View Full Version : NO UND NEXT YEAR!
BisonMav
12-21-2003, 03:29 PM
No Sioux (http://www.grandforks.com/mld/grandforks/sports/7541652.htm)
Too bad, so sad. I am sure this comes as no surprise to most Bison fans. On to bigger and better things. The women have Maryland and Marshall on their shedule.
WYOBISONMAN
12-21-2003, 05:08 PM
All I can say is they are sure CHICKENSHIT up in Grand Forks. They have tried everything to upset the move by NDSU to D1 and now they are just plain afraid of us! I am sure glad I don't have a degree from CHIKENSHIT U. hanging on my wall..... :P
Bisonguy
12-21-2003, 06:26 PM
This is good. I don't think NDSU should be concerned about playing lower division schools. It's time to move on to DI, and establish new rivalries.
If UND moves up within the next ten years, I don't think NDSU should play them. It would hurt NDSU's RPI and playoff chances playing a provisional member.
Bisonguy
12-22-2003, 06:13 AM
The story makes the Forum: http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=46671
Pretty interesting that Gene Taylor had to find out UND's plans from a reporter instead of RT. ::) That says a lot about integrity right there.
Competition during the transition would have been good, but the attitude of their administration is clear. They have their reasons, unfortunately they are transparent. Their position is not very appealing to regional sports fans.
Glas seems to be upset because the NCC is being wiped out. He also seems convnced that some type of realignment is going to happen.
They want to play baseball though! Their baseball coach says it would be fun. He says he hasnt heard from us. The balls in our court he says.
Bison_Kent
12-22-2003, 01:32 PM
The Sioux officials repeatedly have said that the game would hurt their D2 playoff chances for both basketball and football. Apparently, they don't share the same attitude (as if they ever did) as NDSU. If you want to be the best, you want to play the best competition.
I say that is great. It means one (or two in basketball's case) chances to get higher competition. Right now, I would much rather see Montana State or Portland State (even if they are road games) on the NDSU football schedule then a game with the bitter Sioux.
One thing I did I did find interesting was the fact that two years down the road that the rivalry might continue. Does that mean that UND is moving up in two years?
NDSU_grad
12-22-2003, 02:05 PM
I think it's intersting we might still play them in baseball. I've never been to a Bison-sue baseball game, but I've heard those games were more intense than any other sport, and the benches would clear at least once per game :).
airmail
12-22-2003, 02:18 PM
*Apparently, they don't share the same attitude (as if they ever did) as NDSU. *If you want to be the best, you want to play the best competition. *
::)
Exactly which Division I basketball teams has NDSU played in the past few years? I imagine there are many, since you schedule the best competition available...
http://www.grandforks.com/mld/grandforks/sports/7541652.htm
Here's my favorite quote:
"And to be honest with you, if I'm going to play a Division I school, I'd just as soon go somewhere fun than to play a team right down the road."
Down to who plays who just to socialize...NDSU presented the contracts as a responsible citizen of the regional sports community.
Im sure its emotionally staisfying for und to say get lost, but it really is a slap in the face to regional sports fans. Clearly und is operating in a world of their own, making emotional and somewhat ungrounded decisions.
und administrators lack poise. This type of lurching decision making has been glaringly apparent recently.
I dont think und decision makers are being responsible to the tax payers in North Dakota that would like to see the competition.
airmail
12-22-2003, 03:39 PM
Im sure its emotionally staisfying for und to say get lost, but it really is a slap in the face to regional sports fans. *Clearly und is operating in a world of their own, making emotional and somewhat ungrounded decisions. *
und administrators lack poise. *This type of lurching decision making has been glaringly apparent recently.
I dont think und decision makers are being responsible to the tax payers in North Dakota that would like to see the competition.
Or... regarding NDSU's decision to leave the region in its wake during a D-I move... one could say:
Im sure its emotionally staisfying for NDSU to say get lost, but it really is a slap in the face to regional sports fans. Clearly NDSU is operating in a world of their own, making emotional and somewhat ungrounded decisions.
NDSU administrators lack poise. This type of lurching decision making has been glaringly apparent recently.
I dont think NDSU decision makers are being responsible to the tax payers in North Dakota that would like to see the competition.
It goes both ways, JBB. And as far as your "responsibility to the region" rhetoric, UND is still playing in the same conference. NDSU chose differently.
Ask any North Dakotan outside of Bison land where the end of the rivalry originates, and they'll all point in NDSU's direction. I've seen it accross the state, and out of the state. NDSU made its own bed...
*yawn*
UND's new fight song:
We've played the Bison
Time after Time
But now we're in a snit
And we're acting like slime
It's a mistake,
But, hey, we're the Sioux
We've got no future outside of DII
No, not for the U.
We are the victims - meow, meow
And we'll keep on whining till the end
We are the victims
We are the victims
No guts, we're losers
'cause we are the victims -
of the world...
somebison
12-22-2003, 04:36 PM
I think it's intersting we might still play them in baseball. *I've never been to a Bison-sue baseball game, but I've heard those games were more intense than any other sport, and the benches would clear at least once per game :).
The crowds are not as big.. but they are very intense at these games.. probably because alcohol is brought in.. also many times the bison-sioux baseball game in GF is during springfest at UND so things can get pretty crazy
If unds decisions concerning their athletic relationship with NDSU had a rational basis and werent accompanied by the obvious overtones airmail might have a point, but they dont. *After all, NDSU extended the contracts to play with the best interests of the regional sports fan in mind. *They certtainly had as much reason not to as und lays claim to.
und is ignoring the regional sports fans in favor of their own questionable agenda. Take that along with some of the other questionable decisions having the same motive and whats driving the decision makers at und becomes an issue.
My concern is that unds decision is passing costs onto the taxpayer. *Normally these costs would be covered by the extra gate bonus each school enjoys by hosting the other. * Over the next several years NDSU will have a chance, with their expanded scheduling opportunities, to find suitable replacements.
The decision by und not to compete will cost thousands and thousands of dollars in lost revenues over the next 5 yrs.
The type of irresponsible decision making occurring at und, and the lack of poise from their administrators certainly raises eyebrows.
If unds decisions concerning their athletic relationship with NDSU had a rational basis and wasnt accompanied by the obvious overtones airmail might have a point, but they dont.
und is ignoring the regional sports fans in favor of their own questionable agenda. Take that along with some of the other questionable decisions having the same motive and whats driving the decision makers at und becomes an issue.
My concern is that unds decision is passing costs onto the taxpayer. *Normally these costs would be covered by the extra gate bonus each school enjoys by hosting the other. * Over the next several years NDSU will have a chance, with their expanded scheduling opportunities, to find suitable replacements.
Mismanagement at und will cost thousands and thousands of dollars in lost revenues over the next 5 yrs.
There are two sides to this issue. Should I, as a UND fan, be concerned as a taxpayer because NDSU is going to lose money the next couple years (and more likely than not well beyond) with their move to DI. And you will say that they may not lose money, but they are all but guaranteed to. There was an article posted a few weks ago saying that it is nearly impossible to make money in IAA football. The NDSU basketball teams will lose money because a lack of home games, and the home games they do have will be of generally poor quality. Travel budgets will probably triple. And the rest of the sports don't make money the way it is, and their travel budgets will become bloated as well. So am I, as a taxpayer, supposed to hold NDSU in the same light you hold UND. Under your logic I think so, because it will all trickle down to me as the taxpayer. But I am not, because I realize that it is pennies on the dollar. If you have problems with the taxpayer end of it perhaps you should give NDSU $1 less and save that for the government. It isn't that big of a deal.
unds no competition with DI decision has insulted many regional sports fans and the taxpayer. *
You have also failed to read the DI budget projections for NDSU. *Please read them.
Im sure all projections included games with und. *Without those games NDSU may not do as well as projected. *Fortunately *I think NDSU will find scheduling opportunities both locally, regionlly and nationally that will overcome this. *That includes D2 teams.
The no competition with DI claus now in effect at und is going to limit thier opportunities. *Projected gross will be less for them as well.
If und had signed the contracts that NDSU had so gracesiously presented revenue projections for both schools might have been right.
unds no competition with DI decision has insulted many regional sports fans and the taxpayer. *
You have also failed to read the DI budget projections for NDSU. *Please read them.
Im sure all projections included games with und. *Without those games NDSU may not do as well as projected. *Fortunately *I think NDSU will find scheduling opportunities both locally, regionlly and nationally that will overcome this. *That includes D2 teams.
The no competition with DI claus now in effect at und is going to limit thier opportunities. *Projected gross will be less for them as well.
If und had signed the contracts that NDSU had so gracesiously presented revenue projections for both schools might have been right.
I don't care what the budget projection is. I do care, or should under your taxpayer logic, that there aren't many IAA teams in the country that make money. That is your bread winner, and they are about to lose money. No one in the know is really concerned with UND's budget, because the Ralph makes a fairly large chunk of change, and I know you will dispute this, but the above are all facts. I'm not a bitter Sioux fan, good luck NDSU, but your taxpayer logic isn't logical. Heck, I'll send you the quarter extra it may cost you for UND, but then you can send me the NDSU's quarter that, according to your logic, I should be concerned with.
somebison
12-22-2003, 06:39 PM
new story in the Grand Forks Homer, actually not biased (apparently Ryan Bakken was unavailable).. the only real error is calling the Gateway an all-sports conference (man would that get 1234 excited)
http://www.grandforks.com/mld/grandforks/sports/7546959.htm
Bisonguy
12-22-2003, 09:16 PM
Niles works for the Spectrum, and is a contributing writer for the Herald He has stated that his articles are chopped up pretty bad by the time they make print in GF.
How is it again that the decision by the lurching administration at und doesnt have a negative affect on the taxpayer and the regional sports fan? *I think I missed that in all the excuses being made by und fans.
und has insulted the taxpayer by reducing the gate to both NDSU and und.
UND insulted the regional sports fan by reducing the competition.
I say the Nickle goes to baseball and the baseball be played. Its easy to see why football and basketball should be discontinued.
Bisonfan1234
12-22-2003, 11:34 PM
NDSU and UND have no business playing each other when they're in different divions.
Hopefully they'll both come to their senses and see that we don't play each other in football either.
wfduck
12-23-2003, 11:59 AM
;)You'd think that money should drive just about everything wouldnt ya? How in the name of Ralph can UND not want to play NDSU. Whose name other than NDSU will put more people in the Alerus or Fargodome. I can see in a couple of years a legit D1 team pulling 17k into the Fargodome. 4 years from now who will UND be able to put on the schedule that can put 10k in the Alerus?.
It's funny how Admin can use the money thing when they need to isnt it?
airmail
12-23-2003, 02:04 PM
und has insulted the taxpayer by reducing the gate to both NDSU and und.
UND insulted the regional sports fan by reducing the competition.
I say the Nickle goes to baseball and the baseball be played. *Its easy to see why football and basketball should be discontinued. *
I say it again, UND has changed nothing. NDSU has changed everything. Oh yes, as a North Dakota taxpayer, I am not insulted. As a regional sports fan, I am also not insulted. Your grand observations don't hold water.
What insults me is the fact that one man in another institution got a big head, and took the whole university along on his ego trip. In the process, he ended one of the best rivalries in the nation. That is insulting.
As far as baseball/ nickel?
Ask any man, Bison or Sioux, who has played and bled for that trophy; felt a dying sickness come over them when it was lost, or experienced an unimaginable exhuberation when it was won; and they'll tell you they'd rather see the nickel destroyed than watch a baseball team compete for it. What a slap in the face it would be to all the great UND and NDSU teams who competed for it. Terrible idea, IMO.
NDSU and UND have no business playing each other when they're in different divions.
Hopefully they'll both come to their senses and see that we don't play each other in football either.
Hell has frozen over apparently, but I agree with him.
BisonMav
12-23-2003, 02:42 PM
I still like the Bisonville take on recruiting. I would nominate UND as the Bisonville Booster of the week for this week also. Any seconds???????
I don't know what UND is hoping to accomplish by this public relations move, but nevertheless they get a big Bisonville.com "Bison Booster of Week" award for spreading the message that NDSU is leaving UND far, far behind. Hats off, guys. Keep telling recruits that poor old UND won't be any match for mean old NDSU starting next year. That's what we like to hear in Bisonville.
airmail
12-23-2003, 03:58 PM
I still like the Bisonville take on recruiting. *I would nominate UND as the Bisonville Booster of the week for this week also. *Any seconds???????
Since the only thing NDSU can compete for in the next 5-13 years is "conference affiliation," (good luck, by the way) I think our recruiting will be just fine.
Naturally your not insulted airmail. *Never-the-less the decision not to compete with DI schools has insulted the rest of the taxpayers and the regional sports fans not afflicted with the blind spot you have. *Its a selfish decision highlighting the attitude of the und administration.
BisonMav
12-23-2003, 04:58 PM
Since the only thing NDSU can compete for in the next 5-13 years is "conference affiliation," (good luck, by the way) I think our recruiting will be just fine.
It's four more years for football, this past year was year one. Basketball is in the process of being reduced. Individual sports may have the waiting period removed. If any NCC schools were to make the jump to Division I, they would have an extra 18 month notification that the NCC recently passed. Some people are born leaders and some are followers.
airmail
12-23-2003, 05:56 PM
BisonMav & JBB:
I still think you're both screwed up in the head, but Merry Christmas. Thanks for a fun year on your board.
Hope you all have a safe holiday, and who knows, Santa might even bring you Bison guys a conference.
(if you've been nice!) ;D
BisonMav
12-23-2003, 06:19 PM
BisonMav & JBB: *
I still think you're both screwed up in the head, but Merry Christmas. *Thanks for a fun year on your board. *
Hope you all have a safe holiday, and who knows, Santa might even bring you Bison guys a conference. *
(if you've been nice!) ;D
You have a Merry Christmas too Airmail.
And remember to "Keep Drinking the Punch".
For the fan of an institution that is reckless, arrogant and non accountable you sure try and try to sell the image and the lie as fact. Nobodys fooled by your screwed up interpretations so Im inclined not to take your well wishing seriously. But on the chance that you will suffer a lucid moment or two and finally rub a couple of sticks together I wish you a merry christmas as well.
I say it again, UND has changed nothing. *NDSU has changed everything..... *What insults me is the fact that one man in another institution got a big head, and took the whole university along on his ego trip. *In the process, he ended one of the best rivalries in the nation. *That is insulting.
As far as baseball/ nickel? *
Ask any man, Bison or Sioux, who has played and bled for that trophy; felt a dying sickness come over them when it was lost, or experienced an unimaginable exhuberation when it was won; and they'll tell you they'd rather see the nickel destroyed than watch a baseball team compete for it. *What a slap in the face it would be to all the great UND and NDSU teams who competed for it. *Terrible idea, IMO.
It is almost astonishing to see the denial in the voices of the UND fans for the ending of the Bison/Siouxage rivalry. Come on now everyone, let us in the VERY least agree on one thing: the rivalry has ended because BOTH sides took steps/moves/positions that make it impossible to continue the rivalry. To place blame entirely on UND is not right, but also is it not right to place all the blame upon the shoulders of NDSU. NDSU made the choice to go DI, and thus made a choice that had unintended effects (loss of the rivalry). Perhaps NDSU should have looked into the rivalry question a little more in-depth before making the move, but it is now too late to second guess the decision.
Airmail however thinks that NDSU is entirely to blame for this destruction of a wonderful rivalry. Airmail, you are wrong! NDSU extended the contracts to continue the game. UND decided not to sign. NDSU WANTS to play UND for at least the next 2 years, but UND has decided to utilize excuses upon excuses to back out. Where in this scenario is NDSU saying "I don't want to play anymore?" The answer: no where.
The rivalry has ended. It is dead! NDSU fans should set the UND monkey free look to start something new with a school that wants to play a good game filled with antagonism and good rivalry. UND should concentrate on their DII programs and DI hockey, and live their happy lives in Forks. So long UND, it has been fun!
As NDSU fans, let us take a higher road of pride in what lies before us, and allow the Siouxage to fester in Forks!
As far as the baseball/nickel game goes---that would not be right. It is a football trophy, not baseball. Sorry but that is my opinion....
It really has nothing to do with NDSU, und has declared a non-compete clause with DI and DIAA in general. I dont see this as aimed at NDSU at all. But it does hurt the state and disappoints a lot of the regional sports fans.
I agree that it does hurt a lot of UND and NDSU fans in the process. This WAS the largest sporting event in North Dakota before the troubles began. I hope NDSU can regroup and make another rivalry that can be as big or bigger than Bison/Susans
Bisonfan1234
12-24-2003, 01:10 AM
UND will go D1...give them a few years after we have good D1 sucess.
BisonMav
12-24-2003, 01:19 AM
UND will go D1...give them a few years after we have good D1 sucess.
I know a lot of people think UND will go Division I. *I just don't see it, especially with K in charge. *It will take too much away from hockey. *UND does have the facilities, not the motivation.
This topic is becoming way off the main subject, but I am going to continue the trend..... :)
UND will SOMEDAY go DI. They will because that is what Fargonians and Grand Forkers have done for decades; Fargo and Grand Forks have this one-up-manship with each other. FargoDome=>Alerus (aka UND Pole Barn), DI championship Hockey (UND) =>DII championship football (NDSU) (and to the UND fans I know we have not made it to the post season in quite some time, but in the past we had some great teams), West Acres Shopping Area=>SuperTarget/Cabelas.....It is something that I think has spilled over from the rivalry between the schools.
UND will come up into DI because it will not stand to see NDSU become a larger name in collegiate sports and North Dakota politics. They will not allow NDSU to be the bigger, more powerful arm of the ND Education System. They will not allow NDSU to be the keystone institute of the northland (along with SDSU) when they can do it also. UND's jealousy and contempt for NDSU will move RT or whomever occupies the AD position to moving up in the ranks of sports.
It is all a matter of time. Not a question of IF, but one of WHEN....
BisonMav
12-24-2003, 01:27 PM
I guess my point is that I don't think the two schools should play if they are at different levels. UND looks like a Division I institution. The lack of motivation to move to Division I, may be the $500 million trust fund, and it's strings that are attached to Hockey and the Nickname/logo. Otherwise it is puzzling why UND has not made the move, and allowed the NCC to pass the 18 month notification rule.
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