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MinotBison
06-10-2006, 12:29 AM
On the evening news (Ch. 13), there was a story saying that the DAC (that's the Dakota Athletic Conference for those of you in Rio Linda) athletic directors were thinking about asking UM-Crookston to join the DAC, which would mean they would drop from the D-II ranks to the NAIA.

I will resist... the urge... (don't do it) to suggest that there is one more school they could ask. ;D ;D ;D

Mr._Bill
06-10-2006, 04:17 AM
On the evening news (Ch. 13), there was a story saying that the DAC (that's the Dakota Athletic Conference for those of you in Rio Linda) athletic directors were thinking about asking UM-Crookston to join the DAC, which would mean they would drop from the D-II ranks to the NAIA.

I will resist... the urge... (don't do it) to suggest that there is one more school they could ask. *;D ;D ;D

With all the talk abou the DAC going to the NCAA ranks, why would UMC go NAIA just to go back to the NCAA in a couple of years? Just my first impression.

Mr._Bill
06-10-2006, 04:22 AM
Minot,

I grew up in the area there and I don't understand by the Beavers didn't follow Mary in their NCAA move. I would think that MSU is at the high end of the gene pool in the DAC and could have easily followed Mary. MSU would generate some serious energy if they had joined the NSIC and started bringing in some of that competition. Enlighten me. . . Thanks!

broke_back_mnt
06-10-2006, 07:31 AM
Dont you think this is good for Crookston and the Dac? It solidifies the Dac and hurts the NCC since they need new members.

Mr._Bill
06-10-2006, 07:49 AM
Dont you think this is good for Crookston and the Dac? *It solidifies the Dac and hurts the NCC since they need new members.



I agree with you, Crookston to the DAC would benefit that conference.

But the DAC is not stable and has severeal members and even the conference talking NCAA DII. If I were crookston, I would stay put until I knew the DAC's plans and future.

I don't think the DAC belongs in DII, but I think Minot should be looking NSIC for their future with their numbers and facilities. Just one opinion.

BisonMav
06-10-2006, 02:15 PM
Schools used to be able to compete in both NCAA DII and NAIA. Has that rule changed?

MplsBison
06-10-2006, 04:27 PM
With the new possibility of DII-A and DII-AA, I think the DAC could easily be a power conference in DII-AA. I think that would be 8 teams go to the playoffs and each team has no more than 24 scholarships.

Something like that.

MN_BISONS
06-10-2006, 04:39 PM
When Crookston first went from a jr. college to a four year, I believe they were members of the DAC or whatever it was called back then. One of the reason for leaving was that the school is so much more expensive than those in the DAC that it was hard for them to recruit so they thought they'd have better luck moving up to the NSIC. Well looking back on it now, that move hasn't really helped them out too much and I believe it still costs more to go to UMC than most NSIC schools. Top that with the fact that they have very little money for scholarships and their location it is easy to see why they seem to struggle so much in most of the sports that the school offers.

MinotBison
06-10-2006, 05:13 PM
Minot,

I grew up in the area there and I don't understand by the Beavers didn't follow Mary in their NCAA move. *I would think that MSU is at the high end of the gene pool in the DAC and could have easily followed Mary. *MSU would generate some serious energy if they had joined the NSIC and started bringing in some of that competition. *Enlighten me. . . Thanks!

I think alot of the decision not to move up had to do with not having a conference to which they could move. (Gee, where have we heard that before?)

I think a move to the NSIC along with Mary would have been a good idea. It would involve more finances, and the exact numbers I am not sure about, but a survey of their Beaver Boosters indicate that most would be willing to increase their level of giving.

I think eventually they will move, but I also think they should have been looking more carefully at this several years ago.

MplsBison
06-10-2006, 05:16 PM
UMC is sufffering in exactly the same way that UMM was and still is.


I just wish the people in control of the UM system would put an end to Crookston and Morris' misery and hit them over the head with the baseball bat.


It's almost an analogous situation to the NDUS with VC and Mayville, except I think the UM can shut them down if they want.

broke_back_mnt
06-10-2006, 08:44 PM
Morris is a good university. It should not be shut down. Its serving its purpose. I know the coach. They produce half of the electricity the campus uses from two wind towers.

MplsBison
06-10-2006, 09:33 PM
Turn them into a JC, then.

You can never have too many of those. Esp. in rural areas.


The Wyoming system is really the perfect system. A bunch of rural JCs and one university.

JJ_Penn
06-11-2006, 05:49 AM
How many more JC's do you think that MN needs?? UMM and UMC both serve a purpose, UMC for agriculture and UMM for the liberal arts degree. Why is everyone so freaking interested in closing down schools right away??!!

MplsBison
06-11-2006, 02:32 PM
The UM has a very nice liberal arts program and a very nice agriculture program.

Why is everyone so freaking interested in keeping small schools that waste taxpayer money open??!!

broke_back_mnt
06-11-2006, 03:24 PM
I actually think its the large schools that cost money. *I dont know this for sure, but the largest school in ND spends the most/student. *Probably the same way in Minnesota. *I may be wrong about this, I havent done the research.

The only question I have about the small schools is how much support do you give them? *At some point they should be allowed to fail. *

The DAC 10 is a good fit for UMC. *One reason the DAC has been discussing DII is because of the stability problem and lack of scheduling opportunities. *Crookston would restore schedules to what they were before Bismarck and shore them up if Mayville has to pull out or one of the others move up.

sambini
06-11-2006, 03:27 PM
Why would they want to move backwards?

broke_back_mnt
06-11-2006, 03:31 PM
It might not be forward or backward, it might mean finding the best fit. UM-Crookston has had a tough time in DII and their budget problems make them look more like a Dac 10 than a DII NSIC.

Thats probably a big reason NDSU moved up. We fit better in DI than DII. Larger rather than smaller. For Crookston it might just be the opposite?

MplsBison
06-11-2006, 03:48 PM
I actually think its the large schools that cost money. I dont know this for sure, but the largest school in ND spends the most/student. Probably the same way in Minnesota. I may be wrong about this, I havent done the research.

That's the entire point of why we're so mad.

Mayville and Valley City get more money per student from the NDUS than NDSU and UND!

They have to get the much money because their enrollment is so low that they need that amount to even stay open!



You're absolutely right. At some point, a school should just be allowed to fail.

JJ_Penn
06-12-2006, 12:58 AM
MPLSBison: THe UM may have a great school for both agriculture and liberal arts, but why would someone give up the opportunity for a rural campus that has agriculture all around it to go to an urban campus surrounded by cement and buildings...maybe real life experience??? Also the comparison of the two compared to VCSU and MaSU isn't totally the same because of the difference in tuition paid by the MN schools compared to the ND schools.

As far as UMC would be better off going DIII and trying to join the UMAC, no scholarships and they wouldn't have to change to the NAIA.

MplsBison
06-12-2006, 10:27 AM
Are you suggesting that UM ag students get no real life experiance?

I take it you've never been to Rosemount MN.

broke_back_mnt
06-12-2006, 12:05 PM
I guess I was thinking about state funding. North Dakotas largest university gets the most per student.

It doesnt follow that if you closed a smaller college the money would be available for use by the larger university. Its an assumption your making.

mebison
06-12-2006, 02:57 PM
I'm usually just a lurker around here, but I have to point out one thing about this whole small school discussion...if you use the idea of closing the small schools because they require more money per student in support, then don't you also have to apply that within the school? Should we shut down the chemistry department because the engineering college gets way less money per student?

I do agree that keeping schools open indefinately to keep small towns alive is wasteful, but I think its more complex than simply writing a spreadsheet of the most efficient schools in terms of output per state $ and lopping off the lowest 80%.

On a larger scale, the state of North Dakota receives well OVER $1 back in federal aid for every $1 of tax paid. That puts ND on the wrong end of the chopping block.

MplsBison
06-12-2006, 09:51 PM
I guess I was thinking about state funding. North Dakotas largest university gets the most per student.

VC and Mayville get more dollars per student than NDSU and UND.

Have you even been reading the threads lately?


It doesnt follow that if you closed a smaller college the money would be available for use by the larger university. Its an assumption your making.

It easily follows.

Closing down Mayville and VC means more money for NDSU and UND.

Mr._Bill
06-12-2006, 11:42 PM
With the new possibility of DII-A and DII-AA, I think the DAC could easily be a power conference in DII-AA. I think that would be 8 teams go to the playoffs and each team has no more than 24 scholarships.

Something like that.

Even though it would be just for football, I think the DII-A & DII-AA nomenclature is a bunch of crap. DI is trying to get rid of it, why would DII adapt it? If you are going to have 2 different scholly levels for DII football, just do it and call it something. But don't create a naming system that makes every DII school that plays for the same championship in every sport except football have to deal with that.

DI (Bowl), DI (Playoff), DII (Playoff-36), DII (Playoff-24)

JJ_Penn
06-13-2006, 02:01 AM
MPLSBison...you would be wrong to say that I have never been there... I was merely pointing out the fact that Crookston, is surrounded by agriculuture...UM not so much. THe kids that are going to go into agriculture are mostly from small high schools and rural areas, the idea of being able to go to a campus with small numbers in a rural area is more appealing to them, than having to go to a school with 40000+ students at it and have to figure out the transit system to get from one class to the other. Let's just agree to disagree on the whole subject...seems better that way!

dakotadan
06-13-2006, 04:30 AM
I think part of the problem here is that people are equating the quality of a schools athletics with the quality of the degrees earned there. Just because UMC, UMM, MSU, etc aren't huge football powers doesnt mean that they aren't producing educated students. On the other hand, I also understand that budgets need to be followed and balanced.

MplsBison
06-13-2006, 10:31 AM
MPLSBison...you would be wrong to say that I have never been there... I was merely pointing out the fact that Crookston, is surrounded by agriculuture...UM not so much. THe kids that are going to go into agriculture are mostly from small high schools and rural areas, the idea of being able to go to a campus with small numbers in a rural area is more appealing to them, than having to go to a school with 40000+ students at it and have to figure out the transit system to get from one class to the other.

You know what, you're probably right.


However, why should Mr. Joe MN taxpayer be picking up the tab for these kids to be getting the private school experiance for peanuts?


That's not how higher education works.

broke_back_mnt
06-13-2006, 12:02 PM
Mnpls1234 your going to have to show me the facts. *When you do post them make sure you offer up at least one line that bullies and shout the answer would you please? * 8-)