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somebison
02-23-2004, 06:39 AM
An announcement is expected this week to officially launch a new Division I-AA football conference next fall -- one year earlier than previously thought possible



http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=51240

TC.Bison
02-23-2004, 11:57 AM
Could it be possible that this is being accellerated to put pressure on the Big Sky? I wonder what sort of clause will be included about SU leaving for another conference?

JBB
02-23-2004, 12:03 PM
I dont think its intended to pressure the BSC. I think this league forms with ot without the Dakota Schools. I think its to get the schedule filled out.

BisonMav
02-23-2004, 12:48 PM
IMO the conference is forming asap, because it will take five years for the conference winner to become eligible for an automatic playoff bid.

Bison_Kent
02-23-2004, 01:36 PM
I am all for this new league, at least for the time being. However, I don't think NDSU and SDSU are in it for the long haul. Starting the conference now allows for the five years to begin in 2004 but I don't believe that the same schools have to be in the conference for the entire period.

One thing that I will find interesting is scheduling. Right now, NDSU has 5 of the 6 schools scheduled and just one of those games is slated to be at Fargo. I am guessing that S. Utah would be a home game for NDSU but would one other game be moved to Fargo to have 3 home and 3 road games to even out the schedule?

Bison_Kent
02-23-2004, 01:44 PM
Not to be critical of Kolpack but I found the error in mislableling UC-Davis.

He said that UC-Davis was an established I-AA school when actually they are also a fledgling school like N. Colorado, NDSU, and SDSU.

I guess I tend to notice things like that now.

SiouxperMan
02-23-2004, 02:46 PM
That's great. What's even better is that it's a 7 team league which leaves room for UND to join in a couple of years. An 8 team league would be perfect.

WYOBISONMAN
02-23-2004, 03:44 PM
Whether or not it is intended to put pressure on the BSC, it clearly does. The BSC knows that there is a need to add teams. The quality ones that are out there are going to the GWC. The very nature of that turns up the heat.....which is good. I still think that 5 years from now NDSU will be a BSC school.

Bison_Kent
02-23-2004, 03:56 PM
Here is the Greeley paper article on the conference:

http://www.greeleytrib.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20040223/SPORTS/102230049&rs=2

One thing that I found interesting is that they have had talks about possibly joining the Mid Con in 2007.

Texas_Jacks_Fan
02-23-2004, 04:02 PM
Wyobison is right on the money, The BSC really needs to "reload" the conference and soon. I think the GWC will be a temporary home- but not a temporary conference, I think it willl evolve to contain Sac St. and perhaps Univ of San Diego, when/if the 2 SU's move to the "Sky". I think it will be great to have 2 D1AA conferences in the Western US. for both scheduling and rivalry reasons.

JBB
02-23-2004, 04:11 PM
One of the first things talked about at the early formation meetings was the ability of the Dakota schools to move to the BSC and exiting procedures in general. *It is public knowledge that the conference is going to allow for that. *

Playoff eligibility is probably the big thing. *Scheduling comes next, I personally doubt there is any pressure on the BSC since this conference is forming no matter what. *The probablility of the Dakotas joing the BSC is high, and in my opinion always was. *

The fact that we didnt get invited the day we announced was never discouraging to me. *This isnt going to happen overnight and never would have if we would have waited for a conference invite before we moved.

mojobison
02-23-2004, 04:40 PM
That's great. *What's even better is that it's a 7 team league which leaves room for UND to join in a couple of years. *An 8 team league would be perfect.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahaha!

roadwarrior
02-23-2004, 04:55 PM
Southern Utah is trying to get out of previous commitments for the 2004 season in order to schedule the BISON. It appears that this must have been worked out now. It would be great if one of the other games were switched locations so that we would have 3 at home and 3 on the road.

WYOBISONMAN
02-23-2004, 04:55 PM
Yeah....I didn't expect an invite the first day either, but is sure would have been nice. The damn BSC seems to be moving so damn...S>>>L>>O>>W....

Bisonfan1234
02-23-2004, 05:30 PM
Get used to seeing this for at least 5 years or so:

Heatland Pacific Conference standings:
NDSU 7-0

Mid-Con West Division standings:
NDSU 12-0

;D

This is GREAT!! We already have an established rivalry with UC Davis in football. I'm sure we'll be scheduling them in bball NC every year as well.

Get used to booing SDSU and UNC...they're going to be our biggest enemies for the next few years.

MAYBE in 5 years the BSC or the Gateway/MVC will become an option if we do well enough. We'll see...

Bison_Kent
02-23-2004, 06:27 PM
Southern Utah is trying to get out of previous commitments for the 2004 season in order to schedule the BISON. It appears that this must have been worked out now. It would be great if one of the other games were switched locations so that we would have 3 at home and 3 on the road.

Just my opinion but St. Mary's is the only possible team that could switch home for road and come to Fargo if we want 3 home and 3 road games for all teams in the conference. The last meetings for SDSU, Northern Colorado, and UC-Davis were all in Fargo so it seems right that those three are on the road.

If the conference is going to start this year, it only seems fair to have every team with 3 road and 3 home games within the conference. This would certainly help out NDSU and SDSU in getting home games.

NDSU_grad
02-23-2004, 06:28 PM
Not to be critical of Kolpack but I found the error in mislableling UC-Davis. *

He said that UC-Davis was an established I-AA school when actually they are also a fledgling school like N. Colorado, NDSU, and SDSU.

I guess I tend to notice things like that now.



I've noticed Kolpack tends to make more than his share of factual errors. *I remember he once referred to Montana and Idaho State as land-grant schools, when in fact they are not. *I also recall him doing a story on Essler this season when he wrote that the Bison were undefeated when Essler had at least one interception, even though he had an interception against the sue.
Of course, unlike the guy at the Greeley Tribune, at least Kolpack can count to 7.

uncbear
02-23-2004, 07:43 PM
This will be really good but it sounds like UNC's rivalries with NDSU and SDSU are coming to an end. I think you will both get into the BSC and then we probably won't play on a regular basis. Very unfortunate because my favorite game has always been NDSU and UNC. We will probably meet often in the playoffs though. For now though we still get at least one more season where we are in the same conference.

I don't see it taking 5 years for the BSC to give you both an invite. I think within the next year it will happen.

JBB
02-23-2004, 07:59 PM
I dont know why you wouldnt play us in football anyway. EVen if we do move we are both going to need a bunch of games. UNC has been one of the top draws in Fargo for a long time. Largest crowd in the history of the old Dacotah Field was UNC. Im a little confused about this season though, are we playing?

WYOBISONMAN
02-23-2004, 08:07 PM
I would think that even if NDSU is in the BSC we would continue to play UNC. We have a long history of great games with the Bears and we won't want to loose that. There is always the need for non-conference competition. I just wish the GWC would be for all sports, then I think most of us would take either the GWC or the BSC on equal grounds.

Bisonfan1234
02-23-2004, 08:34 PM
I've noticed Kolpack tends to make more than his share of factual errors. *I remember he once referred to Montana and Idaho State as land-grant schools, when in fact they are not. *I also recall him doing a story on Essler this season when he wrote that the Bison were undefeated when Essler had at least one interception, even though he had an interception against the sue.
Of course, unlike the guy at the Greeley Tribune, at least Kolpack can count to 7.

I think, technically, that "land-grant" can be any school in which any part of the land claimed as "campus" land. was granted to them by the government.

However, i think most people think of the Morril Act when they hear "land-grant".

collegesportsinfo
02-23-2004, 08:39 PM
I will be doing a guest spot TODAY with Craig Mattick & Mike Henriksen of Sioux Falls KSWN-AM 1230's, "Sports Talk w/Craig & Mike" at 4:20 EST regarding this topic.

If you'd like to LISTEN LIVE via an internet stream, click here:
http://collegesportsinfo.com/radio

You can catch their show Mon.-Fri. from 3-5pm Central Time and visit their website at KWSN.com. If you have technical difficulties using the link I provided, you can stream via their website: http://www.kswn.com .

BisonKent...hope you can listen.

Bison_Kent
02-23-2004, 08:57 PM
This will be tough to do but wish I could. I don't have any speakers at my work computer. Will it be on any recorded devices?

Bisonguy
02-23-2004, 10:49 PM
That's great. *What's even better is that it's a 7 team league which leaves room for UND to join in a couple of years. *An 8 team league would be perfect.

Football conferences prefer an odd number of teams. UND better try to find another school if they want a chance.

Herd_Mentality
02-23-2004, 10:53 PM
Let's start a donation drive this second to buy underappreciated engineers such as BisonKent headphones! ;D

Bisonfan1234
02-23-2004, 11:04 PM
Football conferences prefer an odd number of teams. UND better try to find another school if they want a chance.

Yeah...i mean since football games are played between 2 teams it seems logical to have an even number and leave out one team from conference play each week.

As far as UND is concerned. I see it happening about the same way that UNM and NMSU are now. Both D1 now...but UNM is light years ahead and in a much better conference.

Bisonguy
02-23-2004, 11:18 PM
BisonFan1234,

An odd number of teams allows an equal amount of home and away games(i.e. NDSU would have 3 home and 3 away conference games each year with seven teams in the conference).


Herd Mentality,

How about finding somebody with some Biomed experience to make an ear implant for Kent? That way nobody will know he's not working that hard ;D ;).

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 12:16 AM
BisonFan1234,

An odd number of teams allows an equal amount of home and away games(i.e. NDSU would have 3 home and 3 away conference games each year with seven teams in the conference).


Herd Mentality,

How about finding somebody with some Biomed experience to make an ear implant for Kent? That way nobody will know he's not working that hard *;D ;).

As nice as that is...obviously it's much easier scheduling wise for there to be an even number in the conference.

THat why there are so many conferences with even numbers...

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 12:34 AM
As nice as that is...obviously it's much easier scheduling wise for there to be an even number in the conference.

THat why there are so many conferences with even numbers...


How many Football only conferences are there in I-AA?

The Gateway is the only one that comes to mind, and the Gateway commish is on record stating that they want to get to an odd number of teams. Nearly every other sport, an even number is better for travel partners.

D
02-24-2004, 12:38 AM
Scott Peters said on KVLY at 6 that he spoke to Gene Taylor a few hours ago and Taylor told him that something came up today that may throw a big wrench in the conference plans. He did not elaborate any further.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 12:42 AM
D,

Steve Halstrom mentioned it on WDAY 6:00 as well. He didn't claim it to be a "big wrench", but more of a stumbling block. Taylor said it might be resolved by wednesday.

BisonMav
02-24-2004, 12:42 AM
Scott Peters said on KVLY at 6 that he spoke to Gene Taylor a few hours ago and Taylor told him that something came up today that may throw a big wrench in the conference plans. *He did not elaborate any further. *

Big Sky invitation?

somebison
02-24-2004, 12:43 AM
Scott Peters said on KVLY at 6 that he spoke to Gene Taylor a few hours ago and Taylor told him that something came up today that may throw a big wrench in the conference plans. *He did not elaborate any further. *

On WDAY @6 Hallstroms said something came up as well... but said Taylor didn't think it would be jeopardize the announcement of the conf... also Hallstrom said that Taylor was hoping to announce an 8th opponent on wed.

filbert
02-24-2004, 12:48 AM
I'd speculate that the problem is that SDSU and Southern Utah can't find a mutually agreeable date, so that there won't be a full round-robin next year.

Absolutely nothing to back that up, just pure speculation.

D
02-24-2004, 12:50 AM
On WDAY @6 Hallstroms said something came up as well... but said Taylor didn't think it would be jeopardize the announcement of the conf... also Hallstrom said that Taylor was hoping to announce an 8th opponent on wed.

Peters seemed concerned, but didn't elaborate at all. *If I had to guess I'd say it is some business having to do with NCAA red tape and rules. I don't mean to rain on anybody's parade, just heard it and saw no one had posted it yet.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 12:54 AM
Peters concern doesn't bother me much. If Hallstrom seemed concerned, I might be worried.

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 01:03 AM
The only thing it could be is that everyone won't get to play everyone else.

I have a question though.

It says here that teams in the conference will be able to receive at large bids to the tournament! Does that mean, if we do well enough, that would get a bid??

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 01:07 AM
NDSU still has to go through the post-season ineligible period. Cal-Poly, St. Mary's (yeah, right), and Southern Utah could recieve an at-large bid for the playoffs, but they could before as well. In five years the conference would be eligible for an auto-bid for the conference champion.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 01:17 AM
Hallstrom just stated on Prime Time Sports that Taylor said there were a few snags with the conference, but did not expect them to change the wednesday anouncement.

I'm going with a couple scheduling problems.

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 01:19 AM
NDSU still has to go through the post-season ineligible period. Cal-Poly, St. Mary's (yeah, right), and Southern Utah could recieve an at-large bid for the playoffs, but they could before as well. In five years the conference would be eligible for an auto-bid for the conference champion. *

Ah...thanks. I thought maybe we had a loophole.

But hey! NDSU gets to play for a conference championship!

JBB
02-24-2004, 01:25 AM
D seems a little to eager doesnt he?

89rabbit
02-24-2004, 01:26 AM
I noticed that too.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 01:28 AM
author=Bisonfan1234

But hey! NDSU gets to play for a conference championship!


;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Good times!

D
02-24-2004, 01:30 AM
D seems a little to eager doesnt he?

Eager for what, passing along that the KVLY sports guy said that a *"big wrench" had come up as told him by AD Taylor? *There were no ill intentions what-so-ever. Although I do have a history of wishing the death penalty upon NDSU athletics, so your paranoia is understandable.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 01:35 AM
"Big Wrench"; or "small snags that won't interfere with the anouncement on wednesday". One sportscaster is a UND fan, one is a NDSU fan.

The truth will be told on wednesday.

D
02-24-2004, 01:42 AM
Don't shoot the messenger, just quoted what was said.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 01:52 AM
I'm not D-hatin', just stating if any Fargo sportscasters had to put a gloomy spin on NDSU, it would probably be Peters. Lodwyck(sp. ?) stated it more along the lines of Hallstrom, and he's a hockey freak.

JBB
02-24-2004, 02:12 AM
Im not D hatin either, everybody loves a wet blanket. He sees the world through und goggles. Its just my opinion that looking at women through beer goggles is a more accurate view of the world. 8)

WYOBISONMAN
02-24-2004, 02:56 AM
Just remember this about beer goggles......you can drink 'em pretty, but you can't drink 'em skinny..... :o

Bison_Kent
02-24-2004, 03:19 AM
Here is an ESPN article on the new conference:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=1742499

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 03:23 AM
Here is an ESPN article on the new conference:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=1742499

What the heck is Bohl doing that he didn't return a call to ESPN?

Thanks for the article, BK.

SiouxperMan
02-24-2004, 03:32 AM
Football conferences prefer an odd number of teams. UND better try to find another school if they want a chance.


Good point * ::) *

Pac 10 - 10 teams
Big 12 - 12 teams
Big East - 8 teams
Mid American - 14 teams
Mtn West - 8 teams
SEC - 12 teams
Sun Belt - 8 teams
WAC - 10 teams

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 03:42 AM
Good point * ::) *

Pac 10 - 10 teams
Big 12 - 12 teams
Big East - 8 teams
Mid American - 14 teams
Mtn West - 8 teams
SEC - 12 teams
Sun Belt - 8 teams
WAC - 10 teams





How many of those are football only conferences? ::)

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 03:47 AM
LOL!

I love your logic.

So obviously since football plays with 2 teams per game.....and ALL other sports play with 2 teams per game...there is no compatibility what-so-ever.

::) ::) ::)

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 03:50 AM
It says he didn't return it Monday and the article was written monday.

It wasn't breaking news or anything so it had to have been written fairly early.

I'm sure coach Bohl is quite busy during the day and simply didn't have time to return a call to ANYONE regardless of who they are.

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 03:51 AM
Another thing occured to me.

We won't have to worry if every team plays each other this year.

NDSU plays all the teams and are going to BEAT them all.

Might as well crown us now. ;D ;D ;D ;D

NDSU: 2004 Heartland Pacific Conference Champions

Bison_Kent
02-24-2004, 03:52 AM
Having an odd number helps for conference game number in having an equal number of road and home games. A team will know exactly every year how many home and road games they will have as conference opponents instead of alternating 4 and 3 (if 8 schools are in the conference).

In basketball and volleyball, even numbers are better as two games per a weekend are played. Football, it doesn't really matter but knowing that 3 are at home and 3 are on the road. The one weekend can allow the school to play an out of conference game or just to have an off week.

I don't see anything wrong with an odd number for football. Currently, the Big 10 is an odd number as is the ACC if you want examples of how it has worked in football.

BisonMav
02-24-2004, 03:59 AM
Here is an ESPN article on the new conference:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=1742499

ESPN calls it the Great West Football Conference


FARGO, N.D. -- Officials at North Dakota State University and six other colleges are set to announce the creation of a new NCAA Division I-AA football league known as the Great West Football Conference.

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 04:04 AM
LOL!

I love your logic.

So obviously since football plays with 2 teams per game.....and ALL other sports play with 2 teams per game...there is no compatibility what-so-ever.

::) ::) ::)

Basketball uses travel partners, football does not. An odd number of teams makes scheduling easier for football. As per the Gateway Conference commish, nine is the ideal number for a football conference. Eight games, four home, four away, three non-conf. games. Other sports: mileage may vary. *::)


Thanks, BK ;D

somebison
02-24-2004, 04:05 AM
What the heck is Bohl doing that he didn't return a call to ESPN?

Thanks for the article, BK.

hopefully getting an O coordinator 8)

Bisonguy
02-24-2004, 04:13 AM
hopefully getting an O coordinator 8)


And a WR coach and a DL coach. ;) ;D ;) ;D

Forgot my smilies in my first post

89rabbit
02-24-2004, 06:10 AM
Here is the Argus Leader story, about a day late, be glad you have the Forum:

http://www.argusleader.com/sports/Tuesdayarticle2.shtml

Go State!

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 01:28 PM
ACC: moving to 12 teams.

Yeah...you're right...odd is much better. *::)

It's EASIER to schedule with an even number of teams.

You simply flop the number of road games and home games each year...not hard at all.

Finding NC opponents...we proved how hard that was.


The love of your lives (the BSC) is at 8 teams. They want 10.

Your explanation is fine except NO ONE uses it!

mojobison
02-24-2004, 03:33 PM
The Gateway had an odd number of members for a long time and liked it that way.

lucchesicourt
02-24-2004, 03:39 PM
Now what I find interesting is that , if D1AA does recognize our new conference, that the conference champions (automatic berths) are allowed to compete in the playoffs. Now, if St. Mary's (an established D1AA team) wins the conference, and is allowed in the playoffs, because they were the conference champions, would then this would also apply to the conference champions in the future years regardless of the 4 and 5 year rules of inelgibility? My feelings are the conference champion should be allowed to compete if the conference is recognized and given automatic berths regardless of the elgibility rules. Any other opinions?

Bisonfan1234
02-24-2004, 03:49 PM
I'm not quite sure i understand you.

Our conference has to wait 5 years before D1AA will decide if it wants to give our conference champ an auto birth.

A few teams on our conference can receive an at-large bid.

Our teams will be awarding conference champions all 5 years.

It's possible a team like Saint Mary's would win the conference and then receive an at-large bid.

Sac_State
02-24-2004, 03:54 PM
If Mary's wins the new conference with 12 schollies, I think the new conference is in trouble.

WYOBISONMAN
02-24-2004, 04:00 PM
Sac Stae.....that is indeed a valid point ;)

collegesportsinfo
02-24-2004, 04:49 PM
This will be tough to do but wish I could. *I don't have any speakers at my work computer. *Will it be on any recorded devices? *



Nope. I got the call at 3pm EST asking if I'd be interested in the 4:20 segment. I was actually driving while doing the interview. I had a few minutes to post on a few sites to give people the heads-up if they wanted to listen. But since I was on my second computer (without totalrecorder) I wasn't able to record the stream. Oh well.

lucchesicourt
02-25-2004, 03:11 PM
My point was let's say a new team in D1AA enters a conference (say NDSU) like the Big Sky (should they eventually move here before their exemption is up) and wins the conference title. Now, we have two events occurring that are in conflict. One NDSU would be exempt from the playoffs as their time for elgibility has not yet elapsed. However, as champions of the Big Sky they should receive an automatic berth. So, what happens?

Bison_Kent
02-25-2004, 03:23 PM
I am not exactly sure but I believe teams have been on probation before and have won conference titles. I think one example is Auburn 10+ years ago. They actually went undefeated in the conference (SEC) and were conference champions by record. However, since they were bowl ineligible, the second place team got the Sugar Bowl bid. I am sure it would happen like that with any new member. The new school is a full member of the conference and is conference champion eligible but not post-season eligible.

lucchesicourt
02-25-2004, 03:46 PM
So, does this mean then that the conference loses its automatic berth (as it's possible that the second place team may only be an overall .500 club- in a weak conference year)?

Bison_Kent
02-25-2004, 03:58 PM
lucchesicourt,

I am not sure on your question. The new conference wouldn't be eligible for an automatic bid until all the current members are full I-AA members.

I have seen conflicting reports on the timeframe for playoff eligibility. It is either five or six years before the new conference would be eligible for an automatic bid.

lucchesicourt
02-26-2004, 01:57 PM
I'm talking about a new team in an established conference. Say NDSU goes 10-0 in the Big Sky ( a team exempt from the playoffs for 4 years) and the second place team say MSU goes 5-5 or 6-4. Since the automatic berth is for the conference champion, and the second place team was so weak, would there be no automatic playoff berth from this conference for this year?

Bison_Kent
02-26-2004, 03:12 PM
I would guess the automatic bid would still go to the second place team.

BisonBizzo
02-26-2004, 03:57 PM
If no one has posted or mentioned this link on espn's website, here it is:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=1744217

It adds the same info seen everywhere else, but it gives an explanation on SDSU and SUU not playing each other and the criteria that will count as conference games for each, like Gene had said in the press conference yesterday. *SDSU's conference game will be Georgia Southern, SUU will be Sac State. *That will be one tough conference game for the rabbits.

lucchesicourt
03-03-2004, 04:09 PM
It seems that St. Mary's may be dropping their football program. We should find out today in a public announcement. What effect do you think this will have on the new conference if they do discontinue their program? This will also leave some open dates for many of the teams to fill.

I hope the administrators of St. Mary's realize how vital a good program is to attracting new students. Football is the number 1 college spectator sport. Sure, it's expensive to operate, but how many future students will you lose because of the loss of this program? And to a school, which charges huge tuitions like St. Mary's, it could end up being more costly than the football program. Let's face it, academically, there are a lot of great academic schools, probably better than St. Mary's, in the SF Bay Area who possess quality football programs and smaller tuitions than St. Mary's.