Fire Bohl and Vigen

[bisontwice]

Forgot, that was a couple of years ago. My how things have changed. It is amazing how good an OC looks when there is some more talent at the receiver spot so the QB actually has receivers to throw to them and how much more that opens up the run game. Vigs certainly may have improved some as well with experience but the talent level has as well.

[ndsubison1]

we probably wont be seeing that double reverse for awhile now since it didnt work. haha

[CaBisonFan]

Vigen has improved. We have a solid QB situation, great RBs, and more depth of talent at wide receiver.

[North Side]

Vigen has improved. We have a solid QB situation, great RBs, and more depth of talent at wide receiver.
Has Vigen really improved? Or have our players just gotten better? Mertens and Mohler are not Jensen... We ran that running back slip screen play again (same one DJ scored on back in the championship game). We must run that play 3 times every game. Teams have to know its coming but they still can't stop it because our players are that good.

[NDSU_grad]

Great players make great coaches.

[NorthernBison]

Hmm. If other teams KNOW that play is coming but can't stop it, then it must be that they don't know WHEN it is coming.

That would be brilliant play calling. Careful what argument you try to make.

[BisonNeil]

we probably wont be seeing that double reverse for awhile now since it didnt work. haha

That was a bewildering call, no doubt, especially in such tight space as in the red zone, and after the Bison had been piss-pounding them. But, everyone has a brain fart every once in a while :D

[A1pigskin]

The talent level is higher so the plays are mixed up more. A few years ago we all could call the play. Recruiting played a big role after a couple losing seasons.

[kab1one]

But what would you do differently?

They complete 65-70 percent of the passes (The Joe Montana 49er's had a short passing game).

They run the ball well.

If they do a "trick" play and it doesn't work, they get criticized.

If they don't run the trick play, they get criticized.

The fact of the matter is, this is a very good football team that does the basis very well. They hold on to the ball, they are winning at the line of scrimmage and the defense is second to none.

What plays do you want added that aren't there?

[westnodak93bison]

Giants just ran a fake reverse middle screen. I dont think we run it or do we? Also, go five wide on occasion.

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[KTF]

Giants just ran a fake reverse middle screen. I dont think we run it or do we? Also, go five wide on occasion.

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Didn't we go 4 wide last night?

[56BISON73]

That was a bewildering call, no doubt, especially in such tight space as in the red zone, and after the Bison had been piss-pounding them. But, everyone has a brain fart every once in a while :D

Havent they run that in every game so far with no effect? May be next time it will be just a single reverse.

[heffray]

Havent they run that in every game so far with no effect? May be next time it will be just a single reverse.

Thought I saw Wahlo run one in one of the early games. I guess it doesn't really count if it was against RMU or PV...

[56BISON73]

Thought I saw Wahlo run one in one of the early games. I guess it doesn't really count if it was against RMU or PV...

If you cant run it against them you think you can get that by UNI?

[X-Factor]

Did you watch the Uni game? We went 5 wide on several occasions. Some very different passing sets as well. Trips left, right, diamond sets, etc.

[IzzyFlexion]

went double stack once.
Never seen an SU team use that.

[EndZoneQB]

The talent level is higher so the plays are mixed up more. A few years ago we all could call the play. Recruiting played a big role after a couple losing seasons.

I still feel like it's fairly easy to call the play. Vigen still has his tendencies and you can tell what plays he has a boner over...we are just getting good push in the run game so he's getting away with it.

[tony]

I can only assume that the guys on this board who aren't saying, "Yeah, I was wrong to be calling for Vigen's job over and over and over again," have what the French would call a "idée fixe."

Yeah, that's right, I've come to the conclusion that you guys are French! Admit it! I mean, who else would argue that NDSU's offense is only good because it has talent or that it's too predictable.

YOU GUYS WERE WRONG. LET THE BALL SACK DROP AND ADMIT IT. :)

[BadlandsBison]

I still feel like it's fairly easy to call the play. Vigen still has his tendencies and you can tell what plays he has a boner over...we are just getting good push in the run game so he's getting away with it.

Middle screen, anyone?

[BisonTeacher]

We must run that play 3 times every game. Teams have to know its coming but they still can't stop it because our players are that good.

How many years did we run the option? Everyone knew it was coming but still couldnt stop it. I will agree and say sometimes it seems we try to get too fancy. Strategery? Just run the damn ball. That was for you grafton!!! See you next weekend...im getting pretty excited for the weekend!

[heffray]

If you cant run it against them you think you can get that by UNI?

No. I agree that it's not really effective. Certainly not when it's used often. I thought I remember it going for a first down and some change though. All the same, no real reason for that play with our offense...

[CAS4127]

I am just simply amazed we have been able to keep Vigen on our staff these many years. He must really love it here to not take all these other offers with bigger programs/NFL. Amazing really!!!


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[heffray]

I can only assume that the guys on this board who aren't saying, "Yeah, I was wrong to be calling for Vigen's job over and over and over again," have what the French would call a "idée fixe."

Yeah, that's right, I've come to the conclusion that you guys are French! Admit it! I mean, who else would argue that NDSU's offense is only good because it has talent or that it's too predictable.

YOU GUYS WERE WRONG. LET THE BALL SACK DROP AND ADMIT IT. :)

I don't know Harry, the French are assholes.

[1998braves64]

How many years did we run the option? Everyone knew it was coming but still couldnt stop it. I will agree and say sometimes it seems we try to get too fancy. Strategery? Just run the damn ball. That was for you grafton!!! See you next weekend...im getting pretty excited for the weekend!

They knew the option was coming... it's just a matter of which option which made it tough on teams! Imagine it is hard for a defense that's use to swarming the ball to stick to their assigned player with the option (every defensive player wants to make the tackle!).

[tony]

I am just simply amazed we have been able to keep Vigen on our staff these many years. He must really love it here to not take all these other offers with bigger programs/NFL. Amazing really!!!

And if we brought in a new OC, NDSU would switch to a multi-volume offensive playbook like Portland State and Indiana (PA) and all those other offensive genius teams that won so many championships.

Time to admit that you were wrong or shush or I will be forced to debate you further.

[BisonNation11]

With a newly found, consistent passing game, run all the boring, mundane, predictable plays all you want. I will take an average of 400 yards per game with our defense any day against any team.

[westnodak93bison]

Yeah, I was wrong about Vigen. He has come around.

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[CAS4127]

And if we brought in a new OC, NDSU would switch to a multi-volume offensive playbook like Portland State and Indiana (PA) and all those other offensive genius teams that won so many championships.

Time to admit that you were wrong or shush or I will be forced to debate you further.

This could get interesting!!! :)


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[BisonTeacher]

With a newly found, consistent passing game, run all the boring, mundane, predictable plays all you want. I will take an average of 400 yards per game with our defense any day against any team.

This! ++++++++

[DjKyRo]

I think past criticisms of vigen were fair, but you have to acknowledge that he's developed Jensen into a total stud in his time here. The offense is as explosive as its been in the d-1 era and vigen defInitely deserves a ton of credit for that.

[westnodak93bison]

It didnt help having minimal depth at WR and QB.

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[344Johnson]

It didnt help having minimal depth at WR and QB.

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Fact. We were mediocre or hurt at these positions. Now that we aren't, we are seeing good things(gasp!).

[ndsubison1]

ive noticed about 99% of the time cooper wahlo is in we run the ball

[CalBison97]

Great players make great coaches.

And vice-versa

[WYOBISONMAN]

Has Vigen really improved? Or have our players just gotten better? Mertens and Mohler are not Jensen... We ran that running back slip screen play again (same one DJ scored on back in the championship game). We must run that play 3 times every game. Teams have to know its coming but they still can't stop it because our players are that good.

I really think this is a huge part of it. We did not have the horses to carry us during the Mertens era.

[Kujava23]

THE BEST ADVICE FOR PEOPLE GIVING ADVICE TO BOHL AND VIGEN

Let them do their jobs!
have been doing this for a while and KNOW what they are doing!!

NEVER like people who criticize coaches and give their "2 Cents"

[CAS4127]

THE BEST ADVICE FOR PEOPLE GIVING ADVICE TO BOHL AND VIGEN

Let them do their jobs!
have been doing this for a while and KNOW what they are doing!!

NEVER like people who criticize coaches and give their "2 Cents"

As you give your "2 Cents" . . .

[BisonAccountant44]

I really think this is a huge part of it. We did not have the horses to carry us during the Mertens era.

There's a little bit of Tecmo Bowl strategy going on too. We're not going to reinvent the playbook from week to week (on either side) so by now teams should have a pretty good idea of what we're going to do. The trick is to out guess them by running something other than what is expected for certain situations, and to out execute them when we run exactly what they're expecting.

I think what we're seeing now, is a combination of better execution, and at dialing up pass 1 when the d guesses pass 2.

[CAS4127]

There's a little bit of Tecmo Bowl strategy going on too. We're not going to reinvent the playbook from week to week (on either side) so by now teams should have a pretty good idea of what we're going to do. The trick is to out guess them by running something other than what is expected for certain situations, and to out execute them when we run exactly what they're expecting.

I think what we're seeing now, is a combination of better execution, and at dialing up pass 1 when the d guesses pass 2.

It's called down and distance tendencies. Whoever is in charge of "quality control" of our offense keeps track of these numbers, and Vigen (in theory) is supposed to know them as well so as not to be completely predictable. When other teams breakdown our film, they formulate our down and distance tendencies from those.

Cat and mouse game . . . and that's where an intelligent and creative offensive coordinator should shine. Oh, and spectacular throws, catches and runs are not the product of the OC-->just sayin' there!!

[EndZoneQB]

It's called down and distance tendencies. Whoever is in charge of "quality control" of our offense keeps track of these numbers, and Vigen (in theory) is supposed to know them as well so as not to be completely predictable. When other teams breakdown our film, they formulate our down and distance tendencies from those.

Cat and mouse game . . . and that's where an intelligent and creative offensive coordinator should shine. Oh, and spectacular throws, catches and runs are not the product of the OC-->just sayin' there!!

Exactly. And while things have improved by the way of plays working better, whoever gets the credit, I still feel like we have some fairly strong tendencies. I will say I haven't paid as much attention to it this year through the first part of the season because the games have largely been cakewalks, other than UNI, which I didn't get to watch most of the game.

[CAS4127]

Exactly. And while things have improved by the way of plays working better, whoever gets the credit, I still feel like we have some fairly strong tendencies. I will say I haven't paid as much attention to it this year through the first part of the season because the games have largely been cakewalks, other than UNI, which I didn't get to watch most of the game.

A positive to playing UNI and YSU early in the conference season (our top competitors for the most part in the MVFC this year) is that "D&D numbers" aren't as exact as they will be later in the season. The better the competition, the more important "D&D numbers" become IMO.

[Herd Hauler]

This years Bison "O" has been far more impressive than past years IMHO. Balance between pass/rush yards have been pretty equal (966/919) as well as the domintating TOP (35 minutes per game). It was amazing during that drive early in 4th quarter watchin UNI's front 4 inability to pick themselves up from the turf from being totally dominted by the Rams. NDSU was up to the line and ready to go while they were bent over,hands on knees and sucking wind. Maybe be "vanilla" but I will take it every game.

[WYOBISONMAN]

THE BEST ADVICE FOR PEOPLE GIVING ADVICE TO BOHL AND VIGEN

Let them do their jobs!
have been doing this for a while and KNOW what they are doing!!

NEVER like people who criticize coaches and give their "2 Cents"

Seriously........like they listen to a bunch of old alumni?!?!?! Don't worry......I suspect nothing in the playbook is coming from Bisonville.

[Wacker_in_the_Hall]

Obviously there are several brilliant minds on Bisonville smarter than Vigen who would have had us as undefeated and National Champions last year. And he is so predictable that our opponents continue to outwit us nearly every game this year.

It is a team game boys.....22 guys not 11. Lets win the game and not worry about how many yards, or why did we pass so much....

[BisonTeacher]

Obviously there are several brilliant minds on Bisonville smarter than Vigen who would have had us as undefeated and National Champions in 2010

FIFY....10 Char...

[westnodak93bison]

We have had real nice balance this year.

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[THEsocalledfan]

I have been silent, and have been very critical of Vigen in the past. (I ALWAYS stood up for Bohl.) I knew Brent in college, and even high school, and he really is a great guy. So, I have no personal axe to grind.

With this said, he is certainly not "creative" as CAS has pointed out. However, it is working and those kids are obviously very well coached and know their roles. Vigen needs to get credit for that.

So, I certainly see no reason for a change, but not sure if Vigen would be doing as well with more marginal players. However, his offense seems to be doing the fundamental things right and that is also good coaching.

What's the old saying about QB's and coaches? They get too much credit when you win and too much blame when you lose?

[westnodak93bison]

We need to realize that the O is also a reflection of the HC. Its about defense and ball control. Obviously we have the personal to make it work.

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[LITTLEGUYSINGREEN]

I can only assume that the guys on this board who aren't saying, "Yeah, I was wrong to be calling for Vigen's job over and over and over again," have what the French would call a "idée fixe."

Yeah, that's right, I've come to the conclusion that you guys are French! Admit it! I mean, who else would argue that NDSU's offense is only good because it has talent or that it's too predictable.

YOU GUYS WERE WRONG. LET THE BALL SACK DROP AND ADMIT IT. :)

I may have been wrong.

Unless, we start losing..............:biggrin:

[LITTLEGUYSINGREEN]

THE BEST ADVICE FOR PEOPLE GIVING ADVICE TO BOHL AND VIGEN

Let them do their jobs!
have been doing this for a while and KNOW what they are doing!!

NEVER like people who criticize coaches and give their "2 Cents"

This is a fan message board. What else are we supposed to do??????

[AjaxTheMighty]

THE BEST ADVICE FOR PEOPLE GIVING ADVICE TO BOHL AND VIGEN

Let them do their jobs!
have been doing this for a while and KNOW what they are doing!!

NEVER like people who criticize coaches and give their "2 Cents"

This is a message board there sprout! If you don't like someone giving their "2 cents" you need to read "little house on the prairie" or Dr Seuss! This is a message board!!