A new and better FBS thread

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Originally Posted by Strongman

Anomaly? I am well aware of what the god-like Sagarin has for his conference and team rankings for this year. Honestly, in my non-humble opinion, I am not buying that the MVFC is a better conference this year than the MAC. The eye test does not convince me that the MVFC is a better conference than the MAC. Granted, NDSU would win the MAC. But the talent on national TV, that I watch every week on ESPN/ESPN 2 looks better than the "average" MVFC talent. I guess NFL scouts are delusional, too based on the # of MAC draft picks versus MVFC. How many MVFC players have ever been drafted in the 1st round of the NFL? 2 years ago, the top pick in the NFL draft was from the MAC. And arguably, the best player from this year's was from the MAC--Khalil Mack, who was drafted 3rd overall. And is already a BEAST.

The MAC blows away the MVFC in talent sans NDSU, attendance, national exposure, national televised games and TV ratings. To say that joining the MAC and being on ESPN or ESPN 2 6x a year and FBS is not a step up is just being
ignorant. Hell, maybe in 4 years, NDSU could have the top overall pick in the NFL draft if it joined the MAC. Or a top 3 pick. :)

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So you're eyeball test is looking at the best of (both in teams and players) the MAC and then not including NDSU in the MVFC? Seems about right.

In regards to the rest of your observations, yes we get it, the MAC is an FBS conference. Every logical thought should tell us the FBS>FCS. FBS players should be better than FCS players. FBS teams should be better than FCS teams. FBS conferences should be better than FCS conferences. Same can be said for BCS. BCS players should be better than FBS players. BCS teams should be better than FBS teams. BCS conferences should be better than FBS conferences.

Sometimes a player screws up that reasoning (Fisher, Mack, Turner, Mays, and many more). Sometimes a team screws up that reasoning (NDSU, Northern Illinois, Boise St, and many more). Why can't that be the same for conferences? In the last 3 years, both conferences have won 2 games against the other conference (and none of which were teams named NDSU), so obviously the talent isn't that far off. Shoot, a MVFC team that's only win last year was against something called Quincy beat a MAC team that won 10 games last year. Obviously the talent level of the MAC blows away the MVFC.

National Exposure? Really, you are going to play that card? I'll let you in on a big secret: The only people that care about the MAC schools are students, alumni, and parents of the athletes at said-school. Same can be said for the MVFC. I'm going to guess that MAC schools' enrollments are higher than those in the MVFC, so yes they will have more people watching, but is 8000 that much bigger than 7000 when looking at "National Exposure"?

TV? Show me any team from the MAC that's been on National TV 6x this year. I honestly don't know if there are any or not. I'll take National TV in the playoffs, championship game, and GameDay while having a regional/national tv FBS game and having the entire state of ND watching. The only thing that transfers over if NDSU moves to the MAC is the entire state of ND watching as long as NDSU keeps winning (if it's even available to the entire state - good luck with simulcast rights from ESPN).

We've been feeding this troll so much that he's getting fat. Somebody call Gabe.

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Originally Posted by Strongman

Almost? We got 4 votes in the AP poll. We need 83 votes to crack the top 25. I "almost" went on a date with Kate Upton. I got on Facebook and sent her a message. She just hasn't responded yet. I guess you are right since 2 people voted for us there is no reason to move up.

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What's the point of moving up? Just to get top 25 votes but never get enough respect to be taken seriously? I'm sorry for you pro FBS guys but this about the worst timing ever nationally for NDSU to be making a move. You have absolutely no valid argument for moving up now except to justify your agendas.

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Originally Posted by BisonNation11

Almost ranked nationally... No need to go FBS when we're already getting votes. Not sure where you're going with the "hosting themselves" comment

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i was talking about other teams in the conference

Well. Obviously the development foundation has heard our FBS voices and are getting things ready for a FBS push
http://kfgo.com/news/articles/2014/n...medium=twitter

You dont read well

President and CEO Doug Mayo needed to bring the groups to the Division-1 level and some of the employees may not have been able to adapt.

And they will push even farther now!

Mayville bison. All MAC teams have been on national tv a minimum of 3 times, NIU like 7 times. Espn espnu & 2 !

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Originally Posted by BisonNation11

What's the point of moving up? Just to get top 25 votes but never get enough respect to be taken seriously? I'm sorry for you pro FBS guys but this about the worst timing ever nationally for NDSU to be making a move. You have absolutely no valid argument for moving up now except to justify your agendas.

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How about to become relevant in BIG time college football and a top 20 team in country.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

Mayville bison. All MAC teams have been on national tv a minimum of 3 times, NIU like 7 times. Espn espnu & 2 !

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you have to excuse some of these guys. National tv to them is ESPN 3, NBC ND, and midco.

also they think that FS1 aired the NDSU/ISU game because of NDSU, just because Kolpack wrote it. LOL. the fact that ND has to run HD trucks down to UNI shows that NDSU needs to get the hell out of this division. so sad. NDSU deserves so much more.

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Originally Posted by Strongman

How about to become relevant in BIG time college football and a top 20 team in country.

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That's all to satisfy your agenda with no means of supporting it. After Boise State's flash in the pan, please tell me the last time they were relevant or were given national attention. There's a reason you don't hear about them. They're just another FBS team now that no one cares about. But hey, they're "big boy football"

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

Mayville bison. All MAC teams have been on national tv a minimum of 3 times, NIU like 7 times. Espn espnu & 2 !

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maybe I'm reading this wrong, but I think NIU has only been on ESPN, ESPN2 or ESPNU two times this year (Arkansas and Ball St.)

http://www.niuhuskies.com/sports/m-f...tbl-sched.html

Using the word "like" gives you creative license.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

President and CEO Doug Mayo needed to bring the groups to the Division-1 level and some of the employees may not have been able to adapt.

And they will push even farther now!

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This might not end well for Mayo. Stay tuned.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

No I was mad that gene taylor turned down the espn 2 Friday night playoff games

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Umm, we played one against GSU didn't we?


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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

President and CEO Doug Mayo needed to bring the groups to the Division-1 level and some of the employees may not have been able to adapt.

And they will push even farther now!

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I find your boot licking interesting. This guy came from Mankato State. What does he know about D-1? But you had nothing but bad things to say about our new AD.

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Originally Posted by CAS4127

Umm, we played one against GSU didn't we?


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And New Hampshire.

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Originally Posted by 56BISON73

I find your boot licking interesting. This guy came from Mankato State. What does he know about D-1? But you had nothing but bad things to say about our new AD.

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I agree. I don't know what is going on, though. Is saying a division 1 alumni association is supposed to look like more money coming in? The shac and lots of other projects look like someone is doing pretty well fundraising. Maybe someone should come out and say what it is supposed to look like rather than saying it doesn't look like something with no reference point.

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Originally Posted by 56BISON73

I find your boot licking interesting. This guy came from Mankato State. What does he know about D-1? But you had nothing but bad things to say about our new AD.

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When was he hired? When did we go D1.? And these employees didn't adapt?

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Originally Posted by BisonNation11

That's all to satisfy your agenda with no means of supporting it. After Boise State's flash in the pan, please tell me the last time they were relevant or were given national attention. There's a reason you don't hear about them. They're just another FBS team now that no one cares about. But hey, they're "big boy football"

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10 years for Boise State was a flash in the pan?

2002 # 15; 2003 #16; 2004 #12; 2006 #5; 2008 #11; 2009 #4, 2010 #9; 2011 #8; 2012 #18.

They are still relevant. Had joined a BCS conference but backed out. They will eventually be part of the Pac 18.

Boise State has 7 ESPN/ESPN2 games, 1 ESPNU game and 4 CBS Sports Network games.

Their entire football schedule is on national TV, I hate to do the dirty work for the FBS brigade but I'm not sure I would be bringing Boise into this debate in regards to irrelevancy. They are much more relevant than a lot of Big 10 programs.

Boise State is what NDSU should be. pEriod!

Northern Illinois played Northwestern and Arkansas on BTN & ESPNU

2 on ESPN2 and 2 on ESPNU

Conference Championship on ESPN 2

that's 7 games national tv what the hell natstar

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Originally Posted by NDSUstudent

Boise State has 7 ESPN/ESPN2 games, 1 ESPNU game and 4 CBS Sports Network games.

Their entire football schedule is on national TV, I hate to do the dirty work for the FBS brigade but I'm not sure I would be bringing Boise into this debate in regards to irrelevancy. They are much more relevant than a lot of Big 10 programs.

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I really don't think Boise will remain in a G5 conference after things shake out. In other words, if NDSU is ever a MWC program, Boise won't be in the conference.

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Originally Posted by NorthernBison

I really don't think Boise will remain in a G5 conference after things shake out. In other words, if NDSU is ever a MWC program, Boise won't be in the conference.

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Boise doesn't really have anywhere to go, academically they are on par with MSU-Mankato. It is a huge issue for them to overcome considering University presidents decide who is in conferences.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

President and CEO Doug Mayo needed to bring the groups to the Division-1 level and some of the employees may not have been able to adapt.

And they will push even farther now!

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We are d1 .... in all sports except1 that we are kinda d1

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Originally Posted by unbison

We are d1 .... in all sports except1 that we are kinda d1

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that's actually a quote from the article

I know it is.... how does it relate to fbs

Boise is not a good comp anyway. The city was 50% bigger than Fargo is now in 1990, 6 years before they moved up. And then they continued to grow at a pace faster than Fargo's current rate for a decade after that.

Fargo-Moorhead is going to be 250-300,000 in about 5 years, its unbelievable the growth south of 52nd and by Costco.

NDSU is ready for this jump and this community is ready.

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Originally Posted by NDSUstudent

Boise doesn't really have anywhere to go, academically they are on par with MSU-Mankato. It is a huge issue for them to overcome considering University presidents decide who is in conferences.

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That's true. I still see them as a "last resort" for a conference like the Big 12. Decent media market and some historical success.

Boise State is a perfect example of why we don't move up now. They don't even know where they will be after the shakeup. I have said this before, we put everything into a move now, where do you come up with what is needed to move again when the music stops? The only move that makes any sense right now is no move. If there is a shakeup, then a decision would be made with a much clearer picture. If a shakeup doesn't happen, then it will still be a much clearer picture because there will still be some shakeup.

Things that have to change no matter what:
1. Notre Dame and BYU have to find a conference. The other P5 conferences have too much involved and at stake to have a couple of independents screw up polls and playoffs. They are going to cry that they bought into this system, so college football will has to honor the God given right conference participation has bestowed on anyone in the P5 conferences.
2. The Big 12 has to figure out a way to add at least two more schools, split into two divisions, and add a championship game. Everyone else is doing it, so there will be pressure for them to follow suit. Either that or they won't be part of the playoff system which would actually make the math a lot easier if you leave the Big 12 out. Take the four conference champions who were decided by playing a round robin divisional schedule and a conference championship game to determine the four remaining schools.

Could happen:
1. The Big 12 dissolves and the P5 becomes 4 super conferences by picking and choosing what 64 programs to bring with. I don't know the critieria, but it would certainly leave out all the AAC schools and Boise State, for example, as well.
2. All the P5 conferences go to 16 teams and now it is up to 80 schools. This would be the most inclusive method. This would mean the addition of 14 schools not currently in the P5 conferences. You could almost make a case for the AAC, at this point.
3. Everything stay just like it is and nothing ever changes. This is the most unlikely scenario because there is too much out there that needs to change to give the illusion of equity in the system.

My point being, there has to be changes and there will be changes. The problem with these changes is they will definitely affect G5 schools. Even the most non-invasive approach, which is getting the Big 12 up to speed, will change the look of the G5 conferences. Someone will get moved up to make it happen. I think the Big 12 and Pac 12 eventually meet the 14 schools the other 3 conferences have. Boise State and BYU would fit in either conference. Where does Notre Dame fit? What other school gets moved up into the Big 12 now? If Texas and OU bolt for the SEC, then you have to think the goal is 16 teams each. Hawaii, Fresno, BYU, and Boise State in Pac 12. Notre Dame and someone like Temple in Big 10? SMU, Tulane, Memphis, and Cincinnati in Big 12? Then USF and UCF in ACC? Now there has to be a G5 shakeup.

No matter which way you look at it, with all the changes that could possibly happen, NDSU doesn't have a home in any of the scenarios until 25 other schools have a home in those scenarios. Even if absolutely nothing happens, nothing has to happen long enough for anyone to be comfortable enough to think there is some stability. Then, and only then is there a chance NDSU could find a suitable home. So FBS or bust is a silly concept right now. Stadium expansion discussion. Silly. MWC discussion. Silly. There may not even be a MWC next year. Even if NDSU were to get into the MWC now, who is to say they are part of any P5 discussion later. Then what happens? We are no further or closer to an answer where we are sitting now then if we were sitting in a conference who might be in purgatory for a couple of years. When the shakeups happen, then we can make a decision on which way to turn the sail towards for the best of the program. I do know this, we will be where we are supposed to be.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

Fargo-Moorhead is going to be 250-300,000 in about 5 years, its unbelievable the growth south of 52nd and by Costco.

NDSU is ready for this jump and this community is ready.

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How big is FM now so I can gauge how ridiculous this statement is.

Fargo-Moorhead, ND-MN Metropolitan Statistical Area, which in 2013 contained a population of 223,490.

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...ead+population <<< there you go mr ridiculous!

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Originally Posted by bisonaudit

Boise is not a good comp anyway. The city was 50% bigger than Fargo is now in 1990, 6 years before they moved up. And then they continued to grow at a pace faster than Fargo's current rate for a decade after that.

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WHEN NDSU WON ITS FIRST NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP, how prominent was Boise State in football? Idaho is not a hotbed for football or recruiting.

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Originally Posted by Strongman

WHEN NDSU WON ITS FIRST NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP, how prominent was Boise State in football? Idaho is not a hotbed for football or recruiting.

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What does that have to do with his post?

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Originally Posted by td577

Boise State is a perfect example of why we don't move up now. They don't even know where they will be after the shakeup. I have said this before, we put everything into a move now, where do you come up with what is needed to move again when the music stops? The only move that makes any sense right now is no move. If there is a shakeup, then a decision would be made with a much clearer picture. If a shakeup doesn't happen, then it will still be a much clearer picture because there will still be some shakeup.

Things that have to change no matter what:
1. Notre Dame and BYU have to find a conference. The other P5 conferences have too much involved and at stake to have a couple of independents screw up polls and playoffs. They are going to cry that they bought into this system, so college football will has to honor the God given right conference participation has bestowed on anyone in the P5 conferences.
2. The Big 12 has to figure out a way to add at least two more schools, split into two divisions, and add a championship game. Everyone else is doing it, so there will be pressure for them to follow suit. Either that or they won't be part of the playoff system which would actually make the math a lot easier if you leave the Big 12 out. Take the four conference champions who were decided by playing a round robin divisional schedule and a conference championship game to determine the four remaining schools.

Could happen:
1. The Big 12 dissolves and the P5 becomes 4 super conferences by picking and choosing what 64 programs to bring with. I don't know the critieria, but it would certainly leave out all the AAC schools and Boise State, for example, as well.
2. All the P5 conferences go to 16 teams and now it is up to 80 schools. This would be the most inclusive method. This would mean the addition of 14 schools not currently in the P5 conferences. You could almost make a case for the AAC, at this point.
3. Everything stay just like it is and nothing ever changes. This is the most unlikely scenario because there is too much out there that needs to change to give the illusion of equity in the system.

My point being, there has to be changes and there will be changes. The problem with these changes is they will definitely affect G5 schools. Even the most non-invasive approach, which is getting the Big 12 up to speed, will change the look of the G5 conferences. Someone will get moved up to make it happen. I think the Big 12 and Pac 12 eventually meet the 14 schools the other 3 conferences have. Boise State and BYU would fit in either conference. Where does Notre Dame fit? What other school gets moved up into the Big 12 now? If Texas and OU bolt for the SEC, then you have to think the goal is 16 teams each. Hawaii, Fresno, BYU, and Boise State in Pac 12. Notre Dame and someone like Temple in Big 10? SMU, Tulane, Memphis, and Cincinnati in Big 12? Then USF and UCF in ACC? Now there has to be a G5 shakeup.

No matter which way you look at it, with all the changes that could possibly happen, NDSU doesn't have a home in any of the scenarios until 25 other schools have a home in those scenarios. Even if absolutely nothing happens, nothing has to happen long enough for anyone to be comfortable enough to think there is some stability. Then, and only then is there a chance NDSU could find a suitable home. So FBS or bust is a silly concept right now. Stadium expansion discussion. Silly. MWC discussion. Silly. There may not even be a MWC next year. Even if NDSU were to get into the MWC now, who is to say they are part of any P5 discussion later. Then what happens? We are no further or closer to an answer where we are sitting now then if we were sitting in a conference who might be in purgatory for a couple of years. When the shakeups happen, then we can make a decision on which way to turn the sail towards for the best of the program. I do know this, we will be where we are supposed to be.

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If Notre Dame joins a conference, it's the ACC. They will not join the B1G.

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Originally Posted by 344Johnson

If Notre Dame joins a conference, it's the ACC. They will not join the B1G.

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That wasn't even the point. First of all, Notre Dame will join a conference. What conference it is doesn't really matter. Just because they are currently in the ACC obviously doesn't mean much to them when it comes to football, so when push comes to shove and they are in a position where they are forced to join somebody, all bets are off. I do believe when it gets to that point, it becomes who is really going where. For all anyone know, they could end up in the SEC. In fact, a very good argument could be made that if the SEC were to make a push for Texas and OU, they might just go all out and go for Miami and FSU, as well. Then they need to start looking at ways to divide up into four divisions and Notre Dame with their built in rivalries with FSU and Miami could very well join them and the ACC falls apart.

The point I was making, which is pretty clear, isn't about who is going where, but rather there is going to be some moving going on sooner rather than later. The whole idea of the P5 conferences leveraging themselves into this position of power is to, well, have equal power among all of its member conferences. That isn't where they are right now. They have made the first move and it has worked. The next move is to get all five conferences on equal footing. To do that, there are a lot of parts that need to move around and not just in the Big 12. When it is all said and done, it probably won't look like it does right now. This is the moment where they are sitting back and reloading for the next round. A handful of TV contracts have to get blown up and reworked. A handful of schools have to figure out where they really want to be. In the end, the P5 or P4 or whatever the end game looks like will not have any weak conferences playing by a different set of rules until the end when there is as much money on the line.

That's exactly correct. Forget about his the conferences are constructed now. Things are likely to change radically. This could be even greater in the G5 conferences as they lose the top programs.

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Originally Posted by El_Chapo

Fargo-Moorhead, ND-MN Metropolitan Statistical Area, which in 2013 contained a population of 223,490.

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...ead+population <<< there you go mr ridiculous!

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pretty sure that number includes cass-clay county...

105,000+38,000=143,000

Not pretty sure anymore but positive that number includes all other towns in both counties.

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Originally Posted by 1998braves64

pretty sure that number includes cass-clay county...

105,000+38,000=143,000

Not pretty sure anymore but positive that number includes all other towns in both counties.

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2013 numbers are closer to 113,600 and 39,300, so we are pretty much already there.