Hawaii pays to be football only. Were you to receive an all sports invitation you would not. Hawaii pays subsidies to the Big West too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin
If you want football only, arrangements would have to be made..
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Hawaii pays to be football only. Were you to receive an all sports invitation you would not. Hawaii pays subsidies to the Big West too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin
If you want football only, arrangements would have to be made..
Lakes, make arrangements.
Hawaii also has a special rule from the NCAA allowing FB teams that play there to schedule an extra game. They explicitly say this is to offset the travel costs. We're not going to get that.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
UND's hockey and football budgets (expenses) are roughly the same. Hockey far outpaces football for revenue generation as it generates more revenue than its expenses.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
https://knightnewhousedata.org/reports/64943136Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
For NDSU:
- Roughly $2M more in conference distributions in MAC than today. That doesn't quite, it's close, get to NDSU to MAC median.
- Roughly $4M more in conference distributions in MWC than today. That still leaves NDSU over $10M short of MWC median.
https://knightnewhousedata.org/reports/ee825a60
So Day 1 in the MAC NDSU would be essentially median?Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Sicatoka
Day 1 in the MW NDSU wouldn't be the lowest and have a decent way to go to get to median?
There are a handful of other things to keep in mind as NDSU's budget relates to it's MW peers.
1) Nowhere have I seen that NDSU would need to be a Day 1 median budget school. Common sense would be that there is a ramp up period as there is at every other FCS to FBS transitioning program. Hell, it may hurt NDSU if the other schools see that it's already going to come in the conference and have too strong of a budget. It's a major reason why we've never been considered for the MVC.
2) NDSU is not currently charging Mountain West prices, and believe you me, we would be charging considerably more for MW tickets than MVFC/Summit tickets (and we should be). The price of everything goes up.
3) NDSU isn't getting FBS-pay for the FBS non-conference games. I would assume the normal schedule is 2 away FBS non-con games at $1M each, one home FBS non-con at a cost of $1M, and a home FCS non-con for $500k. Both the revenue and expenses sides are increasing to bring us more in line with our peers in the MW.
4) NDSU is not currently charging student fees at a similar clip to Mountain West programs. Heck if we charged what UND did for student fees, we'd have another couple million just right there. Easy to explain that to Higher Ed board and state legislature.
5) NDSU is not in California, Utah or Denver. It doesn't have to pay it's admin as if they were located in those states. This is a big reason why the Cali Big Sky schools have budgets as big or bigger than NDSU, SDSU, etc. but then come back to complain about unequal resources.
I'm not saying everything is perfect and there's no concern there, but there's a lot more to it than looking at what the 2021 expense was for NDSU and comparing it to the #6 school in the MW before we've even joined. As Bresciani and Larsen have been on record saying, the money actually works out quite well in most possible scenarios.
Bresciani was intimating that NDSU's wells may be tapped out last I read.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
https://www.ndsu.edu/news/view/detail/67356/Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Sicatoka
Yep, $600M in 6 years raised. Bone dry.
Notice how literally none of the points I made were about NDSU raising more money from donors.
But if you wanna take it there, our strong donor base has proven itself. I know of many, many folks in my demographic (late 20's/early 30's professional, what I would consider at least semi-successful) that would love a reason to donate more than I already do to NDSU. Donating more money to TeamMakers so we can beat Montana State by 7 touchdowns in Frisco vs. 5 just doesn't make sense right now. It probably doesn't for corporate donors anymore either. Sell us that it's all hands on deck for us to compete with and dominate the MW? I'm running to my checkbook*.
*Bitcoin terminal
Fair point. The football program's success has helped to build the Ath. Dept. to it's current status. Now what are we going to do with that success? How are we going to utilize that momentum to build for the future? If we continue to pour money into the football program at a higher rate than the other programs but remain in FCS, that is the definition of diminishing return on investment. I don't believe there is any more ROI to squeeze out of FCS. To me it makes sense to use some of that capital to help balance the AD and hopefully grow support, and revenue from the other sports at a faster rate than pouring more money into an FCS football program. Again, it's a tough situation for sure. There's no clearly right answer but I just don't believe that the momentum that has been built can be sustained with the status quo. If NDSU can't see a relative quick, attainable and sustainable path to FBS for our football program. Than the leadership needs to explore other ways to keep the fanbase and momentum that has developed from the move to D1 and the FCS success going into the future.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
You might be...but there's also a large chunk of the fan base that won't be.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
you got it backwards. NDSU is athletically very FCS other than football.Quote:
Originally Posted by B.Schlossman Fan Club
Yep. I remember people screaming-crying about not being able to to buy tickets. Then they opened up a new section and had problems selling those tickets because of the cost. Plus you have others who were forced to donate so they could get tickets.Quote:
Originally Posted by daddy daycare
About the extra conference money, it goes surprisingly fast. Entz makes around $400k. Bohl at Wyoming is $1.6M. Other coaches, assistants, AD, Pres, etc pretty much all earn significantly more. That $4M extra revenue is gone towards salaries before you know it. I think it's irresponsible to talk about revenue without looking at the extra costs.
Thanks Captain Obvious. I forgot what a budget is. Part of the needing to have more money to compete with those schools is the additional pay for coaches. That's what we're talking about here.Quote:
Originally Posted by taper
Unless you're trying to tell me that coaches', assistants' and the athletic director's salaries aren't included in the athletic department budgets...
Just get a special rule. Why do they deserve a geographic pass and we don’t?Quote:
Originally Posted by taper
Isn’t geography always like issue #2 after money?
Hell. We love more games. Let’s bank it.
Part of the reason not to move is less games.
We built a tits dome to play home games in November december when FBs “can’t”…
But they sure seem to have some marquee games that are being played.
Offer some Friday night FBS December games.
We can still play “if you wanna play in texas” at that one.
For TRADITION.
TM
Like Cameron Indoor level FBS games.
HOT TICKET BROSKIS
Let them THINK NDSU would be “too beat up” for the playoffs.
BISON FBS FOOTBALL
Well, guess I meant outside the MVFC/Big Sky/CAA type schools.Quote:
Originally Posted by ByeSonBusiness
161 would be something like #35 in FCS ... tons of FCS teams are better.
NEC teams (their only win) barely qualify as FCS in my mind.
FIU is atrocious ... their coach quit saying the school just didn't care about football.
They've been begging other schools for used pads and equipment. They make SHSU look rich.
Hint hint sickQuote:
Originally Posted by I miss Chubs
Might have something to do with being 2500 miles from the real US.Quote:
Originally Posted by I miss Chubs
FBS teams play home games in November. What are ya referring to?Quote:
Originally Posted by I miss Chubs
The FBS “break” for “finals” that FCS somehow is able to ignore and NDSU excel academically despite 16 possible games.Quote:
Originally Posted by ByeSonBusiness
It’s barely spoken about anymore and encroached upon more and more, but only for “marquee” matchups.
Well. If we need money. Let’s make some fucking money then. Bring in Alabama for a “tune up” prior to the playoffs. Put it on ESPN on a Friday.
Saban strikes me as a guy who might give football a chance over the statistics for us.
$$$$$???
They are a lot cooler about football and money in the SEC than the Big Yen, or UND. [emoji6]
The 4 million helps but is not a large difference maker. It represents less than 10 percent of the revenue for most MW schools. The trade off is mostly night games for football and not all on Saturdays. That hurts the gate immensely. In addition, the games aren't blacked out for the home team. A night game in San Diego is delightful. However, most of the MW plays in cold weather and at elevation. Not so pleasant.
As for the non conference pay days..P5's will pay up to 1.5 million but generally it is around 750 grand. Out of that money you have to pay for your flights, hotel rooms and food. However, you can use what is leftover to pay for your home non conference appearance fees..
Coaches in the MW do make more per year but a lot of that is coming from boosters with relatively low base pay from the schools.
Nevada pays Cost of Education stipends to all athletes. I think it is around 5 thousand per. That comes from the athletic budget.
NIL funds come from boosters and businesses. That doesn't come out of the budget..
I am sure NDSU could make the numbers work but nothing is easy in mid major land.
Well. They are further???. I guess NDSU IS f’d.Quote:
Originally Posted by ByeSonBusiness
/thread
You are shitting bricks that NDSU ROBOTIC DOMINATING notre dame would look really bad for “high level college football”.
Yup. It will.
Post it on their board son.
Tell them the Bison fans said they are a bunch of pussies. A Bison’s only natural rival may be a lucky drunk irish Catholic midget protecting his gold.
Well.
We are taking the fucking gold. Jesus said NDSU is his favorite football team.
And we praise “defense wins championships” Jesus. “Touchdown Jesus” comes second. Or sometimes not at all.
TM
10 Char
Right, but all of those costs are already included in the budgets. So we’re just back to comparing budgets. I don’t understand how this is difficult to grasp. We’re talking about the increased revenue going towards the things you are talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
Whether $4M is a large difference maker or not doesn’t matter. It’s still $4M. If $4M isn’t a lot of money then why am I being told that we’d need to raise numbers similar to that to compete?
People are saying “look at home much more money they spend. Then on top of that, look how much more they spend on coaches”. No, it’s already included in the first budget number.
If it makes ya feel better, Alaska schools get the same "geographic pass". Travel to Anchorage or Fairbanks is not fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by I miss Chubs
Agreed. Or Grand Forks.Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Sicatoka
Maybe we don’t deserve a pass. But you guys…. You probably do.
Like I said..I am sure NDSU can handle the budget part. However, playing in the MW may not raise your revenue much..Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
$4m is still a lot more than other G5 conferences.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
We would only get about half that from AAC, MAC or SBC.
And its likely a negative number for cusa.
The AAC tv deal distributes 7+ million to their members..
Only to the old/legacy members, the 6 new adds are only getting $2M each.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
It creates a competitive disadvantage for the new schools.
Its been speculated this deal will decrease with the loss of Cincinnati, UCF and Houston.
It has also been speculated the reason the legacy members still get a $7m payout is from the departing 3 exit fees.
Losing those 3 powerhouse schools and the 6 backfills they chose weaken AAC a lot, financially and competively.
Its still a solid G5, but MWC should be the top dog now.
Besides the fact that the MW doesn't need or want NDSU right now, if or when the PAC 12 snipes the top 2-4 teams out of the conference then what happens to that money? She gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHorns
You say you don't understand how we're not understanding this, but I'm quite sure it's you that doesn't understand. If we go MWC, expenses increase faster than income. We need to find a way to make up that difference. And no, it's not the extra media or OOC deals, those are already accounted for. Not saying we can't do it, but don't think for a second we'd suddenly be swimming in more cash than we know what to do with.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
Well a few things.Quote:
Originally Posted by daddy daycare
No, the money's not just "gone". Maybe it gets reduced. If the money gets reduced, it will be reduced for all of the remaining teams just the same as it would be for us. The hypothetical gap between NDSU and the MW on budgets would remain the same.