St. Thomas to FCS

[MankatoBison]

http://www.startribune.com/university-of-st-thomas-wants-to-go-division-i-gets-invitation-to-summit-league/562174952/


St Thomas to FCS- they're considering Pioneer league and MISSOURI VALLEY

[imabison]

http://www.startribune.com/university-of-st-thomas-wants-to-go-division-i-gets-invitation-to-summit-league/562174952/


St Thomas to FCS- they're considering Pioneer league and MISSOURI VALLEY

https://www.inforum.com/sports/4705409-St.-Thomas-invited-to-join-the-Summit-League

Similar to this but it does not mention the Missouri Valley for football. Guess it could come in to play.

[23Bison]

I don’t see MVFC happening anytime soon. Pioneer, yes absolutely.

[HerdThat!]

http://www.startribune.com/university-of-st-thomas-wants-to-go-division-i-gets-invitation-to-summit-league/562174952/


St Thomas to FCS- they're considering Pioneer league and MISSOURI VALLEY

an NDSU game here in the Cities every other year would be awesome

[Bison bison]

I think this is a good thing.

If they have a plan to fund football I see no problem with them in the valley.

[tjbison]

Another FCS school to recruit the MSP area isnt necessarily good IMO

UNI, NDSU, SDSU, USD, UND, UST is a lot of schools looking for that level in low density states

I will say UST probably has a better shot at the MVFC than Augy

[Christopher Moen]

With their alumni and the wealth of their alumni, I can see them being in the MVFC by 2030.

They have a lot resources and will be a threat like NDSU and SDSU were quickly in the MVFC/Summit League. They should make their respective conferences stronger.

Additionally, other schools will be able to recruit Twin City kids easier now that they will have competitions there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MankatoBison]

I think this is a good thing.

If they have a plan to fund football I see no problem with them in the valley.


Another FCS school to recruit the MSP area isnt necessarily good IMO

UNI, NDSU, SDSU, USD, UND, UST is a lot of schools looking for that level in low density states

I will say UST probably has a better shot at the MVFC than Augy

I had two thoughts

1. Would love them in the Valley (even thought I think thats a BIG stretch for them). They would certainly be a better addition than indiana state, Western, Missouri State and now even SIU. They already have a nicer stadium than bout 1/2 of the MVFC. and just think, it would be yet another FCS team that would eventually beat the Gophers. Would be nice to have a game in Minneapolis/st paul every other year as well.

2. I'm also afraid that if they really did join FCS, especially with schollies, that they could take a nice swipe (2-5) quality players from the cities that otherwise would have gone to us. Many players already pick St Thomas over good DII schools like UMDuluth and MSU mankato.

IF THEY JUMP TO MISSOURI VALLEY....... I bet theyre a seeded team in the playoffs within a decade.

[NDSUKurt]

Another team for OOC games.

Perhaps the best item to come from this is that there will be another team in the local area that NDSU can schedule for OOC games. With the addition of Dixie State (Utah), Tarleton State (Texas), and most likely Augustana (South Dakota), we would have 4 new FCS teams west of the Mississippi for scheduling more games with. Add in Merrimack (Massachusetts), Long Island (New York), and North Alabama, that makes 7 new FCS teams in a short time.

This will hopefully help us with not paying so much for our guarantee games - I just saw some of the other guarantees that teams are paying, and it is half of what NDSU has to pay:

Eastern Kentucky is paying Charleston Southern only $115k in 2022 and they are paying Western Carolina $120k in 2023.

Youngstown State is paying Incarnate Word $135k in 2021 and they are paying Duquesne $100k in 2020, $110k in 2022, and $115k in each 2024 and 2026.

(I realize that NDSU is much better than Eastern Kentucky and Youngstown, which increases the cost for teams to come to Fargo, and that Duquesne can drive to Youngstown to save on travel).

Having more FCS teams in the area should help NDSU with game options and thus lower costs.

[MinotBison]

Welcome to the Tommies. :cheers:

[NDSU92]

Yeah not interested in losing out on Twin Cities kids. I hope they stay in the Pioneer

[gumby013]

Pioneer...set up a game at US Bank.

[Greta Van Herd]

I had two thoughts

1. Would love them in the Valley (even thought I think thats a BIG stretch for them). They would certainly be a better addition than indiana state, Western, Missouri State and now even SIU.

This might be just the way you worded it, but SIU, WIU, and ISUb are not additions. They have been in the MVFC from the beginning, 1985-1986. Missouri State joined in 2005.

I’m guessing you mean to say that St. Thomas would be a better addition than these teams are CURRENTLY?

SIU, of course, has been a major FCS power in the past. (until Lennon and Bubba worked their magic, that is. :) ).

I also note that you apparently don’t think St. Thomas would be a better addition than UND?

[Hammerhead]

D-III Tommies are probably better than 10% of the FCS teams.

[everybody knows my name]

IF THEY JUMP TO MISSOURI VALLEY....... I bet theyre a seeded team in the playoffs within a decade.

You're absolutely right. Best case scenario for St Thomas is becoming a kind of Notre Dame of FCS. It could happen, too.

[ZHerd]

Let’s move up and they can take our spot in the valley

[everybody knows my name]

Let’s move up and they can take our spot in the valley

NDSU should go to the Big 12. I've been saying it for years. It's a perfect fit because none of the other Big 12 schools have hockey programs either.

[23Bison]

NDSU should go to the Big 12. I've been saying it for years. It's a perfect fit because none of the other Big 12 schools have hockey programs either.
Well that settles it then. Off to the Big 12 we go.

[ZHerd]

Well that settles it then. Off to the Big 12 we go.

Make it happen

[MinotBison]

NDSU should go to the Big 12. I've been saying it for years. It's a perfect fit because none of the other Big 12 schools have hockey programs either.
:rofl: :biggrin:

[23Bison]

With UCF’s loss to Cincinnati tonight maybe the AAC should just drop them and we can be int the P6!!! #makingnoise

[El_Chapo]

Cant believe NDSU is in same football division as St Thomas....

just embarassing

[Loud and Proud Bison fan]

NDSU should go to the Big 12. I've been saying it for years. It's a perfect fit because none of the other Big 12 schools have hockey programs either.

Best logic I have seen. Heck we are in the conference for wrestling... I am sure our invite is coming within the next week or so.

[AKBison]

I think this is a good thing.

If they have a plan to fund football I see no problem with them in the valley.

Disagree, we are basically Minnesota's FCS program. How is it going to help us to have a new in state program that is filthy rich to recruit against?

[EC8CH]

Brooks off tackle is my favorite run.

[HerdThat!]

Disagree, we are basically Minnesota's FCS program. How is it going to help us to have a new in state program that is filthy rich to recruit against?

Not sure I agree that just cuz they are filthy rich that we will lose recruits- we win recruiting battles against other geographies that already have FCS and FBS programs, we win recruits against schools that have more financial benefits than us, that come from larger markets, beating out FBS schools on offers.
It’s going to be just like recruiting against UND for instate recruits in that if Minnesota kids just want to go play football at some school then go play at St Thomas, but if you want to play at a school with tradition, for championships, learn to be a better player and smaller scale NFL pipeline then come to NDSU - and if that doesn’t resonate with a recruit then maybe that’s not a kid we want in our program.

[heffray]

I think the conference will dictate the level of play and recruit talent. I’m not worried.

[MankatoBison]

This might be just the way you worded it, but SIU, WIU, and ISUb are not additions. They have been in the MVFC from the beginning, 1985-1986. Missouri State joined in 2005.

I’m guessing you mean to say that St. Thomas would be a better addition than these teams are CURRENTLY?

SIU, of course, has been a major FCS power in the past. (until Lennon and Bubba worked their magic, that is. :) ).

I also note that you apparently don’t think St. Thomas would be a better addition than UND?

Yes, obviously I mean that St Thomas is better than those teams CURRENTLY.

Umm yes I think UND, who was currently DI, who is already providing scholarships to their players, who are well within the footprint of the conference, with ample history with over half the league, with FCS well above average facilities across the board, is a better fit than a DIII school with virtually none of those things (except for the footprint comment).

[MankatoBison]

Yes, obviously I mean that St Thomas is better than those teams CURRENTLY.

Umm yes I think UND, who was currently DI, who is already providing scholarships to their players, who are well within the footprint of the conference, with ample history with over half the league, with FCS well above average facilities across the board, is a better fit than a DIII school with virtually none of those things (except for the footprint comment).

Honestly, I hope they go MVFC just for the pure entertainment factor (even though its extraordinarily improbable). I think they'd be a legitimate top 10 team in no time flat.

More than Likely, as we all agree, they will probably go Pioneer, but I dont think that would be a long term home for them. Would probably try and join MVFC within a few years. But probably just end up replacing NDSU if/when we ever jump to FBS

[23Bison]

Maybe St. Thomas will start a coalition to force NDSU out. UN_ will be right there to follow suit. Gentle snowflakes of purple.

[THEsocalledfan]

Heard many say they would want to go MVFC in time.....however, I think those folks are forgetting just how much money they will need to pump into hockey........I really wonder if they will be Pioneer long term.

[Greta Van Herd]

Yes, obviously I mean that St Thomas is better than those teams CURRENTLY.

Umm yes I think UND, who was currently DI, who is already providing scholarships to their players, who are well within the footprint of the conference, with ample history with over half the league, with FCS well above average facilities across the board, is a better fit than a DIII school with virtually none of those things (except for the footprint comment).

Umm ok, but the 4 teams that you said St. Thomas would be better than have all the things that you just referenced UND as having. Why the difference for UND then? Just trying to understand your thought process here. Try not to get so defensive about it.

[El_Chapo]

Heard many say they would want to go MVFC in time.....however, I think those folks are forgetting just how much money they will need to pump into hockey........I really wonder if they will be Pioneer long term.


I was at a St Thomas fundraising function saturday night, that's why they announced this friday.
to a person, their hockey situation is split 50/50 , want to keep it and go to WCHA vs sane people that don't want to money drain.

They were pretty dam excited on this D1 news, lots of deep pockets, Medtronic , GM, Cargill, 3M exec types there.
I predict they go big with Basketball and Olympic sports.....and while it appears their admin said "pioneer for football" I think the donor's will try and convince admin into MVFC.

[bisonp]

Everybody seems to be glossing over the exemption they need from the NCAA to go direct to DI. Has the NCAA ever granted one? I was under the impression that they are pretty strict on their reclassification process.

[El_Chapo]

Everybody seems to be glossing over the exemption they need from the NCAA to go direct to DI. Has the NCAA ever granted one? I was under the impression that they are pretty strict on their reclassification process.

but that's why behind the scenes St Thomas told the other MIAC presidents to "go ahead & kick us out" because that would give them the ammunition to get a waiver from NCAA.

[WhoRepsTheLurker]

It’s not just hockey. Pioneer is a perfect fit. They’ll dominate just like they do now and they can keep playing traditional rivals. If NDSU can play Butler at Target Field, NDSU can play UST there too and it will be epic. Best of all possible worlds

I don't think they are ultimately making this move to be a FB school. They know what they are and where the ceiling is, etc. MVC or bust ...

[MankatoBison]

Umm ok, but the 4 teams that you said St. Thomas would be better than have all the things that you just referenced UND as having. Why the difference for UND then? Just trying to understand your thought process here. Try not to get so defensive about it.

SIU, Indiana State, western and missouri state all have historic rivalries with other MVFC Teams, top rate facilities across the board, are at the geopgraphic center of the conference and are doing COA scholarships? Interesting, never heard anyone, literally ever suggest that about any of these schools besides you.

Some of these schools have ONE of these things.. Most have None. UND has all of them. St Thomas would have some of them day one, and have the rest within 2-3 years.

I guess I dont know what you are arguing? that MoState, Indiana State, Western and SIU are stalwart Athletic programs, top too bottom, in Mid-major college sports? If you have a counterpoint- now would be the time to say it besides just randomly taking offense to something and challenging the semantics of the statement

[MankatoBison]

Lets flash forward- lets say they all go into the summit, Pioneer in football and WCHA in hockey.

What do they REALLY gain out of this that they couldnt get in D2? Football is the big "profile booster", and they would be in a profile-less league. Pioneer doesnt move the needle at all. Like for anyone.

WCHA hockey could be a very big deal for them... but they could do that without going to the summit in other sports.

Sure, they would have more of a regional profile as Summit baseball, track, basketball etc, but does that profoundly boost their profile? if you want ROI on a scholarship, wouldnt you think the sports to target are:

1. Football
2. Hockey (not for everyone, but important for them specifically)
3. Basketball
4. Baseball
5. all of the other 10 million sports

It just doesnt make a great deal of sense to me that they would go through the hassle of paying for all of the scholarships of non-revenue-generating and non-profile increasing sports, and then SKIP over the one that generates more revenue and more profile then the rest combined? What am I missing here?

[Greta Van Herd]

SIU, Indiana State, western and missouri state all have historic rivalries with other MVFC Teams, top rate facilities across the board, are at the geopgraphic center of the conference and are doing COA scholarships? Interesting, never heard anyone, literally ever suggest that about any of these schools besides you.

Some of these schools have ONE of these things.. Most have None. UND has all of them. St Thomas would have some of them day one, and have the rest within 2-3 years.


Heck, if you want to change your own criteria in midstream, I guess that’s your prerogative.

It’s okay if you really, really, really like UND. Why try to hide it?

[JMB]

Lets flash forward- lets say they all go into the summit, Pioneer in football and WCHA in hockey.

What do they REALLY gain out of this that they couldnt get in D2? Football is the big "profile booster", and they would be in a profile-less league. Pioneer doesnt move the needle at all. Like for anyone.

WCHA hockey could be a very big deal for them... but they could do that without going to the summit in other sports.

Sure, they would have more of a regional profile as Summit baseball, track, basketball etc, but does that profoundly boost their profile? if you want ROI on a scholarship, wouldnt you think the sports to target are:

1. Football
2. Hockey (not for everyone, but important for them specifically)
3. Basketball
4. Baseball
5. all of the other 10 million sports

It just doesnt make a great deal of sense to me that they would go through the hassle of paying for all of the scholarships of non-revenue-generating and non-profile increasing sports, and then SKIP over the one that generates more revenue and more profile then the rest combined? What am I missing here?

Basketball certainly has the ability to be the big profile booster if they get good... Why else does Georgetown, Butler, Drake, etc.. play in the same situation?

However, I would expect St. Thomas to attempt to quickly move to scholarship football. They seem to be a football school. I doubt their boosters will be happy getting the living hell kicked out of them by the "schools that matter" in the FCS. They are going to want to play Minnesota. They are going to want to compete with the Dakota Schools.

[THEsocalledfan]

Basketball certainly has the ability to be the big profile booster if they get good... Why else does Georgetown, Butler, Drake, etc.. play in the same situation?

However, I would expect St. Thomas to attempt to quickly move to scholarship football. They seem to be a football school. I doubt their boosters will be happy getting the living hell kicked out of them by the "schools that matter" in the FCS. They are going to want to play Minnesota. They are going to want to compete with the Dakota Schools.

But man, the money unless they drop hockey......

[Yote 53]

But man, the money unless they drop hockey......

Problem is that it is St. Paul, Minnesota. Dropping hockey would be a very bad look to supporters in that state. A hockey program in the hockey mecca of the USA, why would they pass on that? Could easily be a revenue positive sport for them, a potential cash cow.

[JMB]

But man, the money unless they drop hockey......

I am not sure of their hockey following. Minnesota obviously has a lot of support for hockey, but there are plenty of schools to scratch the "hockey itch" down here as well. Now part of UND's problem is they want to have a Top Tier Hockey program... That costs some serious scratch.... If you are willing to be a more mid level hockey program and funded appropriately, could you pull it off??? I am trying to think of a FCS level school that has pulled off a hockey program and a football program successfully.... UND is probably the closest. (And in all honesty, UND right at this second is an above average football program).

[THEsocalledfan]

Problem is that it is St. Paul, Minnesota. Dropping hockey would be a very bad look to supporters in that state. A hockey program in the hockey mecca of the USA, why would they pass on that? Could easily be a revenue positive sport for them, a potential cash cow.

Because of the money. I very, very much doubt they will generate a lot of cash from it when you have the Gophers and Wild in the same market. To me, they simply can't serve both masters well.....they need to either be Pioneer/WCHA, or no hockey MVFC.

[Christopher Moen]

I am not sure of their hockey following. Minnesota obviously has a lot of support for hockey, but there are plenty of schools to scratch the "hockey itch" down here as well. Now part of UND's problem is they want to have a Top Tier Hockey program... That costs some serious scratch.... If you are willing to be a more mid level hockey program and funded appropriately, could you pull it off??? I am trying to think of a FCS level school that has pulled off a hockey program and a football program successfully.... UND is probably the closest. (And in all honesty, UND right at this second is an above average football program).

I think Maine has done alright with both. Maybe New Hampshire too. Yes, DI hockey is tough for any school outside a P5 conference if it was to be competitive in the two major college sports, football and men's basketball due to how much money has to be invested into it.

[EagleBison]

But man, the money unless they drop hockey......

I would take a wild guess and say there is more potential and actual money available to St Thomas, in the Twin Cities, as opposed to Grand Forks, ND.

[2011BisonAlumni]

The Foundation by which NDSU’s success was built upon was a D1 university next to a state with a large population and only one D1 university.

I’m not sure how anyone thinks having more competition for resources (talent) is a good thing for NDSU.

[Christopher Moen]

The Foundation by which NDSU’s success was built upon was a D1 university next to a state with a large population and only one D1 university.

I’m not sure how anyone thinks having more competition for resources (talent) is a good thing for NDSU.

It gives Twin Cities kids that play at NDSU a chance to play near their hometown now.

[taper]

Everybody seems to be glossing over the exemption they need from the NCAA to go direct to DI. Has the NCAA ever granted one? I was under the impression that they are pretty strict on their reclassification process.

Liberty got one to go FBS without a conference invite a few years ago. With the mitigating factors of being kicked out of the MIAC, history of strong athletic performance across all sports, a Summit invite, plenty of money, and the NCAA probably not wanting to grant the Summit another membership size waiver I'd say they have a good chance. I haven't heard of any schools protesting, the NCAA generally turns a blind eye to everything unless someone complains. Just look at how many FBS teams either don't meet attendance or fake that they do.

[2011BisonAlumni]

It gives Twin Cities kids that play at NDSU a chance to play near their hometown now.

Exactly. That is not a good thing for NDSU.

[1998braves64]

Exactly. That is not a good thing for NDSU.Are we going to lose recruiting battles to st Thomas? We lose very few to USD/sdsu/UND already not sure that st Thomas could be that much more intimidating imo.

Sent by my phone on a bullet train from Hillsboro.

[wagsabison]

Are we going to lose recruiting battles to st Thomas? We lose very few to USD/sdsu/UND already not sure that st Thomas could be that much more intimidating imo.

Sent by my phone on a bullet train from Hillsboro.

I would think St Thomas is going to hurt USD and UND. NDSU and SDSU are still going to be the top fcs schools in the region.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Christopher Moen]

Exactly. That is not a good thing for NDSU.

No, not exactly. A Twin City kid that is good enough to play for NDSU isn't going to prefer St. Thomas. Think about the kids we get out of Sioux Falls over USD or SDSU.

[marenlee]

I’d worry about them encroaching on our walk-on program and basketball recruits.


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[2011BisonAlumni]

No, not exactly. A Twin City kid that is good enough to play for NDSU isn't going to prefer St. Thomas. Think about the kids we get out of Sioux Falls over USD or SDSU.

Wrong. They absolutely will take away talent, especially walk on’s.

They also have the ability to offer one heck of an education to a student athlete.

[Christopher Moen]

Wrong. They absolutely will take away talent, especially walk on’s.

They also have the ability to offer one heck of an education to a student athlete.

We’ll have to agree to disagree.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[El_Chapo]

Wrong. They absolutely will take away talent, especially walk on’s.

They also have the ability to offer one heck of an education to a student athlete.

this. it's a viable concern. we had a corner on the twin cities market not only for athletes but students as well

[heffray]

We’ll have to agree to disagree.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think some PWOs, or even a few schollies could be lost to a Twin Cuties based FCS team... especially if they join the Valley... unlikely if they are Pioneer, since they don’t have schollies...

[Christopher Moen]

Maybe, but all that gets offset by the recruits NDSU gets from the area that might have been a PWO at a P5 school or a scholarship player at a G5 school now that they will be playing in the area.


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[NDSU92]

Maybe, but all that gets offset by the recruits NDSU gets from the area that might have been a PWO at a P5 school or a scholarship player at a G5 school now that they will be playing in the area.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There is absolutely no way that St. Thomas in the MVFC brings more overall talent to NDSU.

[scottietohottie]

There is absolutely no way that St. Thomas in the MVFC brings more overall talent to NDSU.

Yeah because Trey Lance would have went to st Thomas fo sho

[ByeSonBusiness]

I'm sure some kids would prefer to stay closer to home. Who cares. Its whatever.

[scottietohottie]

I'm sure some kids would prefer to stay closer to home. Who cares. Its whatever.

Dam right. And some will come from Florida, Texas, and Wyoming.

[Christopher Moen]

There is absolutely no way that St. Thomas in the MVFC brings more overall talent to NDSU.

Well, we’ll have to agree to disagree then.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SafeTeeJ]

Dam right. And some will come from Florida, Texas, and Wyoming.

Every team gets talent. It’s what NDSU has done with their talent, which has made them the power they are.

[NDSU92]

I'm sure some kids would prefer to stay closer to home. Who cares. Its whatever.

Well there’s that, which isn’t even my point. You’re adding 63 schollies at the center of our recruiting footprint. Best case scenario is that we would lose a chunk of walkons we’d normally have every year.

[NDSU92]

Yeah because Trey Lance would have went to st Thomas fo sho


I’m not talking about the Trey Lances, I’m talking about the Joe Haeg’s...

[scottietohottie]

I’m not talking about the Trey Lances, I’m talking about the Joe Haeg’s...

Why would anyone go to a school I've never heard of?

[Bisonator98]

This isn't happening anytime soon. They will be a non-scholly Pioneer Football league team for at least 10 years IMO. If NDSU is afraid of St. Thomas we have no business being D1. Get a grip people.

[unbison]

Why would anyone go to a school I've never heard of?

Well we probably won’t have to worry about the north of 2 recruits heading that way

[ZHerd]

Every team gets talent. It’s what NDSU has done with their talent, which has made them the power they are.

It’s talent as well. Most fcs teams would love to have our roster. If we switched rosters with USD etc. we would never sniff a championship

[ByeSonBusiness]

Why would anyone go to a school I've never heard of?

They have around 10K students. Worth noting a lot of folks might prefer to stay closer to home as well.

[oldmantutters]

Saw a brand new St Thomas billboard in Fargo this morning...

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk

[Bison 4 Life]

This isn't happening anytime soon. They will be a non-scholly Pioneer Football league team for at least 10 years IMO. If NDSU is afraid of St. Thomas we have no business being D1. Get a grip people.

This is the correct take.

[GreenfieldBison]

Why would anyone go to a school I've never heard of?

Well down here in the Twin Cities area we have heard of St. Thomas. One reason a person might choose it is quality of education. According to the ranking referenced in the two links below St. Thomas is ranked well above NDSU but also well behind UofM.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/university-of-st-thomas-minnesota-2345

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/north-dakota-state-9265

[Mr Pep Band]

This isn't happening anytime soon. They will be a non-scholly Pioneer Football league team for at least 10 years IMO. If NDSU is afraid of St. Thomas we have no business being D1. Get a grip people.

If the U of M is afraid of St. Thomas going D1, THEY have no business being D1.



"The U is the ONLY D1 school in Minnesota! We are the best school in Minnesota! BIG 10! Gopher State!....etc"
:rofl:

[tjbison]

pioneer it is per Douple on Izzo's show

[MankatoBison]

pioneer it is per Douple on Izzo's show

FCS adding St thomas to pioneer does nothing for anyone. just adds a non con beatdown

I think they will get bored of PFL in about 2 seconds flat and be looking for greener pastures very quickly.

Adding them to a scholarship league sends shockwaves throughout the FCS. the landscape would change RAPIDLY if they were to go MVFC..


We'll see what happens!

[heffray]

FCS adding St thomas to pioneer does nothing for anyone. just adds a non con beatdown

I think they will get bored of PFL in about 2 seconds flat and be looking for greener pastures very quickly.

Adding them to a scholarship league sends shockwaves throughout the FCS. the landscape would change RAPIDLY if they were to go MVFC..


We'll see what happens!

Siting earlier posts about their fanbase and funding... I think their chances of being relevant in the Pioneer quickly are pretty good. They get an autobid every year, so you never know...

[Bison bison]

As long as they can beat San Diego, they'll be in Fargo the first Friday in December for perpetuity.

[heffray]

As long as they can beat San Diego, they'll be in Fargo the first Friday in December for perpetuity.

I wouldn't be surprised to see them on the non-con schedule soon, too.

[CaBisonFan]

Let’s move up and they can take our spot in the valley...agreed...

[tony]

Not sure that this has been posted but here's a MidCo interview with Tom Douple.


https://www.midcosn.com/blog/2019/10/tommie-time-tom-douple-discusses-st-thomas-summit-league-invitation/

The differences between Augie and St. Thomas: St. Thomas is much bigger and their support for going DI is not just one or two bigwigs. Like NDSU, they enjoy broad support. Schools that try to do stuff with just a couple deep pockets on board seldom do well. Take Northern Colorado - they had some big donors who wanted UNC to go DI and kind of pushed them that way. Then, all the sudden, they got miffed about something and pulled their support.

[AKBison]

Maybe I missed it but I didn't hear any Augustana talk. It was interesting to hear the question about Minnesota State and St Cloud State as it sounds like there has been back channel communication but nothing has ever officially been discussed. However he made it sound like those NSIC schools will be watching how St Thomas does in it's transition. The bottom line was that he sounded open to another D2 move up. I was 100% against UMKC, Augie, and UST from NDSU's perspective but get why it's a good thing for the Summit. At this point we may as well as Mankato, it honestly doesn't matter anymore.

[tony]

Maybe I missed it but I didn't hear any Augustana talk. It was interesting to hear the question about Minnesota State and St Cloud State as it sounds like there has been back channel communication but nothing has ever officially been discussed. However he made it sound like those NSIC schools will be watching how St Thomas does in it's transition. The bottom line was that he sounded open to another D2 move up. I was 100% against UMKC, Augie, and UST from NDSU's perspective but get why it's a good thing for the Summit. At this point we may as well as Mankato, it honestly doesn't matter anymore.

Yeah, I didn't hear any Augie talk either - just UMKC and St. Thomas.

[tony]

Article in NY Times about St. Thomas trying to make the jump from DIII to DI. "but will the NCAA allow it?"

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/27/sports/ncaafootball/st-thomas-division-i.html

Haven't read the article because I don't have a subscription.

[td577]

Article in NY Times about St. Thomas trying to make the jump from DIII to DI. "but will the NCAA allow it?"

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/27/sports/ncaafootball/st-thomas-division-i.html

Haven't read the article because I don't have a subscription.It is a good article establishing a baseline for the Tommie move and challenges. Outside of the St Johns game, they don't draw in football in a stadium that needs a lot more seats for even the FCS. The other sports don't really draw either and have facilities that will also need upgrading like their hockey arena. They hope to have a defcon about D1 by April.

My 1/2 cent follows.

There is a reason the NCAA doesn't want programs going straight from III to I. Put together all the marketing strategies you want, the bottom line this is going to take serious money and serious behavior change by everyone attached to the college.

They are a school that dominates their conference in sports. A conference of schools that focus in academics that happen to have athletics. They are really not a football or basketball school in the sense of a basketball school like Butler or football school like NDSU or hockey school like UN_. Nothing there to really pinpoint as the D1 pivot point.

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[NDSUSR]

If they jump directly to D1 they are in for a rude awakening.

[Vet70]

If they jump directly to D1 they are in for a rude awakening.

Joining the Valley, no thank you. On the other hand the MVFC has shown they will let anyone join.

[El_Chapo]

St Thomas just found a spot in the pioneer.

https://judolphins.com/news/2019/12/3/jacksonville-university-discontinues-football.aspx

JU out. STU in.

[KNOW IT ALL]

St Thomas should have no problem with an FCS move, a majority of the FCS schools draw very few fans, if they can avg 4K-5K a game they are right in there. As for recruiting they have the Twin Cities, Iowa, Wisc. to pull from and it's a small 'wealthy' school. I see them in five years being a pioneer power.

[Bisonator98]

It'll be interesting to see how they fare against a team like San Diego that currently dominates the Pioneer League.

[Herd]

When we played Valpo, we said, this is DI FCS football? In the Pioneer, every game for St Thomas will be, this is DI FCS football? They’ll need to play a few valley teams to better understand the level.

[MankatoBison]

What's this I see in my crystal ball?
They will be top half of pioneer immediately.
They will be top 2 of pioneer by their 2nd year.
They will take over SanDiego in the 3rd year.
They will be in the Missouri Valley by year 5.

[Bison"FANatic"]

Please UND schedule them. PLEASE

[heffray]

What's this I see in my crystal ball?
They will be top half of pioneer immediately.
They will be top 2 of pioneer by their 2nd year.
They will take over SanDiego in the 3rd year.
They will be in the Missouri Valley by year 5.

I don’t see this happening that soon.

[IndyBison]

What's this I see in my crystal ball?
They will be top half of pioneer immediately.
They will be top 2 of pioneer by their 2nd year.
They will take over SanDiego in the 3rd year.
They will be in the Missouri Valley by year 5.Good D3 and Pioneer are very similar. That will not be a huge change for them. Recruiting could be more difficult because all their road but Drake will be a haul for family to see them. It could also become more national. I know Butler has a lot of OOS players. The football transition will be much easier than the other sports.

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[CalBison97]

I don’t see this happening that soon.

They could replace us? /purple?/

[heffray]

they could replace us? /purple?/

lol... Don't stare directly at it... You'll go blind!!!

[MankatoBison]

lol... Don't stare directly at it... You'll go blind!!!

Why did this make me laugh so hard? lol

[heffray]

Why did this make me laugh so hard? lol

As long as it doesn't make us all start talking about the a move to the FBS, mission accomplished. ;)

[GCWaters]

St. Thomas to DI could come much earlier than expected:

http://www.startribune.com/commissioner-st-thomas-move-to-division-i-looking-very-optimistic-after-key-ncaa-meeting/567271842/

[JMB]

It will be interesting to see what they come up with for a reclassification period.

[El_Chapo]

St Thomas playing St Johns at US Bank Stadium next year.

the 1 article i read said it'll be the last game ever between the 2.

I question that, because if ST Thomas is in Pioneer for Football, couldn't they keep playing St Johns? or is there a rule about a D1 vs a D3 in football?

[TAILG8R]

St Thomas playing St Johns at US Bank Stadium next year.

the 1 article i read said it'll be the last game ever between the 2.

I question that, because if ST Thomas is in Pioneer for Football, couldn't they keep playing St Johns? or is there a rule about a D1 vs a D3 in football?

Maybe St Johns is pulling a UND and refusing to play St Thomas after they move up? Serious question/thought

[El_Chapo]

Maybe St Johns is pulling a UND and refusing to play St Thomas after they move up? Serious question/thought

No, I know that answer. St Johns wants to play. St Thomas just hasnt made a decision and where they are going yet.

[bisonp]

St Thomas playing St Johns at US Bank Stadium next year.

the 1 article i read said it'll be the last game ever between the 2.

I question that, because if ST Thomas is in Pioneer for Football, couldn't they keep playing St Johns? or is there a rule about a D1 vs a D3 in football?

I may be mistaken, but I thought you could only play down one division. So FBS cannot play DII, and FCS cannot play DIII.

But going DI isn't official yet, is it?

[B. b. bison]

I may be mistaken, but I thought you could only play down one division. So FBS cannot play DII, and FCS cannot play DIII.

I'm pretty sure this isn't a rule - I don't think it's that uncommon for the lower end of FCS to play DIII or NAIA teams. E.g. in 2017 Campbell played DIII Methodist from NC (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Campbell_Fighting_Camels_football_team).

[Hammersmith]

I may be mistaken, but I thought you could only play down one division. So FBS cannot play DII, and FCS cannot play DIII.

But going DI isn't official yet, is it?

There's no NCAA rule about who you can/can't play division-wise, but I believe many FBS conferences(especially P5) have internal rules about only playing FBS/FCS.

[tjbison]

I'm pretty sure this isn't a rule - I don't think it's that uncommon for the lower end of FCS to play DIII or NAIA teams. E.g. in 2017 Campbell played DIII Methodist from NC (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Campbell_Fighting_Camels_football_team).

FCS vs NAIA happens all the time

hell didnt SDSU play an NAIA a few years back??

[El_Chapo]

SDSU LOST TO UW LACROSSE
UND LOST TO U SIOUX FALLS

so yes.

[bisonp]

Maybe I'm just thinking of wins that count towards postseason eligibility. A single FCS win counts, while DII would not.

[El_Chapo]

Maybe I'm just thinking of wins that count towards postseason eligibility. A single FCS win counts, while DII would not.

correct...

[IndyBison]

Butler plays D3 and NAIA schools around here and are fairly even. Most Pioneer schools are fairly equivalent to D3 schools because they offer the same financial package.

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[CAS4127]

Maybe St. Thomas can take EWU’s Big Sky spot—> https://www.inlander.com/spokane/ewu-faculty-write-report-suggesting-cuts-to-athletics-budget-or-even-eliminating-it-entirely/Content?oid=19099082


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[HerdBot]

Off topic but St Thomas is doing away with ACT and SAT requirements. May be a smart move in the declining enrollment era. Seems to be a bit dated and limited

https://www.twincities.com/2020/02/21/st-thomas-goes-test-optional-admitting-new-students-without-an-act-score/

[Mr Meaty]

Off topic but St Thomas is doing away with ACT and SAT requirements. May be a smart move in the declining enrollment era. Seems to be a bit dated and limited

https://www.twincities.com/2020/02/21/st-thomas-goes-test-optional-admitting-new-students-without-an-act-score/

This is true for normal students. If you are a student athlete you still have to have one of the standardized tests for NCAA requirements.

[El_Chapo]

https://www.startribune.com/ncaa-meeting-to-consider-st-thomas-request-to-move-to-division-i-still-scheduled-for-april/569263832/

[El_Chapo]

St Thomas getting a NCAA Vote today for D1.

I had Wcco radio and kfan radio both in the cities on this morning... both mentioned it in their sports update....and there was zero talk about it. i was hoping for some residual NDSU/Summit League talk