A new and better FBS thread

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Originally Posted by runtheoption

Somebody is having fun with this:

https://pac-4.com/

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That's awesome. Love the schedule and watching a lemon cake baking video for Patreon supporters.

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Originally Posted by runtheoption

Somebody is having fun with this:

https://pac-4.com/

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Oh that is fantastic.

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Originally Posted by heffray

Oh that is fantastic.

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The OG version of this was even better, they must've got hit with a Cease and Desist notice on the logo, etc

https://web.archive.org/web/20230805...s://pac-4.com/

OH BOY. we got a chance!!

If ACC can finish this deal (Cal/Stanford) then expect ESPN to push heavily for AAC to absorb the PAC2 and help fund further expansion that will gut the MWC.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

OH BOY. we got a chance!!

If ACC can finish this deal (Cal/Stanford) then expect ESPN to push heavily for AAC to absorb the PAC2 and help fund further expansion that will gut the MWC.

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If the AAC absorbs WSU and OSU the game ends, and NDSU stays fcs

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Originally Posted by reformedUNDfan

If the AAC absorbs WSU and OSU the game ends, and NDSU stays fcs

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Yeah I fail to see how that scenario is a good thing for NDSU. Wouldn't MWC just add WSU and Oregon State and be happy with west coast dominance?

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

OH BOY. we got a chance!!

If ACC can finish this deal (Cal/Stanford) then expect ESPN to push heavily for AAC to absorb the PAC2 and help fund further expansion that will gut the MWC.

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If (<- big IF) CaliStan goes ACC, the MWC will end up with WasSU/OrSU.

WasSU's budget is a trainwreck under with PAC media funding; they can't afford a four time zone conference on an AAC media budget.

Yeah I fail to see how 2 of the PAC 4 getting absorbed helps NDSU at all. At that point the other 2 will get gobbled up and the carousel will stop for a while.

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Originally Posted by TAILG8R

Yeah I fail to see how 2 of the PAC 4 getting absorbed helps NDSU at all. At that point the other 2 will get gobbled up and the carousel will stop for a while.

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If this were to happen, the only hope for NDSU is if the MWC or AAC were to try to steal from one another in hopes of securing it's spot as the highest rated G5. This battle (if it were to happen) would end in one of the conferences losing members in which case NDSU might be a good add.

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Originally Posted by NDSUguy

If this were to happen, the only hope for NDSU is if the MWC or AAC were to try to steal from one another in hopes of securing it's spot as the highest rated G5. This battle (if it were to happen) would end in one of the conferences losing members in which case NDSU might be a good add.

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Exit fees make that effectively impossible. The difference in media deals is way too small to be worth that move.

AAC would grab WSU/OSU and try and take Boise/Air Force/Colo St/UNLV

then MWC is left looking for FBS teams.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

AAC would grab WSU/OSU and try and take Boise/Air Force/Colo St/UNLV

then MWC is left looking for FBS teams.

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Who is paying the MWC exit fees?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If American gets Oregon State and Wazzu, then look for SDSU and Boise + 1 more to accept invites for 2026 to become an 18 team league. 3rd spot probably between Fresno and Air Force. Will gut MWC and solidify American as the clear 5th best league. Only move OSU can make to be P5

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

If American gets Oregon State and Wazzu, then look for SDSU and Boise + 1 more to accept invites for 2026 to become an 18 team league. 3rd spot probably between Fresno and Air Force. Will gut MWC and solidify American as the clear 5th best league. Only move OSU can make to be P5

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Is MHver your personal avatar?

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Originally Posted by NDSUguy

If this were to happen, the only hope for NDSU is if the MWC or AAC were to try to steal from one another in hopes of securing it's spot as the highest rated G5. This battle (if it were to happen) would end in one of the conferences losing members in which case NDSU might be a good add.

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Seems highly unlikely.

Last round, AAC tried to grab MWC schools and failed. They would have to get a MUCH better media deal than they have now for anyone to move. They would also have little motivation to expand past 16 imo.

CaliStan to ACC and OSU/WSU to AAC is not the outcome that works for us. If that happens, it could be years before the next move, that would likely finish this round, until something else happens at P4 level.

PAC-4 rebuild would be best outcome, followed by a MWC partial merger where some schools are left behind and rebuild MWC.

https://x.com/mhver3/status/16947209...bQhDgWeqSXZc2w

This is NOT great news if true.

What it suggests to me is ESPN is working to kill off the PAC rather than risk the PAC-4 grabbing AAC schools and forcing ESPN to consider bidding on PAC or lose that inventory.

ESPN likely has to pay more overall to maintain similar teams/inventory in the event AAC is raided, so it actually makes sense they may want to prevent this.

So, here is my get NDSU to FBS fantasy scenario not based on anything relating to any sort of reality of actually happening:

The PAC4 decide they need to survive and they realize they cannot wait for the MWC teams to find the money to cover exit fees. Because of this they look to BYU as a name brand to bring on board since they are independent. That still leaves at least 4 openings, right? And with no MWC teams available at that time, they look to the best of the FCS in order to survive. Invites go out to MSU, UM, NDSU, SDSU, the OTHER SDSU, and maybe EWU/UTEP for the time being, with the plan to add MWC teams as soon as their media rights deal expires. That puts them at 10/11 teams, most of which won't be able to bail quickly and gives some semblance of safety net should Cal & Sanford jump ship and they now have at least 8/9 schools left in the conference & they hope to start bringing in other G5 schools (ideally MWC schools based on their footprint) with the goal of getting to 16 to 20 teams.

Again, not based on reality, but this is CFB we're talking about. Who really saw USC and UCLA leaving for the B1G? Weird shit happens.

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Originally Posted by tjamz

So, here is my get NDSU to FBS fantasy scenario not based on anything relating to any sort of reality of actually happening:

The PAC4 decide they need to survive and they realize they cannot wait for the MWC teams to find the money to cover exit fees. Because of this they look to BYU as a name brand to bring on board since they are independent. That still leaves at least 4 openings, right? And with no MWC teams available at that time, they look to the best of the FCS in order to survive. Invites go out to MSU, UM, NDSU, SDSU, the OTHER SDSU, and maybe EWU/UTEP for the time being, with the plan to add MWC teams as soon as their media rights deal expires. That puts them at 10/11 teams, most of which won't be able to bail quickly and gives some semblance of safety net should Cal & Sanford jump ship and they now have at least 8/9 schools left in the conference & they hope to start bringing in other G5 schools (ideally MWC schools based on their footprint) with the goal of getting to 16 to 20 teams.

Again, not based on reality, but this is CFB we're talking about. Who really saw USC and UCLA leaving for the B1G? Weird shit happens.

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BYU is no longer an independent, they're in the B12

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Originally Posted by Big Bird

BYU is no longer an independent, they're in the B12

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Shit, forgot that... My point still stands though 9 or 10 teams is a lot more stable than 4. It gives the PAC room to expand throughout the Midwest increasing their footprint and possibly luring other teams to join once the next shakeup happens.

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Originally Posted by tjamz

So, here is my get NDSU to FBS fantasy scenario not based on anything relating to any sort of reality of actually happening:

The PAC4 decide they need to survive and they realize they cannot wait for the MWC teams to find the money to cover exit fees. Because of this they look to BYU as a name brand to bring on board since they are independent. That still leaves at least 4 openings, right? And with no MWC teams available at that time, they look to the best of the FCS in order to survive. Invites go out to MSU, UM, NDSU, SDSU, the OTHER SDSU, and maybe EWU/UTEP for the time being, with the plan to add MWC teams as soon as their media rights deal expires. That puts them at 10/11 teams, most of which won't be able to bail quickly and gives some semblance of safety net should Cal & Sanford jump ship and they now have at least 8/9 schools left in the conference & they hope to start bringing in other G5 schools (ideally MWC schools based on their footprint) with the goal of getting to 16 to 20 teams.

Again, not based on reality, but this is CFB we're talking about. Who really saw USC and UCLA leaving for the B1G? Weird shit happens.

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Your dream scenario would be amazing if it could happen. It would certainly shock FBS if PAC rebuilt with FCS schools.

From Notre Dame AD comments, it looks like Cal and Stanford will be added to ACC, and PAC will die. Most unfortunate if this happens.

https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/s...118071613?s=20

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Originally Posted by BigHorns

Your dream scenario would be amazing if it could happen. It would certainly shock FBS if PAC rebuilt with FCS schools.

From Notre Dame AD comments, it looks like Cal and Stanford will be added to ACC, and PAC will die. Most unfortunate if this happens.

https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/s...118071613?s=20

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I've seen SMU to the ACC too. The big selling point for all three to the conference is partial to no payouts. I've seen Stanford/Cal would be getting around a 1/3 or 1/4 payout for a while SMU is willing to take NO TV deal payouts for up to 7 years.

Theses additions would trigger the ESPN TV deal to pay pro rata for the new members, and with each of the newcomers taking way less or no money, the extra ~$75 mil would get divided up between current members. The top of the ACC has been clamoring for football performance and viewership to drive revenue distribution and I would bet a good chunk of the extra money would go towards some incentive program.

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Originally Posted by Big Bird

I've seen SMU to the ACC too. The big selling point for all three to the conference is partial to no payouts. I've seen Stanford/Cal would be getting around a 1/3 or 1/4 payout for a while SMU is willing to take NO TV deal payouts for up to 7 years.

Theses additions would trigger the ESPN TV deal to pay pro rata for the new members, and with each of the newcomers taking way less or no money, the extra ~$75 mil would get divided up between current members. The top of the ACC has been clamoring for football performance and viewership to drive revenue distribution and I would bet a good chunk of the extra money would go towards some incentive program.

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At some point it just seems wild to me. SMU admitting it’s so desperate and that it brings nothing to the conference that it won’t take any TV money? Doesn’t that set off alarm bells that “maybe you’re too good for her bro?” lol

Lot of teams signing up for a forever contract without getting paid what they should. Not going to end well. At the end of the day it’s in the conference’s best interest to allow its programs to have a chance to be successful.

If I was a president/AD I would call that bluff in a second. You’re there to compete on an equal playing field or you’ll find somewhere else to do it. Hell no to being a second class citizen in your own conference.

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Originally Posted by BigHorns

Your dream scenario would be amazing if it could happen. It would certainly shock FBS if PAC rebuilt with FCS schools.

From Notre Dame AD comments, it looks like Cal and Stanford will be added to ACC, and PAC will die. Most unfortunate if this happens.

https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/s...118071613?s=20

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I still argue that there is no reason (in my fantasy world) that the PAC couldn't try to survive using my scenario above. More realistic is that WSU and OSU will join the MWC

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Originally Posted by NDSU92

At some point it just seems wild to me. SMU admitting it’s so desperate and that it brings nothing to the conference that it won’t take any TV money? Doesn’t that set off alarm bells that “maybe you’re too good for her bro?” lol

Lot of teams signing up for a forever contract without getting paid what they should. Not going to end well. At the end of the day it’s in the conference’s best interest to allow its programs to have a chance to be successful.

If I was a president/AD I would call that bluff in a second. You’re there to compete on an equal playing field or you’ll find somewhere else to do it. Hell no to being a second class citizen in your own conference.

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NDSU could EASILY do this with the MWC or AAC as well.

NDSU could say "hey let us join, but we keep our LOCAL TV setup and only take 50% of your TV money"

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

NDSU could EASILY do this with the MWC or AAC as well.

NDSU could say "hey let us join, but we keep our LOCAL TV setup and only take 50% of your TV money"

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You're asking for a Boise St style deal, and its unlikely we have the leverage to do that. MWC doesn't like it, it helps Boise.

It works for SMU because they bring the Dallas media market to ACC, which greatly improves the ACC network payout by many millions.
And ... they agreed to take no payout, not even a local broadcast. They are providing all their media rights for FREE. They get nothing.
On top of that they have the academic prestige ACC wants.

SMU can do this because they have HUGE piles of cash ($2 billion) to play with, and are thinking 10 years down the road. Same situation with Stanford looking at taking a reduced payout.

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Originally Posted by NDSU92

At some point it just seems wild to me. SMU admitting it’s so desperate and that it brings nothing to the conference that it won’t take any TV money? Doesn’t that set off alarm bells that “maybe you’re too good for her bro?” lol

Lot of teams signing up for a forever contract without getting paid what they should. Not going to end well. At the end of the day it’s in the conference’s best interest to allow its programs to have a chance to be successful.

If I was a president/AD I would call that bluff in a second. You’re there to compete on an equal playing field or you’ll find somewhere else to do it. Hell no to being a second class citizen in your own conference.

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That’s great, just don’t expect Clemson and FSU to be there when you arrive.

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Originally Posted by tjamz

I still argue that there is no reason (in my fantasy world) that the PAC couldn't try to survive using my scenario above. More realistic is that WSU and OSU will join the MWC

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You are correct that it could be viable. The problem is those schools would view associating themselves with FCS schools as catastrophic. All 4 have been doing everything they can to keep the P5 status/label, and will only accept G5 membership as a last resort. That's why you see Cal and Stanford going all out on ACC. They even hired people like ex-president George Bush, etc to lobby for them.

If Cal/Stan can't get invited to ACC or Big12, then there is a chance the PAC 4 attempt to rebuild rather than join a G5. That would create the best cascade scenario/openings for us.

Well, if the MWC or AAC don't work out, I think I'm finally on board for Conference USA for football only. They just have to do something or they're going to lose the little of the momentum that is left. Bohl used to cite the quote of either being green and growing or ripe and dying. The program is no longer growing.

The competition isn't much of an upgrade from the Valley really but it would be FBS and might open the door to P4 money games. They would then be positioned well if the P4 end up completely breaking off to be at the FBS playoff level, which would really be where they belong.

I'm watching UTEP and Jack State now and it looks like JSU has a pretty cool setup (and I think they're still working on it).

As a fan would have some different road trips and matchups at least.

Pretty good article about the OSU/Wazzu situation.

Still a lot of stuff to be decided.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-fo...und-labor-day/

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Originally Posted by BigHorns

You are correct that it could be viable. The problem is those schools would view associating themselves with FCS schools as catastrophic. All 4 have been doing everything they can to keep the P5 status/label, and will only accept G5 membership as a last resort. That's why you see Cal and Stanford going all out on ACC. They even hired people like ex-president George Bush, etc to lobby for them.

If Cal/Stan can't get invited to ACC or Big12, then there is a chance the PAC 4 attempt to rebuild rather than join a G5. That would create the best cascade scenario/openings for us.

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Chapo, gather your harem of grandma's and get on this!

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

NDSU could EASILY do this with the MWC or AAC as well.

NDSU could say "hey let us join, but we keep our LOCAL TV setup and only take 50% of your TV money"

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It's an interesting thought. I wonder if a deal could be structured to get us into the AAC where we take a quarter share or less for x amount of years. As long as we could retain statewide TV rights for home broadcasting, maybe it could be done. I'm pretty sure the new AAC schools (UNT, UTSA,Rice, UAB, Charlotte, FAU) are only pulling 2.5 million in rights compared to 7 million for the legacy members.

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Originally Posted by Gully

Well, if the MWC or AAC don't work out, I think I'm finally on board for Conference USA for football only. They just have to do something or they're going to lose the little of the momentum that is left. Bohl used to cite the quote of either being green and growing or ripe and dying. The program is no longer growing.

The competition isn't much of an upgrade from the Valley really but it would be FBS and might open the door to P4 money games. They would then be positioned well if the P4 end up completely breaking off to be at the FBS playoff level, which would really be where they belong.

I'm watching UTEP and Jack State now and it looks like JSU has a pretty cool setup (and I think they're still working on it).

As a fan would have some different road trips and matchups at least.

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I go back and forth on the Conference USA deal. Would Tue and Wed game keep us growing? I just don't think so when fan travel to games is huge for NDSU.

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Originally Posted by THEsocalledfan

I go back and forth on the Conference USA deal. Would Tue and Wed game keep us growing? I just don't think so when fan travel to games is huge for NDSU.

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Not ideal, for sure. Are they all on Tue and Wed?

In Jacksonville State's first game hosting a real FBS program in UTEP they drew just under 18k fans to their 24,000 seat stadium yesterday. That's just below their 2022 average (playing an ASUN/FCS schedule) and well below their heyday in 2015 when they averaged over 20k. They can't even use Auburn or Alabama as an excuse since neither played.

I don't think going FBS is going to be the automatic cure for NDSU football's slumping attendance. It would help I'm sure but it's also well within the realm of possibility that we never see the demand from the early to mid 2010s again even in the FBS.

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Originally Posted by THEsocalledfan

I go back and forth on the Conference USA deal. Would Tue and Wed game keep us growing? I just don't think so when fan travel to games is huge for NDSU.

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Tuesday Wednesday games are gross. Maybe 1 game I could stomach but 99% of people working until 5. Tailgating would be dead

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Originally Posted by AKBison

It's an interesting thought. I wonder if a deal could be structured to get us into the AAC where we take a quarter share or less for x amount of years. As long as we could retain statewide TV rights for home broadcasting, maybe it could be done. I'm pretty sure the new AAC schools (UNT, UTSA,Rice, UAB, Charlotte, FAU) are only pulling 2.5 million in rights compared to 7 million for the legacy members.

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I do think a deal like that could work. Hawaii has a similar deal for football only in the MW.

The key is "what's in it for the conference you wish to join?" I am only talking money wise. Do the other schools have to come out of pocket even a little to make it happen? Do you have to chip in some of your home broadcasting revenue to make it work?

Will ESPN kick in a little more dough to make it work. Will that work for all sports, including your extra travel expense? Will you pay a travel subsidy?

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Originally Posted by HerdBot

Tuesday Wednesday games are gross. Maybe 1 game I could stomach but 99% of people working until 5. Tailgating would be dead

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stop with the TUES/WED STRAWMAN BULLSHIT its only the MAC that plays those. NDSU will never goto the MAC

and with CUSA looks like 1 or 2 https://conferenceusa.com/news/2023/...ll-season.aspx

But both CUSA/MAC get the whole nation on ESPN on a Tuesday or Wednesday Night I guess.

(BUT NDSU ALREADY SAID NO TO CUSA & wont got MAC so this point / argument is MOOT)

/End Story

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

stop with the TUES/WED STRAWMAN BULLSHIT its only the MAC that plays those. NDSU will never goto the MAC

and with CUSA looks like 1 or 2 https://conferenceusa.com/news/2023/...ll-season.aspx

But both CUSA/MAC get the whole nation on ESPN on a Tuesday or Wednesday Night I guess.

(BUT NDSU ALREADY SAID NO TO CUSA & wont got MAC so this point / argument is MOOT)

/End Story

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The AAC does play Thursday football games. Pretty much 1 every week. Were you in the league you have a good chance of missing that most years..

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

stop with the TUES/WED STRAWMAN BULLSHIT its only the MAC that plays those. NDSU will never goto the MAC

and with CUSA looks like 1 or 2 https://conferenceusa.com/news/2023/...ll-season.aspx

But both CUSA/MAC get the whole nation on ESPN on a Tuesday or Wednesday Night I guess.

(BUT NDSU ALREADY SAID NO TO CUSA & wont got MAC so this point / argument is MOOT)

/End Story

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19 games on weekdays for a conference that only had 10 teams. None of the weekday games are on ESPN. 3 on ESPN2. 6 are on ESPNU. 10 are on CBS Sports Metwork

There are 3 total Saturday games conference wide on ESPN or ESPN2. 7 on CBS Sports Net. The rest are ESPN+

CBS SPORTS NETWORK

Thu 9/28 Middle Tennessee @ WKU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Fri 9/29 Louisiana Tech @ UTEP 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/4 FIU @ New Mexico State 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Thu 10/5 Sam Houston @ Liberty 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/10 Louisiana Tech @ Middle Tennessee 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/11 Sam Houston @ New Mexico State 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/17 Middle Tennessee @ Liberty 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/18 FIU @ Sam Houston 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/24 New Mexico State @ Louisiana Tech 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/25 Jacksonville State @ FIU 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET


ESPN2
Wed 10/11 UTEP @ FIU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Wed 10/18 New Mexico State @ UTEP 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/25 UTEP @ Sam Houston 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET

ESPNU
Thu 9/28 Jacksonville State @ Sam Houston 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/4 Jacksonville State @ Middle Tennessee 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Thu 10/5 WKU @ Louisiana Tech 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/10 Liberty @ Jacksonville State 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Tue 10/17 WKU @ Jacksonville State 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Tue 10/24 Liberty @ WKU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET

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Originally Posted by HerdBot

19 games on weekdays for a conference that only had 10 teams. None of the weekday games are on ESPN. 3 on ESPN2. 6 are on ESPNU. 10 are on CBS Sports Metwork

There are 3 total Saturday games conference wide on ESPN or ESPN2. 7 on CBS Sports Net. The rest are ESPN+

CBS SPORTS NETWORK

Thu 9/28 Middle Tennessee @ WKU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Fri 9/29 Louisiana Tech @ UTEP 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/4 FIU @ New Mexico State 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Thu 10/5 Sam Houston @ Liberty 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/10 Louisiana Tech @ Middle Tennessee 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/11 Sam Houston @ New Mexico State 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/17 Middle Tennessee @ Liberty 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/18 FIU @ Sam Houston 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/24 New Mexico State @ Louisiana Tech 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/25 Jacksonville State @ FIU 6:00 p.m. CT/7:00 p.m. ET


ESPN2
Wed 10/11 UTEP @ FIU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Wed 10/18 New Mexico State @ UTEP 8:00 p.m. CT/9:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/25 UTEP @ Sam Houston 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET

ESPNU
Thu 9/28 Jacksonville State @ Sam Houston 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Wed 10/4 Jacksonville State @ Middle Tennessee 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Thu 10/5 WKU @ Louisiana Tech 7:00 p.m. CT/8:00 p.m. ET
Tue 10/10 Liberty @ Jacksonville State 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Tue 10/17 WKU @ Jacksonville State 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET
Tue 10/24 Liberty @ WKU 6:30 p.m. CT/7:30 p.m. ET

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Basically 50% of all CUSA games are midweek now.

Each school plays at least 4 midweek games. Last week of September and all of October is midweek.
Believe MAC does this in November instead.