Brock for Walter Payton!

[90 BISON]

There has been a lot said about how "all Brock does is win" however recently his numbers are starting to look extremely impressive also to match the most important stat wins. 200 yards in the air and 5 TDs against a very good YSU game. It is my belief that he should receive some consideration.

[90 BISON]

Not to mention 2 national titles...

[tjbison]

Not to mention 2 national titles...


how about ncaa record tying 43 wins

[DjKyRo]

Sadly, wins aren't what win these kind of individual awards. One could argue wins aren't an individual stat in the first place. No, it's all Vernon Adams, Terrance West or Jimmy Garropollo at this point.

[NDSUstudent]

Sadly, wins aren't what win these kind of individual awards. One could argue wins aren't an individual stat in the first place. No, it's all Vernon Adams, Terrance West or Jimmy Garropollo at this point.

Agreed, I just really hope Brock is given his due and finishes in the top 5.

[tjbison]

Sadly, wins aren't what win these kind of individual awards. One could argue wins aren't an individual stat in the first place. No, it's all Vernon Adams, Terrance West or Jimmy Garropollo at this point.

oh I know just saying

flashy stats outweight proven long term success which sucks but that's what it is

[GOBISON123]

He is not a "made for TV QB" but I can bet my house when it comes down to the wire he has pretty hot hands.

Also ever since Zach Vraa got back to 100%, him and Brock have become some sort of Dynamic Duo.

[DjKyRo]

oh I know just saying

flashy stats outweight proven long term success which sucks but that's what it is

On the flipside, if you haven't watched Vernon Adams or Jimmy G. play, you should. Those two are flat out amazing quarterbacks and although they play in leagues that don't exactly "do defense," they should both play at the next level and are deserving of accolades at the national level. It's just a pity that what Brock brings to the field doesn't translate fully to the stat columns.

[NDSUstudent]

Terrance West is another guy people need to watch, he is just a beast. Will likely finish the regular season with 30 TDs and close to 2,000 yards rushing.

[EC8CH]

It's just a pity that what Brock brings to the field doesn't translate fully to the stat columns.

Except for the column with the "W" on top.

[DjKyRo]

Except for the column with the "W" on top.

Which, again, not an individual stat.

[reformedUNDfan]

jensen won't win, but he has a solid season on the merit, and will hopefully be a finalist

[1998braves64]

I would vote for Brock as Mr. Consistency (especially this year) but even over the past 4 years he almost always performs at decent stats (minus the 2 games with 3 ints) he has almost always has NDSU in position to win every game... What has been our largest margin of defeat when Brock played?

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[JustinTyem]

I would vote for Brock as Mr. Consistency (especially this year) but even over the past 4 years he almost always performs at decent stats (minus the 2 games with 3 ints) he has almost always has NDSU in position to win every game... What has been our largest margin of defeat when Brock played?

Sent from my HTC8x Windows Phone.The Largest loss margin was as a freshman,in his second start against Western Illinois (Homecoming) 28-16. Ootherwise a OT lost to EWU was 7pts,and the other loses are 3pt margins. That's impressive!!!!!

[Mayville Bison]

On the flipside, if you haven't watched Vernon Adams or Jimmy G. play, you should. Those two are flat out amazing quarterbacks and although they play in leagues that don't exactly "do defense," they should both play at the next level and are deserving of accolades at the national level. It's just a pity that what Brock brings to the field doesn't translate fully to the stat columns.

You have to wonder how those two would play if they had to play in the MVFC. Or how would Brock do playing in the OVC? Would Brock's name be in place of Jimmy G right now?

This is where it's a pity there won't be 4 teams from the MVFC in the playoffs to show these flashy offenses that they would be 2nd/3rd tier in the MVFC (I say 3rd tier because everyone is 2nd tier to NDSU right now).

[CAS4127]

IMO. I think Brock has a legit shot at winning this award. As I read things, it's not ALL about individual stats.

We'll see soon enough!

[1998braves64]

In my opinion look at his career statistics is a lot more impressive than each individual season. He consistently puts up good/great numbers he will be the top of most if not all NDSU QB stats granted with help of an additional season of playoff games, to think anyone would have brought down walkers passing records, 2 years ago we all probably would said definitely not Jensen... To me in his senior year... Past years combined should make a difference. Whether they will is a different story.

Again if we win chipper I will not care about Payton award.

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[NDSU '96]

After looking through the season stats of every winner, Brock's numbers just don't fit. It would require the voters to disregard this as a season award and give it as a career accomplishment. Not impossible, but seems unlikely enough voters would do that in order for him to win.

[coloradobison]

I would assume that Brock is more interested in #3 than the Walter Payton award.

[CAS4127]

After looking through the season stats of every winner, Brock's numbers just don't fit. It would require the voters to disregard this as a season award and give it as a career accomplishment. Not impossible, but seems unlikely enough voters would do that in order for him to win.

The award goes to "The Most Outstanding Player" in FCS. To me, that is pretty broad and not necessarily focused specifically on season stats. For example, is there another player in the country that ANY FCS team would want in control with 80 yards to go with ~ 8 minutes left on the clock against the 2012 Big 12 Champs? Ask GSU players and coaches that question.

IOW, it doesn't say the award goes to the guy who puts up the most yards/TD's. If our SI department does this right, I think he could very well get the award, and I don't think anyone could really bitch.

[1st&TennBison]

The award goes to "The Most Outstanding Player" in FCS. To me, that is pretty broad and not necessarily focused specifically on season stats. For example, is there another player in the country that ANY FCS team would want in control with 80 yards to go with ~ 8 minutes left on the clock against the 2012 Big 12 Champs? Ask GSU players and coaches that question.

IOW, it doesn't say the award goes to the guy who puts up the most yards/TD's. If our SI department does this right, I think he could very well get the award, and I don't think anyone could really bitch.
Trying out my first post under my new name.
How could he not be considered one of if not the top candidate for the award. Look at what he has done and the record for most QB wins he is about to break. Brock is NDSU football at its finest. The guy is ice on the field and never get rattled, you just know that as long as he is out there the Bison will always have the chance to win. True his stats are not the big passing and TD numbers usually associated with MVP type award winners. But how about for once we see someone win this award because of what they bring to the game/team, the guy just goes out there and gets it done, on and off the field he is a credit to college football and to the community.

[1st&TennBison]

In my opinion look at his career statistics is a lot more impressive than each individual season. He consistently puts up good/great numbers he will be the top of most if not all NDSU QB stats granted with help of an additional season of playoff games, to think anyone would have brought down walkers passing records, 2 years ago we all probably would said definitely not Jensen... To me in his senior year... Past years combined should make a difference. Whether they will is a different story.

Again if we win chipper I will not care about Payton award.

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I don't think Jensen cares about winning the award either, never seems to come across as the kind of guy that wants personal accolades, and that goes for anyone else on the team as well, they are all team first guys. And that is why it would be so great to see him win it, he is not expecting it or asking for it.

[BisonNeil]

The award goes to "The Most Outstanding Player" in FCS. To me, that is pretty broad and not necessarily focused specifically on season stats. For example, is there another player in the country that ANY FCS team would want in control with 80 yards to go with ~ 8 minutes left on the clock against the 2012 Big 12 Champs? Ask GSU players and coaches that question.

IOW, it doesn't say the award goes to the guy who puts up the most yards/TD's. If our SI department does this right, I think he could very well get the award, and I don't think anyone could really bitch.

I posted this under another thread, but it is more relevant here, especially considering what you just posted..

For whatever reason, I have always regarded the Payton and Buchanan awards as "consolation" prizes for the best players who don't or won't win a national championship. I don't know why I have thought that, but that has always been my impression. So, I decided to check into it.

Since 1987 when the Walter Payton award was first presented only four players from the national championship team in that year won the award; Michael Payton QB, Marshall, 1992; Dave Dickenson QB, Montana, 1995; Adrian Peterson RB, Geo Southern, 1999; Armanti Edwards QB, Appy State, 2008. So, 4 times out of 26 yrs, or 15% of the time. More frequently than I thought.

BTW, even less common for Buck Buchanan award to go to player on national championship team. J.C. Sherritt from EWU won it in 2010. Only 5% of the time has a player from the champion won this award, so rare.

I think it is a shame that a dominant team like NDSU will have no winners of any of these awards, other than Bohl getting the Eddie Robinson award last year, during this stretch run. While I think Brock is deserving of the Walther Payton award, during this three year stretch it has been the defense that has dominated and, quite frankly, done more to win the natty's than the offense or anyone on it, and no one has even sniffed the Buchanan award. MWill should have gotten it last year, IMO. This year, with Grant out, he has no chance, and MWills year has been statistically not even close to his previous two, so he has no chance.

Bummer, but my guess is no one on the team will care as long as they get a third ring.

[CAS4127]

I posted this under another thread, but it is more relevant here, especially considering what you just posted..

For whatever reason, I have always regarded the Payton and Buchanan awards as "consolation" prizes for the best players who don't or won't win a national championship. I don't know why I have thought that, but that has always been my impression. So, I decided to check into it.

Since 1987 when the Walter Payton award was first presented only four players from the national championship team in that year won the award; Michael Payton QB, Marshall, 1992; Dave Dickenson QB, Montana, 1995; Adrian Peterson RB, Geo Southern, 1999; Armanti Edwards QB, Appy State, 2008. So, 4 times out of 26 yrs, or 15% of the time. More frequently than I thought.

BTW, even less common for Buck Buchanan award to go to player on national championship team. J.C. Sherritt from EWU won it in 2010. Only 5% of the time has a player from the champion won this award, so rare.

I think it is a shame that a dominant team like NDSU will have no winners of any of these awards, other than Bohl getting the Eddie Robinson award last year, during this stretch run. While I think Brock is deserving of the Walther Payton award, during this three year stretch it has been the defense that has dominated and, quite frankly, done more to win the natty's than the offense or anyone on it, and no one has even sniffed the Buchanan award. MWill should have gotten it last year, IMO. This year, with Grant out, he has no chance, and MWills year has been statistically not even close to his previous two, so he has no chance.

Bummer, but my guess is no one on the team will care as long as they get a third ring.

Ya, what you are saying is difficult to dispute, but it certainly doesn't rule Brock out of the equation and, as I like to say, just because things have always been done a certain way does not mean they are being done correctly.

Like I said, our SI Department had better be doing it's job. There are many ways to pimp a QB beyond just yards and TD's.

Also, I agee with you and others that Brock probably has not given this much thought, and is focused on a 3-peat!!

[1998braves64]

But then others who have won it with some outstanding parts to their team also, Brock still had to put up his stats even if defense got him back the ball on a three and out. I dislike people using that argument to somewhere cheapen Brock's accomplishment. They both helped each other all as one team.

Personally what other player has done what Brock has done this year or last 4 years...

I get the reality of going with the gaudy numbers... But if voters dig into Brock's history they will get on bandwagon and that is up to SI to direct them to those items.

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[td577]

Ya, what you are saying is difficult to dispute, but it certainly doesn't rule Brock out of the equation and, as I like to say, just because things have always been done a certain way does not mean they are being done correctly.

Like I said, our SI Department had better be doing it's job. There are many ways to pimp a QB beyond just yards and TD's.

Also, I agee with you and others that Brock probably has not given this much thought, and is focused on a 3-peat!!

I think if the Bison sucked at rushing the ball or concentrated on passing, Brock and his receiving corp could be putting up 350 a game. I also think either Ojuri or Crockett could easily be 1500-1800 yard rushers on their own, as well. This is a balanced team with the emphasis on the left hand column and not the box score. I do also think if voters were to consider Championships and some intangible factors in the Most Outstanding category, like the Payton Award, the Bison players would split those votes anyways. In fact, the most consistent outstanding play throughout this season has been the offensive line. They are the most outstanding players first. Then when you look at the skilled positions, Vraa really stepped up this year. Smith, Ojuri, Crockett, and co. were just being their most outstanding selves. Jensen has done everything the coaching staff has asked him to. He runs this offense to almost perfection but when you break it down, it really is so much a sum of its parts.

That all being said, if there is a push for a Bison to be named the Payton Award winner, Jensen is a very good candidate. The fact that he probably won't win it and perhaps walk away from FCS with a three peat, incredibly sums up how to put a team first collection of young men together knowing they could of had those individual accolades anywhere else. Lastly, when it is all said and done, regardless of the ridiculous numbers they could of had individually, NDSU will still have more than its fair share getting invites to the next level. For example, during the off-season Ojuri, like McNorton was, will be in somebody's camp.

[SoCalBison]

What Brock brings to his future NFL employers is the ability to read defenses accurately, to adjust, to manage the clock, and to win. With the improved accuracy he's showing this season, I think he'll get a legitimate shot at the next level. As others have pointed out, he has a lot of tools in the box to work with--just as most NFL teams have great receivers and running backs. Brock has shown the ability to know when to use which weapons.

This award isn't the be-all or end-all. Let's win the 3rd straight title, then get this guy into the NFL. Over and out.

[natstar1]

Just so I'm clear, but this is just a season award, correct?

[1998braves64]

The Walter Payton Award is awarded annually to the most outstanding offensive player in the Division I Football Championship Subdivision (formerly Division I-AA) of college football as chosen by a nationwide panel of media and college sports information directors.[1] The honor was first given in 1987 to the outstanding player in the division, but in 1995, eligibility was restricted to offensive players, as the Buck Buchanan Award for defensive players was inaugurated.

It says annual so you could argue that it is seasonal... Not sure what the official definition is that is given to voters but is probably a bit more defined.

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[CAS4127]

It says annual so you could argue that it is seasonal... Not sure what the official definition is that is given to voters but is probably a bit more defined.

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Annual:-->That just means it's given out each year.


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[1998braves64]

Annual:-->That just means it's given out each year.


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Yup thanks Captain Obvious! :biggrin:

Point was some may construe that to mean they only look at this season and not past seasons. I don't read it that way...





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[mhyer63]

Yup thanks Captain Obvious! :biggrin:

Point was some may construe that to mean they only look at this season and not past seasons. I don't read it that way...





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Was CAS ever a team captain?

[CAS4127]

Was CAS ever a team captain?

Yes.

RTO is a pussy!


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[runtheoption]

Yes.

RTO is a pussy!

I would hit you with my purse, but I don't want you to fall over and break a hip, you old bastage.

[westnodak93bison]

Would be funny if Brock insisted that Grant be allowed to give the acceptance speech and have GO go into a 5 minute explanation of Bison Pride.

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[gotts]

This thread title sounds like a horrible trade. Walter Payton is dead, you guys.

[X-Factor]

I would vote for Brock as Mr. Consistency (especially this year) but even over the past 4 years he almost always performs at decent stats (minus the 2 games with 3 ints) he has almost always has NDSU in position to win every game... What has been our largest margin of defeat when Brock played?

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The TEAM is Mr. Consistency. Brock is a great player, but give me a break here. Brock for Payton is going WAY too far.

People are attributing WAY too much of our winning play to the QB.

Olson, Littlejohn, Vraa,Smith,Heagle,Williams,Grothman,LeCompte,Jirik ,Drevlow and all the other guys that bust their ass every day has just as much to do with it.

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[Mayville Bison]

The TEAM is Mr. Consistency. Brock is a great player, but give me a break here. Brock for Payton is going WAY too far.

People are attributing WAY too much of our winning play to the QB.

Olson, Littlejohn, Vraa,Smith,Heagle,Williams,Grothman,LeCompte,Jirik ,Drevlow and all the other guys that bust their ass every day has just as much to do with it.

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The team concept is exactly why he won't win it but should be considered. How would Brock's numbers look if we played in the Big Sky (and our defense was terrible leading to more possessions) or the Ohio Valley (and ran up the score in the second half)?

I know that's a lot of "what ifs", but the voters need to see there is so much more to the "Most Outstanding Offensive Player" than just stats.

[1998braves64]

People are attributing WAY too much of our winning play to the QB.


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Ask Green Bay how well winning works with just a QB missing or on flip side How about Vikings if someone was just a few hairs better how would this season be looking?

Again yes defense and offense has all been consistent not disputing that but good grief even kolpack and Dom say if Bison win chipper that Brock is definitely in conversation/argument as THE greatest QB to play for Bison (per their seniors blog post) , this is very likely to happen.

So to discount Brock's personal stats achievement as a team effort (esp defense) is ridiculous. He threw all those passes and ran those yards and TDs sure wasn't Grant, Williams et al. Doing it for him right!?

The team GAVE him the opportunity and HE delivered and that is what Payton is about... It's the same argument for all the candidates.


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[NDSUstudent]

Too bad our OL can't win the Payton.

[steelbison]

The TEAM is Mr. Consistency. Brock is a great player, but give me a break here. Brock for Payton is going WAY too far.

People are attributing WAY too much of our winning play to the QB.

Olson, Littlejohn, Vraa,Smith,Heagle,Williams,Grothman,LeCompte,Jirik ,Drevlow and all the other guys that bust their ass every day has just as much to do with it.

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Careful what you wish for. Go back a few years. WE had a very talented team except one postion QB that team finished 6-5.....You are so underselling Brock...

What would Brock's numbers look like if we threw 40 plus times a game....He is having a GREAT year. He absolutely deserves consideration for this award!!!! Sorry you don't see it that way

[90 BISON]

5 TDs vs. Youngstown State is pretty impressive in my opinion. He has broken multiple NDSU records already this year including passing TDs and total TDs.

Stats for the year according to http://www.gobison.com/custompages/fb/2013/teamcume.htm:
149 of 222 passing for 1846 yards for 24 TDs and 5 interceptions
69 rushes for 249 yards for 5 TDs.

2095 total yards for 29 TDs, really are pretty good stats, while leading the number 1 team in the country to an undefeated that is awesome in my completely unbiased book.

[natstar1]

The team concept is exactly why he won't win it but should be considered. How would Brock's numbers look if we played in the Big Sky (and our defense was terrible leading to more possessions) or the Ohio Valley (and ran up the score in the second half)?

I know that's a lot of "what ifs", but the voters need to see there is so much more to the "Most Outstanding Offensive Player" than just stats.
So how do his stats that don't depend on a lot of throwing attempts compare to the other good QBs in FCS. Stats like passing efficiency, completion percentage, yards per attempt, etc. He should be killing in those stats.

[90 BISON]

So how do his stats that don't depend on a lot of throwing attempts compare to the other good QBs in FCS. Stats like passing efficiency, completion percentage, yards per attempt, etc. He should be killing in those stats.

67.1% completion, 209.5 yards/ game, and 168.14 passing efficiency.

[1st&TennBison]

67.1% completion, 209.5 yards/ game, and 168.14 passing efficiency.
ohhhhhhhhh smack!

[coulanon]

Really is eerie how many similarities there are between the two #1's...

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/sports-illustrated-asks-time-consider-aj-mccarron-one-221352675--ncaaf.html

[natstar1]

So how do his stats that don't depend on a lot of throwing attempts compare to the other good QBs in FCS. Stats like passing efficiency, completion percentage, yards per attempt, etc. He should be killing in those stats.


67.1% completion, 209.5 yards/ game, and 168.14 passing efficiency.
Well you compared him to nobody so that proves nothing.

When comparing him to the other 8 QBs that were nominated Jensen was 4th efficiency, 5th in completion percentage, and 6th in yards per attempt.

[JustinTyem]

67.1% completion, 209.5 yards/ game, and 168.14 passing efficiency.AJ McCarron Ala 10 162.2 261 177 67.8 2228 222.8 8.5 21 5

[Bisonfan1]

5 TDs vs. Youngstown State is pretty impressive in my opinion. He has broken multiple NDSU records already this year including passing TDs and total TDs.

Stats for the year according to http://www.gobison.com/custompages/fb/2013/teamcume.htm:
149 of 222 passing for 1846 yards for 24 TDs and 5 interceptions
69 rushes for 249 yards for 5 TDs.

2095 total yards for 29 TDs, really are pretty good stats, while leading the number 1 team in the country to an undefeated that is awesome in my completely unbiased book.


Not bad at all in a run it down your throat first offense. I would certainly hope the commitee takes alot of things into consideration, It would be too easy to pick every year going by stats alone. Leadership, confidence, take command of huddle, control the game, cool under pressure, community involvement, and an outstanding young man on the short list here should put Brock in the running. This award would be a compliment to the entire team, not just Brock. GO BISON

[NDSU '96]

Here's the numbers for another dual threat QB that won this award in '08 and '09, Armanti Edwards. This award is a numbers game folks.


Season Passing Rushing
GP GS Rating Comp Att % Yards TD INT Att Yards Avg TD
2008 13 13 170.20 196 306 64.1 2,902 30 9 193 941 4.9 11
2009 12 12 147.90 257 378 68.0 3,291 12 7 137 679 5.0 18

[Mayville Bison]

So how do his stats that don't depend on a lot of throwing attempts compare to the other good QBs in FCS. Stats like passing efficiency, completion percentage, yards per attempt, etc. He should be killing in those stats.

You are missing part of my point though. But, here's the answer to your questions for the big 3 I was referring to. Adams is out there on his own while Jensen and Garoppolo are pretty similar, but Adams comes back to earth a little by throwing more Ints/attempt than the other two.

Completion %
Adams - 67.4%
Jensen - 67.1%
Garoppolo - 65.9%

Y/A
Adams - 10.7
Garoppolo - 9.0
Jensen - 8.3

Efficiency
Adams - 191.4
Garoppolo - 169
Jensen - 167.9

Now to get back to my point, comparing stats (any stats) when the 3 conferences are so vastly different is almost impossible. I honestly hope SDSU and UNI are the two other teams from the MVFC that make the playoffs and get matched up in round 2 with these two teams just to see how these QBs do against a real defense that Jensen has to play week in week out. Granted, Brock didn't have great statistical games verses those two programs either, but that's kinda my point. If Brock was playing in a league where there was no defense being played (Big Sky) or in the OVC (if that league gets 3 teams in the playoffs, they will be exposed for what they really are), how would his numbers compare?

I get that Brock is probably not going to win this award and I'm ok with that. All I'm asking is for the voters to look at more than just raw stats.

[Herd12]

I totally agree. While Brock is a great player and potentially a winner like no one this program has ever seen before, he is not going to win this award. I'm not even saying he's not deserving of winning the award. The simple fact of the matter is that the offense is not designed around Brock Jensen. He is an unbelievably effective operator of it, but he is in no way "featured". He simply does what he and Coach Vigen believe to be the best way to beat the opponent, whether that is handing the ball off 35 times, running the ball 12 times, or throwing it 30 times. He does what is asked of him within the structure of the offense. Doing that doesn't win you the Walter Payton.

[1998braves64]

I totally agree. While Brock is a great player and potentially a winner like no one this program has ever seen before, he is not going to win this award. I'm not even saying he's not deserving of winning the award. The simple fact of the matter is that the offense is not designed around Brock Jensen. He is an unbelievably effective operator of it, but he is in no way "featured". He simply does what he and Coach Vigen believe to be the best way to beat the opponent, whether that is handing the ball off 35 times, running the ball 12 times, or throwing it 30 times. He does what is asked of him within the structure of the offense. Doing that doesn't win you the Walter Payton.

Which is why he should win the award, because all he has done the past 4 years is win and win some more (the most important stat of all which he holds a huge advantage over any of the other candidates) and didn't have to put up insane numbers in order for the Bison to win. But the numbers he did put up are "impressive" in most peoples books. Top of the chart, #1 across the board no, but definitely top 5-10 (nationally speaking). Your argument you put out is my argument as to why he should get the award. It's "outstanding offensive player" not "who threw the most yards and ran the most yards and had the most TDs, the fewest INTs and had the highest completion percentage and highest efficiency rating" (since it would be pretty unlikely for anyone to lead all those categories)

[Herd12]

Which is why he should win the award, because all he has done the past 4 years is win and win some more (the most important stat of all which he holds a huge advantage over any of the other candidates) and didn't have to put up insane numbers in order for the Bison to win. But the numbers he did put up are "impressive" in most peoples books. Top of the chart, #1 across the board no, but definitely top 5-10 (nationally speaking). Your argument you put out is my argument as to why he should get the award. It's "outstanding offensive player" not "who threw the most yards and ran the most yards and had the most TDs, the fewest INTs and had the highest completion percentage and highest efficiency rating" (since it would be pretty unlikely for anyone to lead all those categories)

My argument doesn't even disagree with your argument. I'm just telling you that he's not going to win it. I'm not saying that the fact that he's not going to win it is right, or fair.

[td577]

My argument doesn't even disagree with your argument. I'm just telling you that he's not going to win it. I'm not saying that the fact that he's not going to win it is right, or fair.

You are absolutely correct. Just because something isn't right nor fair, doesn't mean it won't happen that way. First of all, while it will be difficult to argue Brock's worth to any Bison fan, we aren't going to get any say in the process. The voters will do what voters do. They love the gaudy stats, even if they aren't really the most outstanding player. Secondly, I think there could be arguments about who is the most outstanding offensive player for just the Bison. While an OT will not win any outstanding offensive player award unless it is designated an award for a lineman, Turner might be having one of the most outstanding seasons of any LT in the history of FCS. I am not saying that because I am a Bison fan, just look how he grades out every week. The level he is playing at is beyond phenomenal. He is just one example. Vraa has been lights out this year. Smith has been Smith which is a game changer every time he is on the field. Ojuri and Crockett have been extremely lethal. Just when you think there isn't enough weapons, the TEs start gaining momentum every week.

Brock has run this offense to nearly perfection all year, but he is just a part of the offense. Sure he might be one of the most important parts, but a part nonetheless. The same can be said for a handful of other guys in the offense. Who really is the most outstanding offensive player on this team alone? I like to think it is a sum of its parts.

[CAS4127]

If the "It" factor was one of the criteria, Brock wins hands down. Again, SI department should be working overtime on this!!


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[BisonNeil]

Y'all should read this weeks SI magazine.

The cover has AJ McCarron on the cover and a nice story about him. Every single argument you all are making here for why Jensen should win the Walter Payton award is made in that article for why AJ should win the Heisman, except the argument is being made by guys like Joe Namath, Nick Saban and a dozen other famous people. On the flip side, the reasons why he won't and the perceptions about his role in the offense are exactly what is also stated here.

So, Brock is in some pretty good company.

[1998braves64]

Which goes back to the SI dept doing their job of pimping their guy to the voters, as CAS has so elaborately stated many times! :) Anybody that knows anything about FCS football should have Brock on their radar and at least taken the opportunity to see what he's about.

As I said before it isn't going to break my heart if he doesn't win it, I understand it's up to the voters and how much effort they want to put into researching the players. There just seems to be a few on here that say he doesn't have whatever it is needed to win it, which is what I disagree with.

[Ndsu84]

Brock was really great yesterday. If he keeps playing like that we destroy everyone! I just watched the segment with coach Bohl's parents, and really enjoyed that. Especially let the fullback run!

[JMB]

Saw this, not sure where it belongs, but it relates to Brock.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2013/11/24/go-figure-connecticut-yawin-smallwood-north-carolina-ryan-switzer-oklahoma-state-jeremy-langford-michigan-state/3690901/

[coloradobison]

Brock named one of 20 finalists for the Walter Payton award.

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2013/11/25/twenty-named-walter-payton-award-finalists/

[90 BISON]

So your saying there is a chance?

[56BISON73]

Its nice that he made the list!

[westnodak93bison]

We have several offensive players that could be serious candidates if we chose to focus on their offensive stats. Brock, Sam, Crockett, Ryan and Zach IMHO.

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[Professor Chaos]

If #22.5 Johnuel Crockjuri was a real player he'd have 304 carries for 1935 yards (6.4 ypc) with 15 TDs and would be on the list of Payton finalists as well. :innocent:

[Kermit]

If #22.5 Johnuel Crockjuri was a real player he'd have 304 carries for 1935 yards (6.4 ypc) with 15 TDs and would be on the list of Payton finalists as well. :innocent:

Your man would never win. Samjohn Ojurkett has the same stats and a more memorable name. ;)

[DjKyRo]

Your man would never win. Samjohn Ojurkett has the same stats and a more memorable name. ;)

"ojurkett"

http://i.imgur.com/hNmRp8A.jpg

[Professor Chaos]

Your man would never win. Samjohn Ojurkett has the same stats and a more memorable name. ;)
I see your point but the debate would certainly be epic.

[cbline]

Brock named one of 20 finalists for the Walter Payton award.

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2013/11/25/twenty-named-walter-payton-award-finalists/

My gut tells me that this is going nowhere for Brock. Voters like flash, and all Brock does is win, win, win by managing games and being a quiet leader. My money is on someone with more gaudy stats this year. That said, I would take Brock as our guy 24/7!

[BISON Thunder]

My gut tells me that this is going nowhere for Brock. Voters like flash, and all Brock does is win, win, win by managing games and being a quiet leader. My money is on someone with more gaudy stats this year. That said, I would take Brock as our guy 24/7!

"The team, the team, the team."

[NDSUBowler]

I love Brock but if I had a vote, I would still vote for Garoppolo.

I also chuckle at those that think Brock should get a shot in the NFL (I think I saw one reference in this thread??). McCarron is hardly going to get a shot...tough break for 'one of the best ever' (also makes me chuckle).

I'm a huge fan of everything NDSU but lets take off the Green and Yellow glasses here...

[westnodak93bison]

I love Brock but if I had a vote, I would still vote for Garoppolo.

I also chuckle at those that think Brock should get a shot in the NFL (I think I saw one reference in this thread??). McCarron is hardly going to get a shot...tough break for 'one of the best ever' (also makes me chuckle).

I'm a huge fan of everything NDSU but lets take off the Green and Yellow glasses here...

Yeah, why give Brock a chance. Better to risk millions on a Ryan Leaf, Jamarcus Russell and a whole host of other trouble makers.

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[NDSUBowler]

Yeah, why give Brock a chance. Better to risk millions on a Ryan Leaf, Jamarcus Russell and a whole host of other trouble makers.

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If only 'being a good person' or 'will to win' outweighed physical talent, amirite?

I mean, sure, I hope he gets a tryout with an NFL team and maybe gets a shot somewhere. I truly do hope that! But the rankings I have seen on him are in the mid 30s or unranked (since most only go to around 30). CBS has him at 35 (with potentially 19 being drafted). These same sites have Garoppolo anywhere from 8-15, so we can't use the excuse of 'oh FCS just doesn't get coverage'.

Regardless, I'm just speaking the truth.

In my perfect world, every great NDSU player will get a shot at the NFL so the world can see what continued success NDSU players can have in the NFL.

[Professor Chaos]

I love Brock but if I had a vote, I would still vote for Garoppolo.

I also chuckle at those that think Brock should get a shot in the NFL (I think I saw one reference in this thread??). McCarron is hardly going to get a shot...tough break for 'one of the best ever' (also makes me chuckle).

I'm a huge fan of everything NDSU but lets take off the Green and Yellow glasses here...
AJ McCarron is projected in some places as a 1st round pick and pretty much everywhere as a 1st-3rd round pick. He'll definitely get a shot. I don't think there's even a chance that Brock gets drafted, not sure if anyone else has claimed that either, but there's are a lot of college players who don't get drafted who are signed as undrafted free agents or given a rookie camp invite. I think Brock will get a rookie camp invite at least if he wants one but he'll face a very steep climb to be in consideration to make an NFL roster.

[NDSUBowler]

I agree with that. I think some team will take a flier out on Brock to see what he's got.

Well, I don't agree McCarron is a 1st. I'd be willing to bet a lot of money he isn't a 1st. He is likely a 3rd, but that is when the 8th-12th ranked QBs usually go. Only 3 for sure 1sts this year in my opinion and MAYBE 1-2 can sneak in.

/thread drift

[Hammerhead]

During the Green Bay game, the announcers seemed to think that Scott Tolzien's height (or lack of height) at 6' 2" was a drawback in the NFL and Brock is listed at 6' 3".

[natstar1]

During the Green Bay game, the announcers seemed to think that Scott Tolzien's height (or lack of height) at 6' 2" was a drawback in the NFL and Brock is listed at 6' 3".
John Lynch brought up how many balls Tolzien through that were batted down so I tried to come up for a reason so he brought up his height, but I think 6'2" is plenty tall for an NFL QB.

[BisonNation11]

Doug Flutie, Drew Brees, Russell Wilson, Brett Favre are all QB's that are 6'2" and under...

[tjbison]

Walter Payton AWARD or not

Brock is a NDSU legend, will be in the HOF, and go down as probably the best in NDSU history due to his total years of play, and just flat out winning the damn games he was asked to win cough cough.....GSU 2011 with the FLU

[bisonaudit]

If only 'being a good person' or 'will to win' outweighed physical talent, amirite?

I mean, sure, I hope he gets a tryout with an NFL team and maybe gets a shot somewhere. I truly do hope that! But the rankings I have seen on him are in the mid 30s or unranked (since most only go to around 30). CBS has him at 35 (with potentially 19 being drafted). These same sites have Garoppolo anywhere from 8-15, so we can't use the excuse of 'oh FCS just doesn't get coverage'.

Regardless, I'm just speaking the truth.

In my perfect world, every great NDSU player will get a shot at the NFL so the world can see what continued success NDSU players can have in the NFL.

'Being a good person' got Tim Tebow drafted in the first round.

[JustinTyem]

Aaron Rodgers and Brock Jensen are the same in height at just over 6'2,and weighing in at 225lb................ Also,Rodgers didn't get a big school scholly until he went to Butte,JC. So whats better as a freshmen in college,getting a Full ride right out of highschool or going to JC??? Next !!!!!!!

[NDSUBowler]

'Being a good person' got Tim Tebow drafted in the first round.
And look how that turned out!

And he was the goodest of the good!

If only being nice made up for hitches in his throw.

[natstar1]

'Being a good person' got Tim Tebow drafted in the first round.
Being arguably the greatest college football player ever didn't hurt either.

[westnodak93bison]

Being arguably the greatest college football player ever didn't hurt either.

Yeah, about 3 people actually thought Tebow could play QB in the NFL and I think they all got fired.

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[NorthernBison]

Aaron Rodgers and Brock Jensen are the same in height at just over 6'2,and weighing in at 225lb................ Also,Rodgers didn't get a big school scholly until he went to Butte,JC. So whats better as a freshmen in college,getting a Full ride right out of highschool or going to JC??? Next !!!!!!!

I don't know. It seemed to work for Peyton Manning. What was your point?

Height? Full ride out of HS? Brock's the next Aaron Rodgers? There is some Wisconsin connection?

[90 BISON]

The reason Jensen should win the Walter Payton award is the same reason why AJ MCCarron should win the Heisman, because all he does is win...national titles!

The qualification is most valuable offensive player, setting your team up to win titles is about as valuable of a player as you can possibly be right? Who wants a quarterback that is statistically great yet does not find ways to win?

[NDSU '96]

The reason Jensen should win the Walter Payton award is the same reason why AJ MCCarron should win the Heisman, because all he does is win...national titles!

The qualification is most valuable offensive player, setting your team up to win titles is about as valuable of a player as you can possibly be right? Who wants a quarterback that is statistically great yet does not find ways to win?Ok. I'll bite.

Why should wins, or any other season's stats for that matter, be taken into consideration for this year's award? If Brock's wins should be used, shouldn't that apply to Garappolo's stats as well?

[bison_by_blood]

If only 'being a good person' or 'will to win' outweighed physical talent, amirite?

I mean, sure, I hope he gets a tryout with an NFL team and maybe gets a shot somewhere. I truly do hope that! But the rankings I have seen on him are in the mid 30s or unranked (since most only go to around 30). CBS has him at 35 (with potentially 19 being drafted). These same sites have Garoppolo anywhere from 8-15, so we can't use the excuse of 'oh FCS just doesn't get coverage'.

Regardless, I'm just speaking the truth.

In my perfect world, every great NDSU player will get a shot at the NFL so the world can see what continued success NDSU players can have in the NFL.

And about another 20 or so that are UFA's. Making it more likely than not that he gets a shot at least. For comparison Matt Brown at ISU was a UFA last year. Brock might not be the pure passer Brown was, but I would say he has better intangibles and measurables.

[bison_by_blood]

FWIW Craig Haley at Sports Network doesn't have Brock in his top 5. Worse not to have Bohl in top 5 for the Eddie Robinson, but I ar suppose that is just because he won it last year and they are spreading the love.

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

[Mayville Bison]

FWIW Craig Haley at Sports Network doesn't have Brock in his top 5. Worse not to have Bohl in top 5 for the Eddie Robinson, but I ar suppose that is just because he won it last year and they are spreading the love.

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

Kind of ironic he placed that right below the "J" letter showing how great Brock is.....

[G_Funky]

The reason Jensen should win the Walter Payton award is the same reason why AJ MCCarron should win the Heisman, because all he does is win...national titles!

The qualification is most valuable offensive player, setting your team up to win titles is about as valuable of a player as you can possibly be right? Who wants a quarterback that is statistically great yet does not find ways to win?

Garappolo puts up monster stats AND his team is the number 2 seed

[90 BISON]

Garappolo puts up monster stats AND his team is the number 2 seed

Yeah good point, but Jensen should be in the conversation in my opinion. I have no problem with Garappolo winning the Payton as long as Jensen gets consideration. I agree that Garappolo has way better stats, but why not give Brock a little love for winning and being a clutch player.

[Thomas96]

Yeah good point, but Jensen should be in the conversation in my opinion. I have no problem with Garappolo winning the Payton as long as Jensen gets consideration. I agree that Garappolo has way better stats, but why not give Brock a little love for winning and being a clutch player.

Agree. Unfortunately Brock plats on the #1 team in the nation.

[bri-dog]

Looks like 4th place...

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

[Mayville Bison]

Looks like 4th place...

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

Can't really argue with anything there. West will probably come in with around 250-300 votes and the two QBs will have 1100 votes to split between the two. I see it being 650-350 in favor of Jimmy G.

I'd prefer West wins it, but those gaudy numbers by the two QBs will garner the most votes. And all the no-defense leagues celebrate!!!

[aces1180]

Unfortunately, Brock didn't make the Top 3...

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

[StL Bison Fan]

How many times has a player that is playing in the championship game won?

[BisonNation11]

Unfortunately, Brock didn't make the Top 3...

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/writers/infcshuddle/index.htm

Brock will be busy studying film that week anyway to be bothered with some nonsensical little award ceremony anyway.

[civilguy]

Just one more thing to motivate Brock! Wins are what counts and no one has done better! EVER!

[DjKyRo]

How many times has a player that is playing in the championship game won?

Last one would have been Bo Levi Mitchell in 2010. Other than that, Armanti Edwards twice in...what, 05 and 06?

[td577]

It looks like Brock got serious consideration finishing fourth. While the individual accolades are nice, I have a feeling the team accomplishments are much more important to these guys. In 20 years would people remember Brock as a Payton award winner or as a 2 or 3 time National Championship QB?

[Herd]

It looks like Brock got serious consideration finishing fourth. While the individual accolades are nice, I have a feeling the team accomplishments are much more important to these guys. In 20 years would people remember Brock as a Payton award winner or as a 2 or 3 time National Championship QB?

Every time I buy a Bison game program, there they are, Benny and Simmy with their Harlon Hill's. Pretty sure if Brock had won the award, we'd remember that in 20 years too.

[bisonboone11]

Last one would have been Bo Levi Mitchell in 2010. Other than that, Armanti Edwards twice in...what, 05 and 06?
I think Armanti Edwards won it for the 2007 and 2008 seasons, but App didn't make it to the championship game for the 2008 season.

Edit: Actually, according to Wikipedia, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_Division_I-AA/FCS_football_seasons), it looks like he won it in 2008 and 2009, but App State didn't win the championship either of those years.

[NDSU '96]

Would we be diminishing the significance of the award had Brock won it?

[Mayville Bison]

Personally, I don't really like the awards that go to the best player on the best team. MVPs (which is kinda like what this is) should rarely go to a guy on the best team because they would usually still be pretty good without them. Brock will hopefully get another ring and maybe another championship game MVP.