WAC in trouble

[NDSU92]

Seen many articles from analysts saying that the WAC is all but done. Any insight on how it affects us or teams in the area?

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7871430/utah-state-aggies-san-jose-state-spartans-join-mountain-west-conference-according-report

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/18912164/onceproud-and-large-wac-on-its-death-bed-and-thats-a-shame

[NorthernBison]

So, if the WAC implodes there will be one or more football playing schools out there that need a home. Is Idaho the least bit likely to accept a move back to FCS? If they did, is there a FCS conference that might be looking for another member in their footprint? Would they need to kick somebody out to make that work?

[tony]

Was the WAC Attack one of those pre-emptive nuclear deals?

I suppose Idaho could join the Big Sky... could also end up dropping football.

[NorthernBison]

I've lost track of who is in what conference. What's left of the WAC? Why would the MWC want to be back in the same conference with the WAC schools?

[NDSU92]

After this fall, the WAC will be left with only two football members: Idaho and New Mexico State. I'm not sure which one is responsible for turning out the lights.

From the top link on the OP, apparently there are just two football teams left as of the 2013 season? Is that right?

[zooropa]

I've lost track of who is in what conference. What's left of the WAC? Why would the MWC want to be back in the same conference with the WAC schools?
Because the MWC, which was formed by members dismayed at the loss of identity, dilution of competition and sprawling footprint of the new WAC, need extra members in order to merge with the C-USA.

[zooropa]

From the top link on the OP, apparently there are just two football teams left as of the 2013 season? Is that right?If, as rumored, Utah State, etc., are invited into the MWC, yes.

[NorthernBison]

Because the MWC, which was formed by members dismayed at the loss of identity, dilution of competition and sprawling footprint of the new WAC, need extra members in order to merge with the C-USA.

Saw on another thread that C-USA is adding Charlotte and ODU. That's a surprise. Right?

[The_Sicatoka]

The full C-USA story:
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/campusrivalry/post/2012/05/conference-usa-expansion-six-schools/1

Un. Real.

[NDSU92]

The full C-USA story:
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/campusrivalry/post/2012/05/conference-usa-expansion-six-schools/1

Un. Real.

What the hell is going on?

[Bison bison]

It's genius.

Conference USA is putting its stranglehold on Thursday Night College Football...

[missingnumber7]

And all those folks said we should move up to the WAC...lmao

[tjbison]

Im starting to wonder if there isnt some real shuffling coming in the NCAA Football Divisions and these schools are placing themselves to not be "left out".

I mean is there something coming where BCS splits, non-BCS FBS is DI, FCS is DII and all the current DII DIII get jumbled into the "new" DIII. Something is odd when schools that just start Football are jumping before they have even played a game and in this economy its not like they have gigantic fanbases.

Something smells fishy to me

[NDSU92]

Im starting to wonder if there isnt some real shuffling coming in the NCAA Football Divisions and these schools are placing themselves to not be "left out".

I mean is there something coming where BCS splits, non-BCS FBS is DI, FCS is DII and all the current DII DIII get jumbled into the "new" DIII. Something is odd when schools that just start Football are jumping before they have even played a game and in this economy its not like they have gigantic fanbases.

Something smells fishy to me

Exactly what I was thinking, either that or schools realize that not having an attendance of 2,000+ doesn't work at the FCS level and are moving up to FBS hoping to draw crowds of 25,000+ which would be a pretty bold strategy to say the least

[zooropa]

Something is odd when schools that just start Football are jumping before they have even played a game

Permit me to offer the following simpler, and more plausible explanation:

It's Texas.

or, in the case of South Alabama:

It's Alabama.

[Swaghook]

What happens if Idaho asks to realign back to the FCS and seeks Big Sky affiliation? Might give the sky another reason to rethink the whole UND mess.

[NDSUstudent]

I doubt it, the Big Sky can add Idaho and get to an even number of schools, 12 core members and 14 football playing members.

[Swaghook]

Is it New Mexico State that is sitting out in the cold along with Idaho?

[NDSUstudent]

Yeah, NMSU is left out in the cold too(I doubt New Mexico wants them in the MWC). Denver and Seattle are also without a conference if the WAC folds.

[344Johnson]

Im starting to wonder if there isnt some real shuffling coming in the NCAA Football Divisions and these schools are placing themselves to not be "left out".

I mean is there something coming where BCS splits, non-BCS FBS is DI, FCS is DII and all the current DII DIII get jumbled into the "new" DIII. Something is odd when schools that just start Football are jumping before they have even played a game and in this economy its not like they have gigantic fanbases.

Something smells fishy to me

If it comes to that, I'd like NDSU to move up to the Non-BCS Division 1. We could easily compete with those schools.

But yes, this stuff is all very confusing now. The conferences I grew up with, PAC 10, Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, Big East, and ACC are all different. The MWC is different, the WAC is disappearing...Conference USA is well...whatever they are. The Sun Belt is doing its own thing now too.

My brain has about a 50/50 chance of exploding by the time this is all over.

[tjbison]

Permit me to offer the following simpler, and more plausible explanation:

It's Texas.

or, in the case of South Alabama:

It's Alabama.

What difference does that make, its Georgia and GSU and GSU both going FBS ODU, Charlotte, Umass, and I suspect App ST is next, just seams something is up

[tjbison]

If it comes to that, I'd like NDSU to move up to the Non-BCS Division 1. We could easily compete with those schools.

But yes, this stuff is all very confusing now. The conferences I grew up with, PAC 10, Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, Big East, and ACC are all different. The MWC is different, the WAC is disappearing...Conference USA is well...whatever they are. The Sun Belt is doing its own thing now too.

My brain has about a 50/50 chance of exploding by the time this is all over.

Well conferences change all the time, the same ones I grew up with haven't existed for some time, but never have the lower teams moved this much

[NDSU92]

If it comes to that, I'd like NDSU to move up to the Non-BCS Division 1. We could easily compete with those schools.

But yes, this stuff is all very confusing now. The conferences I grew up with, PAC 10, Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, Big East, and ACC are all different. The MWC is different, the WAC is disappearing...Conference USA is well...whatever they are. The Sun Belt is doing its own thing now too.

My brain has about a 50/50 chance of exploding by the time this is all over.

Definitely agree with you here, if we realigned with the current non-BCS FBS and top tier FCS schools I'd love to be in a conference with UNI, the Dakota schools, the Montana schools and possibly southern Ill along with some current FBSers

[Swaghook]

Yeah, NMSU is left out in the cold too(I doubt New Mexico wants them in the MWC). Denver and Seattle are also without a conference if the WAC folds. So my thought is if NMSU would drop down to FCS for lack of an FBS conference and Idaho does as well I'm sure the Big Sky would take them over a troubled UND.

[zooropa]

What difference does that make, its Georgia and GSU and GSU both going FBS ODU, Charlotte, Umass, and I suspect App ST is next, just seams something is up

So you think what? That a memo got circulated to dozens of 'in' schools advising them to move to FBS or else risk being reclassified as D-2?

Football is king, and these schools are all angling to be part of the only meaningful football division. I mean, it's cool NDSU won the FCS title and everything, but you know where that ended up on ESPN.com? Buried 'below the fold' on the home page, under "FCS and other divisions", and as a briefly shown line item on the SI.com and Yahoo.com AP feeds on the right side of the screen.

FCS is second class, man, and these schools all think they should be first class all around. It's purely ego driven, which means it's generally a bad move.

This has nothing to do with some incipient move by the NCAA to freeze all but 120 or so teams out of the MBB tournament.

[DePereBisonFan]

Was the WAC Attack one of those pre-emptive nuclear deals?

I suppose Idaho could join the Big Sky... could also end up dropping football.

Big Sky would probably prefer Idaho more than UND. Just sayin'...

[DePereBisonFan]

And all those folks said we should move up to the WAC...lmao

Actually, it wasn't all those folks. It was just Lakes saying it all those times.

[tony]

Big Sky would probably prefer Idaho more than UND. Just sayin'...

Sure, if it came down to a choice between the two, the Big Sky would take Idaho over UND (or NDSU, for that matter), but that is not the situation. Adding Idaho might even make keeping UND a little more attractive if it helps scheduling (I forget what the deal was but the scheduling with UND is supposedly not ideal.)

If UND gets a Big Sky booting, it will because of the nickname.

[DePereBisonFan]

Another Dream Conference Situation - moving up to whatever the FBS is. We could call it the "Logical Geographic Footprint Conference":

Montana
Montana State
Colorado State
Wyoming
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Iowa State (or, if not them, then North Dakota and South Dakota)
Illinois State
Indiana State

[344Johnson]

Another Dream Conference Situation - moving up to whatever the FBS is. We could call it the "Logical Geographic Footprint Conference":

Montana
Montana State
Colorado State
Wyoming
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Iowa State (or, if not them, then North Dakota and South Dakota)
Illinois State
Indiana State

Good luck getting Iowa State to sign off on that.

[IndyBison]

Another Dream Conference Situation - moving up to whatever the FBS is. We could call it the "Logical Geographic Footprint Conference":

Montana
Montana State
Colorado State
Wyoming
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Iowa State (or, if not them, then North Dakota and South Dakota)
Illinois State
Indiana State
A large geography but similar schools. Don't forget when putting together a conference that weaker teams are not a bad thing. If everyone is good then a very good team is going 2-9.

[NDSUstudent]

You can probably put this into the dream conference scenario as well but an FCS WAC...

West
Idaho
Boise State*
Seattle*
Portland State
Montana
Montana State

East
Denver*
New Mexico State
North Dakota
North Dakota St
South Dakota
South Dakota St

*Football only

[onbison09]

Well I'm just glad my school is leaving the Sun Belt and going to CUSA. Might not be perfect but it's better than what we have now. Also my friend works in the athletic department and he said the WAC called all the time and invited us. This is why we said no.

Is the Summit in trouble? Butler's going to the A-10 from the Horizon so Oakland and IUPUI would be logical fits no?

[zooropa]

so Oakland and IUPUI would be logical fits no?
There have been reports that the Horizon has a baseball requirement, which drops IUPUI; there are more substantial reports that the Horizon requires a 5,000 seat facility, which drops IUPUI and Oakland (Oakland is close though).

As far as conferences being 'in trouble', no conference is in trouble as long as it has an autobid. The WAC will probably survive as a non-FB conference due to its autobid.

[zooropa]

East

New Mexico State

South Dakota St

How, again, is this better than the Summit?

[NDSUstudent]

How, again, is this better than the Summit?

Its worlds better than the Summit if Oakland leaves, it basically the Big Sky without all the fluff but I called it a dream conference for a reason.

The Summit and Horizon should just merge for baseball.

[EndZoneQB]

Its worlds better than the Summit if Oakland leaves, it basically the Big Sky without all the fluff but I called it a dream conference for a reason.

The Summit and Horizon should just merge for baseball.

I'd actually say, other than the obvious RPI issues, the Summit is still a pretty good home without Oakland. It still has an autobid and that road just got easier.

[NDSUstudent]

If Oakland leaves the Summit is an means to an autobid and that is about it. As a basketball fan the league basically does nothing for me, besides us and SDSU...ORU and Oakland were the only schools that put a lot into building solid programs, all of the other schools lack the needed support(the jury is still out regarding USD).

[zooropa]

Its worlds better than the Summit if Oakland leaves
That is not an indisputable conclusion.


The Summit and Horizon should just merge for baseball.
That means giving up an autobid.

[NDSUstudent]

That is not an indisputable conclusion.

That means giving up an autobid.

If Oakland leaves we have five baseball playing members left, we'd have to add UND and UNC just to survive and really I'm not sure if that is better than just merging.

[zooropa]

If Oakland leaves we have five baseball playing members left, we'd have to add UND and UNC just to survive and really I'm not sure if that is better than just merging.

Adding one is better than adding eight.

[NDSUstudent]

Adding one is better than adding eight.

If Oakland leaves we have to add two(heck as things sit now our coach wants to add two). So it would be either playing in a seven team league or a 10 team league and there would be a lot of stability with 10 members.

[zooropa]

there would be a lot of stability with 10 members.

No there wouldn't. Not with a bunch of Horizon League schools. Those schools would view membership in any conference with the xDSUs as a temporary measure. On the other hand, if you were to add UNC and UND after the nickname mess, those schools wouldn't be as keen to ditch the Summit.

[NDSUstudent]

No there wouldn't. Not with a bunch of Horizon League schools. Those schools would view membership in any conference with the xDSUs as a temporary measure. On the other hand, if you were to add UNC and UND after the nickname mess, those schools wouldn't be as keen to ditch the Summit.

Six of the 10 schools in the league would be or have been in a league with the XDSUs. I don't think being in a baseball conference with the XDSU's would be a big deal, we are talking about baseball here which isn't exactly a major sport at any of these schools.

[zooropa]

Six of the 10 schools in the league would be or have been in a league with the XDSUs. I don't think being in a baseball conference with the XDSU's would be a big deal, we are talking about baseball here which isn't exactly a major sport at any of these schools.

Yeah. All the more reason why they'll be ticked off about traveling to the Dakotas to play baseball. I'm telling you, these people in Ohio and Indiana don't like coming to the Dakotas for anything. Give them the slightest pretext to go elsewhere and they will. There is no stability to be gained by linking up with a bunch of schools that are over 500 miles away.

[NDSUstudent]

Yeah. All the more reason why they'll be ticked off about traveling to the Dakotas to play baseball. I'm telling you, these people in Ohio and Indiana don't like coming to the Dakotas for anything. Give them the slightest pretext to go elsewhere and they will. There is no stability to be gained by linking up with a bunch of schools that are over 500 miles away.

If you split the league into two divisions the schools you are talking about wouldn't have to travel to the Dakotas every year. It would eliminate both leagues from having to worry about losing their autobid in the future. Even with the addition of Oakland the Horizon would have six members, lose one member and they lose their autobid. As for UND and UNC, UND could always cut the sport and then the Summit is in the same situation.

[zooropa]

If you split the league into two divisions the schools you are talking about wouldn't have to travel to the Dakotas every year. It would eliminate both leagues from having to worry about losing their autobid in the future. Even with the addition of Oakland the Horizon would have six members, lose one member and they lose their autobid. As for UND and UNC, UND could always cut the sport and then the Summit is in the same situation.

They wouldn't have to play in the Dakotas every year anyway. And since you're talking about one conference losing its autobid (with the merger), you're not exactly supporting your point by talking about how if they don't merge, one conference is going to lose its autobid.