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D
02-23-2004, 10:43 PM
I've been curious for a while whether or not this year's recruiting class counts against NDSU with regards to the 5/8 rule. *I haven't found anything info regarding how it applies to provisional teams, but would assume that it does count against it. *The rule says tha a team can put no more then 5 recruits on scholarship in one year and no more then 8 every two years. *If so, that means the Bison only have one scholarship left out there right now, and I would assume that they hope for a JUCO kid with that last one for balance class balance and instant impact reasons. *Curious if anyone knows if the rule applies towards this year's recruiting class?

bisongold
02-23-2004, 10:51 PM
15 recruits are on scholarship for next year already so you must have some misinformation.

Herd_Mentality
02-23-2004, 10:55 PM
5/8 applies to NEW scholarships...so you're right, I only see one more available

BisonMav
02-24-2004, 12:31 AM
I've been curious for a while whether or not this year's recruiting class counts against NDSU with regards to the 5/8 rule. *I haven't found anything info regarding how it applies to provisional teams, but would assume that it does count against it. *The rule says tha a team can put no more then 5 recruits on scholarship in one year and no more then 8 every two years. *If so, that means the Bison only have one scholarship left out there right now, and I would assume that they hope for a JUCO kid with that last one for balance class balance and instant impact reasons. *Curious if anyone knows if the rule applies towards this year's recruiting class?

Winkelman would be a good signing, making it five for this year. Maybe Winkelman will chose football, who knows. Some of the five recruits would be redshirted, some would play. I personally would like to see NDSU build for the future using these recruits. Having a good team four years from now would be important. Miles said in an interview that the JUCO route would be more difficult to use with Division I rules.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 12:36 AM
Are all four definitely receiving scholies?

D
02-24-2004, 12:48 AM
Are all four definitely receiving scholies?

The 3 (Lunde, Woodside, and the Wisconsin kid) have signed and Morrman has given a verbal. I stand by my guns that they will take a JUCO kid with the 5th. I doubt Woodside and either Lunde or Moorman will redshirt. With the scholarship breakdown as it is now, there will be 5 SRs, only 1 JR ( and that is Pettis who I think is the football player), and the rest underclassman for next year. That means only 1 SR in 2006, and he isn't on scholarship nor does he ever play. All coaches want to maintain some sort of class balance if possible, and the way things are now the classes are out of wack. I'd look for a JUCO big guy, a 4 or a 5, with the last scholarship, a guy who can step on the floor and play right away. Hell, I could be wrong though.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 02:14 AM
D,

Pettis has 25 minutes this year.

He's also a pretty good high jumper (second at the Bison Classic).

NDSU_grad
02-24-2004, 05:18 PM
I think they'd be better off saving the schollie for next year. The class balance would only be thrown off for one year (05-06), and I don't think that's a big deal anyway because we won't be post-season eligible. Just my opinion though.

Bisonfan1234
03-11-2004, 10:49 PM
I'd be suprised if Pettis is on football scholorship. He hasn't done much in his years here.

D
04-16-2004, 08:09 PM
The NCAA is going to review the 5/8 rule at the end of the month, with all indications being that it will either be done away with or reformed to something more like a 6/10 rule. The consequences would not be good at all for anyone outside of the BCS conferences, CUSA, A10, and Mountain West. It would probably put a quick end to Mid and Low-Major teams success in the NCAA tourney, at least that is what the powers-that-be are hoping for and would probably get.

tony
04-16-2004, 08:24 PM
So the major DI programs want to recruit 6 or more guys a year?

How does that work? I mean they've got 13
scholarships to give total - do they just yank people's schollies after two years or what? Just seems like that would hurt the graduation rates a little at the same time the NCAA is thinking about stepping enforcement on that front.

To me, it doesn't matter. I want NDSU to recruit primarily HS seniors and I want to see them stay at NDSU long enough to get degrees. You can't do that if you are giving out 6 schollies every year. For example, I bet NDSU only gives out 3 scholarships next year.

D
04-16-2004, 08:35 PM
So the major DI programs want to recruit 6 or more guys a year?

How does that work? I mean they've got 13
scholarships to give total - do they just yank people's schollies after two years or what? Just seems like that would hurt the graduation rates a little at the same time the NCAA is thinking about stepping enforcement on that front.

To me, it doesn't matter. I want NDSU to recruit primarily HS seniors and I want to see them stay at NDSU long enough to get degrees. You can't do that if you are giving out 6 schollies every year. For example, I bet NDSU only gives out 3 scholarships next year.

6/10 is one of the posible solutions, as are 5/9 and also just getting rid of it altogether. It all stems from players leaving early and players transferring, because in essence if one or the other happens, it can put the team below the scholarship limit for 4 years in some cases. And, of course, the schools most effected by players leaving early for the NBA and those transferring out are the BCS schools and a few other conferences that are "haves". Any change in the rule would present serious challenges to the power of the Mid and Low-Majors.

tony
04-16-2004, 09:05 PM
Ah, that makes more sense now.

NDSU_grad
04-16-2004, 10:29 PM
Just look at Kansas this year as an example. They've had three guys transfer in the manner of weeks, but since they signed four last year they can only sign four this year, then four next year, etc. I think they should keep the rule but make exceptions when guys transfer or leave early. In the example I gave, Kansas should be able to sign the four guys they are allowed, plus three more to make up for the guys leaving the program early.

89rabbit
04-20-2004, 03:59 PM
Here is the latest on the 5/8 rule:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=1785876

tony
04-20-2004, 08:01 PM
Wow, is that rule change going to put pressure on big schools to engage in some Haskins Era Gopher shennigans! Anything to keep 'em eligible.

I don't like a rule that just favors basketball programs over students. I'd like to read about the pro and con arguments about this.

I'd also like to know how many players DI programs are losing to academic inegibility rather than their own actions (e.g. taking away scholarships and/or cutting playing time to force a kid to transfer).

D
04-20-2004, 08:16 PM
I'd also like to know how many players DI programs are losing to academic inegibility rather than their own actions (e.g. taking away scholarships and/or cutting playing time to force a kid to transfer).



That is what I thought when I first read the article. It makes it seem like there is some major academic ineligibility problems around the country, and that is simply not the case. The BCS conferences have very few problems with it. The low-major schools have the biggest "problem" with academic ineligibility, but I wouldn't classify it as any kind of problem.

89rabbit
04-20-2004, 08:41 PM
The BCS conferences have very few problems with it. *The low-major schools have the biggest "problem" with academic ineligibility, but I wouldn't classify it as any kind of problem. *


D,

you are saying that the Big Boys have less of a problem with kids flunking out then the smaller schools. Or another way of putting it is you think the Big Boys graduate a higher percentage then the little guys. Is that what you are saying? If so where are you getting that info, beacuse that would surprise me ???

D
04-20-2004, 08:59 PM
D,

you are saying that the Big Boys have less of a problem with kids flunking out then the smaller schools. *Or another way of putting it is you think the Big Boys graduate a higher percentage then the little guys. *Is that what you are saying? *If so where are you getting that info, beacuse that would surprise me *???


Oh no, that is not at all what I am saying. All I said was that the smaller schools have quite a few more players declared academically ineligible then the BCS, CUSA, Mountain West, and A10 schools. Mid and Low-Major schools have far more players ruled ineligible for a season in comparison to the big time schools. I made no mention of graduation rates, because in a lot of cases there the big-time schools grad rates pale in comparison to the lesser D1 schools, Arizona and Oklahoma come to mind.

89rabbit
04-20-2004, 09:10 PM
I guess I am still lost. *If the little schools graduate more but have more athletes ruled academic ineligibility what does that mean? *Are you saying that the Big schools are cheating/playing games to keep a student eligible until his playing days are done and then they send them packing? *If so, again, what our your sources? *You could very well be correct, I just would be surprised. *Or maybe I am stupid, you never know. *;) *

D
04-20-2004, 09:21 PM
You are just reading in too much. Lower level D1 schools have a far greater number of players ruled academically ineligible for a year then do the major schools. That has no effect on their graduation, sure it puts them a bit behind, but it just means they have to sit out basketball games for that year. My source is Blue Ribbon, the greatest book ever published. It is a 400 page D1 college basketball yearbook with more info in it then one could possibly want. Case-in-point, off of a quick count I just did, the SWAC had 13 players ruled academically ineligible last year (02-03), whereas the Big Ten had only 2.

89rabbit
04-20-2004, 09:24 PM
ok fair enough. :-/

D
04-30-2004, 05:19 PM
5/8 rule is officially a thing of the past, not a good thing for anyone outside of the power conferences, the parity of the game, and college basketball as a whole IMO.