Attacking the 3-4 defense

[jarhead]

It seems attacking a 3-4 defense is an unsolvable enigma, so I googled "attacking the 3-4 defense" expecting 0 responses. Imagine my surprise when the
very first out of thousands of articles was this one. Seems the process is fairly simple if you have two good tight ends (we have four and next year should
have five) and a decent O line. Hmmm.
Fortunately the Bears likely have the best way to match up with a 3-4 right away and the versatility this offensive scheme offers is invaluable in attacking the 3-4. The two tight end set is ideal for attacking the 3-4 defense,
http://monstersofthemidwayillustrated.wordpress.com/2009/09/02/bears-offer-blue-print-to-attack-the-3-4-defense/

[344Johnson]

It seems attacking a 3-4 defense is an unsolvable enigma, so I googled "attacking the 3-4 defense" expecting 0 responses. Imagine my surprise when the
very first out of thousands of articles was this one. Seems the process is fairly simple if you have two good tight ends (we have four and next year should
have five) and a decent O line. Hmmm.
Fortunately the Bears likely have the best way to match up with a 3-4 right away and the versatility this offensive scheme offers is invaluable in attacking the 3-4. The two tight end set is ideal for attacking the 3-4 defense,
http://monstersofthemidwayillustrated.wordpress.com/2009/09/02/bears-offer-blue-print-to-attack-the-3-4-defense/

Watch any team who has beaten the pittsburgh steelers with any consistency the past decade. Lots of spread, lots of quick passes.

[DjKyRo]

Someone e-mail this to Vigen, stat!

[jarhead]

Belichick & Tomlin are two of the best coaches in the league. Watch tape of their games and see how they attack a 3-4.

[HerdBot]

Vertical passes. Long seam passes to Veldman. Misdirection runs.

[ndsubison1]

i have no problem attacking the 3-4 in madden

[99Bison]

i have no problem attacking the 3-4 in madden

Quick send over the latest copy of madden... super tecmo bowl is great and all, but needs an upgrade!

[bisonaudit]

Belichick & Tomlin are two of the best coaches in the league. Watch tape of their games and see how they attack a 3-4.

They also have two of the best QBs in the league. You can have all the scheme in the world but the guys need to execute it.

Seems like playing the 3-4 at 1-AA level makes some sense. Size is easier to find than athelticism along the line, and those three are space eaters first. Then you get yourself some LBs that were atheltic but maybe not big enough to play 1-A and let them flow behind and make plays. If you've got one superior guy in the back 8 you can bring him as the 4th or 5th rusher from just about anywhere in a 3-4 and it's harder for the offense to decipher.

[ndsubison1]

im no expert and not sure how SIU used their 3-4 against us specifially cuz i wasnt able to watch the game, but normally using the double TE set is the ideal formation to the attack the 3-4 and using the versatility of your TE's. which i know we already use quite a bit

[CAS4127]

They also have two of the best QBs in the league. You can have all the scheme in the world but the guys need to execute it.

Seems like playing the 3-4 at 1-AA level makes some sense. Size is easier to find than athelticism along the line, and those three are space eaters first. Then you get yourself some LBs that were atheltic but maybe not big enough to play 1-A and let them flow behind and make plays. If you've got one superior guy in the back 8 you can bring him as the 4th or 5th rusher from just about anywhere in a 3-4 and it's harder for the offense to decipher.

I broached this last year for the Bison and about got torn to shreds by BV insiders, so watch it!!!

[BlueBisonRock]

I broached this last year for the Bison and about got torn to shreds by BV insiders, so watch it!!!

That was before we met you and decided you were ok (slim margin, but you still got 52 percent of the vote)

[bisonaudit]

I broached this last year for the Bison and about got torn to shreds by BV insiders, so watch it!!!

I'm the guy who doesn't believe that Feeney or Walker were clutch, that kicking in allmost all of its forms is way over rated, and that we should go for it on 4th and 4 from mid-field-ish everytime. I'm used to getting skewered around here.

[KilldeerBison]

How about the shovel pass, would that be effective? Take advantage of overpursuit by speedy defensive linemen & blitzing backs. Seems like any play where you can get by the first level/wave, you may have room to run. The DJ middle screen has been effective, but we need more.

[EndZoneQB]

I broached this last year for the Bison and about got torn to shreds by BV insiders, so watch it!!!

Frankly, I think this is in the works. Look at all the athletic linebackers Bohl has brought in recently..generally converted safetys from high school. Don't forget he also brought in Klieman who obviously ran the 3-4 at UNI...just sayin!

[BadlandsBison]

Frankly, I think this is in the works. Look at all the athletic linebackers Bohl has brought in recently..generally converted safetys from high school. Don't forget he also brought in Klieman who obviously ran the 3-4 at UNI...just sayin!

I like the idea of the 3-4. You have to recruit about 20 linebackers a year and have a half man/half bear for you nose tackle. Seems like its easier to bring pressure on the QB when you really need it, and confuses the Oline in the run game.

[DjKyRo]

I like the idea of the 3-4. You have to recruit about 20 linebackers a year and have a half man/half bear for you nose tackle. Seems like its easier to bring pressure on the QB when you really need it, and confuses the Oline in the run game.

I think Leevon is about 3/4 bear, 1/4 diesel engine. Close enough?

[BadlandsBison]

I think Leevon is about 3/4 bear, 1/4 diesel engine. Close enough?

That should work if we keep a good supply of salmon and diesel fuel on the sideline.

[WYOBISONMAN]

Last year we struggled against the 3-4 due to the passing game and completion percentage. This year with Brock doing well in the first 4 games, I thought we would have a much easier time with SIU than we did. I think our inability to deal with the 3-4 last Saturday has a lot to do with ineffective line play coming from the Bison offensive line. Improve line play and the pass will open up. Brock needs some time for the play to develop. From the comments before the game on the SIU board, it seemed that the Salukis have had a tough time defending against the short passes. The O line for the Bison did not let Brock exploit this....

[bisonaudit]

Last year we struggled against the 3-4 due to the passing game and completion percentage. This year with Brock doing well in the first 4 games, I thought we would have a much easier time with SIU than we did. I think our inability to deal with the 3-4 last Saturday has a lot to do with ineffective line play coming from the Bison offensive line. Improve line play and the pass will open up. Brock needs some time for the play to develop. From the comments before the game on the SIU board, it seemed that the Salukis have had a tough time defending against the short passes. The O line for the Bison did not let Brock exploit this....

What do we think is happening with this? Are our linemen being to passive as they attempt to decipher where the 4th/5th rushers are coming from?

[Kermit]

What do we think is happening with this? Are our linemen being to passive as they attempt to decipher where the 4th/5th rushers are coming from?

The first half at SIU was a perfect storm of offensive ineptness for the Bison. The offensive line has been justifiably criticized, but NOBODY made any plays. Our RBs did not run well and Brock was way off his game. Throw in unbelievably bad field position and we have ZERO production. We could have (and perhaps should have) been down 21-0 at the half.

The good news is that the 2nd half was MUCH better. I think the Bison outplayed SIU by a considerable margin in the second half. It looked like 2 different teams.

[BadlandsBison]

The first half at SIU was a perfect storm of offensive ineptness for the Bison. The offensive line has been justifiably criticized, but NOBODY made any plays. Our RBs did not run well and Brock was way off his game. Throw in unbelievably bad field position and we have ZERO production. We could have (and perhaps should have) been down 21-0 at the half.

The good news is that the 2nd half was MUCH better. I think the Bison outplayed SIU by a considerable margin in the second half. It looked like 2 different teams.

I thought the Oline was in terrible position the whole game. Difference was in the second half, the whole team started playing physically and that won us enough battles.

[99Bison]

Didn't see the game, just listened to it with JJ going out his way to make excuses on every other offensive play, weird. Anyway, was watching the "highlights" on Bohl show, and Brock was practically immediately scrambling around for his life on every pass play, also weird, and obviously affected accuracy.

[ndsubison1]

The first half at SIU was a perfect storm of offensive ineptness for the Bison. The offensive line has been justifiably criticized, but NOBODY made any plays. Our RBs did not run well and Brock was way off his game. Throw in unbelievably bad field position and we have ZERO production. We could have (and perhaps should have) been down 21-0 at the half.

The good news is that the 2nd half was MUCH better. I think the Bison outplayed SIU by a considerable margin in the second half. It looked like 2 different teams.

seems like we always make good adjustments in the 2nd half. good news is that our defense will keep us in every game, we just cant rely on them every single time. offense needs to pick up our D and give each other balance. i still feel our offense is fine and will get better

[Trim]

Didn't see the game, just listened to it with JJ going out his way to make excuses on every other offensive play, weird...

That guy drives me up the wall. I love Scott and Phil, but had to turn it off and listen to the internet guys because of JJ.

[BisonAccountant44]

I like the idea of the 3-4. You have to recruit about 20 linebackers a year and have a half man/half bear/half pig for you nose tackle. Seems like its easier to bring pressure on the QB when you really need it, and confuses the Oline in the run game.
http://southparkstudios.mtvnimages.com/shared/characters/non-human/manbearpig.jpg

I knew it was real

[MAKBison]

Beating the 3-4 is dependent on the ability of your QB. The 3-4 as we have seen it is designed to stop the run and splash plays. A defense must make the offense earn every yard by keeping everything in front of them. The Defense is patient and waits for the QB to make a mistake or an incomplete pass so as to put the offense in 3rd and long. Then they attack!

The way you beat the 3-4 is with 3-5 yard passes, miss direction (if the defense is prone to over-pursuit---good teams will not be), and keep it 3rd and short. In the run game, you have to get your linemen to the second level, which means getting the d-line off their feet---teams in the NFL or doing this by cut blocking the D line. Another aspect is field position, if you can win the field position battle you can usually pull out a win through Field goals

The thing about playing the 3-4 is that outcome of the games are usually ugly. We are fine!!!!

[GradBison]

Good reading from Kolpack: A manifesto on attacking the 3-4

http://bisonmedia.areavoices.com/2011/10/14/a-manifesto-on-attacking-the-3-4/

[Bison"FANatic"]

Good reading from Kolpack: A manifesto on attacking the 3-4

http://bisonmedia.areavoices.com/2011/10/14/a-manifesto-on-attacking-the-3-4/

Very good article.

[KTF]

Good reading from Kolpack: A manifesto on attacking the 3-4

http://bisonmedia.areavoices.com/2011/10/14/a-manifesto-on-attacking-the-3-4/

So did this information come from Mr. V?

[CAS4127]

So did this information come from Mr. V?

Couldn't have--we have not run an unbalanced line the last two years from what I recall/saw, and that really isn't a novel idea against the 3-4. We used to do it all the time back when.

[stevdock]

Couldn't have--we have not run an unbalanced line the last two years from what I recall/saw, and that really isn't a novel idea against the 3-4. We used to do it all the time back when.

We ran some unbalanced line this year. I think it was against St. Francis we had Turner move from LT to outside the right tackle and vice versa. That was the only game that I've seen it though in quite a while.

[Herd]

IMO, the main problem ive seen in attacking the 3-4 is our slow developing power game. To attack the 3-4 we need a quick hitting running game targetted between the tackles. Backs with more quickness will be more successful like mike sig . . . Wes Hu . . . I mean DJ McNorton. I would move DJ closer to the line and hit it quick. No time to read, just hit it.

[BlueBisonRock]

IMO, the main problem ive seen in attacking the 3-4 is our slow developing power game. To attack the 3-4 we need a quick hitting running game targetted between the tackles. Backs with more quickness will be more successful like mike sig . . . Wes Hu . . . I mean DJ McNorton. I would move DJ closer to the line and hit it quick. No time to read, just hit it. Fullback. .Just sayin'

[CAS4127]

You know, this thought just occurred to me. Isn't the fact that we r discussing this here, and that there have been newspaper articles and tv segments on this issue somewhat of an indictment on our offensive coaches? I mean, it ain't like this some newly revealed defensive concept for Christ's sake!!

Just sayin' of course!!!!

[EndZoneQB]

You know, this thought just occurred to me. Isn't the fact that we r discussing this here, and that there have been newspaper articles and tv segments on this issue somewhat of an indictment on our offensive coaches? I mean, it ain't like this some newly revealed defensive concept for Christ's sake!!

Just sayin' of course!!!!

I got the feeling in the offseason/preseason that Bohl is putting the pressure on Vigen. This might be his "final" shot. It is also telling that Walker has said over and over again that it is the same offense they ran...and that was anything but boring and mundane. We had a ton of big plays and it wasn't so predictable. Now, granted, we had some pretty good players on those teams, but we never had scores like 3-0, 9-3....

[westnodak93bison]

yeah but Walker would look things over and change the play if necessary. I'm not sure Brock is there yet.

[Gully]

I think we should run the picket fence at 'em.

[CAS4127]

I'm changing my username to runtheoptiondeuce!!

[EndZoneQB]

yeah but Walker would look things over and change the play if necessary. I'm not sure Brock is there yet.

Oh, he is. I've seen him do some checks at the line and it seriously looks like he is bored with our offense. Did you see what he did to the (albeit poor) Minnesota secondary? He picked them apart ALL night, finding whatever the defense was giving him. Someone needs to give the kid the keys to the offense. Seriously.

[THEsocalledfan]

Someone needs to give the kid the keys to the offense. Seriously.

Keys? What keys? Vigen swallowed them.

[WYOBISONMAN]

You know, this thought just occurred to me. Isn't the fact that we r discussing this here, and that there have been newspaper articles and tv segments on this issue somewhat of an indictment on our offensive coaches? I mean, it ain't like this some newly revealed defensive concept for Christ's sake!!

Just sayin' of course!!!!

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to CAS4127 again.

[westnodak93bison]

I remember watching the Misery St. game last year and watching #63 pull and run right by a LB that blitzed. I was wondering why didn't he $hit can that guy?
Does our offense utilize a "zone blocking" scheme or is it assignment based where each olineman knows the exact defender he needs to block?

[BadlandsBison]

I remember watching the Misery St. game last year and watching #63 pull and run right by a LB that blitzed. I was wondering why didn't he $hit can that guy?
Does our offense utilize a "zone blocking" scheme or is it assignment based where each olineman knows the exact defender he needs to block?

Seems like we've gotten away from zone blocking. Its not easy to do if you don't practice it every day, but against the 3-4 man blocking assignments are what gets an offense in trouble.

[Ross]

Keys? What keys? Vigen swallowed them.

Is someone going to follow him around until he goes #2? :biggrin:

[THEsocalledfan]

Well, I think NDSU has figured out how the shred the 3-4; let Brock be Brock and shred those assholes down the field.

Good luck, SIU; you are going to need it if NDSU opens it up and Brock plays like that again.

[344Johnson]

Well, I think NDSU has figured out how the shred the 3-4; let Brock be Brock and shred those assholes down the field.

Good luck, SIU; you are going to need it if NDSU opens it up and Brock plays like that again.

Good luck to NDSU, we are going to need it if SIU has a pass defense.

[THEsocalledfan]

Good luck to NDSU, we are going to need it if SIU has a pass defense.

Agreed, but NDSU appears better at throwing than UNI in my book with a better QB. NDSU NEEDS TO THROW TO WIN.

[EC8CH]

Agreed, but NDSU appears better at throwing than UNI in my book with a better QB. NDSU NEEDS TO THROW TO WIN.

UNI missed a lot of very close passes downfield in their loss to UNI. They said as much on the Lennon show (http://www.siusalukis.com/sports/m-footbl/silu-m-footbl-body.html)

If NDSU goes down and Brock is as accurate as he was against MSU, it should be a good day for the Bison. Another tough conference game, but I think NDSU just showed their offense is capable of adapting to what the defense gives them. Even going deep it would now seem.

[MarkyMark]

Well, I think NDSU has figured out how the shred the 3-4; let Brock be Brock and shred those assholes down the field.

Good luck, SIU; you are going to need it if NDSU opens it up and Brock plays like that again.

Brock ran the ball over ten times in games against Kansas St., SDSU and UNI. He only ran a couple times per game against Delaware, Ferris and Missouri St. This will be a tough game so I am thinking we will see a fair amount of Brock running the ball.


NDSU went for it on a 4th down against Missouri St. I was urprised Brock didn't carry the ball on that play but I am thinking the coaches were avoiding contact for Brock last Saturday.

[Grizzled]

Agreed, but NDSU appears better at throwing than UNI in my book with a better QB. NDSU NEEDS TO THROW TO WIN.

I have yet to see an opposing MVFC opposing QB who I feel can beat us throwing the ball. UNI's QB was terrible. Yes he made some good throws, but he made a lot more bad ones. We have the best all around QB in the conference and Brock will shred this 3-4 defense. Just like last year, I see SIU lining up man and making us try to beat them throwing the ball. And just like last year I see us doing that.

[THEsocalledfan]

I have yet to see an opposing MVFC opposing QB who I feel can beat us throwing the ball. UNI's QB was terrible. Yes he made some good throws, but he made a lot more bad ones. We have the best all around QB in the conference and Brock will shred this 3-4 defense. Just like last year, I see SIU lining up man and making us try to beat them throwing the ball. And just like last year I see us doing that.

Agreed, again. This ain't rocket science. They ONLY way you have any chance of beating NDSU is to make them throw the ball and the 3-4 is ideal for stopping the run. If I am Lennon, I'd do exactly what is mentioned above as it is the best move and pray the ghost of the former version of Coach Vigen takes hold and NDSU keeps trying to run, throw quick outs, and the almighty RB swing pass. Sadly for SIU, even if this happens, it sounds like Brock has a lot of ability to audible......and he is a smart kid......

[BisonNeil]

I have yet to see an opposing MVFC opposing QB who I feel can beat us throwing the ball. UNI's QB was terrible. Yes he made some good throws, but he made a lot more bad ones. We have the best all around QB in the conference and Brock will shred this 3-4 defense. Just like last year, I see SIU lining up man and making us try to beat them throwing the ball. And just like last year I see us doing that.

While I totally agree NDSU has the best all around QB, I cannot agree with you that UNI's QB is terrible. Yes, he made some bad throws and had a tough game, but he is a So and so did Jensen when he was a So and so did Walker when he was a So. Kollmorgen was 12-33-1 and 128 yds passing against the Bison, the best defense in the country. Jensen was 10-20-1 and 109 yds against a marginal SDSU defense. Was Jensen "terrible" in that game?

Bottom line is that Kollmorgen is a good QB. According to MVFC statistics through last weeks game, Kollmorgen was completing 62.5% of his passes for 1187 yds while Jensen was completing 66.2% of his passes for 1083 yds. In overall passing efficiency, Jensen comes in at #2 in the conference with a 150.7 rating and Kollmorgen comes in at #3 with a 148.5 rating. Jensen is #5 in total offense per game averaging 205.7/gm while Kollmorgen is #6 averaging 204.5/gm.

Kollmorgen had a tough game against NDSU, but there is no way in hell he is a terrible QB.

http://www.mvc.org/football/stats/ind.pdf

[Mr. Burgundy]

While I totally agree NDSU has the best all around QB, I cannot agree with you that UNI's QB is terrible. Yes, he made some bad throws and had a tough game, but he is a So and so did Jensen when he was a So and so did Walker when he was a So. Kollmorgen was 12-33-1 and 128 yds passing against the Bison, the best defense in the country. Jensen was 10-20-1 and 109 yds against a marginal SDSU defense. Was Jensen "terrible" in that game?

Bottom line is that Kollmorgen is a good QB. According to MVFC statistics through last weeks game, Kollmorgen was completing 62.5% of his passes for 1187 yds while Jensen was completing 66.2% of his passes for 1083 yds. In overall passing efficiency, Jensen comes in at #2 in the conference with a 150.7 rating and Kollmorgen comes in at #3 with a 148.5 rating. Jensen is #5 in total offense per game averaging 205.7/gm while Kollmorgen is #6 averaging 204.5/gm.

Kollmorgen had a tough game against NDSU, but there is no way in hell he is a terrible QB.

http://www.mvc.org/football/stats/ind.pdf

I agree, he struggled, but his upside is awesome. Plus, he proved he is one tough SOB in that 4th quarter. He was getting KILLED. A couple of his completions were complete prayers. Back foot prayers. He will be a great qb in the coming years. UNI isn't going anywhere.

[semobison]

I have yet to see an opposing MVFC opposing QB who I feel can beat us throwing the ball. UNI's QB was terrible. Yes he made some good throws, but he made a lot more bad ones. We have the best all around QB in the conference and Brock will shred this 3-4 defense. Just like last year, I see SIU lining up man and making us try to beat them throwing the ball. And just like last year I see us doing that.

UNI has a very good QB! Our defense has shown the ability to make a good look terrible.

[AjaxTheMighty]

UNI has a very good QB! Our defense has shown the ability to make a good look terrible.

I think Bell from SHSU is a decent to good QB, but he has looked more like a drunk Ally McBeal against us! Is there EVER going to be a day when we don't have to hear about NDSU's struggles with the 3-4 defense??? Does NDSU really struggle with the 3-4?

[CAS4127]

I think Bell from SHSU is a decent to good QB, but he has looked more like a drunk Ally McBeal against us! Is there EVER going to be a day when we don't have to hear about NDSU's struggles with the 3-4 defense??? Does NDSU really struggle with the 3-4?

I think you have solved the "3-4" struggle issue!! When one couples your post with the several above it they get-->NDSU struggles with 3-4 defense when the opposing team has a good to above average QB. Take that QB out of the game/his element, and we don't stuggle with a 3-4 defense.

Not that difficult once you see it in writing!!

[Bison"FANatic"]

When your head coach has said multiple times with the latest being a week and a half ago that they haven't had the easiest time with the 3-4. Ya I think we can say we have "struggled" against the 3-4. The thing is the definition of struggle. We have still had success but it hasn't been as much success as we have against 4-3 defenses.

[AjaxTheMighty]

I bet 100 + teams would love to have NDSU's "struggles" with the 3-4.

[CaBisonFan]

Brock & Zach didn't struggle very much. They smoked MSU. Then the running game...as usual...took over.

[CAS4127]

I bet 100 + teams would love to have NDSU's "struggles" with the 3-4.

I agree, because that would mean they have a good to above-average QB!! AmIright?!?

[Grizzled]

While I totally agree NDSU has the best all around QB, I cannot agree with you that UNI's QB is terrible. Yes, he made some bad throws and had a tough game, but he is a So and so did Jensen when he was a So and so did Walker when he was a So. Kollmorgen was 12-33-1 and 128 yds passing against the Bison, the best defense in the country. Jensen was 10-20-1 and 109 yds against a marginal SDSU defense. Was Jensen "terrible" in that game?

Bottom line is that Kollmorgen is a good QB. According to MVFC statistics through last weeks game, Kollmorgen was completing 62.5% of his passes for 1187 yds while Jensen was completing 66.2% of his passes for 1083 yds. In overall passing efficiency, Jensen comes in at #2 in the conference with a 150.7 rating and Kollmorgen comes in at #3 with a 148.5 rating. Jensen is #5 in total offense per game averaging 205.7/gm while Kollmorgen is #6 averaging 204.5/gm.

Kollmorgen had a tough game against NDSU, but there is no way in hell he is a terrible QB.

http://www.mvc.org/football/stats/ind.pdf

He would be a 3rd string QB on our roster. Missouri St. forced Brock to throw the ball and he did/was able. If any team was able to force Kllmorgen to throw the ball to win a game, I don't think he would be able to do it. Now, we couldn't force them to have to throw the ball and when we did, he was not impressive. Doesn't matter if he is a sophmore, junior, or senior. He is an average QB at best with an outstanding RB.

Last year, SIU tried to force Brock to beat them throwing the ball and we were able to make enough plays to win. I don't see this year being any different. Brock is well above average and can take the game into his own hands when needed. So far, of the QBs I have seen in the MVFC, there is not another one who would be able to do that.

[JSUBison]

Someone with some time on his hands and is familiar with opposing teams defense should come up with the stats for NDSU vs 3-4 defense for the past several years.

[CAS4127]

Someone with some time on his hands and is familiar with opposing teams defense should come up with the stats for NDSU vs 3-4 defense for the past several years.

And how good their QB was, or did against us, given the obvious correlation.

[BisonNeil]

He would be a 3rd string QB on our roster. Missouri St. forced Brock to throw the ball and he did/was able. If any team was able to force Kllmorgen to throw the ball to win a game, I don't think he would be able to do it. Now, we couldn't force them to have to throw the ball and when we did, he was not impressive. Doesn't matter if he is a sophmore, junior, or senior. He is an average QB at best with an outstanding RB.

Last year, SIU tried to force Brock to beat them throwing the ball and we were able to make enough plays to win. I don't see this year being any different. Brock is well above average and can take the game into his own hands when needed. So far, of the QBs I have seen in the MVFC, there is not another one who would be able to do that.

Well then you should write to all of the MVFC coaches who voted him the newcomer of the year last year. They obviously don't know shit compared to you.

http://www.mvc-sports.com/media/2012-13/football/2012%20MVFC%20All-Newcomer%20Team.pdf

Or, are you saying he went from the unanimous freshman of the year to a third string QB all because of what you saw in one game?

[CAS4127]

Well then you should write to all of the MVFC coaches who voted him the newcomer of the year last year. They obviously don't know shit compared to you.

http://www.mvc-sports.com/media/2012-13/football/2012%20MVFC%20All-Newcomer%20Team.pdf

Or, are you saying he went from the unanimous freshman of the year to a third string QB all because of what you saw in one game?

He plays for a team that runs a lot of 3-4 defense I think is what he is saying.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[AjaxTheMighty]

I don't know what other teams run the 3-4. Here are the teams that I know do since 2010 and our offensive output. There is a trend, we did struggle with it once upon a time...so what is the yardage quantity we would associate with 'struggling'. Maybe anything under 300? 350?

2010
UNI = 207
SIU = 251
Mo St. = 120
RMU = 482

2011
SIU = 210
Mo St. = 428
UNI = 359
Lehigh = 384

2012
RMU = 495
UNI = 419
SIU = 386
Mo St. = 311

2013
UNI = 359
Mo St. = 450

[Rynomite]

He would be a 3rd string QB on our roster. Missouri St. forced Brock to throw the ball and he did/was able. If any team was able to force Kllmorgen to throw the ball to win a game, I don't think he would be able to do it. Now, we couldn't force them to have to throw the ball and when we did, he was not impressive. Doesn't matter if he is a sophmore, junior, or senior. He is an average QB at best with an outstanding RB.

Last year, SIU tried to force Brock to beat them throwing the ball and we were able to make enough plays to win. I don't see this year being any different. Brock is well above average and can take the game into his own hands when needed. So far, of the QBs I have seen in the MVFC, there is not another one who would be able to do that.

I think the Missouri game showed us that Brock has really developed as a competent passer. As long as he has enough time in the pocket, he can make this decent passes with less chance of a pick. But something tells me that SIU will be looking to force some turnovers in the pass game.

[Mayville Bison]

He plays for a team that runs a lot of 3-4 defense I think is what he is saying.


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Maybe it's because the defense is so great that the QB is on the field more!

[CaBisonFan]

Maybe it's because the defense is so great that the QB is on the field more!It works hand in hand. Defense (and special teams) puts the offense in good field position, and without long droughts without the ball. Offense returns the favor with good defensive field position, usually a lead, and less time on the field. It's Bohl's philosophy. He wants control of the tempo at all times. If you like track-meet football games...it can be boring at times. If you like good fundamental football...it's amazing to watch. And it's really fun to watch the opposing defense slowly wear down.

[CAS4127]

Maybe it's because the defense is so great that the QB is on the field more!

What comes first, a 3-4 defense we have trouble with, or a team with a good to above-average QB that also runs a 3-4 defense we have trouble with? Do we struggle strictly with the 3-4, or does the 3-4 have to come with a good/above average QB accessory in order for us to struggle with the 3-4 defense?

Know what I mean?!

[Mayville Bison]

What comes first, a 3-4 defense we have trouble with, or a team with a good to above-average QB that also runs a 3-4 defense we have trouble with? Do we struggle strictly with the 3-4, or does the 3-4 have to come with a good/above average QB accessory in order for us to struggle with the 3-4 defense?

Know what I mean?!

Fire 4-3 defense, save Brock!

[NDSU_grad]

I don't know what other teams run the 3-4. Here are the teams that I know do since 2010 and our offensive output. There is a trend, we did struggle with it once upon a time...so what is the yardage quantity we would associate with 'struggling'. Maybe anything under 300? 350?

2010
UNI = 207
SIU = 251
Mo St. = 120
RMU = 482

2011
SIU = 210
Mo St. = 428
UNI = 359
Lehigh = 384

2012
RMU = 495
UNI = 419
SIU = 386
Mo St. = 311

2013
UNI = 359
Mo St. = 450

Looking at that, I'd say there's a stronger correlation between our offensive output and the quality of competition that there is between our offensive output and the defensive scheme.

[CAS4127]

I think you have solved the "3-4" struggle issue!! When one couples your post with the several above it they get-->NDSU struggles with 3-4 defense when the opposing team has a good to above average QB. Take that QB out of the game/his element, and we don't stuggle with a 3-4 defense.

Not that difficult once you see it in writing!!


I agree, because that would mean they have a good to above-average QB!! AmIright?!?


Someone with some time on his hands and is familiar with opposing teams defense should come up with the stats for NDSU vs 3-4 defense for the past several years.


And how good their QB was, or did against us, given the obvious correlation.


Well then you should write to all of the MVFC coaches who voted him the newcomer of the year last year. They obviously don't know shit compared to you.

http://www.mvc-sports.com/media/2012-13/football/2012%20MVFC%20All-Newcomer%20Team.pdf

Or, are you saying he went from the unanimous freshman of the year to a third string QB all because of what you saw in one game?


He plays for a team that runs a lot of 3-4 defense I think is what he is saying.


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Maybe it's because the defense is so great that the QB is on the field more!


What comes first, a 3-4 defense we have trouble with, or a team with a good to above-average QB that also runs a 3-4 defense we have trouble with? Do we struggle strictly with the 3-4, or does the 3-4 have to come with a good/above average QB accessory in order for us to struggle with the 3-4 defense?

Know what I mean?!


Fire 4-3 defense, save Brock!

Anybody else notice that we started running the ball much more effectively/had less struggles with SIU's 3-4 D once SIU QB was knocked out of the game?!

[THEsocalledfan]

Anybody else notice that we started running the ball much more effectively/had less struggles with SIU's 3-4 D once SIU QB was knocked out of the game?!

I love the work you went to in that post, but as Coach Bohl stated, the signs started in the first half before he was knocked out.....

[TransAmBison]

I love the work you went to in that post, but as Coach Bohl stated, the signs started in the first half before he was knocked out.....
It's cute how he tries so hard to impress.

[CAS4127]

It's cute how he tries so hard to impress.

It's cute how gullible you are!!

[EC8CH]

Girls... Girls.... You're both cute

3240

[westnodak93bison]

Did our undersized center do ok ?

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[KilldeerBison]

Did our undersized center do ok ?

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Yep, the Bison OL looks like they are finding their stride, a lot like last year. It's really nice to see them healthy.

[HerdBot]

The 3-4 is now our bitch
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6zH7tdatQUA/SnDdktx4bJI/AAAAAAAAGu0/JqptMZp-dpg/s400/smack-you-bitch-i-will.jpg

[Mayville Bison]

Anybody else notice that we started running the ball much more effectively/had less struggles with SIU's 3-4 D once SIU QB was knocked out of the game?!




I knew there had to be a logical reason!





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[56BISON73]

I love the work you went to in that post, but as Coach Bohl stated, the signs started in the first half before he was knocked out.....

I love that CAS observed that fact while the game was in progress but if Bohl wouldnt have mentioned it nobody here would have realized it. But are now parroting him.:biggrin: Just sayin:biggrin:

CAS you did see the changes while the game was in progress right?????????

[1998braves64]

Anybody else notice that we started running the ball much more effectively/had less struggles with SIU's 3-4 D once SIU QB was knocked out of the game?!

So what you're saying or jussayin' is that the best defense against the Bison is have a QB who can effectively move the chains keep the Bison offense off the field except for maybe 8 mins a half and that is the key to beating the Bison? :)

Granted it probably played a factor a bit but the fact that their defense didn't change and we were able to run over them in the 3rd quarter. They found something they could exploit and did it. But they did go 3 and out for most of the 3rd quarter if I remember right so that plays a factor.