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I'm not sure how to take that?Quote:
Originally Posted by semobison
But, I certainly hold no ill will against anyone for feeling differently about this than I do. I'm just one of those personalities that gets really pissed when something like that happens.
As Bergundy said, (I'm actually paraphrasing)....the table was being set perfectly for a public relations explosion next week in Fargo that would have propelled this program to an even more fantastic level. Epic? Oh, yes.....mucho epic.
Take er with a grain of salt Izzy! Or a shaker of salt and la lemon slice!! Bottom line. Referees are part of the game, and you know they did a decent job when you didnt notice them at all!
That's another interesting quote. It's also a goal of most officials but sometimes the ball doesn't bounce their way. This play was a perfect example. No matter what they decided on that play, everybody would have noticed them. You can't be completely invisible.Quote:
Originally Posted by semobison
Trying to watch the replay on ESPN3.com and just saw the 3rd down pass on the EWU second series. On a small screen of a webcast it is so hard to tell but it definitely looked like it hit the ground. The only way I can see that as a catch is if his hands were at least somewhat under the ball. The ball can contact the turf as part of the catch as long as the ground wasn't used to help complete the catch. Those of you who have the TV broadcast probably had a much better view than me. Not as obvious as many described but I think it was incomplete.
NDSU was penalized 4 times for 50 yards. Only one was for a personal foul. Please.Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
Two personal fouls, one in the first half, one in the second half.Quote:
Originally Posted by houndawg
I've watched the replay on espn3 a couple times and I still think he was down. I can understand the on field officials ruling fumble because it's a bang bang play and replay CAN correct an obvious error if you let it go. If you rule down and replay shows it was a fumble it can not be reviewed. Officials who work games with replay are instructed to lean this way on close plays. The problem is the replay officials are instructed to only overturn a call on the field if there is overwhelming evidence it was wrong. My guess here is the replay's definition of "overwhelming" wasn't enough in this play. I think there is some question on whether the ball was coming loose as he was reaching forward before he was down but I think he still had possession when his arms hit the ground and the ball popped out.
This play is a perfect example of why instant replay is not always a good thing. If the officials did not have replay, this most likely would have been ruled down on the field. The philosophy I've been taught is to lean toward down if it's this close because you don't want to allow a cheap turnover. But replay changes that philosophy because you can't review a play for fumble/no-fumble if the runner is ruled down. Then add in the "overwhelming" evidence criteria and replay doesn't help the situation but hurts it.
Careful what you ask you when it comes to replay. It's not a perfect system either.
The ruling on the field was fumble, touchback! The replay official agreed! I dont know if replay is good or not in the FCS games, because of lack of camera's. There were a couple of instances in the Nova-App game where I thought the replay official would overturn the play on the field, and they didnt..... I know what Vince Lombardi would say about this replay shit....WHAT IN THE HELL IS GOING ON OUT THERE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPGW_81TleI
here you go
I dont think there has been much argument anywhere that this was a blown call! Even EWU's fans agree! At this point we just have to live with it!
Are you just trying to prolong the sting, because that replay sucked. YOu couldn't see crap. I thought it would be a replay of some new angle or a super slow motion view. No, this vid SUCKS!
I agree Handox. but it's all we got, unless someone in the Clown Turf Grassy Knoll comes out with some video.
Its over. Move on to next year. Dwelling on all the coulda, woulda, shoulda (no shortage of those, of course) will only make you mad and not change anything.
We made it a heck of a lot longer than any of us thought we would after the Miss. State game and the future looks bright for next year.
I loved how Bohl put it on his show- cant really discuss it because he would be in trouble so him and Phil talk about the replay in the MVC- Bohl talks about how it needs to be done right...cameras, proper protocol- pause...then emphasis on " a competent person in the booth doing reviews".
that would be an indirect zziiiinnnng :bow:
Key point: the replay official didn't necessarily agree. He just didn't see enough to overturn it. There are two very specific announcements the referee is supposed to give:Quote:
Originally Posted by semobison
The ruling on the field stands = not enough to overturn
The ruling on the field is confirmed = replay showed the correct call was made
In this situation it was the former and not the latter so the replay official didn't necessarily agree with the call on the field. He just didn't have enough evidence to overturn the ruling on the field.
In general I like replay but it's not perfect.
On the other hand, Indy, in real time, I couldn't believe they called that a fumble. After seeing the replay, it was absolutely surreal.Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyBison
It kind of make me think that plays might not get overturned because refs want to have each other's backs.
How did they not confer in the endzone after making that call? Considering what was at stake it would have been nice to see the officials huddle and go over what they saw and what the implications would be. They didn't so the call went to replay with it being ruled a fumble without any discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by tony
I'm seeing a problem with that "overwhelming" word. anybody have some insight if they elaborate more on the definition of overwhelming in the officials handbook (looking at you referees)? if they dont define "overwhelming" for the officials, that leaves it wide open to interpretation for the officiating crew. that's a little too subjective for my liking.
The so called ref in the booth is a POS and should never referee a college game again. All sorts of excuses for him like poor camera work, etc., but from what they showed during the game this referee in the booth (assuming he was not biased) doesn't know the rules. Just a joke.
Sure, Bison should have taken care of things, but this is the way things turned out. What an a$$wipe of a booth guy. Hope he can live with himself, but I am sure he is too ignorant to know how bad he screwed up. When the referees do his review I say he gets an F.
This. Kind of like the whole no make up calls thing. (Indy you're not going to convince me otherwise :D)Quote:
Originally Posted by tony
Both replay calls were terrible. I thought the worst "screw job" of the day was the pass interference call.:ranting:Quote:
Originally Posted by SDbison
We can whine all we want, but its over. I feel bad for the seniors but we are going to be tougher than nails the next 3 to 4 years and this playoff game will only make our players hungry.:nod:
So going back to the last play, it seems like there is only 1 person who thought it was a fumble. I can't find anyone else who is being objective that thought it was a fumble and that is after looking at many websites and getting opinions. That is what really sucks.
My question is what is the harm in such a controversial call to just play the play over again? If EWU stops NDSU then they win fair and square and we don't have to end the game on the decision of one ref. If NDSU scores then they play a 2nd OT. Seems like the more logical way to decide the game to me.
Heck, most of the EWU fans agree it was at terrible call! That' s not even the issue. It's WHY was it blown?Quote:
Originally Posted by tcbison
I still contend that there is a reason they only called 2 penalties on EWU all day and our 5 came at the most critical times.
Exactly......Quote:
Originally Posted by tcbison
I don't see how the booth ref fucks the call up unless he had a bias or was "afraid" to overrule his fellow ref on the field. Why have replay reviews then?
Sure EWU won........played a tough game with the Bison, but the ref made the final difference in the outcome, not EWU. That is where I have the issue. Just wonder what the replay ref thinks now and what was his rationale for blowing the decision.
After review this is clearly the WORST call of the day on the field without question. For those who didn't see it and were upset at Richard for the personal foul, now you know why all of his teammates were chasing the ref about the call. BRUTAL!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsG4QKv6KOI
He had to have said something (I know who cares if he did) but wow. Really makes you wonder if sports are rigged?Quote:
Originally Posted by bisonpride
Wow just wow. I hadn't went back and watch that.
I think the ref thought Richards was making contact after the play, when really the Eagle grabbed him by the knee and took him down.
That should have gone the other way. It would have been first and goal at the 1.
That flag went as soon as Austin hit the ground, he didn't have time to say anything. Bisonpride send that into the CAA office, this is their best crew afterall.Quote:
Originally Posted by onbison09
Wow he tripped on him and they call a PF? Are you serious? Looks like they were LOOKING for anything to bail them out.Quote:
Originally Posted by bisonpride
Yep, that one on Austin (Prichard.....?? LOL) was over the top! At the time I was like, WTH did he do? It's now a personal foul penalty to trip over someone laying on the field??? :ranting:
he didn't trip on him, he was taken down.Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
Yep, it was a cheap shot by EWU.
Big time-- and the ref overreacted because he almost got physically caught up in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSUstudent
Ding ding ding!Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSUstudent
#10 Zach Johnson we have you on film being a douche!
http://www.lies.com/wp/images/2009/12/srsly.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by NDSUstudent
Ding Ding Ding #2.Quote:
Originally Posted by CAS4127
The ref was wrong calling the penalty even if it would have been on Zach "I will cheat to win" Johnson.
I didn't see that but now that I look closer... holy crap! How can these refs suck so bad? I mean seriously? What is their deal? I think these guys are damn crooked. 2 penalties on EWU all game? Every Bison penalty occured at a key moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDB2
If it happens once it's random.
If it happens twice it's a coincindence.
It it happens 5 times it's a trend.
These guys are f-ing crooked.
They are either emotionally influenced, stupid, or in some sort of conspiricy.
Fair comment on the real-time call. I disagree but only because bang-bang plays like that are not always easy to see, especially with all the bodies in and around the ball. When they are that close and instant replay is in play, they are taught to err on the side of fumble. The LJ could very well still get a downgrade on the fumble call even though he only did what he was instructed to do. Replay is not there to cover their backs. It's to get it right. I understand why you think that way. Does anyone know if FCS has used instant replay previously. Since the field officials aren't used to using it and the stadiums aren't used to having it I wonder how many gliches there are.Quote:
Originally Posted by tony
Someone else mentioned the officials huddling and I did see a couple of them get together quickly. Unless someone had absolute knowledge the runner was down, there isn't much a longer conversation could have resulted in. Only 2 officials would be looking at Jensen at this point and 1 of them (referee--white hat) would have definitely not had a view from where he is. That leaves the LJ (LOS official on the near sideline) as the only official with responsibility for the runner. The field judge (deep corner pylon on near side), back judge (deep middle on end line), and umpire (middle near LBs) are watching blockers primarily but may pick up the runner and help. If one of them saw him down, they would go to the LJ and have the conversation you are talking about. If they only "think" he may have been down, they don't have applicable knowledge.