If the WAC came calling or when would NDSU move to FBS? No! But MWC? Maybe.

[GSUsTALON]

Is your stadium large enough for a FBS conference, (I don’t know the avg. attendance for WAC games)

Do you have enough sports and budget to entertain a move to a conference like the WAC?

Would you even want to move to the WAC or any other lower level FBS conference in the near future?

[KSBisonFan]

Good question because this topic has never been discussed here before.*

*There isn't enough purple in the world for this.

[GSUsTALON]

KsBison- "Hey, if you’re going to get rolled, why not get rolled by a team at the top of their class, no matter the division, with classy fans who enjoy a good road trip and know how to party."

Bison have definitely proved their greatness over the years. From watching you on TV and reports from GSU fans that attended the nail biter last year your fans are great. It’s my hope to attend a rematch next year whether in Fargo, Statesboro or for the NC in Texas. ( Party on Bison Fans)

[CaBisonFan]

Is your stadium large enough for a FBS conference, (I don’t know the avg. attendance for WAC games)

Do you have enough sports and budget to entertain a move to a conference like the WAC?

Would you even want to move to the WAC or any other lower level FBS conference in the near future?

From what I've heard our football stadium isn't large enough.

It's my opinion that FBS-caliber funds would be found in this community.

I could see a move when/if the FBS playoffs expand something like the FCS.

As the FBS stands right now, in a good year we'd be stuck with a toilet bowl.

The FCS playoffs are exciting as hell.

Maybe someday.

[Trumpster]

Good question because this topic has never been discussed here before.*

*There isn't enough purple in the world for this.

Hey, maybe he doesn't know the half a million threads people* have started over the years on this topic.


Or maybe he does and he's just trolling...

* gabe

[GSUsTALON]

Hey, maybe he doesn't know the half a million threads people* have started over the years on this topic.


Or maybe he does and he's just trolling...

* gabe

Not Trolling just asking

[NorthernBison]

The WAC doesn't sponsor football.

[ndsubison1]

The wac is a joke

[GSUsTALON]

From what I've heard our football stadium isn't large enough.

It's my opinion that FBS-caliber funds would be found in this community.

I could see a move when/if the FBS playoffs expand something like the FCS.

As the FBS stands right now, in a good year we'd be stuck with a toilet bowl.

The FCS playoffs are exciting as hell.

Maybe someday.

It appears that most WAC schools have 30,000 seat stadiums but don’t fill them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Western_Athletic_Conference_football_season

I agree with you and am very hesitant when it comes to GSU moving to the Sun Belt. If said proposal happens I will miss playing in a playoff system and crowning a true NC for some Scum Bowl.

[tony]

The WAC doesn't sponsor football.

Yeah, GSUtalon might be thinking of the Mountain West... That would be a huge step up for NDSU. Average MWC budget is double that of NDSU.

All those teams have left or are leaving the WAC. New Mexico State is the only one that is still hanging around and they'll be gone soon.

[GRAFTONBISON]

KsBison- "Hey, if you’re going to get rolled, why not get rolled by a team at the top of their class, no matter the division, with classy fans who enjoy a good road trip and know how to party."

Bison have definitely proved their greatness over the years. From watching you on TV and reports from GSU fans that attended the nail biter last year your fans are great. It’s my hope to attend a rematch next year whether in Fargo, Statesboro or for the NC in Texas. ( Party on Bison Fans)

I think most Bison fans have grown to respect the product GSU puts on the field every year as well. I don't know if our hearts could take too many more matchups but it sure as hell is fun!! :cheers:

[GSUsTALON]

Yeah, GSUtalon might be thinking of the Mountain West... That would be a huge step up for NDSU. Average MWC budget is double that of NDSU.

All those teams have left or are leaving the WAC. New Mexico State is the only one that is still hanging around and they'll be gone soon.


I meant no disrespect by mentioning the WAC. The stadium size and average attendance is much higher in the M.W. than the WAC. I was just curious on your feelings about an offer & whether you’d entertain the idea of using the WAC as a stepping stone. It looks like GSU will get an invite to the Scum Belt which I am reluctant on doing.

Montain West attendance and stadium size.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Mountain_West_Conference_football_season

[NorthernBison]

I meant no disrespect by mentioning the WAC. The stadium size and average attendance is much higher in the M.W. than the WAC. I was just curious on your feelings about an offer & whether you’d entertain the idea of using the WAC as a stepping stone. It looks like GSU will get an invite to the Scum Belt which I am reluctant on doing.

Montain West attendance and stadium size.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Mountain_West_Conference_football_season

No offense taken. The WAC sponsored football in 2012 for the final season. It is no longer a stepping stone as it is not an FBS conference after dropping football. I believe there are only two football playing schools remaining in the conference. They will likely both be gone in the next year.

As you would know, a move to FBS requires a conference invite. I'm not sure which conferences might offer if we expressed a desire to move up. I think the list would be very short.

[GSUsTALON]

I think most Bison fans have grown to respect the product GSU puts on the field every year as well. I don't know if our hearts could take too many more matchups but it sure as hell is fun!! :cheers:

I look at NDSU as the king of the hill until dethroned. I want GSU to play the best competition in the playoffs in order to prove ourselves and right now NDSU has a target on their back. As far as last year’s game is concerned it was a great one and is all about the great competition found in a playoff system. I would rather have won that game but if we had to lose better to lose to the NC than another.

[GSUsTALON]

No offense taken. The WAC sponsored football in 2012 for the final season. It is no longer a stepping stone as it is not an FBS conference after dropping football. I believe there are only two football playing schools remaining in the conference. They will likely both be gone in the next year.

As you would know, a move to FBS requires a conference invite. I'm not sure which conferences might offer if we expressed a desire to move up. I think the list would be very short.

Sorry my ignorance on the WAC just shot down the entire thread. (Sorry Bison Fans!) I should stick to FCS programs.

[CaBisonFan]

Why the poor rating for this thread when a relatively new member asks some fair questions?

[CaBisonFan]

Here's my guide to 'when' we should entertain a move up...

...when St. Cloud and/or Mankato announce their intention to move up to the FCS.

[GSUsTALON]

Why the poor rating for this thread when a relatively new member asks some fair questions?

Well if I knew anything about the WAC conference, done a little research and followed FBS better I would have known better than to post this topic. Then again, maybe the WAC will reinvent itself. I did get the feeling that you guys are happy right now where you are. You have earned NCs and the respect of the majority of FCS so you’re in a good spot as we post.

[marenlee]

Is your stadium large enough for a FBS conference, (I don’t know the avg. attendance for WAC games)

Do you have enough sports and budget to entertain a move to a conference like the WAC?

Would you even want to move to the WAC or any other lower level FBS conference in the near future?

In reality it is big enough. Kibbie dome holds only 16k and half the MAC stadiums are under 25k and don't even come close to being filled on Saturdays. But of course many of us would like to see a higher capacity in a "future " venue.

[NorthernBison]

Well if I knew anything about the WAC conference, done a little research and followed FBS better I would have known better than to post this topic. Then again, maybe the WAC will reinvent itself. I did get the feeling that you guys are happy right now where you are. You have earned NCs and the respect of the majority of FCS so you’re in a good spot as we post.

Don't apologize. It's hard to keep up with all the conference moves.

We are happy with our football conference. We're nervous as a long tailed cat in a rocking chair factory about our all-sports conference. The Summit just lost a member to the WAC and we have one significant member openly looking for an invite to the Horizon. Our baseball autobid is only there because of an NCAA waiver. There is no question that the Former Big East Catholic basketball schools (C-7) will be making some moves in the near future and poaching some programs. That will definitely affect other conferences and likely trickle down to our conference. Suffice it to say, the result isn't likely to be positive for the Summit. That means our future rests in the capability of our AD and his ability to either broker some deals or read the tea leaves correctly. We can't be complacent.

[GSUsTALON]

In reality it is big enough. Kibbie dome holds only 16k and half the MAC stadiums are under 25k and don't even come close to being filled on Saturdays. But of course many of us would like to see a higher capacity in a "future " venue.

I tought your stadium held 20,000. Sure sounded like it on ESPN........ ;-)

[GSUsTALON]

Don't apologize. It's hard to keep up with all the conference moves.

We are happy with our football conference. We're nervous as a long tailed cat in a rocking chair factory about our all-sports conference. The Summit just lost a member to the WAC and we have one significant member openly looking for an invite to the Horizon. Our baseball autobid is only there because of an NCAA waiver. There is no question that the Former Big East Catholic basketball schools (C-7) will be making some moves in the near future and poaching some programs. That will definitely affect other conferences and likely trickle down to our conference. Suffice it to say, the result isn't likely to be positive for the Summit. That means our future rests in the capability of our AD and his ability to either broker some deals or read the tea leaves correctly. We can't be complacent.

If the Sun Belt passes over GSU I wont cry about it.

[bisonmike2]

Looks like Lakes hacked GSUsTalon's logon.

[marenlee]

I tought your stadium held 20,000. Sure sounded like it on ESPN........ ;-)

19k for fargodome. Kibbie dome is Idaho's warehouse.

[GSUsTALON]

19k for fargodome. Kibbie dome is Idaho's warehouse.

How many GSU fans last year? Did we have 300? I neather saw or HEARD them on ESPN!

[HerdBot]

How many GSU fans last year? Did we have 300? I neather saw or HEARD them on ESPN!

You guys used up your allotted tickets, problem is you were allotted a whopping 400 and the game was sold out basically with season ticket holders I applaud the fans that got tickets and made the trip. Met many in the tailgate lot

[GOBISON123]

Is your stadium large enough for a FBS conference, (I don’t know the avg. attendance for WAC games)

Do you have enough sports and budget to entertain a move to a conference like the WAC?

Would you even want to move to the WAC or any other lower level FBS conference in the near future?

The FBS should first incorporate Playoff style selection process to choose teams playing in the Finals like FCS. The current format is very biased and ESPN will never give us due respect.

[GSUsTALON]

The FBS should first incorporate Playoff style selection process to choose teams playing in the Finals like FCS. The current format is very biased and ESPN will never give us due respect.

That’s what’s nice about the FCS playoff system and its auto bids. It “helps” level the playing field between the power conferences and the mid to lower level conferences. This is something that GSU will no longer enjoy if invited to the Scum Belt.

The new 4 team playoff for FBS should increase to more teams as soon as the extra money comes pouring in. I read somewhere how much more estimated money a 4 team playoff would bring in to the NCAA, school and participating conferences and it was staggering. You can still use the major boles to host the playoff teams while keeping the lower level bowls for the pat on the back teams that had a good season.


QUESTION
I know the spring and a summer practice haven’t happened yet but is NDSU in good shape, after losing the seniors this year, to make another run in the playoffs?

[GSUsTALON]

You guys used up your allotted tickets, problem is you were allotted a whopping 400 and the game was sold out basically with season ticket holders I applaud the fans that got tickets and made the trip. Met many in the tailgate lot



Not a bad attendance for GSU fans for a playoff game so far away. I heard tickets were hard to come by.
The attendance for a late playoff game in the Fargo dome was impressive. Does the city of Fargo make up the majority of your fan base or do the fans come in from a larger area.

How many of your students returned for the GSU/NDSU game?

While GSU averaged about 20,500 for regular season home games but when the students go home for break our attendance drops off drastically.

[DORMIE]

I think that in all due respect to the Georgia Southern foot ball program we should be in different brackets next year. A large majority of Bison fans felt that the Championship the past two years was held in the Fargodome with the Bison and Georgia Southern. We have the utmost respect for your football program. Hope we can meet next year in Frisco. We'll have our hands full with your QB on a neutral field.

[BisonTeacher]

I think that in all due respect to the Georgia Southern foot ball program we should be in different brackets next year. A large majority of Bison fans felt that the Championship the past two years was held in the Fargodome with the Bison and Georgia Southern. We have the utmost respect for your football program. Hope we can meet next year in Frisco. We'll have our hands full with your QB on a neutral field.

Frisco? Neutral field? Thats funny!

[IzzyFlexion]

In reality it is big enough. Kibbie dome holds only 16k and half the MAC stadiums are under 25k and don't even come close to being filled on Saturdays. But of course many of us would like to see a higher capacity in a "future " venue.

What is this "Kibbie Dome" that you speak of?
Is it expandable?
Does it have a retractable roof that can accomodate a bullet train and/or monorail platform?

[BisBison]

I think that in all due respect to the Georgia Southern foot ball program we should be in different brackets next year. A large majority of Bison fans felt that the Championship the past two years was held in the Fargodome with the Bison and Georgia Southern. We have the utmost respect for your football program. Hope we can meet next year in Frisco. We'll have our hands full with your QB on a neutral field.

^^^^^
This. Those were two of the best football games I've ever seen in the Dome. Love to meet up with Southern next yr in Frisco would be epic. On the other hand maybe I'd rather play someone else and have an easier chance at the three-peat.

[GSUsTALON]

I think that in all due respect to the Georgia Southern foot ball program we should be in different brackets next year. A large majority of Bison fans felt that the Championship the past two years was held in the Fargodome with the Bison and Georgia Southern. We have the utmost respect for your football program. Hope we can meet next year in Frisco. We'll have our hands full with your QB on a neutral field.

In the 2011 you trounced us but the 20012 was more respectable for GSU. I to would like to meet the Bison in the NC but if not most GSU fans are obsessed with getting another shot at NDSU. I know of no other FCS team that has taken GSU to the woodshed like NDSU has. I can get over the first two games because of our coaching marry go round. I can even pallet the 2011 beat down due to the re implementation of the Spread Triple and us being outclassed by you defense but last year’s game still sticks in my craw. If the Scum Belt picks us up on June 1st it may be our last chance at playing the proven, current best team in FCS so it has to happen next year!

PARTY ON BISON

PS I don’t see Texas as being a neutral site for the bison with the fan support you bring to that game. I heard you took over the town and even put more fans in the seats than the home state team.

[Bison bison]

I say we hold out for the swac.

[Bison03]

Can we end this stupid discussion?! NDSU IS NOT GOING FBS! Unless we have a way of coming up with another 10-15 million a year, it's not happening anytime soon. I say NEVER!! Why compete in the whogivesacrap.com bowl when we can compete for a national championship. You FBS dreamers need to calm down and get a grasp on reality.

[Strongman]

Can we end this stupid discussion?! NDSU IS NOT GOING FBS! Unless we have a way of coming up with another 10-15 million a year, it's not happening anytime soon. I say NEVER!! Why compete in the whogivesacrap.com bowl when we can compete for a national championship. You FBS dreamers need to calm down and get a grasp on reality.

LOL. Same attitude back in 1991, when guys like you were against the Fargodome. WHY BE A SMALL TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL PROGRAM WHEN WE COULD BE A TOP 20 FOOTBALL TEAM IN THE USA IN 10 YEARS?!!!!!!!

[BisonNation11]

LOL. Same attitude back in 1991, when guys like you were against the Fargodome. WHY BE A SMALL TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL PROGRAM WHEN WE COULD BE A TOP 20 FOOTBALL TEAM IN THE USA IN 10 YEARS?!!!!!!!


Unless we have a way of coming up with another 10-15 million a year, it's not happening anytime soon.

I'd say the money argument is a pretty damn good reason to not be a top 20 football team in America. One more reason would be while under Craig Bohl, this football program will stay FCS. He loves the playoffs, will not trade anything for the playoffs, and I think his recent contract extension would be a good indicator of his belief in that. Any more questions?

[CaBisonFan]

I'd say the money argument is a pretty damn good reason to not be a top 20 football team in America. One more reason would be while under Craig Bohl, this football program will stay FCS. He loves the playoffs, will not trade anything for the playoffs, and I think his recent contract extension would be a good indicator of his belief in that. Any more questions?Yours is a good argument...but I think it's also possible that Bohl signed on to face the next challenge of transitioning into the FBS. He'd be the right guy to do it. Taylor would be the right AD to back him. After next season...make the announcements and begin the process. Compete with MN for players in the region. Make sure that schools like St. Cloud and Mankato don't get to the FCS while we're still there. If UNI moves up...that'll be another reason for us to do the same. Recruiting is the name of this game...and putting yourself in a position of power in the region. Don't let the 90s happen again because of poor planning. The FBS playoff picture will be vastly different within 5 years. The FCS playoffs are great...but the caliber of play in the program is the real key. It's the main ingredient of a football program. Caliber of opponents is another.

[NDSUstudent]

People argue about playoffs and bowls and ignore what really matters and that is....NDSU is going to be at the level of football that best fits it.

Right now that place is FCS but it could very well change, the college football landscape is hardly stable.

[870XPRS]

People argue about playoffs and bowls and ignore what really matters and that is....NDSU is going to be at the level of football that best fits it.

Right now that place is FCS but it could very well change, the college football landscape is hardly stable.

Agreed...we are the best fit in FCS right now. FCS is the level that NDSU is. I never want to see NDSU lose, but part of me wants K-State to trounce us by 40 just to shut some of the idiots up. Fair weather fans talk a lot of smoke.

We are having a glorious ride right now...just let it happen. FBS is always going to be the top few teams in the top few conferences. At no point can we generate the kind of money that it takes to be one of those. Pipe dreams is all it is.

The move to FCS went smooth, the next move is something different. Just get a grip.....

[westnodak93bison]

Some people think money grows on trees.

[Strongman]

The negative talk and the word, cannot, gets old pretty damn quick. In 1967, Boise State did NOT have a football program. In the mid 1970s, they were in D2, like NDSU. Nowadays, they have been an annual top 20 football program for the last 8 years, despite not belonging to a BCS conference. Boise State did it. There is no reason that NDSU cannot do it especially when led by Bohl and Taylor. They are printing money in Western North Dakota and will so for the next 20 years plus. Pretty sure NDSU could get some of that in new donations and naming rights to a stadium. Now is the time to move up (or after we win a 3rd straight title.). The alumni and Teammakers would not allow the program to fail.

[TransAmBison]

The negative talk and the word, cannot, gets old pretty damn quick. In 1967, Boise State did NOT have a football program. In the mid 1970s, they were in D2, like NDSU. Nowadays, they have been an annual top 20 football program for the last 8 years, despite not belonging to a BCS conference. Boise State did it. There is no reason that NDSU cannot do it especially when led by Bohl and Taylor. They are printing money in Western North Dakota and will so for the next 20 years plus. Pretty sure NDSU could get some of that in new donations and naming rights to a stadium. Now is the time to move up (or after we win a 3rd straight title.). The alumni and Teammakers would not allow the program to fail.
I did not realize it was that easy to get all the funding necessary to be a top 20 program. We just had to ask for oil money and they would give it? Please take charge of this...I'm busy calling athletic depts to schedule games.

[tony]

So tempted to lock this thread or at least change the name to something that makes sense by substituting "MWC" for "WAC".

[Bison bison]

I did not realize it was that easy to get all the funding necessary to be a top 20 program. We just had to ask for oil money and they would give it? Please take charge of this...I'm busy calling athletic depts to schedule games.

If you weren't so lazy, NDSU would be in SEC.

I'm so disappointed in you, TAB.

[dragonsfan]

thats a great idea, state land grant connected with other state land grants in mwc


So tempted to lock this thread or at least change the name to something that makes sense by substituting "MWC" for "WAC".

[CaBisonFan]

thats a great idea, state land grant connected with other state land grants in mwc.....this.....

[GSUsTALON]

Why compete in the whogivesacrap.com bowl when we can compete for a national championship. You FBS dreamers need to calm down and get a grasp on reality.

That's why I won’t cry if GSU gets passed over by the Sun Belt. That said I'll support my team in a Toilet Bowl if we move.

I hope you can keep your head coach & coaching staff in place but """ if""" you 3 peat (I hope GSU has something to say about that) or continue to do well Bohl will be a sought after coach. I know all things come in time. I was just curious if you administration had a plan for moving to FBS with all the success you’ve had at D2 & FCS level.

[56BISON73]

People argue about playoffs and bowls and ignore what really matters and that is....NDSU is going to be at the level of football that best fits it.

Right now that place is FCS but it could very well change, the college football landscape is hardly stable.

This!!!!!!!

[BisonNeil]

thats a great idea, state land grant connected with other state land grants in mwc

Say what? Seriously? Out of the nine schools in the MWC, only four are land grant, the minority.

If its a land grant connection you want, then the B1G should be your goal. In the upcoming 14 team league, 10 are land grant, only four are not.

But, the MWC is hardly a land grant affiliated conference.

[Billings]

uhhh no BisonNell

there are now 12 football playing schools in the MWC for this coming fall-- 8 are Land Grant Universities and 4 are not. However Air Force is the top academic school in the conference and a tp academic school in the US and fits nicely as does New Mexico with a full Medical School in tow. Only Boise state and Unlv Stick out as weaker academically

Land Grants:
University of WYoming
Colorado State University
University of Nevada
San Diego State University
San Jose St University
Fresno State University
Utah State University
University of Hawaii


Non Land Grant
Air Force
Univ of New Mexico (has med school though)
UNLV
Boise State

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_land-grant_universities

FBS is about great matchups through the regular season. Yea the bowls are fun for a few days but but they don't compare to a playoff. ON the other hand, FCS is not full of a lot good teams. There is little depth to FCS football and regular season games often suck and are anti-climatic . I prefer a solid FBS conference slate and a conference championship game. Add in that Hosting one of the big boys is a great experience. When WYo hosted Texas, Ole Miss, and Nebraska that was some serious tailgating. We have Oregon, Washington State, and Missouri coming to Laramie soon as well. Those are the advantages of being FBS. you take the good with the bad whether it is FCS or FBS. Both have drawbacks. However I agree if you don't have a solid conference and a Athletic budget of at lest $28 million don't go FBS.

I have season tickets to an FCS school and go to many Wyo games (alumni) I enjoy both but the regular season matchups for Wyo are far more intriguing then the 2-3 don't miss FCS games

[heffray]

uhhh no BisonNell...



You seem to know your stuff, but I find it hard to believe that BisonNeil is wrong about anything... at least, I've never seen it happen before...

[TransAmBison]

You seem to know your stuff, but I find it hard to believe that BisonNeil is wrong about anything... at least, I've never seen it happen before...Yep, he correctly predicted the Bison football team's wins throughout the year. The man never had any doubt. Amazing. :)

[GCWaters]

uhhh no BisonNell

there are now 12 football playing schools in the MWC for this coming fall-- 8 are Land Grant Universities and 4 are not. However Air Force is the top academic school in the conference and a tp academic school in the US and fits nicely as does New Mexico with a full Medical School in tow. Only Boise state and Unlv Stick out as weaker academically

Land Grants:
University of WYoming
Colorado State University
University of Nevada
San Diego State University
San Jose St University
Fresno State University
Utah State University
University of Hawaii


Non Land Grant
Air Force
Univ of New Mexico (has med school though)
UNLV
Boise State

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_land-grant_universities



While San Diego State, San Jose State, and Fresno State are technically land grants, they aren't in the same sense that the other schools listed--and NDSU--are....

[Bison bison]

While San Diego State, San Jose State, and Fresno State are technically land grants


How are they technically land-grants?

[Hammerhead]

States can direct money earned from the transfer of federal land to the state to multiple institutions. North Dakota could direct land a portion of the grand funds (if any still exist) to NDSCS and then have 2 land grant colleges.


How are they technically land-grants?

[NorthernBison]

The Orange Land Grants on the Map are what many consider the true Land Grant Universities. All authorized by the Morrill Act of 1862.

http://www.csrees.usda.gov/qlinks/partners/map_lgu_all_front_12_9_09.pdf

[BisonNeil]

uhhh no BisonNell

there are now 12 football playing schools in the MWC for this coming fall-- 8 are Land Grant Universities and 4 are not. However Air Force is the top academic school in the conference and a tp academic school in the US and fits nicely as does New Mexico with a full Medical School in tow. Only Boise state and Unlv Stick out as weaker academically

Land Grants:
University of WYoming
Colorado State University
University of Nevada
San Diego State University
San Jose St University
Fresno State University
Utah State University
University of Hawaii


Non Land Grant
Air Force
Univ of New Mexico (has med school though)
UNLV
Boise State

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_land-grant_universities

FBS is about great matchups through the regular season. Yea the bowls are fun for a few days but but they don't compare to a playoff. ON the other hand, FCS is not full of a lot good teams. There is little depth to FCS football and regular season games often suck and are anti-climatic . I prefer a solid FBS conference slate and a conference championship game. Add in that Hosting one of the big boys is a great experience. When WYo hosted Texas, Ole Miss, and Nebraska that was some serious tailgating. We have Oregon, Washington State, and Missouri coming to Laramie soon as well. Those are the advantages of being FBS. you take the good with the bad whether it is FCS or FBS. Both have drawbacks. However I agree if you don't have a solid conference and a Athletic budget of at lest $28 million don't go FBS.

I have season tickets to an FCS school and go to many Wyo games (alumni) I enjoy both but the regular season matchups for Wyo are far more intriguing then the 2-3 don't miss FCS games

To be specific, there are only 5 1862 land grant universities on that list. NDSU is an 1862 land grant university. The others have some agricultural programs, and may count as either an 1890 (historically black) or 1994 (with some tribal affiliation or teach native americans), but for those who live and breathe agriculture and work in agriculture, the universities such as San Diego State, San Jose State, etc, are NOT land grant universities in the same sense NDSU is, and that is final.

But, I did miscount, there are five in the conference that meet that criteria but that hardly qualifies that conference as a "land grant" university conference with which NDSU has a ton of resemblence to. And, they are not on this list:

http://classifications.carnegiefoundation.org/lookup_listings/srp.php?clq={%22basic2005_ids%22%3A%2215%22}&limit=0,50

[GCWaters]

The Orange Land Grants on the Map are what many consider the true Land Grant Universities. All authorized by the Morrill Act of 1862.

http://www.csrees.usda.gov/qlinks/partners/map_lgu_all_front_12_9_09.pdf

Bingo........

[Herd]

Is that a scary list of schools that NDSU could not compete with in FB, BB, and all other sports? Absolutely not, but I'd want a BB arena that seats 10k, and 35k for FB to help generate some addl $. Competing, not an issue. BSA should be designed or at least expandable to 10k.

[tony]

Is that a scary list of schools that NDSU could not compete with in FB, BB, and all other sports? Absolutely not, but I'd want a BB arena that seats 10k, and 35k for FB to help generate some addl $. Competing, not an issue.

Yeah, there'd have to a plan to ramp up funding. Of course, this is just wishful thinking - the Mountain West, as it currently sits, is not going to be inviting NDSU anytime soon.

[NDSUstudent]

Honestly I think NDSU would have to prove itself in a conference like the MAC before the MWC would take interest. The MWC is the strongest conference outside of the power conferences like the Big 10, Big 12 etc...no way they take an FCS move up.

[heffray]

To be specific, there are only 5 1862 land grant universities on that list. NDSU is an 1862 land grant university. The others have some agricultural programs, and may count as either an 1890 (historically black) or 1994 (with some tribal affiliation or teach native americans), but for those who live and breathe agriculture and work in agriculture, the universities such as San Diego State, San Jose State, etc, are NOT land grant universities in the same sense NDSU is, and that is final.

But, I did miscount, there are five in the conference that meet that criteria but that hardly qualifies that conference as a "land grant" university conference with which NDSU has a ton of resemblence to. And, they are not on this list:

http://classifications.carnegiefoundation.org/lookup_listings/srp.php?clq={%22basic2005_ids%22%3A%2215%22}&limit=0,50

See. Never wrong. Maybe miscounting from time to time, but that is technically not wrong, it's just bad eyesight.

[DePereBisonFan]

Honestly I think NDSU would have to prove itself in a conference like the MAC before the MWC would take interest. The MWC is the strongest conference outside of the power conferences like the Big 10, Big 12 etc...no way they take an FCS move up.

This.

This is exactly why when we think about going FBS, we need to understand that whatever conference initially invites us will be a temporary stop.

[NDSU92]

This.

This is exactly why when we think about going FBS, we need to understand that whatever conference initially invites us will be a temporary stop.

Completely agree, I hope that sometime in the next 10-15 years we will be in the MWC but there may be one or two stops on the road to getting there. That is of course unless the Pac or Big 12 raid 3-4 Mountain West schools and the MW need schools that can compete right now. That's probably the only way I could see us making the jump.

[reformedUNDfan]

the rumor has been that the mwc wants to go to 16 fb schools. I'm presuming they would want to stay western, so will only include those schools that could plausibly be considered western, and could plausibly be a MWC school within, say, a 3 year timeframe to address facilities, or soforth. Also addressed are the puluses and minuses for each school. Academics will be compared to NDSU.

Tier 1: premier targets.
BYU: duh.

Houston: 41000 students, research budget comparable to NDSU, lower academics ranking. 260,000 almuni. Texas recruiting presence. 16 mens golf titles, 5 final four appearances, two title game appearances, recent high level of success in football. Building new 40,000 seat stadium, 8500. Huge local market, which they do not own (texans, cowboys, longhorns, aggies, rockets). Joining the big east.

Tier 2

UTEP: 22000 students, small research budget, lower academic ranking. 1966 NCAA MBB champions, 7x mCC 6x mens outdoor 7x mens indoor champs. sun bowl stadium 52,000 seats, BB seats 12,000. Geographically isolated. C-USA. Large , poor, local market.

Montana: 15,000 students. academic peer. 2 FCS titles, consistent FCS power. 25000 football, 7300 BB. Generally competitive in other sports. Very geographically isolated. Small local market, medium state market.

North Dakota State: 14,500 students. 2 FXS, 8 d2 football, titles, 5 WBB d2 titles, 4 d2 wrestling titles. 19000 FB 6000 BB. Geographically isolated. Medium local market, medium state market. Football facility meets only bare minimum, marginally un-upgradeable. BB arena decrepit, remodel imminent. Remaining facilities excellent to adequate.

NMSU: 18500 students, a quick drive from UTEP, academic and research peer. 1 final four appearance (1970) terrible football program, 30k seats. 3 bowl games, most recently 1960. 12500 for BB. Geographically isolated, aside from 40 miles from UTEP. Would probably only be consider with UTEP. Small local market but near el paso.

Tulsa: 4300 students, higher tier academically. Won NIT in 1981 and 2001, claims these as national titles. 3 NCAA womens golf titles. Large market, which they do not own.

Montana State: 14,000 students, academic peer. 1 FCS title, 1 D2, 1 naia. 21,000 football. 7250 BB. Small local market, medium state market. Very geographically isolated. Stadium would benefit from expansion.

Tier 3

SDSU: 13000 students, academic peer. D-2 mens and womens title in BB. 16000 FB 6500 BB. Small local market, medium state market. Very geographically isolated. Football facility inadequate, would need heavy remodel and expansion, which has been proposed.

weber state: 27000 students. NOT PHD granting afaik. Established BB program. 17,000 football, 12,000 BB. Small local market, large state market in which they are probably 4th. stadium would likely need expansion to be a viable candidate.

UND: 15000 students, academic peer. 1 d-2 FB, 3 d-2 wBB titles. 13500 football, 3300 or 13000 BB. small local market, medium state market. Very geographically isolated Boasts premier BB facility but is unavailable most of the year. Football facility inadequate and unupgradeable. Improving support facilities.

thats about how i see the MWC's potential targets, and I know i missed at least one decent target. (no, not ewu)

[WYOBISONMAN]

There is no interest from all the MWC fans I know in even looking at NDSU. It is totally off the radar out here.

[reformedUNDfan]

There is no interest from all the MWC fans I know in even looking at NDSU. It is totally off the radar out here.

aside from byu and houston, who is on the radar?

[Facts]

uhhh no BisonNell

there are now 12 football playing schools in the MWC for this coming fall-- 8 are Land Grant Universities and 4 are not. However Air Force is the top academic school in the conference and a tp academic school in the US and fits nicely as does New Mexico with a full Medical School in tow. Only Boise state and Unlv Stick out as weaker academically

Land Grants:
University of WYoming
Colorado State University
University of Nevada
San Diego State University
San Jose St University
Fresno State University
Utah State University
University of Hawaii


Non Land Grant
Air Force
Univ of New Mexico (has med school though)
UNLV
Boise State

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_land-grant_universities

FBS is about great matchups through the regular season. Yea the bowls are fun for a few days but but they don't compare to a playoff. ON the other hand, FCS is not full of a lot good teams. There is little depth to FCS football and regular season games often suck and are anti-climatic . I prefer a solid FBS conference slate and a conference championship game. Add in that Hosting one of the big boys is a great experience. When WYo hosted Texas, Ole Miss, and Nebraska that was some serious tailgating. We have Oregon, Washington State, and Missouri coming to Laramie soon as well. Those are the advantages of being FBS. you take the good with the bad whether it is FCS or FBS. Both have drawbacks. However I agree if you don't have a solid conference and a Athletic budget of at lest $28 million don't go FBS.

I have season tickets to an FCS school and go to many Wyo games (alumni) I enjoy both but the regular season matchups for Wyo are far more intriguing then the 2-3 don't miss FCS games
Perspective: of the true Land Grant Universities (peers) how many are playing FCS?
I'm not saying... I'm just saying.

[WYOBISONMAN]

aside from byu and houston, who is on the radar?

Most feel once BYU comes back no other members are needed to stabilize the conference.

[BisonNeil]

Perspective: of the true Land Grant Universities (peers) how many are playing FCS?
I'm not saying... I'm just saying.

Besides NDSU, SDSU, Maine, Delaware, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Montana State, and Cornell are all I can think of off the top of my head. I think the University of Vermont wants to work their way back up to FCS. Idaho may be back to FCS soon, I doubt they can make it as a football independent, New Mexico State has the same issue.

[silkamilkamonico]

Most feel once BYU comes back no other members are needed to stabilize the conference.

BYU will eventually be suited by the Big 12 or the Pac 12, probably sooner before later.


I agree though, MWC has no interest in NDSU.
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[Billings]

Recent article from BYU AD said they are not playing in the BIG 12 now as BYU won't play on Sundays and BIG 12 wants sunday play in many sports such as BB. Unless BYU changes that rule, and they wont, they won't be in a major conference ever.

[onbison09]

Ohio only lost $78,569 on their bowl game http://deadspin.com/5986403/ohio-university-made-a-bowl-game-won-big-and-lost-78569

[silkamilkamonico]

Recent article from BYU AD said they are not playing in the BIG 12 now as BYU won't play on Sundays and BIG 12 wants sunday play in many sports such as BB. Unless BYU changes that rule, and they wont, they won't be in a major conference ever.

Where does big 12 say they want to play sundays? I never heard that. They dont play any sunday conference games now.

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[NorthernBison]

Where does big 12 say they want to play sundays? I never heard that. They dont play any sunday conference games now.

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Found this story published this week. Nothing is set in stone but there is talk.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/765623110/BYU-and-the-Big-12-Why-playing-on-Sunday-matters-to-the-Big-12-Conference.html?pg=1

[Billings]

Ohio only lost $78,569 on their bowl game http://deadspin.com/5986403/ohio-university-made-a-bowl-game-won-big-and-lost-78569

I wonder how much the FCS playoffs lose? good thing the NCAA is footing the bill with NCAA basketball money as the FCS playoffs are huge money losers

[reformedUNDfan]

I wonder how much the FCS playoffs lose? good thing the NCAA is footing the bill with NCAA basketball money as the FCS playoffs are huge money losers

pretty sure the playoffs made money two years in a row.

[Ginsbach]

Boise State has been trying to make a push to improve their academics in order to try to get into the Pac 12. So there's that.

[reformedUNDfan]

Boise State has been trying to make a push to improve their academics in order to try to get into the Pac 12. So there's that.

that will take decades and a willing pac12. Boise state has made progress over the last decade, but they are still an inferior school to NDSU, buy a fair margin.

[Ginsbach]

that will take decades and a willing pac12. Boise state has made progress over the last decade, but they are still an inferior school to NDSU, buy a fair margin.

No doubt, but that push is still there. My department got an email last semester that was a call for PhD candidates to come to Boise in order to boost their academic reputation.

[1998braves64]

pretty sure the playoffs made money two years in a row.

Many thanks to NDSU selling out 8 games and probably putting in a fairly large bid to get the games (at Fargodome).

[Billings]

pretty sure the playoffs made money two years in a row.

that would be a huge change from the past.

http://thederisoreport.hbcufannation.com/2010/10/04/straight-talk-on-fcs-playoffs-the-system-is-hurting-financially/


"“The FCS playoff system is hurting financially,” O’Day says. “We produced $1.1 million of last year’s budget of $2.5 million. The other 11 games produced less than $1 million TOTAL. The NCAA lost almost $500,000 again, and it will not continue to tolerate to follow this plan. Now we’ve added another round and four more teams. Being on the committee, and as chair, I know this is a major concern to the NCAA – and a last-gasp reason for changing to Frisco, Texas, in hopes of attracting more attention and support.”"

would also worry about the future with Appy state and G Southern really pushing to join the sunbelt

[BlueBisonRock]

that would be a huge change from the past.

http://thederisoreport.hbcufannation.com/2010/10/04/straight-talk-on-fcs-playoffs-the-system-is-hurting-financially/


"“The FCS playoff system is hurting financially,” O’Day says. “We produced $1.1 million of last year’s budget of $2.5 million. The other 11 games produced less than $1 million TOTAL. The NCAA lost almost $500,000 again, and it will not continue to tolerate to follow this plan. Now we’ve added another round and four more teams. Being on the committee, and as chair, I know this is a major concern to the NCAA – and a last-gasp reason for changing to Frisco, Texas, in hopes of attracting more attention and support.”"

would also worry about the future with Appy state and G Southern really pushing to join the sunbelt

We have seen this report on BV before. A little over two years ago... (dated October 4, 2010).

During the broadcast of this years National Championship game (I was able to watch most of the broadcast after getting back from Frisco) it was noted that the FCS tourney attendence this year set an all time record. In addition, the three games in Fargo were soldout. I can't speak for 2011 totals, but do know the natty and the playoff games I attended were filled.

2010 did not bring the same results. It appears the NCAA needs teams with a fanbase who will travel and get their respective asses to the game (or in the case of those teams in the next state west of ND, get to the game...).

Perhaps a better marketing strategy of O'Day and others on this committee just might be to leverage this more recent success rather than pay attention to two and a half year old studies. Change that half empty focus to one that sees the glass half full. Folks need to be ready to adapt when the structure of college football changes.

[56BISON73]

We have seen this report on BV before. A little over two years ago... (dated October 4, 2010).

During the broadcast of this years National Championship game (I was able to watch most of the broadcast after getting back from Frisco) it was noted that the FCS tourney attendence this year set an all time record. In addition, the three games in Fargo were soldout. I can't speak for 2011 totals, but do know the natty and the playoff games I attended were filled.

2010 did not bring the same results. It appears the NCAA needs teams with a fanbase who will travel and get their respective asses to the game (or in the case of those teams in the next state west of ND, get to the game...).

Perhaps a better marketing strategy of O'Day and others on this committee just might be to leverage this more recent success rather than pay attention to two and a half year old studies. Change that half empty focus to one that sees the glass half full. Folks need to be ready to adapt when the structure of college football changes.

This was by an AD that got fired. Correct?

[SlickVic]

wac attack +++♡

[westnodak93bison]

Boise State has been trying to make a push to improve their academics in order to try to get into the Pac 12. So there's that.

Excuse my ignorance but how does one improve academics for an accredited program? Is it based on grad programs and or research dollars?

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[MNLonghorn10]

mountain west by 2020 or bust!

[EndZoneQB]

mountain west by 2020 or bust!

*2014, rather!

[stevdock]

Can at least spring ball open so that these threads can go away for a while again?? Then after the spring game lets fast forward to fall camp. This crap is getting ridiculous again. We can't even build the bball arena but yet we can add 20-some mens and womens scholarships at the drop of a hat

[SDbison]

Can at least spring ball open so that these threads can go away for a while again?? Then after the spring game lets fast forward to fall camp. This crap is getting ridiculous again. We can't even build the bball arena but yet we can add 20-some mens and womens scholarships at the drop of a hat Football is king at NDSU, not basketball. The title of this thread is screwed up since the WAC is essentially dead, but NDSU going FBS in the next 5 to 10 years is more likely than you or others at Bisonville want to believe. As for having these threads I believe Bison posters can decide what they want to post about.

[heckler]

Can at least spring ball open so that these threads can go away for a while again?? Then after the spring game lets fast forward to fall camp. This crap is getting ridiculous again. We can't even build the bball arena but yet we can add 20-some mens and womens scholarships at the drop of a hat

If Saul ball was half as fun to watch as NDSU football it would have been built last year. 36 points vs WIU, no one wants to watch that. Last time NDSU football played the Leathernecks they scored 37.

[SDbison]

If Saul ball was half as fun to watch as NDSU football if would have been built last year. 36 points vs WIU, no one wants to watch that. Last time NDSU football played the Leathernecks they scored 37. This..........There are 5 times as many football fans as basketball. ND and NDSU don't give a rip about basketball and that is obvious with the BSA trainwreck. Mens basketball not capable of winning the big games anymore. Womens basketball is in terrible shape and seems to have settled into the bottom half of the conference indefinitely. Then there is the Summit......essentially a bunch of commuter schools and part of the old NCC......not much fan appeal. DII basketball when Irv was coaching back in the early 1980's was a lot more fun to watch......the Bison played offense back then.

[NDSUstudent]

Offensive style has nothing to do with it and for that matter I don't think NDSU has ever had this great entertaining offense. It has always been ground and pound, which suits us just fine.

The football team has 10 National Championships...the basketball team went to the dance once and DII regionals a few times. That is all you need to know to understand the difference between the two programs.

[SDbison]

Offensive style has nothing to do with it and for that matter I don't think NDSU has ever had this great entertaining offense. It has always been ground and pound, which suits us just fine.

The football team has 10 National Championships...the basketball team went to the dance once and DII regionals a few times. That is all you need to know to understand the difference between the two programs. NDSU packed the BSA with most every game back in the early 1980's. Before your time I know, but Irv ran an aggressive offense. Used to be fan prizes like free Big Macs when the Bison scored over 100 points. Came close a bunch of times and went over several times.

[BisoninNWMN]

NDSU packed the BSA with most every game back in the early 1980's. Before your time I know, but Irv ran an aggressive offense. Used to be fan prizes like free Big Macs when the Bison scored over 100 points. Came close a bunch of times and went over several times.


I think MBB can be a very good draw when the BSA is finally done. Can we sell-out the new BB arena when it is built? I hope so. FB is king at NDSU and I don't see that changing any time soon.

[NDSUstudent]

NDSU packed the BSA with most every game back in the early 1980's. Before your time I know, but Irv ran an aggressive offense. Used to be fan prizes like free Big Macs when the Bison scored over 100 points. Came close a bunch of times and went over several times.

I don't dispute that but I'm sure those teams also won games. Winning draws fans, unfortunately our arena turns many more fans away.

[SDbison]

I don't dispute that but I'm sure those teams also won games. Winning draws fans, unfortunately our arena turns many more fans away. Actually didn't win the conference much back then. The basketball woes are all of the following: BSA remodel stuck, current BSA sucks, bison team inconsistent, defensive game doesn't excite fans, no big wins in a long time and the NCAA playoff appearance in the rearview and fading out of sight. Sad but true.

[stevdock]

Football is king at NDSU, not basketball. The title of this thread is screwed up since the WAC is essentially dead, but NDSU going FBS in the next 5 to 10 years is more likely than you or others at Bisonville want to believe. As for having these threads I believe Bison posters can decide what they want to post about.

Really?? Where the heck have I been the last oh hundred years or so to not know that football is king at NDSU. My point is, like it was last off-season and the off-season before that, that NDSU can't even scrape together 2 million dollars to finish off the BSA remodel. But yet those of you clamoring for FBS football never bring up how the heck NDSU is going to afford the extra 40+ scholarships that are at a bare minimum to move up.

I'm not saying NDSU couldn't compete quite nicely in the right FBS conference. They can and they will when the time is right. But stop looking at this as just a football move, this would be an entire athletic department move, and NDSU currently does not have the resources to do it.

[SDbison]

Really?? Where the heck have I been the last oh hundred years or so to not know that football is king at NDSU. My point is, like it was last off-season and the off-season before that, that NDSU can't even scrape together 2 million dollars to finish off the BSA remodel. But yet those of you clamoring for FBS football never bring up how the heck NDSU is going to afford the extra 40+ scholarships that are at a bare minimum to move up.

I'm not saying NDSU couldn't compete quite nicely in the right FBS conference. They can and they will when the time is right. But stop looking at this as just a football move, this would be an entire athletic department move, and NDSU currently does not have the resources to do it. You don't rule out making the move in the future just because of the present conditions. Also better to be proactive, plan and find ways to make it happen than sit on your hands and give up.

[stevdock]

You don't rule out making the move in the future just because of the present conditions. Also better to be proactive, plan and find ways to make it happen than sit on your hands and give up.

Once again I agree. But look at past history and tell me what is going to change to find the money?? Until that is answered, all of this is irrelevant.

[NDSUstudent]

Really?? Where the heck have I been the last oh hundred years or so to not know that football is king at NDSU. My point is, like it was last off-season and the off-season before that, that NDSU can't even scrape together 2 million dollars to finish off the BSA remodel. But yet those of you clamoring for FBS football never bring up how the heck NDSU is going to afford the extra 40+ scholarships that are at a bare minimum to move up.

I'm not saying NDSU couldn't compete quite nicely in the right FBS conference. They can and they will when the time is right. But stop looking at this as just a football move, this would be an entire athletic department move, and NDSU currently does not have the resources to do it.

I don't think affording it is the question...the real question is can we afford to do it the right way? I'm not so sure about that.

[NorthernBison]

I don't affording it is the question...the real question is can we afford to do it the right way? I'm not so sure about that.

What is our current budget compared to a MWC budget? 22 more Scholarships for football are peanuts. Coaches salaries, assistants, recruiting, travel, etc are significantly higher across the board.

I believe Gene KNEW we could get it done when we made the D1 move. He won't push an FBS move until he has the same assurances that the funds are there to make it work.

[NDSUstudent]

What is our current budget compared to a MWC budget? 22 more Scholarships for football are peanuts. Coaches salaries, assistants, recruiting, travel, etc are significantly higher across the board.

I believe Gene KNEW we could get it done when we made the D1 move. He won't push an FBS move until he has the same assurances that the funds are there to make it work.

Budgets...From....http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/story/2012-05-14/ncaa-college-athletics-finances-database/54955804/1

UNLV 60.55 Million
New Mexico 40.43
Air Force 39.43
Boise St 37.29
San Deigo St 36.05
Hawaii 36.34(football only in MWC)
Fresno 28.84
Wyoming 27.80
CSU 24.95
Nevada 23.11
Utah St 19.70
San Jose St 19.65

NDSU 15.35

[NDSUstudent]

Here is the MAC

Miami(oh) 26.98
UMass 26.963(football only)
Buffalo 26.22
EMU 25.97
WMU 25.41
CMU 23.42
Ohio 22.84
NIU 22.79
Kent St 20.76
Toledo 20.67
Akron 19.36
Bowling Green 18.03
Ball State 14.86

[56BISON73]

What is our current budget compared to a MWC budget? 22 more Scholarships for football are peanuts. Coaches salaries, assistants, recruiting, travel, etc are significantly higher across the board.

I believe Gene KNEW we could get it done when we made the D1 move. He won't push an FBS move until he has the same assurances that the funds are there to make it work.

+++++++++++++++

[roadwarrior]

Budgets...From....http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/story/2012-05-14/ncaa-college-athletics-finances-database/54955804/1

UNLV 60.55 Million
New Mexico 40.43
Air Force 39.43
Boise St 37.29
San Deigo St 36.05
Hawaii 36.34(football only in MWC)
Fresno 28.84
Wyoming 27.80
CSU 24.95
Nevada 23.11
Utah St 19.70
San Jose St 19.65

NDSU 15.35

There is your answer folks. I wonder how many of you screaming for a move to FBS give more than $5,000 a year to Teammakers?

[TransAmBison]

There is your answer folks. I wonder how many of you screaming for a move to FBS give more than $5,000 a year to Teammakers?Don't let facts get in the way of their belly-aching...

[MNLonghorn10]

better start whoring out then!

[TransAmBison]

better start whoring out then!I thought that's what you guys were already doing in teh Frisco Cruiser Bus?

[CaBisonFan]

Once again I agree. But look at past history and tell me what is going to change to find the money?? Until that is answered, all of this is irrelevant.

Same argument was used when the announcement was made about moving up to DI-AA.

Fargo-Moorhead and the surrounding area would support an FBS program in a big way.

Think 'Packers'...'Cornhuskers'...'Sooners'...and many other small-city major programs.

We're already running an fbs-caliber program. Why do you think we've been able to rise to the top so quickly?

[NDSU92]

Anybody have an estimate for increased revenue from increased student fees, more community involvement/donations/sponsorships, media contracts, and conference shared bowl revenue (believe it or not the vast majority of schools don't lose money on bowls) ? I feel like the numbers posted, especially the ones for the MAC actually point to an FBS move being quite feasible. But like others have said before, if we end up getting a conference invite GT will make the decision that is best for the University.

[MNLonghorn10]

I thought that's what you guys were already doing in teh Frisco Cruiser Bus?
Someone has to do it...they aint raising any money from the talent in the reserved spots.

[TransAmBison]

Someone has to do it...they aint raising any money from the talent in the reserved spots.Me thinks you will be in the reserved spots as well come fall.

[56BISON73]

Someone has to do it...they aint raising any money from the talent in the reserved spots.

75.00 a spot vs 18.00 a spot? Ok you go with that.:rofl:

[acf2]

Same argument was used when the announcement was made about moving up to DI-AA.

Fargo-Moorhead and the surrounding area would support an FBS program in a big way.

Think 'Packers'...'Cornhuskers'...'Sooners'...and many other small-city major programs.

We're already running an fbs-caliber program. Why do you think we've been able to rise to the top so quickly?

Green Bay: ~282,000 in metro, and huge following in Milwaukee. Plus the Packers are a totally different animal and real anomaly.
Lincoln: ~302,000 in metro. Omaha near by.
Norman: Part of the Oklahoma City Metro area ~1,253,000

Not to mention Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Oklahoma all have way larger populations then North Dakota.

[CaBisonFan]

Green Bay: ~282,000 in metro, and huge following in Milwaukee. Plus the Packers are a totally different animal and real anomaly.
Lincoln: ~302,000 in metro. Omaha near by.
Norman: Part of the Oklahoma City Metro area ~1,253,000

Not to mention Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Oklahoma all have way larger populations then North Dakota.

North Dakota State...large following in the tri-state area...including the Twin Cities.

Following would increase exponentially with move to the FBS.

Pullman, Washington...population 29,799.

[MNLonghorn10]

75.00 a spot vs 18.00 a spot? Ok you go with that.:rofl:
...

read what he said to me again. This has nothing to do with the cost of parking.

[IzzyFlexion]

Green Bay: ~282,000 in metro, and huge following in Milwaukee. Plus the Packers are a totally different animal and real anomaly.
Lincoln: ~302,000 in metro. Omaha near by.
Norman: Part of the Oklahoma City Metro area ~1,253,000

Not to mention Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Oklahoma all have way larger populations then North Dakota.

Green Bay is also close to a cluster of smaller cities totaling another 260,000 +.

Appleton: 72,000......30 miles.
Manitowoc: 33,000....30 miles.
Oshkosh: 66,000......50 miles.
Fon du Lac: 43,000.....73 miles.
Sheboygan: 50,000.....66 miles.


Not sure if Appleton is included in Green Bay's metro population.....I don't believe that it is.

[CaBisonFan]

And Fargo is next to Kindred, Wahpeton, Mayville, Argusville, Grandin, Ada, Dilworth, Casselton, and other densely populated areas.

[unbison]

And Fargo is next to Kindred, Wahpeton, Mayville, Argusville, Grandin, Ada, Dilworth, Casselton, and other densely populated areas.
Lol love it

[Hammersmith]

And Fargo is next to Kindred, Wahpeton, Mayville, Argusville, Grandin, Ada, Dilworth, Casselton, and other densely populated areas.
snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.

[Tatanka]

snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.I think your first mistake is thinking that his statement has anything to do with population density.

I would submit that Grand Forks and, every other year for a period of time, Bismarck, are by far the most densely populated places in the state if not the upper midwest. I will take his word for it in the small towns listed in his post.

And by that I mean the number of dense people that live there.

[CaBisonFan]

snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.

Every time I visit those communities they look different. The traffic is unbearable. I'd rather drive in LA.

For example...when I visited Mayville this winter, the Corner Cafe had closed...

...and someone had re-opened Pizza Hut as a Mexican Restaurant. Blew 'me' away.

Almost forgot...I saw a house being built just east of Mayville.

[CaBisonFan]

...but here's the real deal. A lot of big-city universities have trouble with maintaining dynasty programs. It's more about medium to small cities with support from the region. In the case of Nebraska it covers several states.

The FM region would support an FBS program in a big way.

[tony]

Blueprint for getting and accepting an FBS invitation:

1. Strengthen the university
2. Strengthen the athletic department
3. Improve facilities
4. Get a plan in place for raising an extra $10 million a year
5. Wait for an FBS conference to invite NDSU

What some people seem to think is a blueprint for going to an FBS conference:

1. Claim that the FCS is a joke... a lot
2. Act like the only reason that NDSU hasn't been invited by an FBS conference is that we haven't posted about it enough on the Bison Media Blog or Bisonville
3. Ignore any semblance of fiscal or political reality

[gotts]

snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.

Don't forget about Colfax, it's practically a booming metropolis!!!

[CaBisonFan]

Don't forget about Colfax, it's practically a booming metropolis!!!

Damn...I forgot. Hillsboro and Gardner too.

[Hammersmith]

Blueprint for getting and accepting an FBS invitation:

1. Strengthen the university
2. Strengthen the athletic department
3. Improve facilities
4. Get a plan in place for raising an extra $10 million a year
5. Wait for an FBS conference to invite NDSU

What some people seem to think is a blueprint for going to an FBS conference:

1. Claim that the FCS is a joke... a lot
2. Act like the only reason that NDSU hasn't been invited by an FBS conference is that we haven't posted about it enough on the Bison Media Blog or Bisonville
3. Ignore any semblance of fiscal or political reality
plus plus fraking plus

Is the above really that hard for people to grasp?

[BisonNation11]

plus plus fraking plus

Is the above really that hard for people to grasp?

If they don't, the lack of reality in here might turn us into el forko grande south :(

[BlueBisonRock]

snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.

To be fair, the community and county I grew up in has significantly fewer peeps than those communities. This is not to disparage your comment, but rather to point out that there towns that make your list look downright big. Heck, I hear that at least one of them has a traffic light - a concept (along with a cloverleaf intersection) that I had only read about until I started college.

[BlueBisonRock]

I think your first mistake is thinking that his statement has anything to do with population density.

I would submit that Grand Forks and, every other year for a period of time, Bismarck, are by far the most densely populated places in the state if not the upper midwest. I will take his word for it in the small towns listed in his post.

And by that I mean the number of dense people that live there.

Hey! I lived in Bismarck for seven years.

Oh? Unh. Never mind.

[NorthernBison]

To be fair, the community and county I grew up in has significantly fewer peeps than those communities. This is not to disparage your comment, but rather to point out that there towns that make your list look downright big. Heck, I hear that at least one of them has a traffic light - a concept (along with a cloverleaf intersection) that I had only read about until I started college.

Isn't there like ONE SCHOOL in the whole County. We got that beat big time.

[1998braves64]

Damn...I forgot. Hillsboro and Gardner too.
And the fine metropolis of Grandin..

[NorthernBison]

And the fine metropolis of Grandin..

Cool story: When I was 13, I played in a baseball game against Grandin at Red Willow Resort. No tournament. Just a challenge game for community pride. I played for the metropolis of Oberon, ND. A former resident of said city was bragging about how good his Grandin team was so it was decided to meet at Red Willow and decide things on the field. Great weekend. We took them down BTW.

[CaBisonFan]

And the fine metropolis of Grandin..

Yup...and Hope, Page, Clifford, and Galesburg. The sprawl is amazing.

[Hammersmith]

To be fair, the community and county I grew up in has significantly fewer peeps than those communities. This is not to disparage your comment, but rather to point out that there towns that make your list look downright big. Heck, I hear that at least one of them has a traffic light - a concept (along with a cloverleaf intersection) that I had only read about until I started college.
But this was the list he was comparing those communities to:

Appleton: 72,000......30 miles.
Manitowoc: 33,000....30 miles.
Oshkosh: 66,000......50 miles.
Fon du Lac: 43,000.....73 miles.
Sheboygan: 50,000.....66 miles.

Wahpeton is the biggest city on his list and is only around 6,500 w/o NDSCS students.

[CaBisonFan]

But this was the list he was comparing those communities to:


Wahpeton is the biggest city on his list and is only around 6,500 w/o NDSCS students.

It was a total joke.

[Hammersmith]

It was a total joke.
Well, kinda hard to tell one from t'other face like yours.

(points for spotting the reference)

[BisonTeacher]

Im pretty sure he was kidding. Just forgot his purple font.

[Hammersmith]

Im pretty sure he was kidding. Just forgot his purple font.
So was my last post. Was the reference too obscure?

[BisonTeacher]

So was my last post. Was the reference too obscure?

I didnt read your post until after i posted...or something like that.

[1998braves64]

Cool story: When I was 13, I played in a baseball game against Grandin at Red Willow Resort. No tournament. Just a challenge game for community pride. I played for the metropolis of Oberon, ND. A former resident of said city was bragging about how good his Grandin team was so it was decided to meet at Red Willow and decide things on the field. Great weekend. We took them down BTW.

cool story bro... of course you took them down! :P

[BisonFan02]

Cool story: When I was 13, I played in a baseball game against Grandin at Red Willow Resort. No tournament. Just a challenge game for community pride. I played for the metropolis of Oberon, ND. A former resident of said city was bragging about how good his Grandin team was so it was decided to meet at Red Willow and decide things on the field. Great weekend. We took them down BTW.

There should be a thread for nothing but Red Willow stories....Gabe, get on that.

[Ginsbach]

Excuse my ignorance but how does one improve academics for an accredited program? Is it based on grad programs and or research dollars?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Pretty much. They're trying to increase the number of PhD students enrolled, the number of graduate students as a whole graduating, the amount of publications, and the dollar amount for research grants.


snicker...snicker.......snicker......BWAAHAHAHAHA!

Oh, you were serious? I grew up in Wahp and have been to most of those communities. When was the last time you've been in one of them? They are about as far from "densely populated areas" as you can get.

As a Hankinson native who was in Wahpeton for the first time in 3 years over Christmas, that town is looking sad nowadays.

[Strongman]

Same arguments against moving up that were repeatedly argued against the FargoDome and moving up to DIAA. NDSU is already a top 50 or 60 program in the country. All these "negative" fans still have the small time mentality, circa 1966.(when my dad graduated from NDSU.) NDSU is not a big enough university. NDSU cannot raise the money. The Fargo-Moorhead metro area of 170,000 is not big enough. BLAH, BLAH. BLAH.

The word, cannot, should not be in North Dakota State's vocabulary. A successful move to the next level can be achieved. Taylor has already said it would be easier to move up to the next level than it was to move from DII to IAA. Wouldn't you want NDSU to be a legitimate top 20 team in the entire country, instead of the best in "small" time college football????

[56BISON73]

Same arguments against moving up that were repeatedly argued against the FargoDome and moving up to DIAA. NDSU is already a top 50 or 60 program in the country. All these "negative" fans still have the small time mentality, circa 1966.(when my dad graduated from NDSU.) NDSU is not a big enough university. NDSU cannot raise the money. The Fargo-Moorhead metro area of 170,000 is not big enough. BLAH, BLAH. BLAH.

The word, cannot, should not be in North Dakota State's vocabulary. A successful move to the next level can be achieved. Taylor has already said it would be easier to move up to the next level than it was to move from DII to IAA. Wouldn't you want NDSU to be a legitimate top 20 team in the entire country, instead of the best in "small" time college football????

And you keep posting the same blah blah blah blah yourself. NDSU will move up when they determine its beneficial to the program.

[344Johnson]

North Dakota State...large following in the tri-state area...including the Twin Cities.

Following would increase exponentially with move to the FBS.

Pullman, Washington...population 29,799.

Pullman, Washington...population 29,799. Home to a major State University in a much more populated state. Also home to the team whose flag is ALWAYS on college gameday.

I'll let Gene and the athletic department/University as a whole figure out when/if moving up is a good idea. I would presume they have access to(not to mention the knowhow to interpret) data that would indicate whether moving up is good/bad/neutral for the school.

Like Tony said, figure a way out to raise an extra $10,000,000 a year(approximately 10/35's of the SHAC annually), then get the ball rolling.

I expect NDSU to be FBS or whatever they decide to call it by the time I am 40. 19 more years! PumP iT uPPP!!!!!11

[CaBisonFan]

Pullman, Washington...population 29,799. Home to a major State University in a much more populated state. Also home to the team whose flag is ALWAYS on college gameday.

I'll let Gene and the athletic department/University as a whole figure out when/if moving up is a good idea. I would presume they have access to(not to mention the knowhow to interpret) data that would indicate whether moving up is good/bad/neutral for the school.

Like Tony said, figure a way out to raise an extra $10,000,000 a year(approximately 10/35's of the SHAC annually), then get the ball rolling.

I expect NDSU to be FBS or whatever they decide to call it by the time I am 40. 19 more years! PumP iT uPPP!!!!!11

People from Seattle and the rest of the coast don't travel to Pullman. Spokane is 75 miles to the north. Not much else out there.

I'll let GT decide too.

[TransAmBison]

Pullman, Washington...population 29,799. Home to a major State University in a much more populated state. Also home to the team whose flag is ALWAYS on college gameday.

I'll let Gene and the athletic department/University as a whole figure out when/if moving up is a good idea. I would presume they have access to(not to mention the knowhow to interpret) data that would indicate whether moving up is good/bad/neutral for the school.

Like Tony said, figure a way out to raise an extra $10,000,000 a year(approximately 10/35's of the SHAC annually), then get the ball rolling.

I expect NDSU to be FBS or whatever they decide to call it by the time I am 40. 19 more years! PumP iT uPPP!!!!!11You know, if Tony started paying out dividends on rep points, we might be able to fund teh FBS movement.*















*Which was just flushed up north.

[CaBisonFan]

Same arguments against moving up that were repeatedly argued against the FargoDome and moving up to DIAA. NDSU is already a top 50 or 60 program in the country. All these "negative" fans still have the small time mentality, circa 1966.(when my dad graduated from NDSU.) NDSU is not a big enough university. NDSU cannot raise the money. The Fargo-Moorhead metro area of 170,000 is not big enough. BLAH, BLAH. BLAH.

The word, cannot, should not be in North Dakota State's vocabulary. A successful move to the next level can be achieved. Taylor has already said it would be easier to move up to the next level than it was to move from DII to IAA. Wouldn't you want NDSU to be a legitimate top 20 team in the entire country, instead of the best in "small" time college football????

You understand.

[BisonTeacher]

Wouldn't you want NDSU to be a legitimate top 20 team in the entire country, instead of the best in "small" time college football????

Not unless there was a playoff system where we legitsmately get a shot. Otherwise all you get is to say" we were a top 20 team this year". That and a dollar will get you a cheap cup of coffee.

Seriously...is that all you want? Just to be able to say ndsu is top 20? Just so you can say "look! My team is on college gameday" "I went to school there. Lets go Bison!"

[unbison]

Same arguments against moving up that were repeatedly argued against the FargoDome and moving up to DIAA. NDSU is already a top 50 or 60 program in the country. All these "negative" fans still have the small time mentality, circa 1966.(when my dad graduated from NDSU.) NDSU is not a big enough university. NDSU cannot raise the money. The Fargo-Moorhead metro area of 170,000 is not big enough. BLAH, BLAH. BLAH.

The word, cannot, should not be in North Dakota State's vocabulary. A successful move to the next level can be achieved. Taylor has already said it would be easier to move up to the next level than it was to move from DII to IAA. Wouldn't you want NDSU to be a legitimate top 20 team in the entire country, instead of the best in "small" time college football????

Top 20? In what? Wrestling?

[344Johnson]

Top 20? In what? Wrestling?

lol burn. 10 char.

[NorthernBison]

You understand.

I'd have to disagree totally with that assessment.

When we talk FBS, we are talking about moving ALL SPORTS to a different conference that sponsors football at the FBS level.

MVC? Nope. Not an FBS conference.
MAC? Well, assuming they might consider us, we would probably have to DOUBLE our budget to get to mid pack in that conference competitively for all sports.
MWC? I don't think they have ANY interest in us and the largest Athletic budget is QUADRUPLE what ours is currently. Travel would bite.

Are there any other FBS conferences that might have the SLIGHTEST interest in offering NDSU a spot if we put the word out? I'm asking because I can't really think of any.

[Hammerhead]

Maybe the B1G will expand to 18 teams and invite us. :p

[870XPRS]

This should be posted everytime this comes up.....


Blueprint for getting and accepting an FBS invitation:

1. Strengthen the university
2. Strengthen the athletic department
3. Improve facilities
4. Get a plan in place for raising an extra $10 million a year
5. Wait for an FBS conference to invite NDSU

What some people seem to think is a blueprint for going to an FBS conference:

1. Claim that the FCS is a joke... a lot
2. Act like the only reason that NDSU hasn't been invited by an FBS conference is that we haven't posted about it enough on the Bison Media Blog or Bisonville
3. Ignore any semblance of fiscal or political reality

[CaBisonFan]

Strongman gets it totally. His response should be posted every time this comes up.

[TransAmBison]

Strongman gets it totally. His response should be posted every time this comes up.
How about instead of making new posts, people just copy and paste one of the two differing opinions?

[IzzyFlexion]

How about instead of making new posts, people just copy and paste one of the two differing opinions?

i smell a new BV Jeopardy category..........................

[stevdock]

Has anyone ever done a cost-benefit analysis on our athletic department?? Meaning I think our budget was about 15 million, do we get 15 million+ in return for spending that. I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that information. Reason for the question: it is hard to justify doubling a budget when it is questionable what the benefit will be to the school.

[NorthernBison]

Has anyone ever done a cost-benefit analysis on our athletic department?? Meaning I think our budget was about 15 million, do we get 15 million+ in return for spending that. I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that information. Reason for the question: it is hard to justify doubling a budget when it is questionable what the benefit will be to the school.

I've seen links to reported information before and, for some odd reason, the income and expense always match to the penny. At least, that's what the NDSU numbers always show. I really wonder how comparable the budget information is from school to school.

[Strongman]

Funny how nobody bothers to research how NDSU's budget, facilities, stadium, etc. compares to MAC teams or other non BCS conference teams before criticizing the move up. It's not even close to doubling the budget. We are not going to be joining the Big 10. (Well at least not until circa 2050.)

[stevdock]

Funny how nobody bothers to research how NDSU's budget, facilities, stadium, etc. compares to MAC teams or other non BCS conference teams before criticizing the move up. It's not even close to doubling the budget. We are not going to be joining the Big 10. (Well at least not until circa 2050.)

Doubling the budget would get us into the middle of the MAC. It's already been brought up. Leaving the budget the way it is would put us at the bottom of the MAC.

[56BISON73]

Funny how nobody bothers to research how NDSU's budget, facilities, stadium, etc. compares to MAC teams or other non BCS conference teams before criticizing the move up. It's not even close to doubling the budget. We are not going to be joining the Big 10. (Well at least not until circa 2050.)

All of those points have been discussed at length.

[BisonNation11]

Funny how nobody bothers to research how NDSU's budget, facilities, stadium, etc. compares to MAC teams or other non BCS conference teams before criticizing the move up. It's not even close to doubling the budget. We are not going to be joining the Big 10. (Well at least not until circa 2050.)

Circa 2050 will put the B1G budgets exponentially as far ahead of us then as they are now. Everyone will grow respectively according to geography due to tv markets and population. There is nothing wrong with the size we are now and we will grow at a rate that fits the university. You can do all the research you want, it doesn't put money in the bank, butts in every venue at every game or build facilities when they are needed the most.

[DePereBisonFan]

Doubling the budget would get us into the middle of the MAC. It's already been brought up. Leaving the budget the way it is would put us at the second to the bottom of the MAC, ahead of Bowling Green.

FIFY.

...10 char

[tony]

FIFY.

...10 char

Only thing I could find on MAC budgets was this: http://www.hustlebelt.com/2011/3/29/2078144/mid-american-conference-school-revenue-expenses-database

NDSU's budget is apparently 16 million. Did MAC budgets really increase that much in the last two years? Looks like NDSU is already in the ballpark of Ball State, Bowling Green, and Buffalo (btw, I want to know Buffalo's secret - according to the story they are making $8 million profit on their budget!)

[Strongman]

Interesting article in Fargo Forum today indicating that FM metro will have 300,000 by 2040. 150,000 in Fargo and 45,000 in West Fargo. 300,000 metro can support a big time program.