That this hasn’t happened yet proves that Matt Larson is a lazy, do nothing, elitist East Coast coaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by EP NDSU Fan
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That this hasn’t happened yet proves that Matt Larson is a lazy, do nothing, elitist East Coast coaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by EP NDSU Fan
The FBS independents are independent for one of two reasons. Either they want to be or nobody wants them. Army uses their scheduling around the country as a recruitment tool and money doesn't matter in the slightest. Notre Dame and BYU had significantly better media deals on their own than as part of a conference, which has only recently changed. Those are the by choice programs.Quote:
Originally Posted by EP NDSU Fan
OTOH, NMSU couldn't find a home after the WAC dropped football until CUSA was taking anyone who could fog a mirror. Liberty might claim they wanted to be a religious independent like ND or BYU but again jumped at the first(and only) conference offer. UConn FB is an afterthought to their basketball and when they got the Big East invite it was an instant yes. UConn wanted to keep FB in the AAC but they didn't want an affiliate. UMass was kicked out of the MAC after refusing an all-sports invite, deciding that A-10 membership was better even if it left FB out in the cold.
Two days ago I guess. Sheesh ... A guy goes into the woods for a couple days and loses all track of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoRepsTheLurker
I'm guessing he didn't say anything too revealing, or you guys would be talking about it on here
He talks a lot and says very little, IMO. I don't know him personally and don't have any major problems with decisions he's made but he just feels like a politico. Maybe I'm comparing him too much with Gene Taylor who I just wanted to drink a beer and chat with.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoRepsTheLurker
Supposedly only five or six of twelve PAC12 ADs at media day.
The rest defecting to the Big10 and Big12?Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Sicatoka
https://www.latimes.com/sports/story...oners-commentsQuote:
Originally Posted by Gully
Hard to say. Merging with the MWC does not appear to be on the table, though. I still think the PAC survives, most likely by stealing from the MWC.
But back to ML on 1660, I found this interesting - https://twitter.com/NdsuToFBS/status...C8vbq3qIwrAAAA
This suggests to me that the AD surely knows a few things that we all do not ...
Here's a thought. If the Big 10 or Big 12 is cool with being coast to coast, why wouldn't the PAC 12 do the same? They have just as much ability to cherry pick teams
I suspect it is the lack of academic peers available or at least high end schools. Who they gonna grab? Tulsa? Tulane?Quote:
Originally Posted by HerdBot
PAC would need the ACC to blow up to see some teams become available. Otherwise they would be looking at AAC | MWC to get further east. SMU, CSU, Memphis, USF. I can't see them looking at the Sun Belt and the BIG 12 would be better conference if and when Wash and Oregon go to the Big 10.
Anything is possible these days, but IMO the PAC has recently become the worst P5 conference. Nobody is leaving B1G, Big12, or SEC to PAC. If someone does break the ACC's GOR it won't be to join PAC. There aren't a whole lot of G5 options if they want to stick with AAU programs, and if academics no longer matter then there's not much reason not to offer MWC schools first.Quote:
Originally Posted by HerdBot
Another thing I was looking at, remember how the Summit had to get a waiver for a year because we dropped below the sponsored sports minimum? PAC's already lost Men's soccer, swimming and Women's lacrosse, and if Stanford leaves they also lose wrestling and Women's swimming. Plus being on the ragged edge of several other sports if others leave. MWC schools on average sponsor fewer sports so they can't do a 1 for 1 replacement.
Some talk here from coaches about FBS reorg:
https://herosports.com/fcs-football-...-coaches-bzbz/
Quote:
“I think there are dominos above us that have to fall to dictate that. Having coached at the G5 level and the FCS, is there a level where it takes the top of FCS and the bottom of even the Power Five along with the Group of Five, does that exist in the future? I think there will be, whatever the number is between 40-60, teams at the top. And then is there a bit of reshuffling to say who wants to be a part of this next level? The second level of football, which I would say now is the Group of Five, and we’re really the third level of D1 football. Is that second level of football, can that level compete for a championship much like we do now? Does that take some FCS teams up to that? I really think that future could be reality.”
Maybe when this all shakes out MVFC and Big Sky become part of the 2nd tier, which is where we fit best. We don't have the same resources as Alabama, OSU, Michigan, etc and likely won't in this lifetime.
Actually, it already looks like SHSU is going down the path of signing up for beatdowns and scheduling payday games. Some of the poor schools in the MAC like Kent St do this also, and have very few home games OOC.Quote:
Originally Posted by EP NDSU Fan
Not sure people understand just how poor CUSA is at this point, and how badly that will impact them.
They will likely jump for a captive portal like Flo if it nets them 100k or so per team.
The Flo model is to take your fanbase hostage and charge $20/month. The problem is it kills all outside exposure.
CUSA is becoming financially desperate. I don't know how long those schools survive as FBS.
I think the thought process is as follows for the FBS at ANY cost crowd:Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHorns
1. Get into any conference that is FBS
2. Be at the top of said conference
3. Wait for conference to implode
4. Hope that other conferences scoop us up
The first 3 things are probably the easy part to predict. #4 is the hardest to guarantee, especially if we're not instantly a top 2 team in that FBS conference and/or if recruiting falls off since we're no longer competing for championships.
I think you can get away with not competing for national championships if you're a MWC/Sunbelt team and still bring in the recruits. I'm not sure that is the case for MAC/AAC/CUSA going forward. I think many kids will pick a championship competing FCS team over a good/mediocre G5 team in a crap conference.
Now, a dominant team in any of those conferences always has a shot, and I think short term it doesn't hurt recruiting, but the goal has to be to be in the best G5 conference that will take you within 5 years of moving to a lower level G5. Good luck getting a G5 to send an invite if that is your (obvious, even if not publicly stated) intent.
I'm 100% on board with a G5 jump, but it has to make sense as well. MWC would be ideal, but things need to happen to shakeup their structure first.
A conference with NDSU, Liberty, UTEP, MTSU and WKU sounds pretty good and doesn't have to implode. It fact, it sounds decent in basketball too when you include NMSU. I think it would be fun to be a part of making that conference respectable again. But regardless, MWC sees itself as a conference that doesn't invite FCS calls ups. It just doesn't. So we have to be FBS if we want that to happen. I'm okay with independent as a temporary fix, but none of you think that's a good idea. That leaves CUSA. I actually think NDSU's presence in CUSA could help it get a better media deal because NDSU does attract some national interest--especially if we move up. People want to see us move up and would tune in to see how we're doing in FBS.Quote:
Originally Posted by tjamz
No i was thinking a little bigger like Clemson, Miami, Florida State. Their TV deal is amongst the worst and the Pac 12 expires soonerQuote:
Originally Posted by ByeSonBusiness
Academic peers is now a delusional wish list
The thing is 3 of those 4 are halfway out the door, and could be gone before we play a game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Professorbum
WKU is likely MAC, MTSU wants to cash out exit fees and go AAC. UTEP could be a MWC candidate. And even Liberty would prefer SBC if they could get in.
Who IS likely to remain in the conference is SHSU, FIU, JSU, NMSU.
Those programs are bottom of the bucket in every way, and they want to add SFA and Tarleton if anyone leaves.
Even with NDSU, I don't see those programs landing a big media deal. None of the networks are even nibbling.
There are reasons 9 schools left and others want out. Its a total train wreck conference.
That's, at best, a middle FCS conferenceQuote:
Originally Posted by BigHorns
ML has always danced about fbs because he has zero visionQuote:
Originally Posted by WhoRepsTheLurker
Nd eye clinic bro.Quote:
Originally Posted by El_Chapo
PAC expansion candidates ranked
https://saturdayblitz.com/2022/07/31...on-candidates/
10. UNLV
9. UC Davis
8. Fresno State
7. NDSU
6. Gonzaga
5. Air Force
4. Hawaii
3. SMU
2. BSU
1. SDSU
Always fun to see NDSU make these lists, even if it is just internet fodder
Lucky #7 !!!Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoRepsTheLurker
That's the other SDSU at #1. :)
San Diego State part of my three degrees of separation from Jr. Seau. My sister-in-law was roommates with Seau's sister when they were students at SDSU.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoRepsTheLurker
I have no idea what the Pac 12 will do but the most intriguing name on that list is UC Davis. I could certainly see them on the MW radar. They have a small football stadium though it is expandable. Their academics are first rate, they have 40 thousand students, they are in the neighborhood, they sponsor 24 sports, their athletic budget is bumping up on 40 million and could easily grow, and the Sacramento metro (which includes Davis) is 2.5 million.
The MW is transitioning the focus a bit towards basketball because football is becoming too corporate and pricey. You have an excellent football program but David has you topped in every other area..
Though the MW has not added directly from FCS, they have never publicly announced that they never will.
I do believe Davis has been a topic of discussion with the MW brass for quite awhile but they were loathe to go above 12..That could change soon if the Pac or the B12 do some poaching.
All good points, except for the fact that NDSU has a better basketball team, program and fan following than UC Davis. And as you can see with UC Davis and all other California colleges, the same dollars don't go nearly as far there as they do in the midwest. The FCS California public schools have larger budgets than NDSU, yet their coaches talk about how much more NDSU has in the way of resources than them. UC Davis is true FCS program in football and a bottom half program in all other D1 sports; unlike NDSU. And if it's about eyeballs and national market share like everyone talks about, UC Davis ain't gonna be it for the MW. It's Montana and NDSU.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
Davis has location, size and academics on NDSU. NDSU has quality of athletic department, tv market and facilities on Davis. I'm not sure which one would win out, I just hope we find out.
I could live with CUSA, only because it is a ladder. Only the indy option is off the table in my book, just too much risk being completely out on an island.
FCS football is not a viable long term option for our football program. It no longer offers a compelling product, unless something dramatic occurs the FCS product is only going to continue its decline.
Fair points. I don't think the MW will add unless they lose 4 schools..I don't think they will be losing 4, though..
The only reason UC Davis has a huge budget is because their tuition in so expensive. It's 45k a year out of state and it inflates their budget number. The full cost of attendance to live on campus is $70,267Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
The fact they have so many sports inflates the total number of scholarships and that makes a huge budget.
They aren't spending much of that on athletics or facilities. They can't even afford full cost of attendance stipend, something we have funded since day 1
If the Mountain West cared about academics, they wouldn't have Boise and wouldn't have looked at Gonzaga, who isn't even an accredited University
Yeah UC Davis’ academics probably gives it a better chance with the PAC than it does with the MW. Exactly my point with their budget. $30M budgets are not apples to apples when everything from tuition to janitors cost at least double in Sacramento. $30M in Sacramento is like $10M in Jacksonville, AL.Quote:
Originally Posted by HerdBot
Considering 8 is the minimum to even be considered a league, I would hope soQuote:
Originally Posted by MWC
Hard to say what a better conference will do for recognition in California. The Big Sky likely does nothing for Davis. The Mountain West is at least a familiar brand.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSU92
I either heard it direct from the commissioner or he implied that they’d like to stay at 12. If they were to lose, they’d like to replace with the same number, it starts getting scary close to 8 because other conferences start circling the water.Quote:
Originally Posted by HerdBot
Yes, MWC. I’m fully aware the conference can do just fine with 10 and has done so in the past. ;)
CUSA would be falling off the ladder and might even be worse off in 2 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by NDSUstudent
What do San Diego State, Fresno State, Utah State, UNLV, Nevada, San Jose State and Boise State have in common other than being in the MW?
According to Wikipedia, besides Utah State they all have significantly smaller endowments than NDSU?Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
Good guess... but no...
Go Big, Or Go Home
TRAVIS
I don't know if you're trying to make some esoteric point, but the easy answer is when you weigh all the factors that go into conference membership, the schools you listed are more like each other than those in the PAC, WCC, Big West, or Big Sky. That's why they're in the MWC. In the future some may decide they've changed enough to be more like a different conference and try to move, but it's really not more complicated than that. There's no shadowy cabal running things behind the curtain.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
All are west of the Rocky Mountains -- some just barely. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by MWC
All of those schools spent time in a conference that hasn't sponsored football for 17 years..Most of these school knew in advance that football was likely to end soon. Boise and NV, in particular, saw this as the opportunity to move up despite the fact the whole thing was obviously collapsing.
You folks here are quite confident that your school is upper level G5 caliber now.
I am not advocating for you to join CUSA but no matter where you go, the good programs eventually get better opportunities. If you are as great as you claim, CUSA is not a dead end..It is a bridge.
Either you believe you are destined for the big time or you don't..