Time for NDSU Hockey

[Professorbum]

I know there have been other threads on this. I know some people hate the idea. But the landscape for college sports in North Dakota has changed since the last hockey conversation.

Now that UND is going to be in the Summit and MVFC, we've no longer got something that UND doesn't have, and that annoys me. In fact, we helped them achieve those league memberships. So, there should be absolutely no reason why UND would oppose NDSU starting D-1 hockey. We could join the WCHA in 5 minutes and be competitive. Scheels would be perhaps the nicest arena in the league. It would sell out every game.

Of course, any change in athletics would have to be gender neutral, so that means a women's team (most leagues require that anyway for membership). In our budget climate, such a move would also have to be revenue neutral or better. That's the kicker...when I look at hockey programs at schools our size, hockey is a money-maker (and that includes calculating for the net loss of revenue with women's hockey). For example, at St. Cloud State, net expenses for men's and women's hockey combined in 2016 was $3.28 million; net revenue was $3.76 million. At Minnesota-Duluth, they were about $1 million in the black.

If there is a plan at NDSU to go FBS, then I would understand not being distracted by hockey. But with an arena already in place and a potentially very large fan base for D-1 hockey in F-M, I'm at a loss for why we would not consider this.

[BisonTeacher]

Boooooo! Omg so dumb. :facepalm:

[Professorbum]

Boooooo! Omg so dumb. :facepalm:

I don't understand... what's so dumb about it?

[HerdBot]

It's the same decision Gene Taylor made. Either get hockey or go D1 in other sports.

I won't dismiss it like others will.

I think we could actually do well in hockey. It's expensive but it's also a revenue sport. We could never be in the same discussion as UND is in facilities but looking at the talent pool in the Midwest and success some pretty small schools have had, I have no doubt we could be competitive within 10 years.

I think we need to build up basketball before we can have that discussion.

But it would take some big time donors to make it happen.

[PattyBison]

I know there have been other threads on this. I know some people hate the idea. But the landscape for college sports in North Dakota has changed since the last hockey conversation.

Now that UND is going to be in the Summit and MVFC, we've no longer got something that UND doesn't have, and that annoys me. In fact, we helped them achieve those league memberships. So, there should be absolutely no reason why UND would oppose NDSU starting D-1 hockey. We could join the WCHA in 5 minutes and be competitive. Scheels would be perhaps the nicest arena in the league. It would sell out every game.

Of course, any change in athletics would have to be gender neutral, so that means a women's team (most leagues require that anyway for membership). In our budget climate, such a move would also have to be revenue neutral or better. That's the kicker...when I look at hockey programs at schools our size, hockey is a money-maker (and that includes calculating for the net loss of revenue with women's hockey). For example, at St. Cloud State, net expenses for men's and women's hockey combined in 2016 was $3.28 million; net revenue was $3.76 million. At Minnesota-Duluth, they were about $1 million in the black.

If there is a plan at NDSU to go FBS, then I would understand not being distracted by hockey. But with an arena already in place and a potentially very large fan base for D-1 hockey in F-M, I'm at a loss for why we would not consider this.

We have serious budget issues to resolve prior to considering any new sports.

[oldmantutters]

Dr. Phil Johnson was on with Jack Michaels a few months ago and said that NDSU was very close to pulling the trigger back when the decision to go D1 was made. He made it sound like everything was basically a done deal as far as funding. Obviously a lot has changed but Dr. Johnson is pretty plugged into the hockey community, it'd br interesting to find out what happened.

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[unbison]

It was hockey or d1 I think the decision played out very well!

[Professorbum]

We have serious budget issues to resolve prior to considering any new sports.

But I'd bet it would be revenue neutral at worst. Probably make a profit.

Look, I'm an NDSU basketball and football fan in that order. The order will switch to football then basketball if we ever go FBS someday, because I love college football at the highest level. But I'd be a season ticket holder for hockey as well if we had it. I'll bet there's a lot of money and interest from the Fargo-Moorhead community that would flow to NDSU hockey and therefore further drive interest in NDSU generally.

[PattyBison]

But I'd bet it would be revenue neutral at worst. Probably make a profit.

Look, I'm an NDSU basketball and football fan in that order. The order will switch to football then basketball if we ever go FBS someday, because I love college football at the highest level. But I'd be a season ticket holder for hockey as well if we had it. I'll bet there's a lot of money and interest from the Fargo-Moorhead community that would flow to NDSU hockey and therefore further drive interest in NDSU generally.

Personally, I am not convinced of that. There are already people saying they will not continue basketball tickets because of limited resources. So I think some of the hockey crowd may shift from supporting another sport to supporting hockey.

And most people who I know in the area who like hockey, support the Sioux. Some also support NDSU football. But the people I know would stay with Sioux hockey.

Regardless, I see no compelling reason for NDSU to add sports in this climate.

[1998braves64]

Plus being in the wcha is pointless, if you want to help your chances you'd need to be in NCHC with UND.

That said against this. I think the hockey arena attached to the dome was a last gasp for hockey at NDSU. One thing NDSU doesn't do is try to be like UND. I'd rather see them add swimming or tennis or lacrosse if that ever becomes a possibility. These are sponsored by the summit already and would be slightly easier add.

That said don't have the budget to do this without significantly impacting another program for a few years and has the possibility of blowing up in your face if you don't do well within say 7 years...

Let UND have the hockey it suits them.
Sent from Win8 phone on a bullet train from Hillsboro.

[El_Chapo]

HELL NO. if ya want to watch hockey Minnesota Gophers

[56BISON73]

But I'd bet it would be revenue neutral at worst. Probably make a profit.

Look, I'm an NDSU basketball and football fan in that order. The order will switch to football then basketball if we ever go FBS someday, because I love college football at the highest level. But I'd be a season ticket holder for hockey as well if we had it. I'll bet there's a lot of money and interest from the Fargo-Moorhead community that would flow to NDSU hockey and therefore further drive interest in NDSU generally.

Look at what UND spends on hockey. Wheres the money going to come from? Then you have title 9 issues you are going to have match for a womens sport. Wheres that money going to come from? Now look at the current budget restrictions and cuts. It would be political suicide to add lets say mens and womens hockey while job openings arent being filled, people are taking early retirement, department responsibilities are being consolidated etc etc etc.

You know UND just did something similar as a committee actually recommended that they NOT cut any sports and asked for MORE money while they are being directed to cut 1.3 million.

[HerdBot]

Look at what UND spends on hockey. Wheres the money going to come from? Then you have title 9 issues you are going to have match for a womens sport. Wheres that money going to come from? Now look at the current budget restrictions and cuts. It would be political suicide to add lets say mens and womens hockey while job openings arent being filled, people are taking early retirement, department responsibilities are being consolidated etc etc etc.

You know UND just did something similar as a committee actually recommended that they NOT cut any sports and asked for MORE money while they are being directed to cut 1.3 million.

Right now would be like the Vikings asking for a new stadium the year the bridge collapses in Minnesota when they had budget shortfalls

Some day the timing will be right... Just not now

[Bisonator98]

FBS football and increase our coaching salaries in FB and BB also need a IPF and a new FB stadium before adding fricking hockey.

[HerdBot]

FBS football and increase our coaching salaries in FB and BB also need a IPF and a new FB stadium before adding fricking hockey.

I think the biggest thing is to continue to increase budgets in all of our sports.

If we want to be a competitive mid major in basketball , we need to spend like a competitive mid major. That means paying our head coaches closer to a million bucks like they do at UNI and giving them bigger recruiting budgets and resources. Sick of coaches leaving for better opportunities and fans being happy about it.The Shac is nice by the Summit League standards but if we want to really wow recruits, we need to blow them away. One basketball player can make a world of difference. And being in a smaller conference and in a remote part of the country... We need that wow factor. As nice as the Shac is now it's still not going to blow them away. More money needs to go into it.

Same with football. The dome is nice but an IPF will impress them. But if you want to blow them away take it up a notch. Same with our locker rooms. The lockers now are functional. Standard upgrades will be nice but we want blow their minds type awesome. Sick of coaches leaving for money. If we pay big time it will be a career job not a stepping stone.

Once we get to that level we can talk hockey IMO

[BisonTeacher]

I don't understand... what's so dumb about it?

1.Hockey is a financial drain.
2.Addition of title 9 sports.
3.We already have a thread dedicated to this nonsense.
4. Un_ sucks. Let them have this ridiculousness.

[EC8CH]

Canadian Ice Soccer blows!

[HandoEX]

I'd burn my diploma if NDSU ever added hockey.

[BisonAccountant44]

I want nothing to do with this expensive niche sport.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GB5iIX2BBMc

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[AKBison]

1.Hockey is a financial drain.
2.Addition of title 9 sports.
3.We already have a thread dedicated to this nonsense.
4. Un_ sucks. Let them have this ridiculousness.

I believe you meant, Women's Hockey is a financial drain. Consider this, if NDSU football goes FBS, we will have ZERO sports on campus capable of winning a national championship. Let me repeat, NDSU will no longer be able to win a national Championship. That's a tough pill to swallow for an institution and alumni base that is accustomed to it. For that reason alone I hope we look at Hockey someday.

Football at FBS: Boise State type status which would be awesome.
M&W Basketball: Ceiling is probably a Sweet 16
Softball: Ceilling is probably a Super Regional but since we have done that perhaps a College World Series
Wrestling is the one sport where we are likely to see an individual national championship.

Rest of the Olympics? Very unlikely

Lastly, imagine the epic anguish and butthurt from GF if NDSU ever made it to a Frozen Four in a year when UND didn't.

[moosbah]

I believe you meant, Women's Hockey is a financial drain. Consider this, if NDSU football goes FBS, we will have ZERO sports on campus capable of winning a national championship. Let me repeat, NDSU will no longer be able to win a national Championship. That's a tough pill to swallow for an institution and alumni base that is accustomed to it. For that reason alone I hope we look at Hockey someday.

Football at FBS: Boise State type status which would be awesome.
M&W Basketball: Ceiling is probably a Sweet 16
Softball: Ceilling is probably a Super Regional but since we have done that perhaps a College World Series
Wrestling is the one sport where we are likely to see an individual national championship.

Rest of the Olympics? Very unlikely

Lastly, imagine the epic anguish and butthurt from GF if NDSU ever made it to a Frozen Four in a year when UND didn't.

I think it needs to be kept in mind how long it would take to be competitive in hockey in the NCHC. It's a BIG jump in level of play from where they are now. And that's IF the NCHC would take them, as they already shoot down WCHA teams that are jumping off that sinking ship (WCHA will likely dissolve in the near future). If they didn't go NCHC, where would they go to? No one is going to add a program from North Dakota if there aren't other teams nearby to play and college hockey is, as you know, a super niche sport.

That's a lot of huge ifs to address.

[El_Chapo]

I'd burn my diploma if NDSU ever added hockey.

best answer ever. hockey is stupid sport for moronic neanderthals , they actually THINK they are relevant in the world, that everything revolves around hockey. its amazing the stupidity of that,

if you have to watch this niche sport, Minnesota Gophers right over there for ya.

[El_Chapo]

I believe you meant, Women's Hockey is a financial drain. Consider this, if NDSU football goes FBS, we will have ZERO sports on campus capable of winning a national championship. Let me repeat, NDSU will no longer be able to win a national Championship. That's a tough pill to swallow for an institution and alumni base that is accustomed to it. For that reason alone I hope we look at Hockey someday.

Football at FBS: Boise State type status which would be awesome.
M&W Basketball: Ceiling is probably a Sweet 16
Softball: Ceilling is probably a Super Regional but since we have done that perhaps a College World Series
Wrestling is the one sport where we are likely to see an individual national championship.

Rest of the Olympics? Very unlikely

Lastly, imagine the epic anguish and butthurt from GF if NDSU ever made it to a Frozen Four in a year when UND didn't.


Oh so beating out 58 teams that are over 50% D2 and D3 institutions would give you a chubby? oh wow, you beat out Quinnipiac, Union and Ferris State, Mankato, & Bemidji. hahaha.

Do you think Illinois, Rutgers, Arizona fans hate their lives too, they will never win a ncaa football title either will Minnesota, Iowa, Kansas State.

[barnwintersportsengelstad]

But I'd bet it would be revenue neutral at worst. Probably make a profit.

Look, I'm an NDSU basketball and football fan in that order. The order will switch to football then basketball if we ever go FBS someday, because I love college football at the highest level. But I'd be a season ticket holder for hockey as well if we had it. I'll bet there's a lot of money and interest from the Fargo-Moorhead community that would flow to NDSU hockey and therefore further drive interest in NDSU generally.

If NDSU seriously started planning for Div I hockey, the budget crisis would be over by the time your ready. FM area would greatly support Bison Hockey, it should be a money maker, they are 3 times as many homes games than in FB, (FBS is a dream, it would grab every dollar from every other sport, and still not enough $ and any Natty would be unreachable). WCHA is were you get in, very respected conference and someday you would be in same conference as UND. UND would not do anything to harm your start, they have been very supportive of other programs starting Div I hockey. Scheels Arena would be a great home, hope we get to pay in the regional there in 2.5 weeks.

WISH YOU THE BEST, of course till you play the Hawks.

[ndsubison1]

Id rather go FBS

[WhoRepsTheLurker]

Id rather go FBS

I agree. If you’re going to fork out the $$ to add MIH - and something else for W - the overall brand/growth of NDSU is better served by FBS, but I don’t see it happening any time soon.

The G5 knows they're getting hosed by the P5, but their reaction is to try to appear more P5ish. This is why the MWC has eyes for Rice and not NDSU. Rice will never go, IMHO … lateral move.

[Bisonator98]

NDSU's athletic priorities should be:
1. An indoor practice facility
2. Getting all of our programs to the top tier in funding and salaries
3. A new expandable football stadium
4. Move FB to FBS and add womens sports for title IX compliance
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10. Explore adding hockey

Priorities could be changed depending on a sugar daddy leaving NDSU a $100 million or more. :biggrin:

[AKBison]

NDSU's athletic priorities should be:
1. An indoor practice facility
2. Getting all of our programs to the top tier in funding and salaries
3. A new expandable football stadium
4. Move FB to FBS and add womens sports for title IX compliance
5. Build new basketball arena on campus and make the SHAC the home of Volleyball, Women's Basketball, Wrestling, and new gymnastics program that is added to offset FBS scholarships. Big XII would take us in that sport in a heartbeat.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10. Explore adding hockey

Priorities could be changed depending on a sugar daddy leaving NDSU a $100 million or more. :biggrin:

Fixed it for you...

[Bisonator98]

Fixed it for you...

Good, good. That's why I left those blank ones there...;):innocent:

[skolbrother]

I gave up on this years ago, the Non- hockey people are very loud and adamant, though I too believe it wold be a great addition.
I simply enjoy watching hockey and accept not all do, they won, they beat me down.

[NDSUstudent]

I gave up on this years ago, the Non- hockey people are very loud and adamant, though I too believe it wold be a great addition.
I simply enjoy watching hockey and accept not all do, they won, they beat me down.

The problem isn't the non-hockey people, the problem is the financial reality of adding a hockey program. Only way it ever happens is if a big donor or group of donors comes in and makes it happen by removing a lot of risk the school would have to take on.

[Bisonator98]

The problem isn't the non-hockey people, the problem is the financial reality of adding a hockey program. Only way it ever happens is if a big donor or group of donors comes in and makes it happen by removing a lot of risk the school would have to take on.

Exactly, just like when hockey backers were pushing MSUM but couldn't get to the $30M threshold. Or even our own FBS now folks. Lots of people talk big but don't open their checkbooks.

[TransAmBison]

The problem isn't the non-hockey people, the problem is the financial reality of adding a hockey program. Only way it ever happens is if a big donor or group of donors comes in and makes it happen by removing a lot of risk the school would have to take on.This right here. I am not a hockey fan, but I am not against hockey coming to NDSU. I just don't want it to come at the expense of any of our current programs. If funding is there that does not hurt any of our current funding, go for it.

[DORMIE]

I'm not against hockey as I played it at Fargo Central. To add men's hockey, you'll probably have to add women's hockey or lacrosse. SS reported that women's indoor hockey had income of $29,239 and expenses of $1,429,827. Game, set, match.

[AKBison]

I'm not against hockey as I played it at Fargo Central. To add men's hockey, you'll probably have to add women's hockey or lacrosse. SS reported that women's indoor hockey had income of $29,239 and expenses of $1,429,827. Game, set, match.

...Or you could add gymnastics, rowing, or lacrosse at a third of the cost. Besides, in the words of the great Tatanka The UND prez couldn't lead a dog if it was on a leash. I wouldn't exactly use their athletic numbers to make a decision, it's like the blind leading the blind.

[scbison91]

...Or you could add gymnastics, rowing, or lacrosse at a third of the cost. Besides, in the words of the great Tatanka The UND prez couldn't lead a dog if it was on a leash. I wouldn't exactly use their athletic numbers to make a decision, it's like the blind leading the blind. lacrosse would be great.. It is a sport that ESPN actually covers in spring and each year they add more games to telecast and sport is growing fast. I know it isn't big in ND yet but MN is getting big.

[AKBison]

Plus, we already have the facility for it at Dacotah. All it would take is new field turf.

[roadwarrior]

Plus, we already have the facility for it at Dacotah. All it would take is new field turf.

New turf? Already done.

[AKBison]

New turf? Already done.

New turf with soccer and lacrosse markings. Football will have an IPF by then. :)