post spring game analysis

[HerdBot]

Post your thoughts. Ill post mine later.

[bisonhp330]

YAAAAWWWWNNNNN. same boring offense- had chances at some big plays- but no one could catch the ball. Good look for spring practice- lots of the 1's were hurt so there were good reps.

one thing .......it was kind of nice having 3000 people at the spring game.......hell - thats about 700 more than the sue averaged for a regular season game!

[Facts]

Sam "The judge, ojuri, and executioner" was good.

Mertens spotted leaving the game holding hands with a gal donning "who" apparel... confirming suspicions that all along he was a double-agent. ;)

[MNLonghorn10]

admittedly..i was falling asleep.

for those who had to travel long distances..that sucks

[4mcruenomore]

admittedly..i was falling asleep.

for those who had to travel long distances..that sucks

Not as bas as when Mertens played both sides, WOW

[EndZoneQB]

Sam "The judge, ojuri, and executioner" was good.

Mertens spotted leaving the game holding hands with a gal donning "who" apparel... confirming suspicions that all along he was a double-agent. ;)

I saw his Jersey on the rack at the sale...seemed like it had been picked up and put back more than a few times lol

Got myself a Vraa and Olson jersey to start the year.

[Ross]

After seeing Powell-Calhoun today I can't believe he was going to play WR! He has the right body type and the potential to be a great pass rusher in the next couple years. The guy is all arms and legs. Once he puts a few more pounds on and gets more experience this year... I'm excited about his future with the Bison!

[Mr. Burgundy]

Great crowd, great atosphere around the sale, and a great turnout for a TON of recruits that were there with their families. Great production put on by NDSU. It was a first class day. New sound system in the dome? Alot of new speakers.

Christian Dudzik and Boyd were the stars for me. 9 tackles and a blocked punt for Dudzik and Boyd looks like a great corner from NDSCS. He had a nice interception on an underthrown ball by Esley. We know that Marcus and Pierre are extremely solid starters, but we need that depth, they will play and look great. Dudzik looks like another star in that amazing recruiting class.

Our future at linebacker is almost scary. Looking at Don Carter and Carlton Littlejohn is scary.

Defense is very very good, and we played without 3 starters. When we are healthy in August, we could be freaky good. Our run game looks solid as always. DJ is DJ. Lang runs hard and I predict will be the crowd favorite with his in your face running style. Ojuri has all the talent to be the feature back when it is his turn. He has some great runs. I hope they carve out a spot for Lang. Sigers has to still get his 7 carries a night as well, he is too electric to not touch it.

Juckem started at the nose and fills the hole nicely. Luecke (sp?) always makes plays. The defensive line suddenly is really deep with some additions. I wanted to see depth and I think we have it on defense.

At wide receiver....can someone step up and help out a QB? I have never seen Brock throw it better. His first fade pass to Vraa was perfect. Continually dropping balls on him. Vraa made a great catch on the goal line, but, and Cooper made a great sideline catch, but the group must have dropped 10 balls. Killing all 3 of the quarterbacks who I thought looked pretty good. Brock appears to be leading this team to some high expectations, but a WR needs to step up. Warren will be ready.

Ryan Smith. I hope he returns punts and kicks. He is electric. That speed is amazing....and Boyd was going to catch him. Really fast kids.

Overall, I enjoyed the day. Fun to see the depth. Very successful day put on by NDSU. I would guess that the recruits will see how important football is at NDSU and put us high on their list. Good to start the recruiting process with such a positive impression.

[walknroehl]

The dropped balls are probably the biggest worry. Our best receiver today was a QB last year. Vraa had a pretty nice grab though.

All 3 quarterbacks looked better than all last season. That Thorton kid has a bright future.

Nice return by Smith though what may have been more shocking on that play was the speed that Ariel Boyd displayed.

Voigtlander is going to be a great punter. Someone told me at coffee this morning that Drago was at the showcase last night spoutin that he's going to be all-american.

[AEBison1998]

Danny Leuke seemed to have about 1/2 the 2nd team D's tackles.
Christian Dudzik looked good to me. As did Beck and Juckem.
Ojuri has already been mentioned. Veldman had a very good game catching the ball (didn't watch him blocking...can't comment) Gimmestad started at OG. I thought that was a good sign for him. He's only played the position in college for a few weeks and he beat out Anderson, Bekius, and Heinz....that's good. Jirik is tough....still. Stochynski needs to gain a belly, but he did better than I tought he would do at DT after making the change from DE.

Gebhart and Vraa weren't able to get the ball event thrown to them. Not sure if that was the OL the DB's as the cause.

Our OL is able to run at will between the tackles on the #1 D it seemed to me.
Our weaknesses today were run defense (inside...good on the perimeter), pass protection and the #1 O hardly had a pass to the WRs...except for 3 drops...by the same guy.

We could really use a 300 lb NG and we'd be set on D. And we need to be able to get the WR's the ball.

My $.02

[X-Factor]

QB: Brock is good. I don't know what his stats are, but they are meaningless because of some poor drops. Only a few passes went slightly high. He made a few tough throws. He has the ability to become a top caliber FCS QB in my honest opinion and is far and away the #1 right now. Esley struggled at times today. He had some poor throws in the first half, one being the INT that was just a REALLY bad throw, but then settled down in the 2nd half and did a lot better. Jose was pretty good today.

RB: not much needs to be said. We have great depth, especially this fall.

OL: Did pretty good in run blocking, but at times were really overwhelmed against the #1's. Hopefully that is more due to our DL. I was also impressed by our tackles in pass blocking going against Jirik and Co.

Veldman actually caught a couple of passes! I know most have written him off (for good reason), but he may be a big factor this year

Gebhart looks good. I seriously doubt anyone is going to give him much competition for a starting spot opposite of Holloway. Reed was open on a number of plays and had several targets, but was a big contributor in the drops category. Wahlo did not look good. He had the one juggling catch along the sidelines, but really made quite a few mistakes to offset that and couldn't really get open. He may not see the field a whole lot.

D-line: The #1's looked really good. I bet a lot of teams will have trouble containing this line. Jirik and Hagan surprised me with their quickness off the line. Linebackers looked good but I honestly had a hard time keeping track of them all. Littlejohn did get beat in pass coverage once, but other than that they looked good. The secondary played well overall. Williams may be one of the best players on D this fall. He can play very tight coverage.

Special teams : F- is the grade, would give lower if possible. Amazing how many people were clapping and cheering when the blocks and returns happened. The only consistencies on special teams: Voigtlander (who is going to be an amazing punter by the way), Heagle, and Ryan Smith. What the hells the point in even kicking a field goal anymore? Just go for it on 4th or punt.

Overall this team is pretty deep for being FCS. Looking forward to making the trip to TCF Bank for the Bison's first test of the season.

[CaBisonFan]

Some Big Ten spring game attendance stats:

Nebraska - 66,784
Ohio State - 44,276
Michigan - 25,000 est.
Wisconsin - 10,000 est.
Iowa - 8,000 est.
Penn State - 7,500 est.
Illinois - 6,000 est.
Purdue - 5,500 est.
Minnesota - 2,500 est.

Iowa State was the lowest in the Big 12 with about 4000. BYU had 5000.

3000 at NDSU is a great thing for the future.

[AEBison1998]

Who likes the Staute of Liberty play after a fake lateral to Dante Perez? I thought that was Awesome! Lots of options out of that formation!

[HerdBot]

Tough to judge. Paid more attention to 1st team O vs D. Brock was going against the 1st team defense and threw the ball more. Thorton was going up against a lesser defense.

Brock completed less than 50% of his passes, was sacked 4 times, and hurried other times. He did have some drops. The 1st team receivers sucked. The only thing the offense could consistently do is run the ball up the middle. It was impressive. Pass blocking not so much. Passing hurt them. The offense could move the ball on the ground when they wanted to. I think we were a little light with Stoczynski at tackle and when your missing your middle linebacker its going to be easier to run the ball. I think Perry was missed.

The Dline looked great rushing the passer. If these guys can tee off they are going to be great. Starters were Boyer, Drevlow, Jirik, Juckem. I saw Emmanuel and Stoczynski play a lot. Boyer only played a few series. The true starters got some great pressure early.

Players that jumped out that suprised me. Connor Roach, Dudzik, and Lueke. Boyd was always around the ball.

Ojuri had a drop on a screen.
Heagle had a PI call but a great ST tackle on Ryan Smith.
Ryan Smith dropped a key pass late in the game.
Saw Emmanuel get some pressure and the back blocked him.
Wahlo had a great circus catch. Also fumbled.
Vraa was matched up with Williams.
Gebheart had a drop on a long pass.
kicking game sucks and they weren't even going full speed.
Stoczynski had a sack. Quick to the Qb couldn't tell if he was quick, unblocked, or if it was a stunt. Bad angle where I was sitting.
So many new linebackers I had a tough time following them. Had to have made some mistakes with the less than stellar run defense against our 1st team O. We ran the ball at 5 yards a clip.

Defense looks good and very deep. Offense sucked passing but going up against that defense you have to give them credit.

[runtheoption]

New sound system in the dome? Alot of new speakers. Lang runs hard and I predict will be the crowd favorite with his in your face running style...I hope they carve out a spot for Lang.

The bass in those speakers today was incredible. I was most impressed with Lang out of everyone today. Reminded me of Roehl.


Nice return by Smith though what may have been more shocking on that play was the speed that Ariel Boyd displayed.

Yep, I couldn't make up my mind what was more impressive: Smith's return or Boyd's speed in how quickly he was gaining on Smith.


Veldman had a very good game catching the ball (didn't watch him blocking...can't comment)

Our weaknesses today were ...the #1 O hardly had a pass to the WRs...except for 3 drops...by the same guy.

We could really use a 300 lb NG and we'd be set on D. And we need to be able to get the WR's the ball.

Veldman was the guy that surprised me most. Catching the ball in traffic, and taking some solid hits. Reed D. (#80) was my disappointment of the day. My buddy and I were discussing the same thing about having a 320 lb NG to take on 2 OL every play.


Ojuri had a drop on a screen.
Heagle had a PI call but a great ST tackle on Ryan Smith.

I think that drop on the screen was going to be a huge gain too. There wasn't much for D in front of him. Agreed on Heagle's special teams tackle on Smith -- Heagle shot through the muck like a rocket to take out Smith's legs.

[goldenshower]

Some Big Ten spring game attendance stats:

Nebraska - 66,784
Ohio State - 44,276
Michigan - 25,000 est.
Wisconsin - 10,000 est.
Iowa - 8,000 est.
Penn State - 7,500 est.
Illinois - 6,000 est.
Purdue - 5,500 est.
Minnesota - 2,500 est.

Iowa State was the lowest in the Big 12 with about 4000. BYU had 5000.

3000 at NDSU is a great thing for the future.

i was at the gopher spring game and there were a lot more than 2500 people.

[HerdBot]

The bass in those speakers today was incredible. I was most impressed with Lang out of everyone today. Reminded me of Roehl.



Yep, I couldn't make up my mind what was more impressive: Smith's return or Boyd's speed in how quickly he was gaining on Smith.



Veldman was the guy that surprised me most. Catching the ball in traffic, and taking some solid hits. Reed D. (#80) was my disappointment of the day. My buddy and I were discussing the same thing about having a 320 lb NG to take on 2 OL every play.



I think that drop on the screen was going to be a huge gain too. There wasn't much for D in front of him. Agreed on Heagle's special teams tackle on Smith -- Heagle shot through the muck like a rocket to take out Smith's legs.

I'm with you on the 300+ pounder at nose tackle. The guys we have blow by the o line on passing downs but they struggled to stop the 3rd and short. Need a big dude for short yardage. I wonder if its too late to find a juco

[THEsocalledfan]

Please give a solid assessment of qb play please.

[SDbison]

The bass in those speakers today was incredible. I was most impressed with Lang out of everyone today. Reminded me of Roehl.



Yep, I couldn't make up my mind what was more impressive: Smith's return or Boyd's speed in how quickly he was gaining on Smith.



Veldman was the guy that surprised me most. Catching the ball in traffic, and taking some solid hits. Reed D. (#80) was my disappointment of the day. My buddy and I were discussing the same thing about having a 320 lb NG to take on 2 OL every play.



I think that drop on the screen was going to be a huge gain too. There wasn't much for D in front of him. Agreed on Heagle's special teams tackle on Smith -- Heagle shot through the muck like a rocket to take out Smith's legs.
Lang looked great and I like his agressiveness on the run. Ojuri has the ability to make some quick changes in direction and brings something a bit different than McNorton. Didn't see much from McNorton, as he didn't get very many carries but he did well and we know how good he can be. NDSU is loaded at RB.
Boyd looks as good as Williams athletically and not only has speed but something you can't teach......height. Also, Boyd was in on a bunch of tackles in the first half. I was surprised no one else mentioned the way Boyd came out of nowhere to nearly catch up with Smith. Wow!
Weakspots are size and depth at defensive tackle. Everywhere else on defense seems to be 2 and 3 deep in talent. On offense looks like the usual suspects of lack of a QB taking the bull by the horns and getting it done. I think Jensen will do better next year, but somehow he has to get chemistry with the receivers and start motivating them to make catches. Outside of Veldman I think NDSU is lacking for size and depth at TE. The O line should be good but loses size when going beyond the starters. Cornick will be hard to replace after this next year unless Bohl can find another Turner. As I said earlier the Bison are loaded at RB and Grothman is another tough FB. I would prefer Bruhns size at backup FB, but the the small Buehner packs a punch too. QB's and WR's need to step up and start contributing to the passing game. My fear is much of the issue really comes down to Vigens coaching of the QB's and a poor passing game plan.

[4mcruenomore]

i was at the gopher spring game and there were a lot more than 2500 people.

Most of the articles say 2500, some people on your board say 5,000. Weren't you just bragging how you guys have 50,000 students?? Lame. You sound like UND Frank, "the millions", and reminds me of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFAkmkfcTfU

[Mr. Burgundy]

Remember our starting NT Perry was out with a concussion. He started last year as a true freshman. He adds alot at that spot. Highly athletic big kid who has added alot of weight.

[4mcruenomore]

The QB play was horrible in the first half besides for Jose. The 2nd half I felt that Brock and Esley started a little rhythm. It doesn't help when the play calling is generic, and the receivers aren't all that in sync yet with the qb's. I am confident it will fall into place though IMO.

[SDbison]

Please give a solid assessment of qb play please.
I wrote a bit about QB's in my last post but did not do a comparison. I think Mohler looked good today and he is a great competitor and seems to have the best grasp of the offense. His weak spots are ability to see over the line and throw deep balls when needed although NDSU doesn't do this unless behind by 2 TD's late in the 4th quarter. If the other guys do well Mohler can be relied upon to be a really good 3rd QB.
Thorton has great footwork from what I saw today and has a real deceptive handoff like was commented by one of the announcers. He will be excellent with another year of experience and hopefully he gets a bunch of game time to ramp up. His accuracy may be lacking in the college game at this point but he is still pretty good. He looks real smooth on delivery of the ball. Better than any other NDSU QB out there.
Jensen looked good and seems to put the ball only where it can be caught. I just wish the receivers would quit dropping his good throws. He could be in that 65 % completion range if the receivers did better. Jensen is the leader and has good size and speed to run. I think Jensen will have a breakout year when things start to sync up and Vigen gets a clue how to run tha passing part of the offense.

[4mcruenomore]

I agree with SD, and again, spring ball. Brock and Esley could have ran a few times but the play was called dead, etc...Phil touched on this during the game.

[NorthernBison]

I saw about what I expected on the field. Typical Spring Game type plays. Not much rhythm or consistency on offense. Admit it guys, if the offenses were shredding the D, everybody would be on suicide watch.

Plenty of new guys making plays so overall depth doesn't seem to be a problem. Some positions might be thinner but I'll leave that commentary to the "experts".

Whenever there is a big hit, expect to see Heagle there.

JUCO from Whap showed serious speed catching Smith.

Sound system was much improved. Same lame stuff coming out though. Might want to figure out the pronunciation of the last name on #31. Was funny though.

How many linebackers do we have? 20? Wow.

Oh yeah, our kicking game has always scared me. This one is terrifying.

Nobody mentioned the BAND. Lots of noise from a little group. Excellent job.

[Bison"FANatic"]

One thing I found interesting was how much they rolled Esley out and let him throw on the run you would think that they would have tried more of that with Jose as that seems to be a strength of his. (hmmm I wonder who called those plays)

Overall Brock looked good and Esley looked like he was ahead of or on pace to be where he should be at this time in his career.


Very concerned about or O-line but it seems they always seem to pull it together.

Wow is the only thing I can say about the D. The speed the depth and the overall team defense will be the rock of this team and Defense wins championships.

When Voight gets the ball off it does well but one block and at least one other if not two just about blocked doesn't bode well.

[AEBison1998]

Anyone else think there were more than 3000 people there? There wasn't anyone counting when I walked in. I think they just picked a number, divided by two, took integral, then the derivative, and then multiplied by two. That's my theory. :)

[Ferd]

Anyone else think there were more than 3000 people there? There wasn't anyone counting when I walked in. I think they just picked a number, divided by two, took integral, then the derivative, and then multiplied by two. That's my theory. :)

The people I saw at the door had clickers though they were'nt paying real close attention...

[ndsubison1]

Great crowd, great atosphere around the sale, and a great turnout for a TON of recruits that were there with their families. Great production put on by NDSU. It was a first class day. New sound system in the dome? Alot of new speakers.

Christian Dudzik and Boyd were the stars for me. 9 tackles and a blocked punt for Dudzik and Boyd looks like a great corner from NDSCS. He had a nice interception on an underthrown ball by Esley. We know that Marcus and Pierre are extremely solid starters, but we need that depth, they will play and look great. Dudzik looks like another star in that amazing recruiting class.

Our future at linebacker is almost scary. Looking at Don Carter and Carlton Littlejohn is scary.

Defense is very very good, and we played without 3 starters. When we are healthy in August, we could be freaky good. Our run game looks solid as always. DJ is DJ. Lang runs hard and I predict will be the crowd favorite with his in your face running style. Ojuri has all the talent to be the feature back when it is his turn. He has some great runs. I hope they carve out a spot for Lang. Sigers has to still get his 7 carries a night as well, he is too electric to not touch it.

Juckem started at the nose and fills the hole nicely. Luecke (sp?) always makes plays. The defensive line suddenly is really deep with some additions. I wanted to see depth and I think we have it on defense.

At wide receiver....can someone step up and help out a QB? I have never seen Brock throw it better. His first fade pass to Vraa was perfect. Continually dropping balls on him. Vraa made a great catch on the goal line, but, and Cooper made a great sideline catch, but the group must have dropped 10 balls. Killing all 3 of the quarterbacks who I thought looked pretty good. Brock appears to be leading this team to some high expectations, but a WR needs to step up. Warren will be ready.

Ryan Smith. I hope he returns punts and kicks. He is electric. That speed is amazing....and Boyd was going to catch him. Really fast kids.

Overall, I enjoyed the day. Fun to see the depth. Very successful day put on by NDSU. I would guess that the recruits will see how important football is at NDSU and put us high on their list. Good to start the recruiting process with such a positive impression.

I loved watching Boyd on that pick. He has some speed!

[ndsubison1]

The dropped balls are probably the biggest worry. Our best receiver today was a QB last year. Vraa had a pretty nice grab though.

All 3 quarterbacks looked better than all last season. That Thorton kid has a bright future.

Nice return by Smith though what may have been more shocking on that play was the speed that Ariel Boyd displayed.

Voigtlander is going to be a great punter. Someone told me at coffee this morning that Drago was at the showcase last night spoutin that he's going to be all-american.

i love the way thorton sells on some of his handoffs and play action type stuff.

[Wally]

I wasn't at the game, but the media blog mentioned issues with special teams. Were specials pretty bad? I am not going to start freaking out about it right now, but come fall the special teams better be up to par.

[Hambone]

Remember our starting NT Perry was out with a concussion. He started last year as a true freshman. He adds alot at that spot. Highly athletic big kid who has added alot of weight.

Just a point of clarification - he was a redshirt freshman last year.

[tcbison]

I wasn't at the game, but the media blog mentioned issues with special teams. Were specials pretty bad? I am not going to start freaking out about it right now, but come fall the special teams better be up to par.

I listened to the game and Phil brought up a good point that a lot of the players on kick return would normally be covering kicks as well. So I wouldn't read too much into that part of special teams. Now the field goal kickers have no excuse in a spring game. That is a huge concern and one that needs to be figured out. Jastram has a strong leg but has serious accuracy issues.

[HerdBot]

I listened to the game and Phil brought up a good point that a lot of the players on kick return would normally be covering kicks as well. So I wouldn't read too much into that part of special teams. Now the field goal kickers have no excuse in a spring game. That is a huge concern and one that needs to be figured out. Jastram has a strong leg but has serious accuracy issues.

They didn't even rush the kicker and he still missed them. They literally stood and didn't attempt to even jump. Jastrom has some skills but he certainly needs a ton of practice

[AEBison1998]

I believe it was a 40 yarder and a 50 yarder. They weren't chip shots.

[AEBison1998]

Yup. Just checked and there are "unofficial" stats on GoBison.

Jastram missed from 50, 40, and then made one from 23.

Keller made his only attempt from 32.

(Not that I'm saying it's great...but a 40 yarder isn't automatic.)

[HerdBot]

I wrote a bit about QB's in my last post but did not do a comparison. I think Mohler looked good today and he is a great competitor and seems to have the best grasp of the offense. His weak spots are ability to see over the line and throw deep balls when needed although NDSU doesn't do this unless behind by 2 TD's late in the 4th quarter. If the other guys do well Mohler can be relied upon to be a really good 3rd QB.
Thorton has great footwork from what I saw today and has a real deceptive handoff like was commented by one of the announcers. He will be excellent with another year of experience and hopefully he gets a bunch of game time to ramp up. His accuracy may be lacking in the college game at this point but he is still pretty good. He looks real smooth on delivery of the ball. Better than any other NDSU QB out there.
Jensen looked good and seems to put the ball only where it can be caught. I just wish the receivers would quit dropping his good throws. He could be in that 65 % completion range if the receivers did better. Jensen is the leader and has good size and speed to run. I think Jensen will have a breakout year when things start to sync up and Vigen gets a clue how to run tha passing part of the offense.

Good observation on Mohler. He looked the most confident. His throws were accurate and he had a well thrown PI ball.

That begs the question...lets say Brock is the starter and he gets hurt during the Gophers. Who do you want to come in? I wish I had seen Thorton play with the first team.

[stevdock]

Did anyone else think it was strange that Vigen was with the #2 offense and Polacek was with the #1?? I assumed that caused a few procedural penalties. Because of Vigen not calling the offense for the #1's, I think it's very iffy to blame him for the offense today.

I think if Veldman can stay healthy he's going to have a great year and showed some of that today. One other thing that hasn't been mentioned is I think Ryan Smith will do just fine in the slot. The one pass he had thrown to him, he went up to get it and almost came down with it even though he got lit up.

I still say if our offense can score on our defense, that's a good sign for our offense, as our defense could be scary good. Let's keep those guys healthy and see how few points they give up.

As for the 40 yard FG, I was shocked that the refs called it no good, because I thought it hit the Scheels sign.

[HerdBot]

Did anyone else think it was strange that Vigen was with the #2 offense and Polacek was with the #1?? I assumed that caused a few procedural penalties. Because of Vigen not calling the offense for the #1's, I think it's very iffy to blame him for the offense today.

I think if Veldman can stay healthy he's going to have a great year and showed some of that today. One other thing that hasn't been mentioned is I think Ryan Smith will do just fine in the slot. The one pass he had thrown to him, he went up to get it and almost came down with it even though he got lit up.

I still say if our offense can score on our defense, that's a good sign for our offense, as our defense could be scary good. Let's keep those guys healthy and see how few points they give up.

As for the 40 yard FG, I was shocked that the refs called it no good, because I thought it hit the Scheels sign.

Veldman better have a good year sincetbe receivers cant catch. Cooper Wahlo was sort of a surprise but he got more opportunities.

[EndZoneQB]

After watching the recaps, they took a bunch of shots down field...the big plays were just not completed because of drops.

I saw a few subtle things with the QB's...they seemed to feel pretty comfortable in the pocket and had a good feel for the rush. I saw Jensen just take a sidestep out of pressure with his eyes down field. On that same play, Ojuri had a decent blitz pickup, he pushed the rush passed Jensen. Thorton did a good job stepping up in the pocket as well...just taking that subtle step up to avoid the pressure and stay in down field.

[Herd Mentality]

a 40 yd field goal should be automatic for a FCS kicker when he is indoors and nobody is making a real attempt to block it...

The only good thing about our kicking game is that it isnt as bad as the year Kyle Kelly was the kicker and PATs were far from a gimme.

[IzzyFlexion]

a 40 yd field goal should be automatic for a FCS kicker when he is indoors and nobody is making a real attempt to block it...

The only good thing about our kicking game is that it isnt as bad as the year Kyle Kelly was the kicker and PATs were far from a gimme.

I agree with the "Mentality Man".
In that much of a controlled environment, a veteran kicker (used to the stadium) should be able to nail a 40 yarder with no pressure at least 75 if not more percent of his tries.

EDIT: So, I guess I'm a hypocrite. I guess I'm can't put myself in the "it should be an automatic". But damn close to it.

[KilldeerBison]

I agree with the "Mentality Man".
In that much of a controlled environment, a veteran kicker (used to the stadium) should be able to nail a 40 yarder with no pressure at least 75 if not more percent of his tries.

EDIT: So, I guess I'm a hypocrite. I guess I'm can't put myself in the "it should be an automatic". But damn close to it.

It looked like Keller was limping a little, favoring his leg/hip? He seemed to be doing alot of stretching on the sidelines, during the game.

[runtheoption]

I wrote a bit about QB's in my last post but did not do a comparison. I think Mohler looked good today and he is a great competitor and seems to have the best grasp of the offense. His weak spots are ability to see over the line and throw deep balls when needed although NDSU doesn't do this unless behind by 2 TD's late in the 4th quarter. If the other guys do well Mohler can be relied upon to be a really good 3rd QB.
Thorton has great footwork from what I saw today and has a real deceptive handoff like was commented by one of the announcers. He will be excellent with another year of experience and hopefully he gets a bunch of game time to ramp up. His accuracy may be lacking in the college game at this point but he is still pretty good. He looks real smooth on delivery of the ball. Better than any other NDSU QB out there.
Jensen looked good and seems to put the ball only where it can be caught. I just wish the receivers would quit dropping his good throws. He could be in that 65 % completion range if the receivers did better. Jensen is the leader and has good size and speed to run. I think Jensen will have a breakout year when things start to sync up and Vigen gets a clue how to run tha passing part of the offense.

+++

Just based on yesterday's performance, I would go Jensen, Mohler, Thorton on my depth chart. Obviously, the coaches have a lot more to go on than just one scrimmage, and next fall should be a very interesting, intense camp for the QB's.

It was also nice to Perez in the slot (and get a few reps at QB, you never know with injuries). On the ball I saw him catch, you could tell the athleticism was there on the YAC. Some very good options for our slot receiver spot. End-around pass??

Damn SD, you just about made it through a whole post without ripping on Vigen. :)

Also, I question Herd Mentality's loyalty to the Bison. I do not recall seeing one article of Bison gear on him yesterday. My children were disturbed by this.

[mgbison]

Only if Vigen would start catching the ball. On a side note, if Dante is playing a receiver/ slot postition, it would be nice to see him throw it a time or two.

[JSUBison]

Some Big Ten spring game attendance stats:

Nebraska - 66,784
Ohio State - 44,276
Michigan - 25,000 est.
Wisconsin - 10,000 est.
Iowa - 8,000 est.
Penn State - 7,500 est.
Illinois - 6,000 est.
Purdue - 5,500 est.
Minnesota - 2,500 est.

Iowa State was the lowest in the Big 12 with about 4000. BYU had 5000.

3000 at NDSU is a great thing for the future.

Any idea to what our local FCS teams get for spring games: UNI, SDSU, Montana, Southern Illinois, etc?

[westnodak93bison]

Correct me if I'm wrong but it sure seems all our QBs stare down their first option nearly every time and hold the damn ball a little too long.

[jacks1]

Any idea to what our local FCS teams get for spring games: UNI, SDSU, Montana, Southern Illinois, etc?

SDSU had about 300 this year...weather was horrific. Usually get around 800 (by my estimation)...still not very good.

[SDbison]

Correct me if I'm wrong but it sure seems all our QBs stare down their first option nearly every time and hold the damn ball a little too long.
Who is the QB coach anyway?
Seems Vigen should be picking up on this and teaching his QB's how to be less obvious and how to find other options on the field.

[SDbison]

Only if Vigen would start catching the ball. On a side note, if Dante is playing a receiver/ slot postition, it would be nice to see him throw it a time or two.
I wish pure drops were the only problem with the passing offense.
#1 the overgame plan is too predictable.
#2 the selection of pass plays is limited (middle screen, toss screen, bubble screen). How about a pass to the TE over the middle. How about a quick hitting slant or a deep slant to a WR? All sorts of other possibiities.
#3 defensive coverage is easy because 99% of Bison plays are runs or very short passes so the defense can cheat up and is never on their heels. Defenders can play receivers tight because the threat of getting burned is not there. Lots of tips, blocks and knocks on the receivers when they are about to catch a predictable pass.

[SDbison]

+++

Just based on yesterday's performance, I would go Jensen, Mohler, Thorton on my depth chart. Obviously, the coaches have a lot more to go on than just one scrimmage, and next fall should be a very interesting, intense camp for the QB's.

It was also nice to Perez in the slot (and get a few reps at QB, you never know with injuries). On the ball I saw him catch, you could tell the athleticism was there on the YAC. Some very good options for our slot receiver spot. End-around pass??

Damn SD, you just about made it through a whole post without ripping on Vigen. :)

Also, I question Herd Mentality's loyalty to the Bison. I do not recall seeing one article of Bison gear on him yesterday. My children were disturbed by this.
Ha ha........I thought about not bringing up Vigen, but then the analysis would have not been complete.
So what is the deal with Herd Mentality? Is he getting forgetful in his old age? Maybe he is a closet Sioux fan and didn't want his underwear to clash with his outerwear?

[BisonNeil]

Remember our starting NT Perry was out with a concussion. He started last year as a true freshman. He adds alot at that spot. Highly athletic big kid who has added alot of weight.

Not that the GoBison roster is accurate, but a lot of other weights have been changed to show players getting a lot bigger and adding "alot of weight". However, in Levon's case he was listed as 268 last year and 274 this year. Not sure this qualifies as "alot of weight". I hope your eyeballs are more accurate than the roster :)

[NDSUFan_Sav]

Not that the GoBison roster is accurate, but a lot of other weights have been changed to show players getting a lot bigger and adding "alot of weight". However, in Levon's case he was listed as 268 last year and 274 this year. Not sure this qualifies as "alot of weight". I hope your eyeballs are more accurate than the roster :)

he's dropped fat and added muscle so lets say he dropped 10 lbs of fat and added 16 lbs of muscle...not saying that's the case.

[tjbison]

my thoughts:


I cant wait till September!!!

[NDSUFan_Sav]

my thoughts:

Montana St. roadtrip was a blast and I'm still recovering, but I still cant wait till September!!!


you left out a few things

[tjbison]

you left out a few things

HA HA yeah thats true:judges:

[Tatanka]

Tailgating went off without a hitch, and although the crowd was lighter than in previous years, everyone there had fun, even Answer Guy, sans the skull cap! Good to see everyone there talking Bison football and having a good time.

One drive-by by the dome security and police (probably just to say they did it). Don't know that they even stopped or engaged with anyone. And what a surprise, there were absolutely positively zero point zero issues or concerning behavior. Hmmmmm.....

[MontBison]

Any idea to what our local FCS teams get for spring games: UNI, SDSU, Montana, Southern Illinois, etc?

Montana had around 5000 people although they have their spring game in Billings which could help with attendance. Mont. St. had about 3500 which is by far the most I've seen in my three years here.

[Herd Mentality]

I seem to have "outgrown" a lot of my gear over the winter. :facepalm:

I also like to go to the dome incognito for all non-season events. My hope is dome security forgets about me before the next season.

RunTheOption...I hope your kids learn to forgive me in time.

[A1pigskin]

Bohl's biggest concern seems to be the passing game.

[Herd80]

I was a bit disappointed not to see more of Smith in the slot.

Note to TAB: Hereto is lodged a preemptive TWSS

[goldenshower]

I was a bit disappointed not to see more of Smith in the slot.

Note to TAB: Hereto is lodged a preemptive TWSS

alright, i was at the spring game and i will give my opinions which will be put on blast im sure. obviously spring games cant be taken too seriously because players sit out(im think i heard you guys were missing at least 6 guys that get good minutes?) and playbooks are pretty vanilla, i do think you can get a relative talent evaluation and your defense will be tough. your offense should look better than it really is because of the field position your defense will put them in.

qb-ndsu just cant get this figured out since walker was dominating. wr's need to help the qb's out more.

rb-solid-good depth

wr-i think this is the second weakest position for ndsu. vraa looked like he has nice hands but to me he looked slow. looked like there were some balls that the wr's should have caught but just were a step behind the ball.

that white kid that returned kicks is fun to watch. pretty damn electric.

oline-looked small with the exception of the loadholt(sp) look alike-i think i heard a couple starters were sitting out.

dline-looked smaller than i expected. looked like they used their hands well.

lb-obvious strength of defense-even w/o the 2 starters in there they were impressive. that olson kid is really tough-i would trade ryan grant for olson not question!

secondary-a lot better than i expected-williams is better than the mvc-he should probably be in the big ten

punter looked very good

field goals looked subject-long time to iron that out, but not terrible!

pretty good showing, nice crowd!

[IzzyFlexion]

alright, i was at the spring game and i will give my opinions which will be put on blast im sure. obviously spring games cant be taken too seriously because players sit out(im think i heard you guys were missing at least 6 guys that get good minutes?) and playbooks are pretty vanilla, i do think you can get a relative talent evaluation and your defense will be tough. your offense should look better than it really is because of the field position your defense will put them in.

qb-ndsu just cant get this figured out since walker was dominating. wr's need to help the qb's out more.

rb-solid-good depth

wr-i think this is the second weakest position for ndsu. vraa looked like he has nice hands but to me he looked slow. looked like there were some balls that the wr's should have caught but just were a step behind the ball.

that white kid that returned kicks is fun to watch. pretty damn electric.

oline-looked small with the exception of the loadholt(sp) look alike-i think i heard a couple starters were sitting out.

dline-looked smaller than i expected. looked like they used their hands well.

lb-obvious strength of defense-even w/o the 2 starters in there they were impressive. that olson kid is really tough-i would trade ryan grant for olson not question!

secondary-a lot better than i expected-williams is better than the mvc-he should probably be in the big ten

punter looked very good

field goals looked subject-long time to iron that out, but not terrible!

pretty good showing, nice crowd!

Hey!!
Objectivity is not allowed by visitors!
You're supposed to be a venomous hater that rips the Bison apart from top to bottom.:D

One of the best summaries I've seen.

[mgbison]

Good summary by glodenshower.

The only observation I don't agree with is he size of our oline. We are pretty much 6'3 to 6'6 and 290 to. 310 across the board. You start getting too many guys over 310 at this level and they are gonna be slow and unathletic. Most NFL lineman are in the 300 to 320 range. Maybe some of our younger olineman are still in the 280's.

[SDbison]

Bohl's biggest concern seems to be the passing game.
I would really be worried if Bohl didn't have that figured out by now.

[Tatanka]

alright, i was at the spring game and i will give my opinions which will be put on blast im sure. obviously spring games cant be taken too seriously because players sit out(im think i heard you guys were missing at least 6 guys that get good minutes?) and playbooks are pretty vanilla, i do think you can get a relative talent evaluation and your defense will be tough. your offense should look better than it really is because of the field position your defense will put them in.

qb-ndsu just cant get this figured out since walker was dominating. wr's need to help the qb's out more.

rb-solid-good depth

wr-i think this is the second weakest position for ndsu. vraa looked like he has nice hands but to me he looked slow. looked like there were some balls that the wr's should have caught but just were a step behind the ball.

that white kid that returned kicks is fun to watch. pretty damn electric.

oline-looked small with the exception of the loadholt(sp) look alike-i think i heard a couple starters were sitting out.

dline-looked smaller than i expected. looked like they used their hands well.

lb-obvious strength of defense-even w/o the 2 starters in there they were impressive. that olson kid is really tough-i would trade ryan grant for olson not question!

secondary-a lot better than i expected-williams is better than the mvc-he should probably be in the big ten

punter looked very good

field goals looked subject-long time to iron that out, but not terrible!

pretty good showing, nice crowd!

you should have come out and tailgated with us...

[goldenshower]

Good summary by glodenshower.

The only observation I don't agree with is he size of our oline. We are pretty much 6'3 to 6'6 and 290 to. 310 across the board. You start getting too many guys over 310 at this level and they are gonna be slow and unathletic. Most NFL lineman are in the 300 to 320 range. Maybe some of our younger olineman are still in the 280's.

on paper ndsu's line is as big as the gophers-i was at both spring games and i was impressed with the size of the gopher oline. i didnt think i was going to see ndsu and think they looked small. ndsu is known to have big intimidating olines and i didnt see it.

im really anxious to see how marcus williams does vs da'jon mcknight and how your linebackers do covering our te eric lair, especially with the threat of gray running the ball. it appeared you guys struggled a bit covering your tight end(probably due to those 2 lb's not playing) im also really interested in who covers ge'shun harris a juco transfer wr(he looks the part-hoping he can play however)

i am really concerned about the gopher secondary, especially the safeties. but im not sure your passing game is something we will have to be worried about. i think we can load the box and stop the run w/o fear of being beat deep. i like the gopher cornerbacks except vs spread formations and i dont think ndsu is thinking their best option is to spread the field and throw the ball 30+ times.(i know in 2007 roehl ran all day-good thing for me its not 2007)

there isnt much "match up" situations to talk about with usc-usc is better at every position and ndsu is better than both new mexico st and miami(oh).

[344Johnson]

I am a tad concerned because we didn't run on Kansas at all. However, our line got much better throughout the season...

[DjKyRo]

I am a tad concerned because we didn't run on Kansas at all.

What stats are you looking at? We had 32 carries, albeit a handful were sacks. McNorton had 15 of them.

[Gully]

What stats are you looking at? We had 32 carries, albeit a handful were sacks. McNorton had 15 of them.

I think he meant "run successfully".

[344Johnson]

I think he meant "run successfully".

Yes, whoopsies on not mentioning this.

[Greenie]

5 biggest questions/keys to a successful 2011 season
1. QB passing accuracy at least 55%
2. WR catching the ball
3. Interior D-Line play to replace Gratzek
4. Kicking game
5. Avoid the major injury bug

#1 and #2 will make play-calling a lot easier

My depth chart projections for game #1
QB - Jensen, Thorton, Mohler; best depth in DI years, yet no true #1 guy
RB - McNorton, Ojuri, Lang -- Sigers and Smith slot/RB options, this group is loaded. Not enough playing time for this group of playmakers.
WR - Holloway and Gebhart, Vraa, Smith, Perez, Wahlo. I think Perez is the sleeper in this group, seems to have good hands.
TE - Veldman for catching, Bruhn for blocking
FB - Grothmann, Buehner. Could see Lang here to get him on the field.
O-Line - Turner, Cornick, Richard, Lund, Hinz (Gimmestad and Jerve, others in mix)
D-Line - Perry, Drevlow, Boyer, Stoczynski (with many others rotating in)
LB - Evans, Olson, Jemison; Wilson in passing downs (with lots of depth which should make special teams very good)
CB - Williams and Pierre; Boyd in nickel, and Dudzik
FS - Eaves, Pike
SS - Heagle, Ollman

K - Keller wins job with accuracy
Kickoffs - Jastram because stronger leg
P - Voigtlander
LS - Murphy
KR - Smith and Sigers
PR - Smith

This team has a lot of quality players and depth, and we haven't even seen the incoming freshmen yet!

[Wacker_in_the_Hall]

Unless we can find a receiver capable of beating man coverage and then catching the ball, we will continue to see 8 men in the box. All the Vigen haters, need to consider his options, when teams are able to outnumber us up front.

I saw alot of great things on Saturday, and I am excited for next year! But we need a WR to really step up! I thought the play calling was excellent, and the QB's were delivering the ball on target.

[westnodak93bison]

Unless we can find a receiver capable of beating man coverage and then catching the ball, we will continue to see 8 men in the box. All the Vigen haters, need to consider his options, when teams are able to outnumber us up front.

I saw alot of great things on Saturday, and I am excited for next year! But we need a WR to really step up! I thought the play calling was excellent, and the QB's were delivering the ball on target.

IMHO, some of the WR issues are due to the QB staring down the first option nearly every time. The D knows where the ball is going.

[stevdock]

IMHO, some of the WR issues are due to the QB staring down the first option nearly every time. The D knows where the ball is going.

The flat out drops are not caused by this. If you get your hands on it, you need to come down with it a majority of the time.

[HerdBot]

5 biggest questions/keys to a successful 2011 season
1. QB passing accuracy at least 55%
2. WR catching the ball
3. Interior D-Line play to replace Gratzek
4. Kicking game
5. Avoid the major injury bug

#1 and #2 will make play-calling a lot easier

My depth chart projections for game #1
QB - Jensen, Thorton, Mohler; best depth in DI years, yet no true #1 guy
RB - McNorton, Ojuri, Lang -- Sigers and Smith slot/RB options, this group is loaded. Not enough playing time for this group of playmakers.
WR - Holloway and Gebhart, Vraa, Smith, Perez, Wahlo. I think Perez is the sleeper in this group, seems to have good hands.
TE - Veldman for catching, Bruhn for blocking
FB - Grothmann, Buehner. Could see Lang here to get him on the field.
O-Line - Turner, Cornick, Richard, Lund, Hinz (Gimmestad and Jerve, others in mix)
D-Line - Perry, Drevlow, Boyer, Stoczynski (with many others rotating in)
LB - Evans, Olson, Jemison; Wilson in passing downs (with lots of depth which should make special teams very good)
CB - Williams and Pierre; Boyd in nickel, and Dudzik
FS - Eaves, Pike
SS - Heagle, Ollman

K - Keller wins job with accuracy
Kickoffs - Jastram because stronger leg
P - Voigtlander
LS - Murphy
KR - Smith and Sigers
PR - Smith

This team has a lot of quality players and depth, and we haven't even seen the incoming freshmen yet!

I think for the D tackles to be successful they need to add some major weight this summer. They are too undersized. If they can't beef up quickly we need a juco at tackle.

[westnodak93bison]

The flat out drops are not caused by this. If you get your hands on it, you need to come down with it a majority of the time.

sure but it makes it harder for a receiver to get open when the safeties pretty much know where the ball is going

[CAS4127]

Well, as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. First, we did not see a National Championship caliber type of team or play on Saturday, both from a player and plays standpoint and from a coaching standpoint. But we have some things going for us nonetheless.

Offense: Our O-line looks solid, and we were missig a couple. Very solid at RB. All three QBs were about equal in my opinion, and I think that has to do with the fact that they are running Vigen's offense, and therefore, any personal physical abillities of one over the other are not that noticeable. WR/Wideouts--below average performance--catch the effin ball. Fullback--I think Grothman may be our best player when it comes to consistency and fundamentals. He is always in an "athletic" position ready to explode on whoever gets in his way as he leads on runs. As for the offensive scheme, it has not, from what I saw, changed 1 bit. We still are not seeing the read/speed option, even though almost everyone is running that play AND our defense has a very difficult time stopping it. As for the passing plays, do not worry about our QB's making check downs, as it appeared clearly to me that the ball is designed to go to one specific receiver on any given play, and, if that reciever is not open, it's either attempt to dump off to a RB or tuck and run. Vigen pass plays suck. Again, the plays are designed for one player to get the ball, the other receivers are merely running "run off" patterns, and unless it is a broken play, they will not see the ball, which is another reason we see our QB's telegraphing/dialed in on one receiver. If this does not change, I do not see us being a major offensive threat next year, because MVFC defenses can and will stop the run. Also, why is Vign insistent on not allowing our QB's to rollout past the hash marks. This would give them more of a run/pass option, especially on the 10-15 yard out plays. Thornton's manner of faking the handoff would make a naked roll-out even more effective. An example of the rollout, run-pass option would have been when (in the 4th quarter) Jensen rolled to his left and Grothman ran a 10-12 yard out. G was covered, but J had checked-up at the hash. He attempted to force it to G, and the pass went incomplete. What would have been perfect would have been J continuing his rollout, and G, being covered, turning it up field, as the other receiver on that side had ran a post pattern. If G got seperation from his cut up the sideline, then J could have dumped it to him for a TD. If G doesn't get seperation because the LB/SS covering him goes with him up the field, J tucks and runs with the ball at least 30-35 yards, and, with just one or two minor blocks downfield, takes it to the house. Vigen's offense sucks, and his ability to "coach" players up on just minor type ad-libs appears non-existant.



Defense: I was very happy with the performance. Active LB's, secondary looks solid (Boyd can fly!!), and our D-line looks to have depth. My only concern was that I thought our D-line played with their pads a little high, and the QB "sacks" were often the result of the ONE receiver to whom the ball was to go being covered.

Kicking game: Turn on the circus music when it comes to PATs and Field goals (this could very well lose games for us next year if there is not drastic imrovement. Did we recruit a kicker??!!! V did well at punting, but I would like to see more hangtime. Kickoffs were average, and again, we need more hangtime.

All in all, our D looks much better than our O, and appears to be MUCH better coached.

[HerdBot]

Well, as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. First, we did not see a National Championship caliber type of team or play on Saturday, both from a player and plays standpoint and from a coaching standpoint. But we have some things going for us nonetheless.

Offense: Our O-line looks solid, and we were missig a couple. Very solid at RB. All three QBs were about equal in my opinion, and I think that has to do with the fact that they are running Vigen's offense, and therefore, any personal physical abillities of one over the other are not that noticeable. WR/Wideouts--below average performance--catch the effin ball. Fullback--I think Grothman may be our best player when it comes to consistency and fundamentals. He is always in an "athletic" position ready to explode on whoever gets in his way as he leads on runs. As for the offensive scheme, it has not, from what I saw, changed 1 bit. We still are not seeing the read/speed option, even though almost everyone is running that play AND our defense has a very difficult time stopping it. As for the passing plays, do not worry about our QB's making check downs, as it appeared clearly to me that the ball is designed to go to one specific receiver on any given play, and, if that reciever is not open, it's either attempt to dump off to a RB or tuck and run. Vigen pass plays suck. Again, the plays are designed for one player to get the ball, the other receivers are merely running "run off" patterns, and unless it is a broken play, they will not see the ball, which is another reason we see our QB's telegraphing/dialed in on one receiver. If this does not change, I do not see us being a major offensive threat next year, because MVFC defenses can and will stop the run. Also, why is Vign insistent on not allowing our QB's to rollout past the hash marks. This would give them more of a run/pass option, especially on the 10-15 yard out plays. Thornton's manner of faking the handoff would make a naked roll-out even more effective. An example of the rollout, run-pass option would have been when (in the 4th quarter) Jensen rolled to his left and Grothman ran a 10-12 yard out. G was covered, but J had checked-up at the hash. He attempted to force it to G, and the pass went incomplete. What would have been perfect would have been J continuing his rollout, and G, being covered, turning it up field, as the other receiver on that side had ran a post pattern. If G got seperation from his cut up the sideline, then J could have dumped it to him for a TD. If G doesn't get seperation because the LB/SS covering him goes with him up the field, J tucks and runs with the ball at least 30-35 yards, and, with just one or two minor blocks downfield, takes it to the house. Vigen's offense sucks, and his ability to "coach" players up on just minor type ad-libs appears non-existant.



Defense: I was very happy with the performance. Active LB's, secondary looks solid (Boyd can fly!!), and our D-line looks to have depth. My only concern was that I thought our D-line played with their pads a little high, and the QB "sacks" were often the result of the ONE receiver to whom the ball was to go being covered.

Kicking game: Turn on the circus music when it comes to PATs and Field goals (this could very well lose games for us next year if there is not drastic imrovement. Did we recruit a kicker??!!! V did well at punting, but I would like to see more hangtime. Kickoffs were average, and again, we need more hangtime.

All in all, our D looks much better than our O, and appears to be MUCH better coached.

Great analysis. DO you think the D line getting pushed back has more to do with playing too high, being ligher than we've been in years, or a combo of the 2?

[Siouxfallsbison]

Well, as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. First, we did not see a National Championship caliber type of team or play on Saturday, both from a player and plays standpoint and from a coaching standpoint. But we have some things going for us nonetheless.

Offense: Our O-line looks solid, and we were missig a couple. Very solid at RB. All three QBs were about equal in my opinion, and I think that has to do with the fact that they are running Vigen's offense, and therefore, any personal physical abillities of one over the other are not that noticeable. WR/Wideouts--below average performance--catch the effin ball. Fullback--I think Grothman may be our best player when it comes to consistency and fundamentals. He is always in an "athletic" position ready to explode on whoever gets in his way as he leads on runs. As for the offensive scheme, it has not, from what I saw, changed 1 bit. We still are not seeing the read/speed option, even though almost everyone is running that play AND our defense has a very difficult time stopping it. As for the passing plays, do not worry about our QB's making check downs, as it appeared clearly to me that the ball is designed to go to one specific receiver on any given play, and, if that reciever is not open, it's either attempt to dump off to a RB or tuck and run. Vigen pass plays suck. Again, the plays are designed for one player to get the ball, the other receivers are merely running "run off" patterns, and unless it is a broken play, they will not see the ball, which is another reason we see our QB's telegraphing/dialed in on one receiver. If this does not change, I do not see us being a major offensive threat next year, because MVFC defenses can and will stop the run. Also, why is Vign insistent on not allowing our QB's to rollout past the hash marks. This would give them more of a run/pass option, especially on the 10-15 yard out plays. Thornton's manner of faking the handoff would make a naked roll-out even more effective. An example of the rollout, run-pass option would have been when (in the 4th quarter) Jensen rolled to his left and Grothman ran a 10-12 yard out. G was covered, but J had checked-up at the hash. He attempted to force it to G, and the pass went incomplete. What would have been perfect would have been J continuing his rollout, and G, being covered, turning it up field, as the other receiver on that side had ran a post pattern. If G got seperation from his cut up the sideline, then J could have dumped it to him for a TD. If G doesn't get seperation because the LB/SS covering him goes with him up the field, J tucks and runs with the ball at least 30-35 yards, and, with just one or two minor blocks downfield, takes it to the house. Vigen's offense sucks, and his ability to "coach" players up on just minor type ad-libs appears non-existant.



Defense: I was very happy with the performance. Active LB's, secondary looks solid (Boyd can fly!!), and our D-line looks to have depth. My only concern was that I thought our D-line played with their pads a little high, and the QB "sacks" were often the result of the ONE receiver to whom the ball was to go being covered.

Kicking game: Turn on the circus music when it comes to PATs and Field goals (this could very well lose games for us next year if there is not drastic imrovement. Did we recruit a kicker??!!! V did well at punting, but I would like to see more hangtime. Kickoffs were average, and again, we need more hangtime.

All in all, our D looks much better than our O, and appears to be MUCH better coached.

Here is my .02 on this.
Defense is always going to look better this early. 2 advantages: they know most of the plays that the offense runs and the timing is not as crucial on defense.
Dropped passes: yes there were two many, especially the wide open ones. Smith and Gebhart got hit right when they caught theirs but then dropped them. Tough catches, yes, should they have held on Yes, but that will come.
Our O line needs to do a better job of pass blocking. run blocking looked good.
Defense looked great for a spring game.
Overall: I am excited about this team. Its going to be very good. Defense we are solid. Offensively our running game is going to be electric and by fall I think our passing game is going to be good, and by the Gophers game its going to be taken to another level. :)

[CAS4127]

I think D-line pushback has more to do with pads being too high and lack of leverage as a result. That said, I thought or Dline did a fairly good job of maintaining the LOS, but we did not get much penetration, especially from the DT's, and that is where I noticed where the pads we the highest, both first and second team. Maintenance of the LOS is what allowed our LB's to be so active and make a lot of plays. It doesn't allow the Oline to get to their (the next) level, although I saw some of that, which is to be expected given our power running game.

[The Lost Dutchman]

Coach on 740 The Fan right now talking about the game, 2373767 and ask the coach a question!

[BisonNeil]

Well, as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. First, we did not see a National Championship caliber type of team or play on Saturday, both from a player and plays standpoint and from a coaching standpoint.

I'm curious. Did "we" see a quarterfinalist caliber type of team last year in the spring game?

[CAS4127]

@BNeil: NO, and that is what everyone needs to consider, and why we need to keep things in perspective. Neil, we finished 7-4 last year, and BARELY made the playoffs--remember??!! Then we got a home playoff game against an over-matched RM team that would have been the MSU of the MVFC in my opinion (and recall we had just lost to MSU with a miserable offensive showing). Next came Montana State, who, in my opinion, over looked us a bit, and who was not prepared for our physical style of play. Then came EWU. We stayed with them, but that was only after their biggest offensive threat got knocked out of the game, and their QB was having an off day.

So, in a nutshell, the "NC or bust" thread, and all this talk about how unbelievable we are going to be next year is, at least for now, tomfoolery!!

We can move the ball on the ground and play good D. The problem is that, despite those being the ingrediants for success, we have to be able to pass the ball, and we have to have a strong kicking game.

Oh, and I should add, WE SAW THE EXACT SAME OFFENSE WE HAD LAST FALL, AND THAT MOST OF US WERE UPSET WITH EVEN AFTER OUR PLAYOFF RUN. A good DC will have an easy time making us one dimensional, and, when I say one dimensional, I mean a team that uses only its RB's to run the ball effectively, and which does not use the talent of other players who could be threats.

[HerdBot]

I'm curious. Did "we" see a quarterfinalist caliber type of team last year in the spring game?

We saw a team that was just good enough to get in the playoffs and make a deep run, despite a 4-4 conference record. I think the Missouri Valley is just as tough as the playoffs. I think were built to win in the playoffs but not built to win the Missouri Valley. Are we built to win a National Championship? Not if we can't get the passing game going.

[Bison bison]

Now no more shenanigans, no more tomfoolery, no more ballyhoo.

[Kermit]

Oh, and I should add, WE SAW THE EXACT SAME OFFENSE WE HAD LAST FALL, AND THAT MOST OF US WERE UPSET WITH EVEN AFTER OUR PLAYOFF RUN. A good DC will have an easy time making us one dimensional, and, when I say one dimensional, I mean a team that uses only its RB's to run the ball effectively, and which does not use the talent of other players who could be threats.

I agree. I am very pleased with the state of the defense, recruiting, and depth of quality athletes. I am disappointed that the offensive philosophy and design have not evolved, despite some obvious problems last season.

[bisonmike2]

@BNeil: NO, and that is what everyone needs to consider, and why we need to keep things in perspective. Neil, we finished 7-4 last year, and BARELY made the playoffs--remember??!! Then we got a home playoff game against an over-matched RM team that would have been the MSU of the MVFC in my opinion (and recall we had just lost to MSU with a miserable offensive showing). Next came Montana State, who, in my opinion, over looked us a bit, and who was not prepared for our physical style of play. Then came EWU. We stayed with them, but that was only after their biggest offensive threat got knocked out of the game, and their QB was having an off day.

So, in a nutshell, the "NC or bust" thread, and all this talk about how unbelievable we are going to be next year is, at least for now, tomfoolery!!

We can move the ball on the ground and play good D. The problem is that, despite those being the ingrediants for success, we have to be able to pass the ball, and we have to have a strong kicking game.

Oh, and I should add, WE SAW THE EXACT SAME OFFENSE WE HAD LAST FALL, AND THAT MOST OF US WERE UPSET WITH EVEN AFTER OUR PLAYOFF RUN. A good DC will have an easy time making us one dimensional, and, when I say one dimensional, I mean a team that uses only its RB's to run the ball effectively, and which does not use the talent of other players who could be threats.

I can't really disagree with any of this but here's my take. We saw a young team, loaded with talent struggle throughout the year to find themselves and their identity. Talented enough to beat a Big 12 team on the road but inexperienced enough to not use that confidence to beat UNI. Many ups and downs, then they got lucky at the end of the season eecked into the playoffs and got a favorable match-up. They played with a nothing to lose attitude in the playoffs where they took the eventual champs into overtime on the road. These guys got a taste of what it's like to play at championship level. Now I think they are going to hit the ground running. Gone are the questions of whether they can compete against the top teams in the valley or even the country. They already know they can. Gone are the questions about who is going to lead the team. Brock has stepped up and accepted the challenge. Esley may challenge but this QB race no longer has the uncertainty to it that we had last year. Gone are the questions about this defense. These guys now play hard and fast to the ball and we got to see a return of a defense that can force turnovers and directly change the outcomes of games. Sure we still have the play calling in question, but I feel a hell of a lot better about it this off season than I did last year. For the first time since we've been eligible for the playoffs I think this team is ready to make a championship run. I can't wait for football to start.

[TransAmBison]

TAB's take:

Jensen looks improved. He was hitting his receivers. When Esley hit his receivers he seemed to hit them perfectly, but then he also floated a deep ball that was picked off quite easily. I'm sorry, overall I was not impressed with Mohler. He made a couple nice plays but he is in no way challenging for the starting spot. I think Jensen is going to be significantly improved next season...and that will loosen up defenses.

Receivers have potential. They have definite room for improvement, but I see potential I haven't seen for a few years.

The d looks solid...if they can find a way to replace Gratzek we are going to be dangerous.

[CAS4127]

By TAB:

I
think Jensen is going to be significantly improved next season...and that will loosen up defenses.

Are you assuming audibles away from what Vigen calls for in the huddle? I mean, ya, Jensen can practice his hand-off skillls all Summer to ensure we don't have fumbled exchanges, and he can practive his passing skills to improve accuracy and strength, but if a passing play isn't called, it won't matter, and if a passing play is called, but is designed for only one player to get the ball, well, the defense is not going to "loosen up" over that type of veiled threat--just saying.


And, where's on-teh-road when I need someone to debate with about Vigen.

[SDbison]

I am in 100% agreement with CAS and Kermit. The comments about the the offensive game plan still not improving and coaching of QB's still lacking is very disappointing. Of course, I have pointed this issue out to Bisonville for a long time being the #1 Vigen hater. Actually, I don't hate Vigen, I feel sorry for him because he is trying to do something that is beyond his current capabilities. The situation completely rests on Bohl's shoulders since for some reason he is comfortable with this part of his staff. If by this fall little or nothing changes it will be sad that the Bison have to struggle due to inadequate coaching. What a potential waste of talent and opportunity for another season.
Please God, help Vigen and Bohl figure it out. :facepalm2:

[westnodak93bison]

I am in 100% agreement with CAS and Kermit. The comments about the the offensive game plan still not improving and coaching of QB's still lacking is very disappointing. Of course, I have pointed this issue out to Bisonville for a long time being the #1 Vigen hater. Actually, I don't hate Vigen, I feel sorry for him because he is trying to do something that is beyond his current capabilities. The situation completely rests on Bohl's shoulders since for some reason he is comfortable with this part of his staff. If by this fall little or nothing changes it will be sad that the Bison have to struggle due to inadequate coaching. What a potential waste of talent and opportunity for another season.
Please God, help Vigen and Bohl figure it out. :facepalm2:

I think you are right. It may take an act of God to make the passing game work.

[TransAmBison]

By TAB:

I

Are you assuming audibles away from what Vigen calls for in the huddle? I mean, ya, Jensen can practice his hand-off skillls all Summer to ensure we don't have fumbled exchanges, and he can practive his passing skills to improve accuracy and strength, but if a passing play isn't called, it won't matter, and if a passing play is called, but is designed for only one player to get the ball, well, the defense is not going to "loosen up" over that type of veiled threat--just saying.


And, where's on-teh-road when I need someone to debate with about Vigen.
I'm not saying we are there yet, but I see potential. Hopefully Vigen gives his qb some more authority and hopefully the qb takes it. Jensen seems like more of a leader than last year. I watched him on and off the field, and I think come fall he will take control.

[BisonNeil]

@BNeil: NO, and that is what everyone needs to consider, and why we need to keep things in perspective. Neil, we finished 7-4 last year, and BARELY made the playoffs--remember??!! Then we got a home playoff game against an over-matched RM team that would have been the MSU of the MVFC in my opinion (and recall we had just lost to MSU with a miserable offensive showing). Next came Montana State, who, in my opinion, over looked us a bit, and who was not prepared for our physical style of play. Then came EWU. We stayed with them, but that was only after their biggest offensive threat got knocked out of the game, and their QB was having an off day.

So, in a nutshell, the "NC or bust" thread, and all this talk about how unbelievable we are going to be next year is, at least for now, tomfoolery!!

We can move the ball on the ground and play good D. The problem is that, despite those being the ingrediants for success, we have to be able to pass the ball, and we have to have a strong kicking game.

Oh, and I should add, WE SAW THE EXACT SAME OFFENSE WE HAD LAST FALL, AND THAT MOST OF US WERE UPSET WITH EVEN AFTER OUR PLAYOFF RUN. A good DC will have an easy time making us one dimensional, and, when I say one dimensional, I mean a team that uses only its RB's to run the ball effectively, and which does not use the talent of other players who could be threats.

Hey, don't get me wrong, I am not arguing, just saying we had a very tempered view of the Bison last spring coming off a 3-8 season and a really poor spring game, IMO. I agree with you a 100%.

I am just being cautious. Several on here have beaten me about the head and shoulders when I have criticized Vigen as an OC. Now, that is largely because I have been very critical of him for a long time and those posters don't like what I have to say, but it has caused me to lighten up nonetheless.

I am sure your analysis of there being only a primary receiver on every pass play without options is bang on and I would add that I am not sure the over-reliance on the inside screen is such a good thing either. I have a sneaking suspicion that is going to be an over-called play this fall.

[NorthernBison]

I feel I must throw the BS flag regarding pass plays designed for only one receiver.

Langdon HS runs this offense. As a matter of fact, I think much of the terminology is the same. I stood by Coach Bohl when he was up to watch Travis Beck a couple years ago and he commented that the plays look very familiar.

I've sat with one of our HS coaches and he explained some of the plays they ran in games and the methodology of the playcalling. Go ahead and blame Vigen for not coaching up the QB's on going through progressions. That's fair.

But seriously, can you really believe an NDSU game plan with Bohl in charge would be designed like a pee wee team? Good grief, give the staff a bit more credit than that.

[BadlandsBison]

We run the west coast, right? Four options every pass play but we only stare down one Guy. We need Jon Gruden to visit Fargo...

[CAS4127]

I feel I must throw the BS flag regarding pass plays designed for only one receiver.

Langdon HS runs this offense. As a matter of fact, I think much of the terminology is the same. I stood by Coach Bohl when he was up to watch Travis Beck a couple years ago and he commented that the plays look very familiar.

I've sat with one of our HS coaches and he explained some of the plays they ran in games and the methodology of the playcalling. Go ahead and blame Vigen for not coaching up the QB's on going through progressions. That's fair.

But seriously, can you really believe an NDSU game plan with Bohl in charge would be designed like a pee wee team? Good grief, give the staff a bit more credit than that.

Say WHAT?? You are in the same breath saying Langdon (pee wee offense)and NDSU run the same offense??!! Are you kidding me??!! I was going to say in an earlier post that this may be the same offense that Central Valley, Vigen's HS, ran, and I guess I may have been correct.

[THEsocalledfan]

Say WHAT?? You are in the same breath saying Langdon (pee wee offense)and NDSU run the same offense??!! Are you kidding me??!! I was going to say in an earlier post that this may be the same offense that Central Valley, Vigen's HS, ran, and I guess I may have been correct.

They were 9 man at the time, so doubt it is the same.....but get your point.

(by the way, we beat them his senior year and we had a much better offense.)

[CAS4127]

Hey, don't get me wrong, I am not arguing, just saying we had a very tempered view of the Bison last spring coming off a 3-8 season and a really poor spring game, IMO. I agree with you a 100%.

I am just being cautious. Several on here have beaten me about the head and shoulders when I have criticized Vigen as an OC. Now, that is largely because I have been very critical of him for a long time and those posters don't like what I have to say, but it has caused me to lighten up nonetheless.

I am sure your analysis of there being only a primary receiver on every pass play without options is bang on and I would add that I am not sure the over-reliance on the inside screen is such a good thing either. I have a sneaking suspicion that is going to be an over-called play this fall.

Well, if there are other options (other than dumping it to an available, nearby RB) then neither the QB nor the other receivers involved in the play know about it, as they certainly don't act like it. As for the middle screen, you are spot on, Neil. We ran that at least 5 times in this scrimmage, didn't we?!!

[CAS4127]

We run the west coast, right? Four options every pass play but we only stare down one Guy. We need Jon Gruden to visit Fargo...

I think Vigen should come up with a new name, like the "helter skelter" offense, with run/middle screen options"!

I guess what it boils down to is that I was very disappointed in Vigen and our offensive scheme even after our playoff run, and I really wanted to see some changes, even adding the read/speed option would have been something. Instead, nothing--ZERO. And, for all those who were saying last year that Vigen is limited by the talent he had, what say you now?!

[THEsocalledfan]

I think Vigen should come up with a new name, like the "helter skelter" offense, with run/middle screen options"!

Are we going to fall into the same "swing pass" rut? After Rhoehl housed that one in the Goopher game, NDSU kept running it over and over and over and over and over and over and over......

[Notorious]

We have to throw the ball down the field, or we're toast...as an oppossing DC, I would stack the box and just sit on the screen...play man to man on the outstide...easy schmeesy...

I agree with most everyone on here...without a passing game, we will finish middle of the pack in conference and not make the playoffs.

[TransAmBison]

We have to throw the ball down the field, or we're toast...as an oppossing DC, I would stack the box and just sit on the screen...play man to man on the outstide...easy schmeesy...

I agree with most everyone on here...without a passing game, we will finish middle of the pack in conference and not make the playoffs.
Easy to say for a guy who doesn't have the slightest idea how the game of football is played.:duel:

[CAS4127]

Are we going to fall into the same "swing pass" rut? After Rhoehl housed that one in the Goopher game, NDSU kept running it over and over and over and over and over and over and over......

I think we already have with the middle screen. And, you know, now that I have posted my some of my thoughts on this, I also remember thinking during the game that Vigen was, as usual, not setting up any particular play. It seemed he just ran random plays for whatever reason. For example, what the hell was, and where the hell did it come from, that double pitch-type reverse in the 4th. We had not run anything close to resembling a reverse prior to that, and he calls a DOUBLE reverse??!!

Here is how basic it is, A reverse or miss direction play is commonly called when the D is not staying honest, at home, and or is over pursuing. So, run a reverse or other misdirection play to take advantage of that. If you run a DOUBLE reverse, the ball is just going to go right where the defense is to begin with if it is over pursuing. And, guess what, that's exactly what happend on the double reverse. The defense was all over it and it went for a loss, at least to the extent I even bothered watching the ending of the play.
:banghead: :banghead:

[Notorious]

Easy to say for a guy who doesn't have the slightest idea how the game of football is played.:duel:

Shut the farck up dickhead! - Copyright: SDBision

;)

[CAS4127]

We have to throw the ball down the field, or we're toast...as an oppossing DC, I would stack the box and just sit on the screen...play man to man on the outstide...easy schmeesy...

I agree with most everyone on here...without a passing game, we will finish middle of the pack in conference and not make the playoffs.

Exactly, Note. And if you are playing 1man or man-under coverage (likely 1-an) on the wideouts, a LB will usually be assigned to man up on the RB. If a middle screen is the called, that LB will have DJ in his crosshairs as soon as the ball leaves the QB's hands, and will be loving life!! On the other hand, image if we were to fake like we were running a middle screen, and, instead, have DJ hesitate, and then run up the seem or even just bounce out to the flat and be in space when he caught the ball, with the LB trying to run him down from behind. Oh, wait, we either don't have that play, or just never call it.

[NorthernBison]

Say WHAT?? You are in the same breath saying Langdon (pee wee offense)and NDSU run the same offense??!! Are you kidding me??!! I was going to say in an earlier post that this may be the same offense that Central Valley, Vigen's HS, ran, and I guess I may have been correct.

The Langdon coach played in the Bison offense under Bohl. Hence the similarity. Way to miss the entire point. If a High School team designs pass plays with multiple receivers and expects the QB to make decisions, I doubt if NDSU needs to "dumb it down" to a pee wee level.

So what I'm saying is that I don't believe that NDSU has a passing game that has only one receiver as an option.

[Bison bison]

So what I'm saying is that I don't believe that NDSU has a passing game that has only one receiver as an option.


?


I thought that was our trademark?

[Answer Guy]

Tailgating went off without a hitch, and although the crowd was lighter than in previous years, everyone there had fun, even Answer Guy, sans the skull cap!

In the tailgating biz, that is know as "going bareback*".




*Not advised for the younger, single guys. Stay safe, my friends.

[CAS4127]

The Langdon coach played in the Bison offense under Bohl. Hence the similarity. Way to miss the entire point. If a High School team designs pass plays with multiple receivers and expects the QB to make decisions, I doubt if NDSU needs to "dumb it down" to a pee wee level.

So what I'm saying is that I don't believe that NDSU has a passing game that has only one receiver as an option.

Oh, I would guess any given passing play has more than one receiver as an option, but we just do not run them that way. If you watch our passing plays closely, the recievers who are not the first option are running clearing routes for the most part, and the QB then waits for the "clearing" to take place, and throws to 1st option, whose route and area has been "cleared" out of defensive players. Yes, we have very simple, quick passing plays such as 10 yard curls and outs that are run by several recievers and all could be an option, but watch any of the plays that take time to develop, and we are down to one receiver, and it does look "pee wee", pure and simple. The whole effin crowd knows where the ball is going before it is even thrown.

[Bison bison]

Dude.

Bitching about things here isn't going to change anything.

If you want things to change you're going to have to contact EA Sports.

If your designs have merit they'll make it into NCAA 2013 (it's probably too late for 2012). And then wait for Vigen to play it over the winter of 2013-2014.

[CAS4127]

Dude.

Bitching about things here isn't going to change anything.

If you want things to change you're going to have to contact EA Sports.

If your designs have merit they'll make it into NCAA 2013 (it's probably too late for 2012). And then wait for Vigen to play it over the winter of 2013-2014.

I"m not sure he knows how to play that game--he might not even know how to successfully play NCAA 1913-14.

Okay, I'm done bitching about it for now, but, to a man, we all (witht he exception of on-teh-road) agreed that for us to have a great 2011 season and possible deap playoff run, Vigen and his offense needed to improve in the off-season, along with some players. Well, it appears those players have improved . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

[EndZoneQB]

I think we already have with the middle screen. And, you know, now that I have posted my some of my thoughts on this, I also remember thinking during the game that Vigen was, as usual, not setting up any particular play. It seemed he just ran random plays for whatever reason. For example, what the hell was, and where the hell did it come from, that double pitch-type reverse in the 4th. We had not run anything close to resembling a reverse prior to that, and he calls a DOUBLE reverse??!!

Here is how basic it is, A reverse or miss direction play is commonly called when the D is not staying honest, at home, and or is over pursuing. So, run a reverse or other misdirection play to take advantage of that. If you run a DOUBLE reverse, the ball is just going to go right where the defense is to begin with if it is over pursuing. And, guess what, that's exactly what happend on the double reverse. The defense was all over it and it went for a loss, at least to the extent I even bothered watching the ending of the play.
:banghead: :banghead:

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to CAS4127 again.

Great point, didn't even think about that during the game. It's like a 13 year old kid playing Madden. Even I set up plays in freakin' Madden.

[NorthernBison]

Oh, I would guess any given passing play has more than one receiver as an option, but we just do not run them that way. If you watch our passing plays closely, the recievers who are not the first option are running clearing routes for the most part, and the QB then waits for the "clearing" to take place, and throws to 1st option, whose route and area has been "cleared" out of defensive players. Yes, we have very simple, quick passing plays such as 10 yard curls and outs that are run by several recievers and all could be an option, but watch any of the plays that take time to develop, and we are down to one receiver, and it does look "pee wee", pure and simple. The whole effin crowd knows where the ball is going before it is even thrown.

I'll buy that. What you're saying is that it is about execution rather than design though. I don't know if it really has changed all that much. During the Walker years, everybody knew he was going to throw the ball to Heck. He pump faked somewhere else and went to Heck.

Solution? Teach the pump fake to our current QB's and we're good.

BTW, that was only half in jest.

[Bison bison]

I"m not sure he knows how to play that game.

I was thinking of that when I posted.

We might need break out the DeLauren and plant a modified version of Tecmo Bowl with THREE running and THREE passing plays into 12-year-old Brent's 1989 Christmas Stocking.

[bluebison35]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to CAS4127 again.

Great point, didn't even think about that during the game. It's like a 13 year old kid playing Madden. Even I set up plays in freakin' Madden.

FYI that reverse play that was ran by the #1 offense was called by Coach Polesek.

[HerdBot]

I think we already have with the middle screen. And, you know, now that I have posted my some of my thoughts on this, I also remember thinking during the game that Vigen was, as usual, not setting up any particular play. It seemed he just ran random plays for whatever reason. For example, what the hell was, and where the hell did it come from, that double pitch-type reverse in the 4th. We had not run anything close to resembling a reverse prior to that, and he calls a DOUBLE reverse??!!

Here is how basic it is, A reverse or miss direction play is commonly called when the D is not staying honest, at home, and or is over pursuing. So, run a reverse or other misdirection play to take advantage of that. If you run a DOUBLE reverse, the ball is just going to go right where the defense is to begin with if it is over pursuing. And, guess what, that's exactly what happend on the double reverse. The defense was all over it and it went for a loss, at least to the extent I even bothered watching the ending of the play.
:banghead: :banghead:

Thats a great point. I watched the 1st half of the 07 Gophers game last week and Perles did a great job of faking the reverse and end arounds and it worked brilliantly to set up the short passing game. On one play after faking the end around 4 times, Walker dumped it off to either a back or TE and he had open space and ran for 15 yards. They ran it out of the same formation. That was a masterfully called 1st half. Same stuff we do now, just better timed. Walker didn't complete passes at a high rate only because of his talent, the plays were timed beautifully ..

Perles also ran the play action better and threw deep early to make the d think the threat was there. Then you wouldnt see it again but the secondary respected it. He threw deep when the safeties played close to the line.

How about faking or running an end around and then running a bootleg? Or having the receiver take the end around after showing it and throwing it to a wide open TE or back.

[ndsubison1]

5 biggest questions/keys to a successful 2011 season
1. QB passing accuracy at least 55%
2. WR catching the ball
3. Interior D-Line play to replace Gratzek
4. Kicking game
5. Avoid the major injury bug

#1 and #2 will make play-calling a lot easier

My depth chart projections for game #1
QB - Jensen, Thorton, Mohler; best depth in DI years, yet no true #1 guy
RB - McNorton, Ojuri, Lang -- Sigers and Smith slot/RB options, this group is loaded. Not enough playing time for this group of playmakers.
WR - Holloway and Gebhart, Vraa, Smith, Perez, Wahlo. I think Perez is the sleeper in this group, seems to have good hands.
TE - Veldman for catching, Bruhn for blocking
FB - Grothmann, Buehner. Could see Lang here to get him on the field.
O-Line - Turner, Cornick, Richard, Lund, Hinz (Gimmestad and Jerve, others in mix)
D-Line - Perry, Drevlow, Boyer, Stoczynski (with many others rotating in)
LB - Evans, Olson, Jemison; Wilson in passing downs (with lots of depth which should make special teams very good)
CB - Williams and Pierre; Boyd in nickel, and Dudzik
FS - Eaves, Pike
SS - Heagle, Ollman

K - Keller wins job with accuracy
Kickoffs - Jastram because stronger leg
P - Voigtlander
LS - Murphy
KR - Smith and Sigers
PR - Smith

This team has a lot of quality players and depth, and we haven't even seen the incoming freshmen yet!

this should mean we will redshirt the majority of our frosh coming in. there will probably be a couple that are too good to redshirt and can see the field too.

[ndsubison1]

Well, as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. First, we did not see a National Championship caliber type of team or play on Saturday, both from a player and plays standpoint and from a coaching standpoint. But we have some things going for us nonetheless.

Offense: Our O-line looks solid, and we were missig a couple. Very solid at RB. All three QBs were about equal in my opinion, and I think that has to do with the fact that they are running Vigen's offense, and therefore, any personal physical abillities of one over the other are not that noticeable. WR/Wideouts--below average performance--catch the effin ball. Fullback--I think Grothman may be our best player when it comes to consistency and fundamentals. He is always in an "athletic" position ready to explode on whoever gets in his way as he leads on runs. As for the offensive scheme, it has not, from what I saw, changed 1 bit. We still are not seeing the read/speed option, even though almost everyone is running that play AND our defense has a very difficult time stopping it. As for the passing plays, do not worry about our QB's making check downs, as it appeared clearly to me that the ball is designed to go to one specific receiver on any given play, and, if that reciever is not open, it's either attempt to dump off to a RB or tuck and run. Vigen pass plays suck. Again, the plays are designed for one player to get the ball, the other receivers are merely running "run off" patterns, and unless it is a broken play, they will not see the ball, which is another reason we see our QB's telegraphing/dialed in on one receiver. If this does not change, I do not see us being a major offensive threat next year, because MVFC defenses can and will stop the run. Also, why is Vign insistent on not allowing our QB's to rollout past the hash marks. This would give them more of a run/pass option, especially on the 10-15 yard out plays. Thornton's manner of faking the handoff would make a naked roll-out even more effective. An example of the rollout, run-pass option would have been when (in the 4th quarter) Jensen rolled to his left and Grothman ran a 10-12 yard out. G was covered, but J had checked-up at the hash. He attempted to force it to G, and the pass went incomplete. What would have been perfect would have been J continuing his rollout, and G, being covered, turning it up field, as the other receiver on that side had ran a post pattern. If G got seperation from his cut up the sideline, then J could have dumped it to him for a TD. If G doesn't get seperation because the LB/SS covering him goes with him up the field, J tucks and runs with the ball at least 30-35 yards, and, with just one or two minor blocks downfield, takes it to the house. Vigen's offense sucks, and his ability to "coach" players up on just minor type ad-libs appears non-existant.



Defense: I was very happy with the performance. Active LB's, secondary looks solid (Boyd can fly!!), and our D-line looks to have depth. My only concern was that I thought our D-line played with their pads a little high, and the QB "sacks" were often the result of the ONE receiver to whom the ball was to go being covered.

Kicking game: Turn on the circus music when it comes to PATs and Field goals (this could very well lose games for us next year if there is not drastic imrovement. Did we recruit a kicker??!!! V did well at punting, but I would like to see more hangtime. Kickoffs were average, and again, we need more hangtime.

All in all, our D looks much better than our O, and appears to be MUCH better coached.

i think we have a national title caliber defense

[HerdBot]

i think we have a national title caliber defense

Very true. Our defense has the potential to be one of the best on the planet. But we also have one of the worst offensives so it kind of balances out. We can't forget we were shut out by a Missouri State team that once allowed 72 points in a game. Not only that it was a must win game. Hadn't 9 other games gone our way, we would still be bitching about how we blew it and missed the playoffs.

[onbison09]

Very true. Our defense has the potential to be one of the best on the planet. But we also have one of the worst offensives so it kind of balances out. We can't forget we were shut out by a Missouri State team that once allowed 72 points in a game. Not only that it was a must win game. Hadn't 9 other games gone our way, we would still be bitching about how we blew it and missed the playoffs.

I'm still trying to wipe that from my mind thank you very much

[HerdBot]

I'm still trying to wipe that from my mind thank you very much

Everyone is expecting this dramatic offensive turn around. After watching the spring game I don't see much improvement. Actually it looks like the passing game may have taken a step back. Completing less than half your passes in a spring game and giving up that many sacks is nit a good sign. I understand why Vigen goes up the middle play after play.. its the only thing were good at. I'm convinced we would be better off never throwing the ball again. Has that ever happened? I sound like SD!

[ndsubison1]

hard to really gauge from just the spring game

[mgbison]

The offense should be improved. It will help that Jensen and the receivers will get 2 cupcake games to get their timing down.

Look at perles, he looked like an awesome oc when walker was the qb. Then the year mertens was qb, he looked terrible. It all depends on the qb. The thing I like about Jensen is he throws the ball downfield and seems to have good pocket presence. I didn't see the spring game, but it seems the problem was more the receivers dropping balls than qb accuracy issues. From the reports people have been giving about the practices, the receivers dropping balls wasn't that big of an issue. So, I'll give the receivers a game or 2 before I'm gonna be concerned.

Another example of oc's is norm chow. He was regarded as one of the best oc's in the country at USC, but now at ucla he hasn't been the same. It all depends on the talent you have, especially at the qb position.

[mgbison]

Also, how much of the spring game is scripted?

[jarhead]

We need to remember that a lot of those dropped passes were thrown on the money into some pretty tight coverages. Give the D backs
their props. Whether it be from good reads, superior athleticism, familiarity with the playbook or lack of looking off by the QBs, they wer
all over the receivers. Maybe the receivers lack of ability to separate should be as big a concern as their inability to hold on to the ball.

[ndbj52]

There was only 15 practices this spring that is not a lot of time to turnaround the offense from where it was. They will have about 30 in August plus a couple weeks of practice with some easy opponents to get better. If they haven't improved then I will be more concerned than I am now.

[gotts]

Also, how much of the spring game is scripted?

Its only scripted through the use of steel chairs and the destruction of the Spanish announcers table. It's ad-lib from there on out.

[semobison]

The bottom line is we cant be one dimensional offensively and expect success in the MVFC! We were at the bottom of almost every offensive catagory last season. Offensive improvement must be made or expect another middle of the pack finish in conference play!

[NDSUFan_Sav]

The defense knows what the offense is running based on their formation, so they jump a lot of routes. Playing a defense unfamiliar with our offense things should look a lot better

[TransAmBison]

The defense knows what the offense is running based on their formation, so they jump a lot of routes. Playing a defense unfamiliar with our offense things should look a lot better
I think everybody in the conference is familiar with our routes.:hide:

[CAS4127]

I think everybody in the conference is familiar with our routes.:hide:

Tru dat^. And keep in mind that our opponents see/get a minimum of 3 of our games to break down. They will know our tendencies out of each formation this season even better than they did last season given that nothing has changed.

I agree there were a lot of dropped passes and good defensive plays made, my biggest gripe is that our offensive scheme has not changed one bit--that's my concern, and I will leave it at that, other than to say almost all of us were concerned about our offensive scheme and play calling even after the EWU game. Recall Vigen going back to the well several times on the QB keep? In fact, I believe it was the last play we saw, just sayin!!:hide: :mad:

[THEsocalledfan]

Recall Vigen going back to the well several times on the QB keep? In fact, I believe it was the last play we saw, just sayin!!:hide: :mad:

He did get a first down and not fumble, but let's not start down that road.....point is correct.

[steelbison]

Before we jump off the bridge over a SPRING game let's look at some factors regarding our offense.

We started THREE freshman last year. QB, T, C. I don't care who is calling the plays, you are going to struggle, especially in pass protection.


We are going to have a major upgrade in talent at the WR position over last season and our young players should be much improved.

I expect a much more balanced offense this year and for some reason were not significantly improved there will be questions to answer.

To people that want to judge our offense over the spring game get serious. Defense usually dominates these glorified scrimmages. You are going to have vanilla calls at best.

I understand people are expecting something different than what we saw last year. I am too, but lets give this team/coach a chance.


My example is a rookie QB for the Colts is going to have a different play book than what Peyton uses. They are going to keep it basic and simple. Try not to let him lose the game.

My belief is that is what we did with Brock last year. Keep it simple, try not to make mistakes, run the ball and play good defense.

At least that's what I'm hoping! lol

[SDbison]

Before we jump off the bridge over a SPRING game let's look at some factors regarding our offense.

We started THREE freshman last year. QB, T, C. I don't care who is calling the plays, you are going to struggle, especially in pass protection.


We are going to have a major upgrade in talent at the WR position over last season and our young players should be much improved.

I expect a much more balanced offense this year and for some reason were not significantly improved there will be questions to answer.

To people that want to judge our offense over the spring game get serious. Defense usually dominates these glorified scrimmages. You are going to have vanilla calls at best.

I understand people are expecting something different than what we saw last year. I am too, but lets give this team/coach a chance.


My example is a rookie QB for the Colts is going to have a different play book than what Peyton uses. They are going to keep it basic and simple. Try not to let him lose the game.

My belief is that is what we did with Brock last year. Keep it simple, try not to make mistakes, run the ball and play good defense.

At least that's what I'm hoping! lol
How long has Vigen been making the play calls? Even more so, how many QB's have to make the same mistakes before it's realized a coaching change must be made?

[mgbison]

Vigens been calling the plays 2 years. The 3-8 year shouldn't count. The only option at qb was mertens, we had no spring ball that year, and we still managed to score enough points to win games. The damn defense killed us that year. A little FYI, going into the Iowa state game, they had to put Titus Mack on the field as a decoy because we had no receivers. I'm sure it's fun being a oc when you have a senior qb (who wasn't the greatest and no receivers).

Last year, we knew we had no passing game and didn't force it. I think thats good coaching. Be smart enough to know what to do and what not to do.

I do think vigen has to improve this year, but the I'll give him time.

[Herd Hauler]

How long has Vigen been making the play calls? Even more so, how many QB's have to make the same mistakes before it's realized a coaching change must be made?

Why cant you give this team a chance? Not just the coaching staff but the whole team all together!!! Holy we are over 4 months away from the first game and all I here from you is Vigen this and Vigen that. Good god man give it a rest and let this TEAM with another year of experience get better. If things are (to your standards) still horrible after 2 or 3 games than you can come on here and call for his head, trade your season tickets for BB or whatever. Im pretty sure Bohl knows what he's doing and if he was the sole source of the problem(if there is one) it would have been dealt with during the offseason.

[bisonmike2]

Very true. Our defense has the potential to be one of the best on the planet. But we also have one of the worst offensives so it kind of balances out. We can't forget we were shut out by a Missouri State team that once allowed 72 points in a game. Not only that it was a must win game. Hadn't 9 other games gone our way, we would still be bitching about how we blew it and missed the playoffs.

You know, I go out and get my hopes up for this next season then BAM! You drop this nugget back into my memory and remind me of why I should just keep my mouth shut.

[SDbison]

Why cant you give this team a chance? Not just the coaching staff but the whole team all together!!! Holy we are over 4 months away from the first game and all I here from you is Vigen this and Vigen that. Good god man give it a rest and let this TEAM with another year of experience get better. If things are (to your standards) still horrible after 2 or 3 games than you can come on here and call for his head, trade your season tickets for BB or whatever. Im pretty sure Bohl knows what he's doing and if he was the sole source of the problem(if there is one) it would have been dealt with during the offseason.
Sorry, this is a messageboard for discussion of issues and opinions. There also are at least 10 others on this messageboard that are frequently questioning the play calls and use of QB's. You like a bunch of others on this board need to learn a bit about free speech. If you don't agree with an opinion go ahead and express your reasons and facts to refute what is being said. But to tell me I should not callout Vigen....... BTW, I don't have issue with the talent on this TEAM.

[stevdock]

Very true. Our defense has the potential to be one of the best on the planet. But we also have one of the worst offensives so it kind of balances out. We can't forget we were shut out by a Missouri State team that once allowed 72 points in a game. Not only that it was a must win game. Hadn't 9 other games gone our way, we would still be bitching about how we blew it and missed the playoffs.

Gabe you want to look at one game against Missouri State, who yes we should have beat. But then instead decide not to look at the next game where the team (yes I know some was set up/scored by the defense) scored 43, 42, and 31 (+7 for what we were robbed). I watched the Cubs scored 23 runs once in a game and thought they were on their way to the World Series. They ended that season with over 100 losses. Yeah we got shutout by MSU, but we still got in and did alot of damage in the playoffs. How many of us would have taken 31 points going into the EWU game and assumed we would have won??

Now I don't like some of the route combinations that we run or even running plays that we run, but I have seen the OC trying to tailor an offense to the personnel that we have out there. Everyone has to admit there was a different playbook for Mohler than for Jensen. And my guess is there will be a different one for Thornton too, which is why I think Vigen was coaching the #2 offense in the game. He's trying to get an even better feel for what Thornton can do. If you watched the #2's there were some new wrinkles with that group that haven't been done in a while.

[TransAmBison]

Gabe you want to look at one game against Missouri State, who yes we should have beat. But then instead decide not to look at the next game where the team (yes I know some was set up/scored by the defense) scored 43, 42, and 31 (+7 for what we were robbed). I watched the Cubs scored 23 runs once in a game and thought they were on their way to the World Series. They ended that season with over 100 losses. Yeah we got shutout by MSU, but we still got in and did alot of damage in the playoffs. How many of us would have taken 31 points going into the EWU game and assumed we would have won??

Now I don't like some of the route combinations that we run or even running plays that we run, but I have seen the OC trying to tailor an offense to the personnel that we have out there. Everyone has to admit there was a different playbook for Mohler than for Jensen. And my guess is there will be a different one for Thornton too, which is why I think Vigen was coaching the #2 offense in the game. He's trying to get an even better feel for what Thornton can do. If you watched the #2's there were some new wrinkles with that group that haven't been done in a while.
Are you speaking of the forward pass? It is a fad and will not last long.

[bri-dog]

Well, I couldn't make the game. Since I couldn't find cheap airline tickets I had to go snowmobiling instead.:)

I had one thought -- it sounded like our FG unit kinda sucked. Since it seems he can do everything else, have they tried Voigtlander there yet?:hide:

[Twentysix]

Well, I couldn't make the game. Since I couldn't find cheap airline tickets I had to go snowmobiling instead.:)

I had one thought -- it sounded like our FG unit kinda sucked. Since it seems he can do everything else, have they tried Voigtlander there yet?:hide:

#17 has a highschool leg. Very worried about it. I believe his kickoffs were caught at the 17 and 22.... Maybe he will gain chuck norris leg strength by the season, kinda doubt it though.

[WYOBISONMAN]

How long has Vigen been making the play calls? Even more so, how many QB's have to make the same mistakes before it's realized a coaching change must be made?

I am with SD on this. Vigen has not proven up in my opinion. Maybe he will show us something different this season. I hope so.........but am not counting on it.

If it is the same old....same old on offense.....well.......you know what Einstein said.....

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

[stevdock]

I am with SD on this. Vigen has not proven up in my opinion. Maybe he will show us something different this season. I hope so.........but am not counting on it.

If it is the same old....same old on offense.....well.......you know what Einstein said.....

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

My only criticism of SD on Vigen being the OC, because he does have a point, is do you really need to bring it up in 9 out of 10 posts that you make :hide: It may not be 9 out of 10 but it sure seems like it.

I mean if you talk about Lirano's no hitter tonight, you probably don't have to bring up Vigen's name in it.

[OrygunBison]

My only criticism of SD on Vigen being the OC, because he does have a point, is do you really need to bring it up in 9 out of 10 posts that you make :hide: It may not be 9 out of 10 but it sure seems like it.

I mean if you talk about Lirano's no hitter tonight, you probably don't have to bring up Vigen's name in it.

I, too, agree somewhat with the constant non-ending SD rant about Vigen. What I find truly amusing is how he gets so upset when anyone challenges him on anything...pulling the "free speech" card in this case. Look at his posts when he disagrees with someone else. He responds with profanity and name calling.

Can't have it both ways, Dude. Sad thing is that he has some pretty good points but it all gets lost in the near constant venomous attitude.

[perthbison]

#17 has a highschool leg. Very worried about it. I believe his kickoffs were caught at the 17 and 22.... Maybe he will gain chuck norris leg strength by the season, kinda doubt it though.

Maybe they should try billy Turner. He has very strong legs.

[DjKyRo]

stevdock raises a good point about the offense at the Missouri State game. While our offense wasn't exactly prolific during the regular season, there come games where things just come together in such a way that you simply can't make it happen. It's a jink here rather than a juke there, a hitting of the wrong hole, a whiffed block, you name it. We just couldn't make it happen, and I'm certain that at least eight times out of ten we win that game. Missouri State wanted it more and they got it. Was it embarrassing, and did it raise questions at a time in the season we could least afford them? Absolutely. I'm not dwelling on it, but there absolutely needs to be some consistent improvement in the offense before I lower the eyebrow on Vigen.

[Twentysix]

Maybe they should try billy Turner. He has very strong legs.

You wont be cracking a joke if jastram gets hurt and we choose to kick the ball out of bounds for a penalty rather than having a speedster receive it at the 22. :S

Maybe the spring game was a fluke for the new guy, but ive seen better kicks at a ND class A fb game.

[SDSUAlum08]

You wont be cracking a joke if jastram gets hurt and we choose to kick the ball out of bounds for a penalty rather than having a speedster receive it at the 22. :S

Maybe the spring game was a fluke for the new guy, but ive seen better kicks at a ND class A fb game.

Maybe it was the wind?

[SavageBison]

Maybe it was the wind?

Was your girlfriend in the stands blowing queefs out of her vajayjay thus causing gusts up to 35 mph in the Fargodome. (sorry, just watched the South Park about queefing on demand.) ;)

[aces1180]

Was your girlfriend in the stands blowing queefs out of her vajayjay thus causing gusts up to 35 mph in the Fargodome. (sorry, just watched the South Park about queefing on demand.) ;)

I do know that someone sitting in front of me either had bad gas, queefs or BO in the Dome on Saturday...Being hung over as well, I kind of wanted to barf because of the smell.

[TransAmBison]

I do know that someone sitting in front of me either had bad gas, queefs or BO in the Dome on Saturday...Being hung over as well, I kind of wanted to barf because of the smell.
Being that you partied hard the night before, are you sure you were not smelling yourself?:hide:

[bisonmike2]

I do know that someone sitting in front of me either had bad gas, queefs or BO in the Dome on Saturday...Being hung over as well, I kind of wanted to barf because of the smell.

Was it the offense?

[CAS4127]

Was it the offense?

Funny post^^^^. But, now that this thread has "evolved" into a discussion about bodily "functions" we should expect a post from Note in 3. . . .2. . . .1. It's like he can just inately sense when a thread turns rancid!!

[Notorious]

Funny post^^^^. But, now that this thread has "evolved" into a discussion about bodily "functions" we should expect a post from Note in 3. . . .2. . . .1. It's like he can just inately sense when a thread turns rancid!!

That's a bunch of crap, CAS!!! ;)

[aces1180]

Being that you partied hard the night before, are you sure you were not smelling yourself?:hide:

I showed just before I arrived at the Dome...I think I know who the culprit was, however.

[Tatanka]

I showed just before I arrived at the Dome...I think I know who the culprit was, however.

you showed? you showed what, exactly???

[aces1180]

you showed? you showed what, exactly???

Crap...Showered...

[IzzyFlexion]

Crap...Showered...

Ooooooo!
Be careful.....scat porn can ruin your marriage.:D

[SDbison]

I, too, agree somewhat with the constant non-ending SD rant about Vigen. What I find truly amusing is how he gets so upset when anyone challenges him on anything...pulling the "free speech" card in this case. Look at his posts when he disagrees with someone else. He responds with profanity and name calling.

Can't have it both ways, Dude. Sad thing is that he has some pretty good points but it all gets lost in the near constant venomous attitude.
Sorry DUDE.......you again like many others love to spew lies and distort the truth. ANY AND EVERY TIME I HAVE USED PROFANITY OR DEROGATORY TERMS AGAINST SOMEBODY IS IF THEY HAVE CALLED ME AN IDIOT, STUPID OR USED PROFANITY DIRECETED AT ME FIRST.
Actually I like a good heated debate and welcome disagreement of any views or topics, but as soon as it's not about the topic and instead directed at me the gloves come off.
Orygun I really don't care for you much, but I not going to make up stuff to make you look bad.

[Notorious]

Sorry DUDE.......you again like many others love to spew lies and distort the truth. ANY AND EVERY TIME I HAVE USED PROFANITY OR DEROGATORY TERMS AGAINST SOMEBODY IS IF THEY HAVE CALLED ME AN IDIOT, STUPID OR USED PROFANITY DIRECETED AT ME FIRST.
Actually I like a good heated debate and welcome disagreement of any views or topics, but as soon as it's not about the topic and instead directed at me the gloves come off.
Orygun I really don't care for you much, but I not going to make up stuff to make you look bad.

Looks like a couple guys are going to meet behind M&H after school for some fist-a-cuffs!!!

[BlueBisonRock]

Looks like a couple guys are going to meet behind M&H after school for some fist-a-cuffs!!!

I see it turning out like the great SD - Slick debate from a couple of years ago.

More than just a little badgering and response on BV.
Projected Bisonville BB Playoff Bloodbath during the spring game.
Resulted in arm in arm drinking and roadtrip buddies after the game.

Of course, who can resist the Slickster's charm?

[OrygunBison]

Sorry DUDE.......you again like many others love to spew lies and distort the truth. ANY AND EVERY TIME I HAVE USED PROFANITY OR DEROGATORY TERMS AGAINST SOMEBODY IS IF THEY HAVE CALLED ME AN IDIOT, STUPID OR USED PROFANITY DIRECETED AT ME FIRST.
Actually I like a good heated debate and welcome disagreement of any views or topics, but as soon as it's not about the topic and instead directed at me the gloves come off.
Orygun I really don't care for you much, but I not going to make up stuff to make you look bad.

Please do me a favor and find a quote of mine that makes your point. I'm seriously curious. I do my very best to not call names or not to make stuff up...unless it is intended to be funny and/or clearly obvious. In my mind (which admittedly is a scary and dark place), I have only responded to your postings when irritated with your tone or the actual vulgarity...which I never think is justified unless it is in jest. If I am wrong in how I have behaved, I'll take my lumps.

Seriously, help me out. I really want to understand your point of view on this.

As for your last point, I don't really know you. From what I've heard, you're a pretty stand up guy in person, which makes this issue all the more puzzling. And as far as I go, you wouldn't really have to make things up to make me look bad. I generally give out enough real ammo to make the case...

[SDbison]

I am going to say one more thing........much as I and a few others might call out Vigen a bunch for the lack of offensive improvement, there are others at Bisonville that need calling out. A few seem to think EVERY thread needs to become a place for bathroom humor or constant highjacking......that is getting REALLY OLD TOO! This place has lost a lot of luster and it is not because of Lakes being banned. Maybe a few posters that don't contribute a damn thing to talk up Bison sports should be banned. At least Lakes contributed quite often.
Also too often this place is like 7th grade where some buds at Bisonville team up to carry out their form of justice for a post they disagree with.......often going out of their way to discredit the person, not the content of the post.
I think the moderators need to excercise a bit more control to stop the constant highjcking and stupid attempts at humor. A brief reference to make a lighthearted comment is OK, but it seems too often lately there are 20 posts in a row where the highjack continues. Isn't there is an entire area at this messageboard dedicated for humor and smack?
So lay off your comments about me........you know who you are. If you have a problem with me come talk to me at tailgate next year in person......stop hiding behind your computer.

[aces1180]

I am going to say one more thing........much as I and a few others might call out Vigen a bunch for the lack of offensive improvement, there are others at Bisonville that need calling out. A few seem to think EVERY thread needs to become a place for bathroom humor or constant highjacking......that is getting REALLY OLD TOO! This place has lost a lot of luster and it is not because of Lakes being banned. Maybe a few posters that don't contribute a damn thing to talk up Bison sports should be banned. At least Lakes contributed quite often.
Also too often this place is like 7th grade where some buds at Bisonville team up to carry out their form of justice for a post they disagree with.......often going out of their way to discredit the person, not the content of the post.
I think the moderators need to excercise a bit more control to stop the constant highjcking and stupid attempts at humor. A brief reference to make a lighthearted comment is OK, but it seems too often lately there are 20 posts in a row where the highjack continues. Isn't there is an entire area at this messageboard dedicated for humor and smack?
So lay off your comments about me........you know who you are. If you have a problem with me come talk to me at tailgate next year in person......stop hiding behind your computer.

Did you not highjack the Bin Laden thread with your political rhetoric? It goes both ways.

[SlickVic]

I am going to say one more thing........much as I and a few others might call out Vigen a bunch for the lack of offensive improvement, there are others at Bisonville that need calling out. A few seem to think EVERY thread needs to become a place for bathroom humor or constant highjacking......that is getting REALLY OLD TOO! This place has lost a lot of luster and it is not because of Lakes being banned. Maybe a few posters that don't contribute a damn thing to talk up Bison sports should be banned. At least Lakes contributed quite often.
Also too often this place is like 7th grade where some buds at Bisonville team up to carry out their form of justice for a post they disagree with.......often going out of their way to discredit the person, not the content of the post.
I think the moderators need to excercise a bit more control to stop the constant highjcking and stupid attempts at humor. A brief reference to make a lighthearted comment is OK, but it seems too often lately there are 20 posts in a row where the highjack continues. Isn't there is an entire area at this messageboard dedicated for humor and smack?
So lay off your comments about me........you know who you are. If you have a problem with me come talk to me at tailgate next year in person......stop hiding behind your computer.

I agree SD...I just brought a new lambragini aka callaway razr hawk bout to go crush with that bad boy let's set up a 4 day 5 day weekend at your mansion in sioux falls soon fool I wanna play some of them courses

[TransAmBison]

You guys are all a bunch of f###'ed up s###heads without a d### clue. Do you know who the f### I am? Go to H### you useless pieces of s###! I don't give a rat's a## if you went to a g##d### game or if you want the mother####ing stream on the d### interwebs you ungrateful p###ies. Now go #&#$ your #$&$ and ##&%$ #$%#$%#^@#$$ (#$%#$%#^@#$$)^!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Found it for you. You really have a potty mouth...I tried to clean it up a bit for you.








*Oh crap, is this the kind of post SD just mentioned? And now I just mentioned crap so Notorious will be all over it like flies on....crap. Oh no, I said it again!

[OrygunBison]

Found it for you. You really have a potty mouth...I tried to clean it up a bit for you.








*Oh crap, is this the kind of post SD just mentioned? And now I just mentioned crap so Notorious will be all over it like flies on....crap. Oh no, I said it again!

Oh, thank you. Yes, that was bad. I feel horrible. My apologies, SD.

And in compliance with your (SD's) post in the "post spring game analysis" thread where you were discussing the finer points of banning people that hijack serious threads, I will officially retire my involvement in this topic within this thread.

[SDbison]

Did you not highjack the Bin Laden thread with your political rhetoric? It goes both ways.
Sorry , I don't consider that a hijack. The topic discussed was closely related except for when you and a few others attacked me for my opinion. Get over yourselves. There are a few posters that made it very personal in the nasty comments they sent me. I won't forget.

[aces1180]

Sorry , I don't consider that a hijack. The topic discussed was closely related except for when you and a few others attacked me for my opinion. Get over yourselves. There are a few posters that made it very personal in the nasty comments they sent me. I won't forget.

You say I attacked you? How? By asking you to keep your political party comments to yourself? Did I call you a name? Did I even argue with you? I wanted the thread to be a celebration, not a Democrat vs. Republican platform. What's wrong with that?

[CAS4127]

If it makes any difference to anyone, my analysis of the spring game still leads me to believe Vigen needs to improve--period.

[OrygunBison]

Sorry , I don't consider that a hijack. The topic discussed was closely related except for when you and a few others attacked me for my opinion. Get over yourselves. There are a few posters that made it very personal in the nasty comments they sent me. I won't forget.

Please don't lump ME into that. All I asked is that the thread not become political and negative. I don't think I was nasty at all, although I know I can be very blunt and direct. Perhaps, I am wrong. You tell me. Again, I consciously make an effort not to lie or call names. Unfortunately it IS an effort sometimes and maybe I don't catch it all.

Is this a hijack or not? I can't quite tell.

[TransAmBison]

If it makes any difference to anyone, my analysis of the spring game still leads me to believe Vigen needs to improve--period.
Quit hijacking the thread.

[OrygunBison]

If it makes any difference to anyone, my analysis of the spring game still leads me to believe Vigen needs to improve--period.

I think you might need a new thread for this crazy talk.

[Notorious]

If it makes any difference to anyone, my analysis of the spring game still leads me to believe Vigen needs to improve--period.

I agree.

Also, I will no longer post my sophomoric humor in an attempt to gain much needed attention. Next, I have made an appointment to see a psychiatrist to get to the bottom of my bathroom fetish.

Finally, I want to get back on SDBison's Christmas Card list, so I am officially extending the olive branch. Although I don't believe I have ever attacked him personally, or even his opinions...

[Notorious]

p.s. You should meet 4Mcrue in person... ;)

[CAS4127]

I agree.

Also, I will no longer post my sophomoric humor in an attempt to gain much needed attention. Next, I have made an appointment to see a psychiatrist to get to the bottom of my bathroom fetish.

Finally, I want to get back on SDBison's Christmas Card list, so I am officially extending the olive branch. Although I don't believe I have ever attacked him personally, or even his opinions...


p.s. You should meet 4Mcrue in person...

As long as you are addressing most of your bad habits/personality disorders, you may as well invest in some nicoderm patches and nicorette gum.

Also, I have met 4Mcrue in person.

[Kermit]

I am going to say one more thing........much as I and a few others might call out Vigen a bunch for the lack of offensive improvement, there are others at Bisonville that need calling out. A few seem to think EVERY thread needs to become a place for bathroom humor or constant highjacking......that is getting REALLY OLD TOO! This place has lost a lot of luster and it is not because of Lakes being banned. Maybe a few posters that don't contribute a damn thing to talk up Bison sports should be banned. At least Lakes contributed quite often.
Also too often this place is like 7th grade where some buds at Bisonville team up to carry out their form of justice for a post they disagree with.......often going out of their way to discredit the person, not the content of the post.
I think the moderators need to excercise a bit more control to stop the constant highjcking and stupid attempts at humor. A brief reference to make a lighthearted comment is OK, but it seems too often lately there are 20 posts in a row where the highjack continues. Isn't there is an entire area at this messageboard dedicated for humor and smack?
So lay off your comments about me........you know who you are. If you have a problem with me come talk to me at tailgate next year in person......stop hiding behind your computer.

Good post and I think this needed to be said. I enjoy the humor on the board--and I don't think anybody needs to be banned--but lately it is becoming difficult to find the actual Bison content on the board. Personal attacks should never be OK and moderators need to step in when that stuff is happening.

[TransAmBison]

Good post and I think this needed to be said. I enjoy the humor on the board--and I don't think anybody needs to be banned--but lately it is becoming difficult to find the actual Bison content on the board. Personal attacks should never be OK and moderators need to step in when that stuff is happening.
One must also remember there is little going on this time of year. Wasn't that many years ago there were hardly any posts during the late winter & spring.

Also, I think some humor is needed to take the edge off the complete crap getting thrown around here. "I'm being oppressed", and "Somebody needs to oppress the oppressers", and "Hey a-hole, don't swear at me" or any of the other stupid arguing. Seriously.

Some posts are just meant in humor, but there are plenty that have a bit of irony to them. We are in the Bisonville ocean and there are plenty of crabs and clownfish*, with a few dolphins thrown in to raise the iq level. It's been a tough winter...we lost our dinghy, now we are without our fearless leader to start chants etc.







*Surprisingly not that funny of a fish.

[Notorious]

This is the same discussion we had last year at this time...there is nothing going on, so off-beat topics/posts are the flavor of the season...one can only rehash the spring game, two deep roster, or how bad Vigen sucks so many times before it gets old too.

I suppose we could always talk about one of the following:

1] und
2] Adding DI hockey
3] Building a new football stadium
4] New dome turf
5] Renewing the Nickel game
6] Moving to FBS
7] NDSU Marketing Dept.
8] 2012-2029 recruiting
9] The 2012 Gopher game
10] LakesBison
11] SHAC fundraising
12] Gold Star Marching Band
13] EndZone's criminal record
14] Dan Hammer
15] PL's sausage
16] Movies
17] Video Games
18] Checkpoints
19] Tim Miles
20] The Big Sky Conference
21] Sebrings ;)

and.......????

[Kermit]

One must also remember there is little going on this time of year. Wasn't that many years ago there were hardly any posts during the late winter & spring.

Also, I think some humor is needed to take the edge off the complete crap getting thrown around here. "I'm being oppressed", and "Somebody needs to oppress the oppressers", and "Hey a-hole, don't swear at me" or any of the other stupid arguing. Seriously.

Some posts are just meant in humor, but there are plenty that have a bit of irony to them. We are in the Bisonville ocean and there are plenty of crabs and clownfish*, with a few dolphins thrown in to raise the iq level. It's been a tough winter...we lost our dinghy, now we are without our fearless leader to start chants etc.







*Surprisingly not that funny of a fish.

Excellent points. Thanks TAB. Bisonville seems to go through something like this every year. We do need to make sure that when someone DOES want to talk about Bison athletics that they don't get drowned out by all the other stuff.

[CAS4127]

What's all the BS about moderators stepping in?!! Moderators . . . schmoderators----just do it to yourself. Before you click the "post" button, think about whether you really need to post what you are about to post, what the reaction will be, what point you are really trying to make (if any) . . . whatever you need to do, but just don't moderate yourself too much or this will become as boring ass as is ss.com. Go over there if you aren't willing to at least have some fun and ready to take some shit!!!

JEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!

[Answer Guy]

and.......????


get to the bottom of my bathroom fetish.


And Tranny's cross-dressing.

[Notorious]

Back on topic, is Sigers expected to be eligible in the fall?

[CAS4127]

Back on topic, is Sigers expected to be eligible in the fall?

I sure hope he is--the change of pace he add at RB is excellent, and, if we use him more on kick/punt returns, he gets those touches as well. DJ, Ojuri, Sigers, Lang, and Voit if need be--pretty deep there, and more on shelf and coming in as recruits.

As Lakes likeD to; sAy "Runningback U" ,># . . .^PUMP IT UP!!%%

[DjKyRo]

Back on topic, is Sigers expected to be eligible in the fall?

For what my observations are worth, I haven't seen an affirmation of an upward trend in Sigers' academic progress yet, and it's about the time of the semester when you pretty much know how you're going to do. Obviously, that doesn't mean much but if his GPA is worthy of ineligibility, and cumulative over the four semesters he'll have been here, it's going to take a lot to shift it significantly.

[stevdock]

For what my observations are worth, I haven't seen an affirmation of an upward trend in Sigers' academic progress yet, and it's about the time of the semester when you pretty much know how you're going to do. Obviously, that doesn't mean much but if his GPA is worthy of ineligibility, and cumulative over the four semesters he'll have been here, it's going to take a lot to shift it significantly.

He'll have a full spring semester to get things taken care of. If he can't get it done there, he does have the opportunity of two summer sessions, doesn't he?? If you can't get the grades taken care of over 6-10 classes, that would definitely be an issue.

[CAS4127]

I did not here that he was academically ineligable this Spring. What was said, from what I recall, is that he was not going to participate in Spring ball so that he could concentrate on his academics/grades. I interpreted that to mean that he might have been on the edge academically, and that having more time to focus on his class work would likely result in him being eligible this Fall. NO??!!

[DjKyRo]

I did not here that he was academically ineligable this Spring. What was said, from what I recall, is that he was not going to participate in Spring ball so that he could concentrate on his academics/grades. I interpreted that to mean that he might have been on the edge academically, and that having more time to focus on his class work would likely result in him being eligible this Fall. NO??!!

It has been said through several sources that Sigers is in fact ineligible. Had we made the championship game (insert crushed weeping here) he would not have been able to participate as this semester's eligibility statuses would have been applied.

[CAS4127]

OK--thanks. Let's just hope he is doing better now, and, if he has to take summer courses, he gets after it.



P.S. I heard Note took mostly summer courses, as the "bell curve" method was much lower in the summer--as in students who had to take summer courses were normally challenged academically (He fit right in at about the middle, in other words).

[EndZoneQB]

I did not here that he was academically ineligable this Spring. What was said, from what I recall, is that he was not going to participate in Spring ball so that he could concentrate on his academics/grades. I interpreted that to mean that he might have been on the edge academically, and that having more time to focus on his class work would likely result in him being eligible this Fall. NO??!!

This was my original impression of the situation as well.

[ndsubison1]

OK--thanks. Let's just hope he is doing better now, and, if he has to take summer courses, he gets after it.



P.S. I heard Note took mostly summer courses, as the "bell curve" method was much lower in the summer--as in students who had to take summer courses were normally challenged academically (He fit right in at about the middle, in other words).

im taking summer classes :p

[CAS4127]

im taking summer classes :p

Proof positive!!!!!!!!!!!!:bow:

[SavageBison]

It has been said through several sources that Sigers is in fact ineligible. Had we made the championship game (insert crushed weeping here) he would not have been able to participate as this semester's eligibility statuses would have been applied.

Really, what sources? Coach Bohl? Coach Vigen? His mother's sisters cousin?

[westnodak93bison]

Really, what sources? Coach Bohl? Coach Vigen? His mother's sisters cousin?

IMHO, this topic should be left alone. Hopefully he is back on the field this fall for his sake and the team.

[Bison bison]

I agree.

I would like to remember Mike as the fun-loving older brother of Carol and Ben and leave it at that.

[BisonNeil]

It has been said through several sources that Sigers is in fact ineligible. Had we made the championship game (insert crushed weeping here) he would not have been able to participate as this semester's eligibility statuses would have been applied.

I don't agree with that characterization at all. I don't know who you are citing as "several sources", but I only care what the horse's mouth says.

Bohl said he wanted Sigers to take the spring off to get his academics in order. He did NOT say he was academically ineligible. That is a big difference especially when players have become academically ineligible Bohl has simply stated that they were. He did NOT say that in the case of Sigers.

My understanding was that he did poorly in the fall and was just barely eligible. Bohl wanted him to get his GPA up and out of the trouble zone. I think Bohl was just being proactive and was acting on the advice of the academic advisors. The one thing Bohl has always exceled at is making sure his student-athletes are students first and that they take care of academics. He monitors this very, very closely which is why NDSU is always near the top in APR year after year.

[MN_BISON]

I don't agree with that characterization at all. I don't know who you are citing as "several sources", but I only care what the horse's mouth says.

Bohl said he wanted Sigers to take the spring off to get his academics in order. He did NOT say he was academically ineligible. That is a big difference especially when players have become academically ineligible Bohl has simply stated that they were. He did NOT say that in the case of Sigers.

My understanding was that he did poorly in the fall and was just barely eligible. Bohl wanted him to get his GPA up and out of the trouble zone. I think Bohl was just being proactive and was acting on the advice of the academic advisors. The one thing Bohl has always exceled at is making sure his student-athletes are students first and that they take care of academics. He monitors this very, very closely which is why NDSU is always near the top in APR year after year.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This, well said Neil!!!!

[westnodak93bison]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This, well said Neil!!!!

Didn't Bohl do the same with another player recently? DJ?

[DjKyRo]

It has been said through several sources that Sigers is in fact ineligible. Had we made the championship game (insert crushed weeping here) he would not have been able to participate as this semester's eligibility statuses would have been applied.

Allow me to clarify:

Upon the initial attack of this post I went back and check and apparently I've misread what I thought was confirmation. My apologies on the confusion that it's been openly reported, that's on me.

I do have good reason to believe he's ineligible but I'll refrain from commenting further to avoid further ire.

[mgbison]

it'll be interesting to see what happens with Sigers. During the EWU game, someone told me during the game that Sigers was going to have trouble with eligibility. So, it was known then that he may be ineligible this coming year.

Hopefully Mr. Sigers can get it together academically, he was/is an explosive player that can change a game.

[DjKyRo]

Hopefully Mr. Sigers can get it together academically, he was/is an explosive player that can change a game.

Couldn't agree more. Mike's a cool guy off the field and a game-changer on it - look at the impact he had at EWU. Heck of a player.

[HerdBot]

Couldn't agree more. Mike's a cool guy off the field and a game-changer on it - look at the impact he had at EWU. Heck of a player.

That would really suck. We need his speed. This is total speculation (no clue what's true or rumor) and I have no idea what the standards are for student athletes but I assume that would have been for the fall of 2010 which ended Dec 23. I hope it's just academic probation and not suspension. I doubt it's a suspension because he wouldn't even be in class right now if that's the case and he would be ineligibale to take classes for the spring and summer but would be reeligibale to enroll in the fall of 2011. Let's hope he can clean it up this summmer.

[DjKyRo]

That would really suck. We need his speed. This is total speculation (no clue what's true or rumor) and I have no idea what the standards are for student athletes but I assume that would have been for the fall of 2010 which ended Dec 23. I hope it's just academic probation and not suspension. I doubt it's a suspension because he wouldn't even be in class right now if that's the case and he would be ineligibale to take classes for the spring and summer but would be reeligibale to enroll in the fall of 2011. Let's hope he can clean it up this summmer.

You get two semesters of sub-2.0 GPA performance before you're suspended, on the academic side. It starts with an Academic Warning, basically saying "Hey, get your sh*t together," following by Academic Probation, saying "Quick f***ing up, you're on thing ice" and culminating with suspension. So your given student-athlete could be below the required GPA to be on the football, say, but still be enrolled and in class.

[NorthernBison]

You get two semesters of sub-2.0 GPA performance before you're suspended, on the academic side. It starts with an Academic Warning, basically saying "Hey, get your sh*t together," following by Academic Probation, saying "Quick f***ing up, you're on thing ice" and culminating with suspension. So your given student-athlete could be below the required GPA to be on the football, say, but still be enrolled and in class.

Not speaking here about any particular person or athlete.

As a general question, does it only have to be about grades?

I believe there is a "progress toward degree" standard applied. So, a student athlete could be getting the grades but not on track in terms of credits toward graduation and have problems with eligibility. Is that correct?

[HerdBot]

Not speaking here about any particular person or athlete.

As a general question, does it only have to be about grades?

I believe there is a "progress toward degree" standard applied. So, a student athlete could be getting the grades but not on track in terms of credits toward graduation and have problems with eligibility. Is that correct?

Were talking Sigers. A recap. Someone heard he wouldn't have been eligible academicly for the championship game had we gone that far. That would have been for grades for the fall 2010 season. Then Bohl held him out of the spring to work on grades. Were speculating on whether or not be will be back with the team this fall. Be will have the last semester (just finished) and summer to get back on track. Let's hope he gets it together. We need him.

[NorthernBison]

Were talking Sigers. A recap. Someone heard he wouldn't have been eligible academicly for the championship game had we gone that far. That would have been for grades for the fall 2010 season. Then Bohl held him out of the spring to work on grades. Were speculating on whether or not be will be back with the team this fall. Be will have the last semester (just finished) and summer to get back on track. Let's hope he gets it together. We need him.

Thanks for the recap. I was aware of the discussion about Mike. I didn't want to get in on the gossip session. I'll stay out of it. Question withdrawn.

[IzzyFlexion]

Thanks for the recap. I was aware of the discussion about Mike. I didn't want to get in on the gossip session. I'll stay out of it. Question withdrawn.

C'mon Northern....Quit trying to intellectualize this thread. We don't need any rational thoughts and words just running willy-nilly throughout this board! Clearly, there are those who are jockying to backfill the gossip void left by the.....

http://www.iheartkroger.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/images-2.jpeg

[Hammersmith]

Not speaking here about any particular person or athlete.

As a general question, does it only have to be about grades?

I believe there is a "progress toward degree" standard applied. So, a student athlete could be getting the grades but not on track in terms of credits toward graduation and have problems with eligibility. Is that correct?

I know you withdrew the question, but you are correct. You can have a high GPA and still be academically ineligible if you have not made enough progress in your degree. I want to say it's in 20% increments starting your sophomore year, but I could be wrong(I'm not looking at the DI manual). It does make significant major changes late in an academic career pretty much impossible.

[BisonPride72]

I know you withdrew the question, but you are correct. You can have a high GPA and still be academically ineligible if you have not made enough progress in your degree. I want to say it's in 20% increments starting your sophomore year, but I could be wrong(I'm not looking at the DI manual). It does make significant major changes late in an academic career pretty much impossible.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/NCAA/Academics/Division+I/Explanation+of+seamless+eligibility+model

Once in college, student-athletes must make steady progress toward degrees.

•Student-athletes must complete 40 percent of the coursework required for a degree by the end of their second year, 60 percent by the end of their third year and 80 percent by the end of their fourth year. Student-athletes are allowed five years to graduate while receiving athletically related financial aid.
•All student-athletes must earn a minimum of six hours each term to be eligible the next semester.