current Gopher Hockey program is. I know, I know...apples v. oranges but I believe there are some lessons that can be learned from that situation. Don't take anything for granted.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by G_Funky

That's the reason why talent is coming here vs going MAC or MW. Athletes want to win championships. They want rings and they want banners and they want to hoist trophies. They want to be considered the best. They dont want to go to Akron Ohio or Dekalb Illinois or Las Cruces New Mexico and win 24 games in their whole college carrier when they can come here and win 15-16 games a year and leave with multiple natty rings. And they'll cherish those rings and show them off and hold them near and dear to their heart because the only thing those rings signify is that they were the best.

Im sure CAS wears his rings from his DII titles (as he damn well should). I know Scott Fuchs had his out on display, as well as the ones he won with SIU. Those things mean a shit load to athletes and they dont really GAF is someone they dont even know in another area of the country knows who they are or where they play.

Kids are coming to NDSU because they want to be the best.

---

The Kids also want to play in front of big crowds. Think about that v. Decreases fan. attendance.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vet70

I am happy I could provide you with a stupid argument. If you read what went before my post you would see the statement was made that the jump could be made based on sustained success. Thus the argument you ridicule came from a FBS now supportér. Being satisfied with a competitive team sounds like you are from UND. Many fans at NDSU measure the term in the number of championships. You need to look at 21years of history before the current run.

---

So what do you say to millions of fans of UCLA, Arizona , Iowa, Tennessee etc. Teams that will NEVER win a National Title? should they drop down to FCS so they can win championships?


and once again the AAC would be FOOTBALL ONLY.

MAC/MWC would be for all sports (which would help our other sports too!) can you imagine the jump in talent?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El_Chapo

So what do you say to millions of fans of UCLA, Arizona , Iowa, Tennessee etc. Teams that will NEVER win a National Title? should they drop down to FCS so they can win championships?


and once again the AAC would be FOOTBALL ONLY.

MAC/MWC would be for all sports (which would help our other sports too!) can you imagine the jump in talent?

---

I say leave it to you to take something out of context.

This isn't a case to move up now, but I just had a vision of how things could decline the longer a move takes to develop.

NDSU's funding stagnates or declines (as it does periodically) and college leadership considers the lessened fan interest in football, despite the continuing success of the program on the field. Knowing that NDSU can continue to beat 90% of FCS even with no new, or even fewer, resources, the administration's commitment, fiscal and other, declines. The team would still win, but the number of wins each year could be expected to decline as parity returns to FCS. After a few more years, no one here would be talking FBS.

Hope this is just my dystopian nightmare...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kingbison

If we are seeking a full acceptance into a conference, we also have to meet the academic standards. Which include research dollars, research facilities, and overall academic ranking. While football is on forefront, all of the behind the scenes requirements have to match up as well.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

---

Yeah, I think it is safe to say we meet that for any G5 conference....we wouldn't be joining the Big 10.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El_Chapo

So what do you say to millions of fans of UCLA, Arizona , Iowa, Tennessee etc. Teams that will NEVER win a National Title? should they drop down to FCS so they can win championships?


and once again the AAC would be FOOTBALL ONLY.

MAC/MWC would be for all sports (which would help our other sports too!) can you imagine the jump in talent?

---

So now we have to have TWO conference invites when we cant get just one? Thats some shrewd thinking right there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NDSUguy

Let's be honest for a moment.

Do we really think that in an age where Universities are struggling to make ends meet that the rest of the FCS will "up its game" when it is very likely that FCS football funding at most schools will decline over the next 5-10 years? If i had to bet the gap between the top 2-3 FCS schools and the rest of the pack will bigger not smaller.

If this is true, where do we think that the FCS will be in 10 years? Will it be something that we want to be a part of? Does anyone actually believe that if it comes to that and we are finally ready to make a move that any P5/G5 conference would want us? Especially if there is more money for each conference due to expanded playoffs? I would bet that the conferences will NOT be adding to dilute the money more.

That is why I believe it would be in the best interest of NDSU in the long run (even with all the money, conference, stadium issues) to make a move so that when that day comes where we are ready we can look to move up even higher instead of being stuck in the FCS with no place to go.

---

This is where I'm at guy, well stated---------many. Have said wait until 2024 when tv contracts and current playoff contracts are up, wait for the p5/g5 slip then see what happens--------but what happens if the expand the playoffs to a "March madness" contract where Cinderella gets a shot? Good luck moving up after that....the stakes are high and so am I!!! Really enjoying these discussions by the way, keep it up bisonville!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 56BISON73

So now we have to have TWO conference invites when we cant get just one? Thats some shrewd thinking right there.

---

Amazing he pulls all this from a hypothetical article on fan site, which was probably written by someone who is clueless on how conference invites work.

Not to mention, I believe the article lists 20-25 teams that could replace UCONN - a school, despite its basketball success for Men’s and Women’s, is leaving because they are losing money, which includes their major sports. That should be a huge arse red flag for any school joining the conference.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk