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HuskerFan
01-15-2007, 10:01 PM
Hey Bison fans, I was just wondering what your opinion would be "IF" NDSU and SDSU joined the Big 12 Conference for baseball. In my opinion, I would love to see it, because I was born in Fargo, and would like to see NDSU join a great baseball conference. I always thought it was strange that there is only 10 schools in the Big 12 that play baseball, so why not fill those other 2 spots.

roadwarrior
01-15-2007, 10:34 PM
I dont see much of a chance since next spring we will be in the Mid Continent Conference.

RodentiaX1
01-16-2007, 04:27 PM
Conferences usually don't take on associate members unless they are pretty short of full members for a sport. 10 teams out of 12 isn't all that short. Now for field hockey, the Big Ten only has 7 out of 11 teams that play it, that might be a situation where they would look for an associate member. But NDSU already has a baseball home.

Mr._Bill
01-17-2007, 12:34 AM
Yeah, I'm sure that Big XII offer is on the table. Even if it was, too little too late.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-17-2007, 01:57 PM
The Big 10 also has 10 teams for baseball (Wisconsin dropped their program) and I think that would be a more appropriate conference for us if we were to be added to a conference for baseball only. Having said that, I think Gene needs to up the funding for the program significantly and we need to win in the Mid-Con before we considered anything like that.

Mr._Bill
01-26-2007, 10:41 PM
How many schollies are the bison offering in 2007?

sambini
01-27-2007, 01:06 AM
Big 12 has four teams ranked.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-27-2007, 01:23 PM
How many schollies are the bison offering in 2007?

I've heard it was five, but I'm not sure. That seems like the same amount as it was a couple years ago, but then again I don't really know.

2006gwfcchamps
01-27-2007, 04:11 PM
I wish OPE gave expenses info on every sport.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-27-2007, 04:42 PM
That would be nice. I think that there is no real mystery that it would show baseball needs to be more fully funded.

Mr._Bill
01-27-2007, 05:16 PM
Are those schollies all partials, and how many player are receiving some scholarship money? I agree, baseball needs to be funded at a greater level as we start Mid-Con play in 2008 and beyond.

We have many of the ingredients to develop a great program, minus the northern weather. Hopefully a great practice facility for baseball can be a future priority, along with emphasis on coaching and recruiting. There is no reason why the bison cannot complete for the mid-con title and an ncaa playoff spot. That would be awesome.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-27-2007, 09:13 PM
My understanding (again, who knows how good that is) is that they have about 5 scholarships, as in five full scholarships divided up amongst the team. There isn't anyone on the team getting a full scholarship (unless things have really changed since I was playing), and there are probably more than a few guys who aren't getting anything.

Mr._Bill
01-27-2007, 10:08 PM
I wonder how that compares to 9 time champ in the mid-con Oral Roberts? That's who we will be competing with.

It seem like there is no match for them in the mid-con, and at our scholly level, we won't push them either.

2006gwfcchamps
01-27-2007, 10:40 PM
SDSU might give them a shot.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-28-2007, 02:58 AM
I'd expect ORU has the max 11.5 scholarships. Now that I think I can't remember the exact amount but it is 11. something.

2006gwfcchamps
01-28-2007, 03:16 PM
Why would the NCAA ever make a scholarship maximum a fraction? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?

DenverBison05
01-28-2007, 03:28 PM
Why would the NCAA ever make a scholarship maximum a fraction? *:-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?
Its the NCAA. ;D And baseball is allowed 11.7 Equivalencies (i.e. scholarships)

Mr._Bill
01-28-2007, 03:37 PM
So with a 30 player roster and 11.7 schollies

An Oral Roberts at 11.5 could give out . . .

4 Fulls
10 Halves
10 Quarters
6 No Schollies

An NDSU at 5 could give out . . .

2 Fulls * *(or) *0
4 Halves (or) * * 5
4 Qtr (or) *10
20 No Schollies *15

I could see where that could create a better product on the field for ORU. Hopefully NDSU can move up the ladder a little.

2006gwfcchamps
01-28-2007, 03:46 PM
I suppose women's soccer has a maximum of 6.13306047022342681884765625.

That's 1/128 + 1/64 + 1/32 + 1/16 + 1/8 + 6.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-28-2007, 07:00 PM
So with a 30 player roster and 11.7 schollies

An Oral Roberts at 11.5 could give out . . .

4 Fulls
10 Halves
10 Quarters
6 No Schollies

An NDSU at 5 could give out . . .

2 Fulls * *(or) *0
4 Halves (or) * * 5
4 Qtr (or) *10
20 No Schollies *15

I could see where that could create a better product on the field for ORU. *Hopefully NDSU can move up the ladder a little.

I bet there is nobody on ORU that has a full scholarship. They are rare in college baseball because of the need to cover so many guys with limited scholarships, so unless you are and absolute stud you are on a partial scholarship.

Mr._Bill
01-28-2007, 07:04 PM
So with a 30 player roster and 11.7 schollies

An Oral Roberts at 11.5 could give out . . .

4 Fulls
10 Halves
10 Quarters
6 No Schollies

An NDSU at 5 could give out . . .

2 Fulls * *(or) *0
4 Halves (or) * * 5
4 Qtr (or) *10
20 No Schollies *15

I could see where that could create a better product on the field for ORU. *Hopefully NDSU can move up the ladder a little.

I bet there is nobody on ORU that has a full scholarship. *They are rare in college baseball because of the need to cover so many guys with limited scholarships, so unless you are and absolute stud you are on a partial scholarship.


That would mean that the entire team is probably on scholarship, and you are probably correct. Whereas 50-70% of the bison team is probably receiving some scholarship support.

DenverBison05
01-28-2007, 09:06 PM
I suppose women's soccer has a maximum of 6.13306047022342681884765625.

That's 1/128 + 1/64 + 1/32 + 1/16 + 1/8 + 6.

Actually only men sports have fractions in their equivalencies. You should look up the rules some time, I think it will be enlighten you.

Hammersmith
01-28-2007, 09:10 PM
Why would the NCAA ever make a scholarship maximum a fraction? *:-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?
FYI, for Title IX reasons the NCAA reduced most men's scholarships by a certain percentage while leaving women's sports alone. Most men's limits are fractions while all women's sports are integers.

i.e.
Men's

Baseball11.7
Basketball13.0
X-Country/T&F12.6
Fencing4.5
Football63.0
Golf4.5

Women's

Badminton6.0
Basketball15.0
Bowling5.0
X-Country/T&F18.0
Equestrian15.0
Golf6.0

2006gwfcchamps
01-28-2007, 10:23 PM
title IX, should've figured.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-31-2007, 01:14 PM
Football shouldn't count against Title IX for the simple reason that there isn't a women's sport that requires that level of scholarship commitment and it skews the statistics.

2006gwfcchamps
01-31-2007, 04:16 PM
Football shouldn't count against Title IX for the simple reason that there isn't a women's sport that requires that level of scholarship commitment and it skews the statistics.


Absolutely.

Until women's football becomes a mainstay of American athletics, this has to be done.


How do we get there?


Think how simple title IX becomes if football is taken out of the equation.


Literally, every other sport has a male/female analog.

Wrestling is the only sport that doesn't that I can see.

Jeffdaryl3rd
01-31-2007, 04:25 PM
It would make everything remarkably simple. Football basically provides the budget for most of the other sports, men's and women's, it is exempted from this portion of the direct counting and Title IX would then effectively become a rule that ensures that the school is spending money equally on men's and women's sports that represent the typical sporting spectrum. Probably wishful thinking, but it would be great to see.

Mr._Bill
01-31-2007, 11:15 PM
Why would the NCAA ever make a scholarship maximum a fraction? *:-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?
FYI, for Title IX reasons the NCAA reduced most men's scholarships by a certain percentage while leaving women's sports alone. Most men's limits are fractions while all women's sports are integers.

i.e.
Men's

Baseball11.7
Basketball13.0
X-Country/T&F12.6
Fencing4.5
Football63.0
Golf4.5

Women's

Badminton6.0
Basketball15.0
Bowling5.0
X-Country/T&F18.0
Equestrian15.0
Golf6.0


What about softball, how many there??

Hammersmith
02-01-2007, 03:13 AM
Here's the whole(long) list:

Men's
Head Count Sports
Basketball13.0
Equivalency Sports
Baseball11.7
X-Country Only05.0
X-Country/T&F12.6
Fencing04.5
Football63.0/85
Golf04.5
Gymnastics06.3
Ice Hockey18.0/30
Lacrosse12.6
Rifle03.6
Skiing06.3
Soccer09.9
Swimming/Diving09.9
Tennis04.5
Volleyball04.5
Water Polo04.5
Wrestling09.9
Women's
Head Count Sports
Basketball15.0
Gymnastics12.0
Tennis08.0
Volleyball12.0
Equivalency Sports
Archery05.0
Badminton06.0
Bowling05.0
X-Country Only06.0
X-Country/T&F18.0
Equestrian15.0
Fencing05.0
Field Hockey12.0
Golf06.0
Ice Hockey18.0/30
Lacrosse12.0
Rowing20.0
Rugby12.0
Skiing07.0
Soccer14.0
Softball12.0
Squasch12.0
Swimming/Diving14.0
Synch. Swimming05.0
Team Handball10.0
Water Polo08.0


Head count sports only allow full scholarships; no partials. Football and ice hockey have limits on the number of counters; i.e. 63 scholarships distributed over 85 players.

2006gwfcchamps
02-01-2007, 12:45 PM
This is for DI I assume?

Because FBS is a head count with an 85 limit.

Hammersmith
02-01-2007, 06:09 PM
This is for DI I assume?

Because FBS is a head count with an 85 limit.
No, it's for Division III.
[/sarcasm]


Of course it's for Division I. I didn't really think there was much point to labeling it since we're talking about sports at a DI FCS school on a DI FCS message board. I see I was mistaken.

For the record, the only difference between a list like this for a school like NDSU and a school like U of Minnesota is the football scholarships. Everything else is exactly the same.


BTW, I pretty much agree with jeffdaryl3rd about a football exemption for Title IX, but I'd probably do something like count football scholies only to the level of the largest women's sport. In other words, rowing allows 20 equivalencies, so FCS football would count as 20. The remaining 43 scholies would not count against Title IX. That would seem to be a decent compromise, but what do I know?

sambini
02-01-2007, 11:07 PM
Big 12 baseball hmm...Some North Dakotans have played in the BIG 12..

Mr._Bill
02-02-2007, 12:02 AM
Based on this list, for the next round of sports we should fire up Men's Hockey, and Women's Swimming and Equestrian. What is the price tag on 60 extra scholarships.

Man, und's D1 budget is going to have to be 1.3 to 1.5 times the size of NDSU's to support all the programs they will have at division I. I can see where Chuck is a little bit nervous about the DI move.

Jeffdaryl3rd
02-03-2007, 10:58 PM
BTW, I pretty much agree with jeffdaryl3rd about a football exemption for Title IX, but I'd probably do something like count football scholies only to the level of the largest women's sport. In other words, rowing allows 20 equivalencies, so FCS football would count as 20. The remaining 43 scholies would not count against Title IX. That would seem to be a decent compromise, but what do I know?

That would probably be a better system than not counting it at all. Either way, the main thing is that the men's athletic department shouldn't be penalized for a lack of a large roster women's sport.

bisonpride2k
02-04-2007, 04:15 AM
Big 12 baseball *hmm...Some North Dakotans have played in the BIG 12..

2 Shireks and an Erstad. Not what i would consider alot of players to build around at that level. If you had the chance to play at NDSU or Nebraska I think the obvious choice would be Nebraska 98% of the time.

Paulie
02-06-2007, 02:08 PM
The Mid Con sponsors baseball numb nuts. ::)

mikelsch
02-06-2007, 03:40 PM
The Mid Con sponsors baseball numb nuts. *::)

Perfect. I'm glad someone posted this.

Jeffdaryl3rd
02-07-2007, 07:11 AM
As was said earlier, I think NDSU needs to do some more winning before this suggestion really even made a modicum of sense.