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View Full Version : South Dakota's Support of SDSU's move to D-I



Big_BisonFan
12-14-2005, 09:20 PM
I recently drove through the Sioux Falls area and tuned into a local sports talk show(no idea of the name or station). The two guys on the show were ripping into SDSU's ability to market the quality of teams playing in Brookings. They cited a recent matchup against UW-Milwaukee were the attendance was less then a previous year's game against NAIA-II U of Sioux Falls. They also questioned SDSU ability to succeed at all if it wasn't for leaning on NDSU. All thoughts from he radio show hosts.

Do Jack's fans feel the same way? How do you see the move affecting attendance at Frost Arena? I always thought SDSU was a good basketball school with a great following, maybe things have changed.

IowaBisonToo
12-14-2005, 10:15 PM
I live just southeast of Sioux Falls in Iowa. I swear, nothing against NAIA teams, they have there place but please, you would think that's the only kind of college sports there is out there. :-/ I get so sick of hearing about GPAC teams it makes me want to puke. I watch the news out of the Sioux Falls TV stations, KSFY and KELO. KELO is completely crappy but KSFY does a fair job with sports in general but limited coverage of SDSU. When a DI school 40 minutes north of SF can get about a breaths worth of time on the news, there's something wrong with that!! It's USF this and USF that. The Cou did this tonight in mens heavy petting??? Again, nothing completely against NAIA sports (although I'm not a big fan of it) but you'd think there was nothing else out there. Hell, Augie gets more coverage than SDSU but still less than USF. There's something definitely wrong with the support of SDSU athletics in the Sioux Falls area.

JACKGUYII
12-14-2005, 10:56 PM
The Argus Leader has really stepped up with Chris Solari the beat writer who covers the Jacks writing numerous stories about the Jacks games and road in DI.The Sports Radio station I'm sure you were listening is a bush league show called Craig and Mike that is on from 3pm-5pm on 1230am. They are the flagship station of USF Sports and go out of there way to take shots at the Jacks and Vikings for some reason. Mike posts on here from time to time to add his satirical slant on things. The tone on this program in no way reflects the general attitude that Sioux Falls or the State have towards the Jacks move to DI. You have to remember Sioux Falls is the king of minor league sports with Junior Hockey(Stampede)Basketball(Skyforce)Baseball(Canar ies) as well as Soccer and Arena Football many of which are attendence leaders in their respective leagues. My point is the Sioux Falls Metro area is sports crazy and their are lot's of options (more than are in Fargo). I think the majority of sports fans in the state have come around to support the DI move with a small older, minority group who will not support change no matter what the topic is. We have seen the Basketball numbers go down due to the lackluster schedule, lack of familiarity with teams coming in, no more women/men doubleheaders and the fact the Jacks mens team is down the first two years of DI. I expect the women will draw well especially if they make a run at a NIT bid and I think the men will be much improved next year and the numbers will go up. Remember we lead the nation in attendence for the men most years and did so for the women our last year in DII.

bisonranch
12-15-2005, 04:55 AM
I live just southeast of Sioux Falls in Iowa. *

I live in the same part of the planet and know what you mean. The Forum has good coverage of Bison athletics, much better than the Argus Leader's coverage of any SD college. The TV station seem to cover the Jacks and 'Yotes about the same. I think the Sioux Falls media needs to do a lot more to get people interested in DI. After all, the Jacks are part of a bigger community now.

Big_BisonFan
12-15-2005, 05:13 AM
It is fine to blame the Sioux Falls media, but is SDSU's athletic department is pursuing those media outlets? They might be, but i think the athletic department might need to be marketing their product more as well. Just some thoughts. I wish all the best to SDSU in their move.

BisonBryce
12-15-2005, 05:38 AM
well i for one think SDSU made the good transition. good luck. and of course, while i was denied for next year's trip to brookings for football, i know that i will get a chance to visit their and wave my flags.

jackrabbitdw
12-15-2005, 02:37 PM
Hey Big_BisonFan the show you were listening to was the Lane Grindle Jeff Culhanne show on 1570am, usd's flagship station. I found out about this show on the Jackrabbit message board and have been listening since last summer. Their schtick is to take shots at SDSU every chance they get, for example this week they are cherry picking attendance figures from naia games back in our dii days and comparing them to this years DI attendance. They really can't stand the fact that the SU's left them behind. A couple of weeks ago your AD was on the show and they asked him if NDSU would join a DI ncc, when he told them the SU's would rather be in an established conference with an auto bid it floored them. They dismissed this as the arrogance of the SU's, completely ignoring the fact that a DI ncc wouldn't be tournament eligible until sometime in the 2020's. Overall they are pretty funny to listen to, usd is always getting screwed, bad officiating, no playoff bid, Wes B. no Harlon Hill Award. They always rag on SDSU going DI saying they will never make it all the while sucking up to NDSU.

IowaBisonToo
12-15-2005, 02:51 PM
I have no doubt that SDSU is doing an excellent job of marketing their product. It's also a little tougher to get, say, a few hundred people driving up to Brookings from SF on a cold night in Jan. However, as big a step as it was, it seems the majority of the press up to this point (although it is changing -- very slowly) was negative press about the move. I don't get the NBC station from SF so I don't know what they're like but, I think KSFY should make a commitment to become the "flagship" station of SDSU sports in the SF area like WDAY is to Fargo and NDSU. I realize it would be difficult due to the large variety of sports offerings there are in SF as JACKGUYII stated -- all the amateur teams plus the numerous local NAIA teams plus the 2 NCC teams plus all the high school teams. However, somebody needs to step up and take the lead. It will only benefit them in the long run and I think DI sports in SF would become the lead sporting event -- not the USF Cougars. :-/

JACKGUYII
12-15-2005, 03:43 PM
I have no doubt that SDSU is doing an excellent job of marketing their product. *It's also a little tougher to get, say, a few hundred people driving up to Brookings from SF on a cold night in Jan. *However, as big a step as it was, it seems the majority of the press up to this point (although it is changing -- very slowly) was negative press about the move. *I don't get the NBC station from SF so I don't know what they're like but, I think KSFY should make a commitment to become the "flagship" station of SDSU sports in the SF area like WDAY is to Fargo and NDSU. *I realize it would be difficult due to the large variety of sports offerings there are in SF as JACKGUYII stated -- all the amateur teams plus the numerous local NAIA teams plus the 2 NCC teams plus all the high school teams. *However, somebody needs to step up and take the lead. *It will only benefit them in the long run and I think DI sports in SF would become the lead sporting event -- not the USF Cougars. :-/

I really like the idea of a Sioux Falls TV Station stepping up and becoming the flagship station. I think we have a great situation with radio as WNAX in Yankton as our flagship station. They have signal all the way to Minneapolis to Omaha and everwhere in between. The only negative is WNAX isn't really listened to in Sioux Falls as it's percieved as more of a rural/agriculture focused station. I think the answer is to sign up some affiliate stations to cover the Jacks. Jackrabbit Report is on Tuesdays on 1230am KWSN which is a coaches interview show paid for by sponsors. No doubt NDSU has many advantages residing in North Dakota's largest city.

IowaBisonToo
12-15-2005, 05:16 PM
I really like the idea of a Sioux Falls TV Station stepping up and becoming the flagship station. I think we have a great situation with radio as WNAX in Yankton as our flagship station. They have signal all the way to Minneapolis to Omaha and everwhere in between. The only negative is WNAX isn't really listened to in Sioux Falls as it's percieved as more of a rural/agriculture focused station. I think the answer is to sign up some affiliate stations to cover the Jacks. Jackrabbit Report is on Tuesdays on 1230am KWSN which is a coaches interview show paid for by sponsors. No doubt NDSU has many advantages residing in North Dakota's largest city.

Yeah, radio would be a boon, too. SDSU needs to get the Western part of the state at least a little interested in Jacks athletics. I'm sure that would be as difficult as Western ND if not more so -- being that much closer to Wyoming and Colorado. But, they have to try.

Jeffdaryl3rd
12-15-2005, 05:38 PM
It sounds like USD has the same type of complex about SDSU going D-I that unD-II has with NDSU.

JACKGUYII
12-15-2005, 06:42 PM
No question. The only difference there isn't much they(USD) can do about it as they are cash stapped at the DII level let alone trying to make a go at the DI level.

bisonmike
12-15-2005, 07:41 PM
when I lived in SF I always that the the people there cared more about the minor league sports than anything college. If I were to pick a university that got the most attention in the Sioux Falls media I would go with USF or Nebraska. The Sioux Falls market seemed to follow Nebraska like Fargo/Moorhead follows the Gophers.

IowaBisonToo
12-15-2005, 07:47 PM
I don't get the feeling SF follows the huskers that much. Watch the Sioux City stations and then you'll get that impression -- of course not more than Iowa. It's just if it's not high school, minor league or GPAC competition, it's really not that news worthy unless it's something spectacular. You don't see Fargo covering Jamestown, VCS or Mayville St. athletics like Sioux Falls covers, USF, Dakota St., and all the other tiny schools within 200 miles of SF in SD. If they paid as much attention to SDSU, you'd think SDSU had won a DI national championship.

JACKGUYII
12-15-2005, 08:43 PM
Nebraska does have a major following in Sioux Falls and Univeresity of Minnesota to a lesser extent. In terms of professional sports the Vikings and Twins are king as it relates to who the media follows. Sioux Falls has become much more diverse as people are moving there from different geographically areas. I always thought these are the people who can be won over as SDSU fans as they might be more prone to want to follow DI sports rather than minor or small college sports in the area. I really don't get or understand the fascination with USF.

89rabbit
12-16-2005, 04:15 AM
Hey Big_BisonFan the show you were listening to was *the Lane Grindle Jeff Culhanne show on 1570am, usd's flagship station. I found out about this show on the Jackrabbit message board and have been listening since last summer. Their schtick is to take shots at SDSU every chance they get, for example this week they are cherry picking attendance figures from naia games back in our dii days and comparing them to this years DI attendance. They really can't stand the fact that the SU's left them behind. A couple of weeks ago your AD was on the show and they asked him if NDSU would join a DI ncc, when he told them the SU's would rather be in an established conference with an auto bid it floored them. They dismissed this as the arrogance of the SU's, completely ignoring the fact that a DI ncc wouldn't be tournament eligible until sometime in the 2020's. Overall they are pretty funny to listen to, usd is always getting screwed, bad officiating, no playoff bid, Wes B. no Harlon Hill Award. They always rag on SDSU going DI saying they will never make it all the while sucking up to NDSU.

I am sure they also forgot to mention that SDSU is almost doubling USD's attendance so far this season. ::)

Go State! ;D

IowaBisonToo
12-16-2005, 02:33 PM
I really don't get or understand the fascination with USF.

Neither do I. :-/ You'd think they were the school that was DI and had been for quite some time. I think a lot of it has to do with a winning tradition. I think some of it also has to do with, to some extent, the small-town attitude of those that follow NAIA athletics. For instance, I live within a 50 minute drive of 5 or 6 GPAC, NAIA teams -- including USF. Kids from the area grow up following these teams, want to go to school and play for these teams, get a job in the town or near where they went to college, and follow that team until the day they die. I'm not saying it's not good competition but, when you get a taste of what a DI program is like in terms of the step up in athletic ablility of these kids, and you can go catch a game at a DI school for about the same price you can an NAIA school, it's mind boggling why one wouldn't take advantage of that! I guess I grew up and went to a high school that could probably compete with some of these NAIA schools so, for me, it's not that exciting.

89rabbit
12-16-2005, 02:51 PM
I am sure they also forgot to mention that SDSU is almost doubling USD's attendance so far this season. *::)

Go State! *;D


I had a little more time this morning and I looked up some additional info. I also bet our friends at the USD flagship station forgot to mention that SDSU's D-I women's program too is outdrawing USD's D-II Men's program. :o

Go State! ;D

89rabbit
12-16-2005, 03:17 PM
One more thought about this topic. One of the reasons for the move to D-I was that it will allow SDSU to capture the Sioux Falls Market (largest in South Dakota). Sioux Falls has experienced rapid growth over the past 20 or so years. This has led Sioux Falls to struggle with it's own identity. Not so long ago in some people's minds Sioux Falls was big but in compition with other South Dakota town's. So Sioux Falls media embraced "their own" school (Augie). Oh sure they covered USD and SDSU but those schools belonged to Vermillion and Brookings respectively. As Augie slowly became a NCC doormat these same folks looked for a "Sioux Falls school" that they could be proud of and thus the love for NAIA Sioux Falls University and the GPAC. In the past 10 years or so you have seem coverage of SDSU, USD and Augie at one level with USF just behind it (again another reason to move to D-I and get some separation).

Some "old school" media types are struggling with the concept that SDSU is South Dakota's team (not just Brookings), but they will get there it will just take a little time.

On the TV side (for those of you who live in or around the Sioux Falls coverage area) your best bet is to watch KSFY (ABC) or KDLT (NBC) as they both have sponsership positions with SDSU (signage inside Frost Arena) and do a much better job of covering SDSU. KELO is the model of "old school" and loves to cover Sioux Falls and pretend that the rest of the state doesn't really matter. Just my two cents.

Go State! ;D

bisonranch
12-16-2005, 11:20 PM
What channel is KELO? If my antenna is in the right spot, I get the others fine.

89rabbit
12-16-2005, 11:56 PM
What channel is KELO? *If my antenna is in the right spot, I get the others fine. *

Channel 11 (CBS)

bincitysioux
12-17-2005, 02:14 AM
I am sure they also forgot to mention that SDSU is almost doubling USD's attendance so far this season. *::)

Go State! *;D


I'm sure that has alot to do with both schools home schedule through the first five games. SDSU's is decent while USD's is very weak. By the end of the season, USD will have likely averaged 800-1,000 better per game than SDSU, if not more. USD averaged over 4,200 per game in their conference schedule last year.

89rabbit
12-17-2005, 02:36 AM
I'm sure that has alot to do with both schools home schedule through the first five games. *SDSU's is decent while USD's is very weak. *By the end of the season, USD will have likely averaged 800-1,000 better per game than SDSU, if not more. *USD averaged over 4,200 per game in their conference schedule last year.


It is kinda cute how the D-II schools try and stick up for each other, but it isn't good to lie this close to Christmas. Remember Santa is watching. ;)

Although USD's home avg. attendance was higher for conference play, it was not over 4,200. As a matter of fact it wasn't even 4,000 per game. The Yotes avg. home attendance for the NCC portion of their schedule was 3,786 as compared to their overall season home avg. of 2,578.

I will agree that SDSU has put together a much more meaningful schedule so far this season and that trend is not likely to change. After all it is very tough to come up with a "big draw" from D-II ranks. Not a lot of schools that anyone has heard of, know what I mean?

Go State! ;D

bincitysioux
12-17-2005, 02:49 AM
It is kinda cute how the D-II schools try and stick up for each other, but it isn't good to lie this close to Christmas. *Remember Santa is watching. *;)

Although USD's home *avg. attendance was higher for conference play, it was not over 4,200. *As a matter of fact it wasn't even 4,000 per game. *The Yotes avg. home attendance for the NCC portion of their schedule was 3,786 as compared to their overall season home avg. of 2,578.

I will agree that SDSU has put together a much more meaningful schedule so far this season and that trend is not likely to change. *After all it is very tough to come up with a "big draw" from D-II ranks. *Not a lot of schools that anyone has heard of, know what I mean?

Go State! *;D





Santa will not be bringing you anything.

Last year, USD played 6 conference games at home, and averaged 4,217 fans in attendance for those 6 games.

http://www.usdcoyotes.com/sports/mbball/review/2004-2005/stats.asp?PAGE_ID=79&SEASON=2004-2005

The only home game that SDSU had last season that was anywhere near those numbers was the game against SDSU's "rival" (as designated by university president), NDSU. ;)

Rodentia
12-17-2005, 04:19 AM
The only home game that SDSU had last season that was anywhere near those numbers was the game against SDSU's "rival" (as designated by university president), NDSU. ;)


NDSU and SDSU are rivals. Can't maintain a rivalry with an institution you've left in the dust.


UND: North Dakota's first Division I Institution.

You're well aware that UND is not a Division I institution.

89rabbit
12-17-2005, 04:46 AM
Santa will not be bringing you anything.

Last year, USD played 6 conference games at home, and averaged 4,217 fans in attendance for those 6 games. *

http://www.usdcoyotes.com/sports/mbball/review/2004-2005/stats.asp?PAGE_ID=79&SEASON=2004-2005

The only home game that SDSU had last season that was anywhere near those numbers was the game against SDSU's "rival" (as designated by university president), NDSU. ;)


You got me. *:-[ *I thought your point was that NCC schools draw in the fans so I counted the Feb. 29 game that USD played against their NCC rival Augie (even though this was not a "conference" game) and that brought their avg. down. *However, I can now see that you are trying to engage in the same cherry picking non-sense that the boys over at the USD radio staition were up to.

02/29/05 * AUGUSTANA (S.D.) * *W * *81-71 * 1211

Of course this does not change the fact that Both SDSU's Men's and Women's teams are outdrawing USD's Men's team so far this season.

Go State! *;D

89rabbit
12-17-2005, 05:30 AM
Uh oh, the Jackrabbits had 2,052 fans at tonight's women's game. *That is 634 more fans then showed up for the USD Men's opener (their best showing so far with 1,418 ) and 1,150 more fans then USD had at their Men's game tonight (902 fans to watch Briar Cliff vs. USD). *The Women have Alabama coming to Brookings on Sunday, it doesn't look good for the Yotes and their hopes of drawing as many fans as our women's team as their next game is against Upper Iowa. *It is good to be D-I. *8)

To date:

SDSU Women -- Home Avg. 1,626

USD Men -- Home Avg. 976

Go State! *;D

jackmd
02-20-2006, 04:02 AM
Gap in attendance figures has closed a bit.

At home:

SDSU men 2070
USD men 1679

SDSU women 1889

With Augie and St. Cloud St. coming to town the Yotes do have an outside shot at averaging over 2000/game. They need to draw 7,500+ for the 2 games. Best the yotes can do is 3rd in the conference and that might not be enough to get the fans out. We'll see. It is a little disappointing that its even close, but with our struggles and lack of a conference its not a suprise.

NanoBison
04-07-2006, 01:46 AM
According to their website USF is a christian school program. So are they kind of like Concordia up here?




I'm guessing it is, considering they charge $15,900 for yearly tuition.

Holy crap has Concordia gone up.... Here is what they charge... $20,980.00
They estimate that each year a student should plan for $28,330.00

WOW. I'll stick with my DI-NDSU baby. Even graduates rates aren't that high.

Bisonguy
04-07-2006, 01:58 AM
The vast majority of students at Concordia are on some sort of institutional financial aid.

89rabbit
04-08-2006, 02:49 PM
Since this post was resurrected from the dead . . . The Final Results are in


SDSU Men - Avg. 2,070 per home game

USD Men - Avg. 1,979 per home game

SDSU Women - Avg. 1,905 per home game


Congratulations to the USD Men for just nipping our Women's program. My guess is this will be a close as USD ever gets as each year our schedule is getting a little more "user friendly".


Go State! :)

USA_Hockey
04-08-2006, 10:03 PM
Since this post was resurrected from the dead . *. *. The Final Results are in


SDSU Men - *Avg. 2,070 *per home game

USD Men - Avg. 1,979 *per home game

SDSU Women - Avg. 1,905 per home game


Congratulations to the USD Men for just nipping our Women's program. *My guess is this will be a close as USD ever gets as each year our schedule is getting a little more "user friendly".


Go State! *:)


2,000 fans a game for a D1 basketball program still sucks. If SDSU wants to become a mid-major program they're going to have to get more fans, more money, and better facilities.

USA_Hockey
04-08-2006, 11:47 PM
Look at SDSU's home football schedule for next year. There is only one d1 team on the schedule, which is Cal Davis. Playin d2, d3, and NAIA teams at home for football isn't going to expand your d1 interest. USD has a better home football schedule than SDSU.

Last_Noel
06-13-2006, 09:28 AM
Look at SDSU's home football schedule for next year. *There is only one d1 team on the schedule, which is Cal Davis. *Playin d2, d3, and NAIA teams at home for football isn't going to expand your d1 interest. *USD has a better home football schedule than SDSU.
What can you expect out of "Bad Dakota" as compared to "Good Dakota"? I applaud SDSU's move to D-1 but "Bad Dakota" has been slow to respond on many things from adoption of high school FB playoffs to lack of open-mindedness on non-resident hunting issues( pheasant hunting being the lone exception ). Compared to "Good Dakota" I feel the challenge will not be insurmountable but more difficult.

Dakota
08-06-2006, 04:19 AM
Look at SDSU's home football schedule for next year. *There is only one d1 team on the schedule, which is Cal Davis. *Playin d2, d3, and NAIA teams at home for football isn't going to expand your d1 interest. *USD has a better home football schedule than SDSU.
What can you expect out of "Bad Dakota" as compared to "Good Dakota"? I applaud SDSU's move to D-1 but "Bad Dakota" has been slow to respond on many things from adoption of high school FB playoffs to lack of open-mindedness on non-resident hunting issues( pheasant hunting being the lone exception ). Compared to "Good Dakota" I feel the challenge will not be insurmountable but more difficult. * *
RIGHT ON LAST NOEL EVEN IF YOU LIVE IN MICHIGAN!!!!!!!WAS YOUR DAD THE FIRST NOEL?