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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
Well Dak and Jalen take the pressure off of Carson with their playoff performances.
Remember why I gave up on the nfl before the flood of Bison made the pros. Was reminded during the Bengals vs raiders. They talk about that whistle before the td. Well the first Bengal td the ball bounced off the turf and it was never reviewed. I'm not sure the players are involved but the refs really seem to have an impact on the outcome of these big games. And the Dallas move the ball the length of the football thing? Didn't end up mattering but what a bunch of crap.
Lol Dak's biggest mistake yesterday was applauding the fans for throwing objects at the refs. Unreal...
He'll obviously get a pass for it, but still
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
And the Dallas move the ball the length of the football thing? Didn't end up mattering but what a bunch of crap.
One of the very first things that we teach little kids about the game is to put the ball on the ground or hand it to an official at the end of every play. If a third grader can understand that concept, so should grown ass men. In just about every hurry-up offense that I'm used to seeing, the offense knows 100% to make sure that the official has quick and uninterrupted access to the ball so that they can get the next play ready. It is an elemental concept that the Cowboy players forgot yesterday.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OrygunBison
One of the very first things that we teach little kids about the game is to put the ball on the ground or hand it to an official at the end of every play. If a third grader can understand that concept, so should grown ass men. In just about every hurry-up offense that I'm used to seeing, the offense knows 100% to make sure that the official has quick and uninterrupted access to the ball so that they can get the next play ready. It is an elemental concept that the Cowboy players forgot yesterday.
No there was a play where the 49ers got a first down. They moved the ball back a half of the football length and made them go for it on 4th down. They converted so it didn't matter but it was stupid to move it that little of a bit in the first place.
Dak is dak.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OrygunBison
One of the very first things that we teach little kids about the game is to put the ball on the ground or hand it to an official at the end of every play. If a third grader can understand that concept, so should grown ass men. In just about every hurry-up offense that I'm used to seeing, the offense knows 100% to make sure that the official has quick and uninterrupted access to the ball so that they can get the next play ready. It is an elemental concept that the Cowboy players forgot yesterday.
Dallas has nobody to blame but themselves for that ending. They knew they didn't have any timeouts left, but they still ran up the middle with seconds left and no timeouts.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
No there was a play where the 49ers got a first down. They moved the ball back a half of the football length and made them go for it on 4th down. They converted so it didn't matter but it was stupid to move it that little of a bit in the first place.
So, they shouldn't worry about ball placement as it relates to first downs? That's like the argument a few weeks ago about BV wanting to redefine the definition of a forward pass.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OrygunBison
So, they shouldn't worry about ball placement as it relates to first downs? That's like the argument a few weeks ago about BV wanting to redefine the definition of a forward pass.
They measured gave them the first down and then ended up reviewing it and moving the ball six inches so it wasn't a first down. Would have been different if they just reviewed it right away. It added a good extra ten minutes and had absolutely no effect on the outcome. That's what I get sick of. And how did they not review the first Bengals td if the replay booth can tell they didn't spot the ball right? When they came back from the break after the first Bengals td somebody had taken the time to cut the replay right so you don't see the fumble. They just conveniently use replay when they want too. That's s joke.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXMoEmv70tM
This play was not even reviewed. Yet they could tell they didn't spot the ball right during the other game.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
You have technology so good you can spot the football sub inch but don't review a score in a playoff game?
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NDSU92
Lol Dak's biggest mistake yesterday was applauding the fans for throwing objects at the refs. Unreal...
He'll obviously get a pass for it, but still
Wow? Really? Tool. His team screwed up. That's not on the Refs. They did everything possible to allow them to get a play off, but the Cowboys screwed up with their clock managment.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
The NFL needs to figure out when "going to the ground" matters in a catch.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
Every score is reviewed. Just because they don't stop the game and send the referee over to the screen doesn't mean it's not reviewed. The referee holds up the try until he gets confirmation from the replay official the call stands. In this case the replay official thought the receiver had already completed the catch before he was taken to the ground or held it long enough once he hit the ground. I've only seen this one angle so I'm not sure what it looked like from other angles.
Comparing this to the review of the spot are like comparing apples and oranges. They are very different situations and very different rules. Replay will become more and more involved in sports, but is it always a good thing?
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IndyBison
Every score is reviewed. Just because they don't stop the game and send the referee over to the screen doesn't mean it's not reviewed. The referee holds up the try until he gets confirmation from the replay official the call stands. In this case the replay official thought the receiver had already completed the catch before he was taken to the ground or held it long enough once he hit the ground. I've only seen this one angle so I'm not sure what it looked like from other angles.
Comparing this to the review of the spot are like comparing apples and oranges. They are very different situations and very different rules. Replay will become more and more involved in sports, but is it always a good thing?
I was under the impression that a player had to "make a football move" before going to the ground or they were held to the standard of maintaining control through the process of going to the ground. I'm not sure what kind of football move he did other than get tackled.
The NFL has had issues with the catch rule for years. Too many ambiguous terms. I get that some calls are very much up to the officials opinion on whether this or that happened but when it comes to something as important and visible as a completion and then on top of that a completion in the end zone there has to be a better way of making it universally clear.
I've only seen this one angle a couple times but I didn't seen anything that satisfied ALL of the rules laid out here.
https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules...eting-a-catch/
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TAILG8R
I was under the impression that a player had to "make a football move" before going to the ground or they were held to the standard of maintaining control through the process of going to the ground. I'm not sure what kind of football move he did other than get tackled.
The NFL has had issues with the catch rule for years. Too many ambiguous terms. I get that some calls are very much up to the officials opinion on whether this or that happened but when it comes to something as important and visible as a completion and then on top of that a completion in the end zone there has to be a better way of making it universally clear.
I've only seen this one angle a couple times but I didn't seen anything that satisfied ALL of the rules laid out here.
https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules...eting-a-catch/
Why don't they just go back to one foot w/ possession and two feet w/ possession? Why did they ever start with the "process of the catch", "football move", "successfully go to ground", "accept the football as their lord and savior" crap?
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TAILG8R
I was under the impression that a player had to "make a football move" before going to the ground or they were held to the standard of maintaining control through the process of going to the ground. I'm not sure what kind of football move he did other than get tackled.
The NFL has had issues with the catch rule for years. Too many ambiguous terms. I get that some calls are very much up to the officials opinion on whether this or that happened but when it comes to something as important and visible as a completion and then on top of that a completion in the end zone there has to be a better way of making it universally clear.
I've only seen this one angle a couple times but I didn't seen anything that satisfied ALL of the rules laid out here.
https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules...eting-a-catch/
Football move is definitely factor but so is a time element. If you are in the end zone you have no need to make a football move to get anywhere else so time element is more important. If he's standing still when he catches it then it's more of a time issue. If he makes a football move for some reason (especially if he's moving as he catches it) that helps his case that he's completed the catch.
The fan confusion around a catch is directly related to the implementation of replay. Replay always causes rules to become much more technical and toward black and white. It has made the calls much more consistent from a very technical perspective, but it's also made catches that look like they should be catches incomplete. Is that really a good thing?
Based on the live view it seems like this should have been incomplete, but they may have used the criteria I mentioned in my previous post to rule catch. No two plays are exactly the same. Yes if you are going to the ground as part of the catch you have to maintain control or not let the ball hit the ground while loose if you are still in bounds. But if you determine they have completed the catch by a time element or football move prior to going to the ground
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NDSU92
Why don't they just go back to one foot w/ possession and two feet w/ possession? Why did they ever start with the "process of the catch", "football move", "successfully go to ground", "accept the football as their lord and savior" crap?
That's actually what they do but because of replay they needed to further define possession. As I mentioned in my previous post those terms actually make the catch/no catch much more consistent. It will never be black and white though. That's just not how football works.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
I get genuinely tired of hearing so many fans constantly bitching about officiating of the game. If you don't want the the refs to influence the game, play less on the margins and kick more ass. That's generally been the way that the Bison have taken care of business and I think that it works.
Many of the most vocally angry fans don't have a fucking clue about what they are seeing yet they whine and whine about it.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OrygunBison
I get genuinely tired of hearing so many fans constantly bitching about officiating of the game. If you don't want the the refs to influence the game, play less on the margins and kick more ass. That's generally been the way that the Bison have taken care of business and I think that it works.
Many of the most vocally angry fans don't have a fucking clue about what they are seeing yet they whine and whine about it.
The challenge with the NFL is many of the games are very close (outside of these playoffs) so each game has a couple plays people can point to. They ignore all the other plays that also played a factor. The relative importance of the plays at the end of a game especially though stand out. You never want to see incorrect or tight judgement calls affect the game but I think they add to the intrigue of the game. The ball is not round so it bounces funny.
Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IndyBison
Every score is reviewed. Just because they don't stop the game and send the referee over to the screen doesn't mean it's not reviewed. The referee holds up the try until he gets confirmation from the replay official the call stands. In this case the replay official thought the receiver had already completed the catch before he was taken to the ground or held it long enough once he hit the ground. I've only seen this one angle so I'm not sure what it looked like from other angles.
Comparing this to the review of the spot are like comparing apples and oranges. They are very different situations and very different rules. Replay will become more and more involved in sports, but is it always a good thing?
Sometimes you take the wrong part of my post and respond to it. I understand how replay works and that those 2 plays are apples and oranges. Somebody confirmed that td during the commercial break. It's just when they came back from the break they had the td edited so that you didn't see the fumble. That bugs me. I did hear those refs will not be allowed to officiate another playoff game this year so the NFL did realize they sucked and shouldn't be working big games.
I warned Bisonville about 5g years ago. I'm smarter then you guys give me credit for eh.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
FWIW I think the Bengals play above is a catch and TD. I think the only reason it is even being questioned by fans is the NFL did an absolute horse shit job with consistency when it came to the "maintaining possession all the way through the catch and going to ground" for two seasons in a row about 10 years ago. Remember the catch and non catch by Calvin Johnson in the same season?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uag-ClYRMs&ab_channel=PSCHighlights
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
scottietohottie
Sometimes you take the wrong part of my post and respond to it. I understand how replay works and that those 2 plays are apples and oranges. Somebody confirmed that td during the commercial break. It's just when they came back from the break they had the td edited so that you didn't see the fumble. That bugs me. I did hear those refs will not be allowed to officiate another playoff game this year so the NFL did realize they sucked and shouldn't be working big games.
I warned Bisonville about 5g years ago. I'm smarter then you guys give me credit for eh.
I don't get your first comment. You only had 2 parts to your post. One was that the catch wasn't review (I pointed out it was). And then you added that a very minor spot change was reviewed and changed.
As for what was shown after the commercial that is the TV production. Sounds like your issue is with them.
As for the refs not working any more playoffs that has nothing to do with their performance last weekend. Generally the officials who work Wild Card weekend are only working that weekend. The Super Bowl officials are assigned to work the Divisional round as well. Everyone else only works 1 game. They may be an alternate for another game but that is it. Exceptions are made depending on how they rated out during the season. If an official slated for the Super Bowl has a major error this week I guess it's possible they are pulled from the Super Bowl assignment, but they aren't known until next week so you really don't know if you were pulled. The media has taken any potential controversial calls and the officials not being assigned the rest of the playoffs as an indication the NFL is displeased with the call. There is no connection.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OrygunBison
I get genuinely tired of hearing so many fans constantly bitching about officiating of the game. If you don't want the the refs to influence the game, play less on the margins and kick more ass. That's generally been the way that the Bison have taken care of business and I think that it works.
Many of the most vocally angry fans don't have a fucking clue about what they are seeing yet they whine and whine about it.
I completely agree. My 9 year old son has a bad tendency to constant yell at the refs and he really does understand the rules, but I don't want this to translate to when he is actually playing so he gets grounded frequently. The refs for the most part do a fantastic job and do miss something once in a while. I get more irritated when a play goes to instant replay and they screw that up cause they can clearly see it slowed down. Missing a play during the game does not seem hard to me since the game moves so fast and there is quite a bit going on. This is coming from a guy that would periodically argue with a ref when playing high school sports :), I just don't do it anymore even as a travel BB coach.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Wow, has this thread drifted.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BisonVifte
Wow, has this thread drifted.
https://i.imgflip.com/61rl8a.jpg
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
isn't there a REF Thread for Indy to take your best shots at.
Merge these posts over.. Wentz only please! its' gonna be a scary few weeks
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El_Chapo
isn't there a REF Thread for Indy to take your best shots at.
Merge these posts over.. Wentz only please! its' gonna be a scary few weeks
It's not like Carson is making any news bro. Probably on a hunting trip eh
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El_Chapo
isn't there a REF Thread for Indy to take your best shots at.
Merge these posts over.. Wentz only please! its' gonna be a scary few weeks
Like being mauled by a bear scary?
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Carson Wentz news is scary? He's among the least worrisome QBs out there in terms of off-season behavior.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NDSU_grad
Like being mauled my a bear scary?
Bears aren't real.
Wake up, sheeple.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
WeAreThePride
Bears aren't real.
Wake up, sheeple.
Coming from a Chicago fan, I completely agree.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
I think the criticism on Wentz is overblown. He didn't play great and he didn't play horrible. He is just like Cousins. Even this year Cousins was taking some blame when for the most part he had a great year.
I looked up Wentz's fumble stats thinking they would be quite bad, but he had 8 fumbles according to the NFL site I looked at and after the top four QBs all of them had between 7-13. Murray had 13 and he doesn't take any blame for practically anything.
Now they are comparing Murray's bad play yesterday to Wentz. In my opinion it is a massive difference. If Wentz takes a sack there which was going to happen they don't get the ball back as it would have been safety. In some ways it was like the defense intentionally letting an offense score to get the ball back. Now I am not saying Wentz intentionally did it but the gamble was fine as they still had a chance to tie. No one discusses that at all they just completely bash him.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snowgoose
I think the criticism on Wentz is overblown. He didn't play great and he didn't play horrible. He is just like Cousins. Even this year Cousins was taking some blame when for the most part he had a great year.
I looked up Wentz's fumble stats thinking they would be quite bad, but he had 8 fumbles according to the NFL site I looked at and after the top four QBs all of them had between 7-13. Murray had 13 and he doesn't take any blame for practically anything.
Now they are comparing Murray's bad play yesterday to Wentz. In my opinion it is a massive difference. If Wentz takes a sack there which was going to happen they don't get the ball back as it would have been safety. In some ways it was like the defense intentionally letting an offense score to get the ball back. Now I am not saying Wentz intentionally did it but the gamble was fine as they still had a chance to tie. No one discusses that at all they just completely bash him.
QBs always get too much credit when a team is successful and too much blame when a team loses. Nature of the best.
Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IndyBison
QBs always get too much credit when a team is successful and too much blame when a team loses. Nature of the best.
Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
I just checked and Wentz this year had a 94.6 QB rating and threw 27 TDs compared to 7 ints. It's pretty amazing how much the game has changed -- that those numbers are now essentially mediocre. Imagine Elway or Aikman having stats like that in a season.
Edit: Elway's highest-ever TD total in a season was 27. He never had a season with single digit interceptions. Aikman threw more than 20 TDs once in his career - I realize it's because he simply didn't need to, but it's still interesting. This all makes me want to watch football from the 80s and 90s instead of today.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snowgoose
I think the criticism on Wentz is overblown. He didn't play great and he didn't play horrible. He is just like Cousins. Even this year Cousins was taking some blame when for the most part he had a great year.
I looked up Wentz's fumble stats thinking they would be quite bad, but he had 8 fumbles according to the NFL site I looked at and after the top four QBs all of them had between 7-13. Murray had 13 and he doesn't take any blame for practically anything.
Now they are comparing Murray's bad play yesterday to Wentz. In my opinion it is a massive difference. If Wentz takes a sack there which was going to happen they don't get the ball back as it would have been safety. In some ways it was like the defense intentionally letting an offense score to get the ball back. Now I am not saying Wentz intentionally did it but the gamble was fine as they still had a chance to tie. No one discusses that at all they just completely bash him.
People criticizing Wentz have an agenda. Oftentimes you’ll see them going after Cousins and Rodgers too.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Well we'll find out if Goodell wants Cincinnati to win today. He's at the game
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El_Chapo
Wentz > tannehill
Crazy how Tannehill went 12-5 in the same division, played the same teams as the Colts, got a first round bye without his stud RB for 8 games, had a better QBR, threw for more yards, had more YPG passing, got sacked more than Wentz, and Carson didn't even make the playoffs.
Oh well. Guess Ryan is lucky. Maybe he is Irish?
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wolfie
Crazy how Tannehill went 12-5 in the same division, played the same teams as the Colts, got a first round bye without his stud RB for 8 games, had a better QBR, threw for more yards, had more YPG passing, got sacked more than Wentz, and Carson didn't even make the playoffs.
Oh well. Guess Ryan is lucky. Maybe he is Irish?
He had a better oLine, duh.
:)
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wolfie
Crazy how Tannehill went 12-5 in the same division, played the same teams as the Colts, got a first round bye without his stud RB for 8 games, had a better QBR, threw for more yards, had more YPG passing, got sacked more than Wentz, and Carson didn't even make the playoffs.
Oh well. Guess Ryan is lucky. Maybe he is Irish?
Nice, next do TD, INT and QB rating
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NDSU92
Nice, next do TD, INT and QB rating
I did do the QBR. Tannehill was better. I guess since there are like 15 different QB rating calculations, you could of course find one that puts Wentz ahead if you want.
I can add completion percentage too if you'd like. Tannehill was better there. He also had a better PFF if you like stats such as those.
Also, Tannehill won both matchups against Wentz this season.
Both played the same exact teams. Tahnnehill was missing the best RB in the NFL for half the year as well.
Those 6 extra TD's Wentz threw didn't help much did they? But, if it makes you feel better, yes, he threw 6 more TD's and 7 less ints.
I'm just stating facts, and I know those don't mean much when people don't want them to.
Based off their overall stats, team record and head to head results, I'd have a hard time saying Wentz>Tannehill this season.
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Re: What sort of thread have you made for us? A Wentz thread, if you can keep it.
Wentz had a 94.6 QB rating and Tannehill had a 89.5
