Difficulty in assessing recruits before they are in the program

[NDSUmulligan]

With the upcoming Signing Day, I got to thinking about how difficult it is to actually predict which kids will turn in to stars of the class. On paper certain kids look great and some look pretty average, but until they actually get in the program and play a down for the Bison its tough to tell who's going to be leaders of the class.

Here's a perfect example. I looked back to the Bison Media Blog to look at comments about the 2008 recruiting class (this class had a high attrition rate, even tougher to judge). Kolpack dissects this class and rates the top ten players that stood out to him. Out of his top ten, I believe only 3 are still on the team (2 have seen action as starters I believe). He gave honorable mention to Preston Evans, who turned out to be a stud.

Here's the link: http://bisonmedia.areavoices.com/2008/02/07/recruiting-in-review/

I know that this particular class was unusual in the extremely high rate of players leaving the team. But my main point is that all the hype leading up to signing day is very entertaining and gives us a glimpse into the future, but in all reality its extremely tough to accurately predict who will be stars. That being said, some highly touted kids are just destined to be stars and stick out right away (See Billy Turner, Grant Olson, etc...)

No matter how many stars or how hyped up they are coming in, all of these recruits will be Bison, and I hope they all turn out to be studs. Go Bison!

[HandoEX]

All of our recruits are the best and I wouldn't trade the 2011 Bison class for any other in the country. This class will produce 20 All Americans.

[lakesbison]

LOOK at LAKESBISON's track record with recruits.. not kolpacks.


DJ - lakes
Billy turn - lakes
Grant Olson - lakes
MWILL - lakes
Leevon Perry - lakes

[IBleedYellow]

Nick Mertens - lakes

Just sayin'.

[lakesbison]

mertens wasnt the problem, vigen was!

[HerdBot]

With the upcoming Signing Day, I got to thinking about how difficult it is to actually predict which kids will turn in to stars of the class. On paper certain kids look great and some look pretty average, but until they actually get in the program and play a down for the Bison its tough to tell who's going to be leaders of the class.

Here's a perfect example. I looked back to the Bison Media Blog to look at comments about the 2008 recruiting class (this class had a high attrition rate, even tougher to judge). Kolpack dissects this class and rates the top ten players that stood out to him. Out of his top ten, I believe only 3 are still on the team (2 have seen action as starters I believe). He gave honorable mention to Preston Evans, who turned out to be a stud.

Here's the link: http://bisonmedia.areavoices.com/2008/02/07/recruiting-in-review/

I know that this particular class was unusual in the extremely high rate of players leaving the team. But my main point is that all the hype leading up to signing day is very entertaining and gives us a glimpse into the future, but in all reality its extremely tough to accurately predict who will be stars. That being said, some highly touted kids are just destined to be stars and stick out right away (See Billy Turner, Grant Olson, etc...)

No matter how many stars or how hyped up they are coming in, all of these recruits will be Bison, and I hope they all turn out to be studs. Go Bison!

Tough to give Hallstrom crap since 4 of those guys got kicked off the team and the guys who left would have been behind some great players. I think some of them actually had some good talent. That class set us back a year. At least Bohl fixed the issues and is recruiting high character people now and we haven't lost anyone over the last 2 recruiting classes. Hope its the same this year. I like this years class and it has good players from top to bottom. I hope we get to redshirt most of the class. Wonder who has a chance to play this year?

[AEBison1998]

I hate to bring up the past, but last night I was just thinking how nice it would have been to have Johnson and Reid at the DT spot next year. Two upperclassmen that could have given us an outstanding D-Line next year.

It doesn't matter how good they are if they don't make the field. Character is a big factor that doesn't show up on paper. Hopefully the coaches had good insight when they interviewed the kids and their coaches.

[Bison Dan]

mertens wasnt the problem, vigen was!

Not true. Mertens was a hair slow on pulling the trigger and that got him in trouble. He had the tools but .....

[BisonNeil]

Tough to give Hallstrom crap since 4 of those guys got kicked off the team and the guys who left would have been behind some great players. I think some of them actually had some good talent. That class set us back a year. At least Bohl fixed the issues and is recruiting high character people now and we haven't lost anyone over the last 2 recruiting classes. Hope its the same this year. I like this years class and it has good players from top to bottom. I hope we get to redshirt most of the class. Wonder who has a chance to play this year?

In my humble opinion the way he fixed the problem was dumping Vigen as his recruiting coordinator and putting Polasek in that slot. Big improvement! The 2009 class was the best in years, probably since Bohl's first class, and the 2010 class is stellar and arguably Bohl's best. Polasek is the man, but Bohl gets credit for changing direction on putting the right man in charge (just like when he fired himself as special teams coordinator and put Polasek in charge :) ).

As for Hallstrom's opinion of the 2008 class I am not sure where you are coming from. Hallstrom said early on, and he told me in an email right after the 2009 class hit the field in the fall of that year, that the 2008 class was not impressive athletically. When you looked at the players side by side, one set who had been in the system for a year and the other right out of high school, that there was no question that the 2008 class was not very good. So, I am not sure I can agree with you that the 2008 class "actually had some good talent". I don't think there is any evidence of that.

[NDSUmulligan]

I think it's pretty apparent that recruiting has definitely taken a step in the right path over the last two years, as evidenced by last years class. I wasn't giving Hallstrom any crap...the opposite actually, I was saying its really difficult to tell if some guys will pan out until they are in the system.

There always be kids that stand out in recruiting classes, but I'm sure they'll be kids from this class that people don't peg as stars that turn into big time contributors.

[Dabison]

In my humble opinion the way he fixed the problem was dumping Vigen as his recruiting coordinator and putting Polasek in that slot. Big improvement! The 2009 class was the best in years, probably since Bohl's first class, and the 2010 class is stellar and arguably Bohl's best. Polasek is the man, but Bohl gets credit for changing direction on putting the right man in charge (just like when he fired himself as special teams coordinator and put Polasek in charge :) ).

As for Hallstrom's opinion of the 2008 class I am not sure where you are coming from. Hallstrom said early on, and he told me in an email right after the 2009 class hit the field in the fall of that year, that the 2008 class was not impressive athletically. When you looked at the players side by side, one set who had been in the system for a year and the other right out of high school, that there was no question that the 2008 class was not very good. So, I am not sure I can agree with you that the 2008 class "actually had some good talent". I don't think there is any evidence of that.

You have no idea about what goes on as a recruiting coordinator. Being the recruiting coordinator has nothing to do with what talent you bring into the program, that is up to the coaches recruiting the area, the position coach, and finally coach Bohl. What is important about the coordinator position is staying organized and keeping the other coaches informed on scholarship availability. Polasek is a good coach and recruiting coordinator but this was one of Vigens best attributes before taking over as offensive coordinator.

This probably is blown up simply because this is another area for people to web rape Vigen.

[westnodak93bison]

In my humble opinion the way he fixed the problem was dumping Vigen as his recruiting coordinator and putting Polasek in that slot. Big improvement! The 2009 class was the best in years, probably since Bohl's first class, and the 2010 class is stellar and arguably Bohl's best. Polasek is the man, but Bohl gets credit for changing direction on putting the right man in charge (just like when he fired himself as special teams coordinator and put Polasek in charge :) ).

As for Hallstrom's opinion of the 2008 class I am not sure where you are coming from. Hallstrom said early on, and he told me in an email right after the 2009 class hit the field in the fall of that year, that the 2008 class was not impressive athletically. When you looked at the players side by side, one set who had been in the system for a year and the other right out of high school, that there was no question that the 2008 class was not very good. So, I am not sure I can agree with you that the 2008 class "actually had some good talent". I don't think there is any evidence of that.

Imagine what Polasek could do as QB coach and Offensive Coordinator. We would have won at least 1 more regular season game and would have beat EWU with Tim at the controls.

[steelbison]

You have no idea about what goes on as a recruiting coordinator. Being the recruiting coordinator has nothing to do with what talent you bring into the program, that is up to the coaches recruiting the area, the position coach, and finally coach Bohl. What is important about the coordinator position is staying organized and keeping the other coaches informed on scholarship availability. Polasek is a good coach and recruiting coordinator but this was one of Vigens best attributes before taking over as offensive coordinator.

This probably is blown up simply because this is another area for people to web rape Vigen.

DaBison- If you haven't figured it out yet Bison Neil thinks Bohl and Vigen are worthless and Polasek is god.

Trust me the Head coach and assistants have zero to do with a good recruiting class it's the Recruiting coordinator!!!! LMAO That's funny stuff right there!!!!

[NDSUmulligan]

This probably is blown up simply because this is another area for people to web rape Vigen.

Not at all what I intended when I made this thread, oops. I had just stumbled across that Bison Media Blog post where he rated the recruits and thought it was interesting to look back. I didn't attend this to be a Vigen bashing AT ALL.

[BisonNeil]

You have no idea about what goes on as a recruiting coordinator. Being the recruiting coordinator has nothing to do with what talent you bring into the program, that is up to the coaches recruiting the area, the position coach, and finally coach Bohl. What is important about the coordinator position is staying organized and keeping the other coaches informed on scholarship availability. Polasek is a good coach and recruiting coordinator but this was one of Vigens best attributes before taking over as offensive coordinator.

This probably is blown up simply because this is another area for people to web rape Vigen.

Yeah, you're right. It is pure coincidence that the below average 2005 and 2006 classes, an average 2007 class and a horrific 2008 class were coordinated by Vigen and the very good and excellent classes of 2009 and 2010 were under Polasek. My mistake, apologies.

Although the many articles on recruiting coordinators that I see in SI, ESPN, USA Today and SportingNews would contradict your statements, I am quite certain you are right.

[mgbison]

Some people don't understand how college recruiting works and never will. It is pointless to explain to them how it works.

Do some of you people really think that the recruiting coordinator has that much say in who the coaches bring in. The recuiting coordinator just sets up campus visits, lodging and other things along those lines. The recruiting coordinator doesn't decide which recruits to bring in and which recruits should get offered. If anything Vigen has more say now about which recruits are being offered.

The bad classes back to back were due to several coaches not pulling their weight on the recuiting trail. Guess what? Most of those coaches are no longer with the program.

[BisonNeil]

DaBison- If you haven't figured it out yet Bison Neil thinks Bohl and Vigen are worthless and Polasek is god.

Trust me the Head coach and assistants have zero to do with a good recruiting class it's the Recruiting coordinator!!!! LMAO That's funny stuff right there!!!!

To be accurate, I did not rip on Bohl once in 2010, not once! It was part of my much publicized New Years Resolution for the year, one I extended to 2011.

Now, relative to Vigen, that is another story. I am not the only one, however, who question his abilities to be a QB coach and OC.

But, I challenge you to find one post in 2010 where I ripped on Bohl. That is ancient history as far as I am concerned and I have moved on, so should you.

[HerdBot]

In my humble opinion the way he fixed the problem was dumping Vigen as his recruiting coordinator and putting Polasek in that slot. Big improvement! The 2009 class was the best in years, probably since Bohl's first class, and the 2010 class is stellar and arguably Bohl's best. Polasek is the man, but Bohl gets credit for changing direction on putting the right man in charge (just like when he fired himself as special teams coordinator and put Polasek in charge :) ).

As for Hallstrom's opinion of the 2008 class I am not sure where you are coming from. Hallstrom said early on, and he told me in an email right after the 2009 class hit the field in the fall of that year, that the 2008 class was not impressive athletically. When you looked at the players side by side, one set who had been in the system for a year and the other right out of high school, that there was no question that the 2008 class was not very good. So, I am not sure I can agree with you that the 2008 class "actually had some good talent". I don't think there is any evidence of that.

Offerman was highly touted but he never even qualified. I think he was 1st team Kare 11. Reid and Garret Johnson were talented and were starters or penciled in to be part of the rotation.

Fortunately Scott Stoczynski, Cole Jirek, and Leevon Perry took advantage of the opportunity and could be better than them anyway.

Now we need Juckem, Gimmestad, Hagen, or maybe even a few of the lineman in this class to try and contribute and do the same. I think the development of Juckem and Gimmestad is the most important thing we need to see this offseason. Im suprised we haven't gotten a juco DT yet but the coaches must believe in these guys.

I think Hakeem Bourne Mcfarlane was somewhat talented but I dont think he had star potential. Problem is he was a thug. I think Wahlo, Gebhart, Vraa, and Powel Calhoun are ten times the players. Bigger, stronger, faster, and smarter.

I think overall we are getting better athletes that are bigger, stronger, and faster. It seems like most of the guys in this class are already bigger than the 2008 class. Lots of 6-3 or taller guys with potential to bulk up.

[tony]

Pfft. It's easy to assess recruits.

To get The Angry Elf Simple Recruit Rating, follow these steps.

Step 1: Figure out the ratio of consonants to vowels in the player's name.
Step 2: Multiply by weight (in stones)
Step 3: Multiply by height (in links, 1 link = 7.92 inches)
Step 4: Divide by 40 time (seconds)

Example: Ragnar Skrammgirdsson, a 6'6, 280 lb guy who runs a 4.4 40 would be calculate out to 3 * 20 * 9.85 / 4.4 = 134.32 rankems*.

Angry Elf would be a 7.03, btw.

* A much better unit of measure than "stars". Why? Because it's scientastic!

[Bison"FANatic"]

Pfft. It's easy to assess recruits.

To get The Angry Elf Simple Recruit Rating, follow these steps.

Step 1: Figure out the ratio of consonants to vowels in the player's name.
Step 2: Multiply by weight (in stones)
Step 3: Multiply by height (in links, 1 link = 7.92 inches)
Step 4: Divide by 40 time (seconds)

Example: Ragnar Skrammgirdsson, a 6'6, 280 lb guy who runs a 4.4 40 would be calculate out to 3 * 20 * 9.85 / 4.4 = 134.32 rankems*.

Angry Elf would be a 7.03, btw.

* A much better unit of measure than "stars". Why? Because it's scientastic!

Hey I come out as about a 27. I guess that 7 second 40 kind of killed me. (Actually about a 24 but I couldn't admit openly that my 40 is really 8 seconds.:D :D :D ) Just about had me on the stones but I got it figured out and thanks for the links conversion.

[tony]

Hey I come out as about a 27. I guess that 7 second 40 kind of killed me. (Actually about a 24 but I couldn't admit openly that my 40 is really 8 seconds.:D :D :D ) Just about had me on the stones but I got it figured out and thanks for the links conversion.

I haven't done the science yet, but I kind of think C.J.Smith has the highest number of rankems. The 7 to 1 consonant to vowel ratio is going to be pretty hard to beat.

[Kermit]

Pfft. It's easy to assess recruits.

To get The Angry Elf Simple Recruit Rating, follow these steps.

Step 1: Figure out the ratio of consonants to vowels in the player's name.
Step 2: Multiply by weight (in stones)
Step 3: Multiply by height (in links, 1 link = 7.92 inches)
Step 4: Divide by 40 time (seconds)

Example: Ragnar Skrammgirdsson, a 6'6, 280 lb guy who runs a 4.4 40 would be calculate out to 3 * 20 * 9.85 / 4.4 = 134.32 rankems*.

Angry Elf would be a 7.03, btw.

* A much better unit of measure than "stars". Why? Because it's scientastic!

Good work, Tony, but your forumula is obviously incomplete because it fails to account for the "Lakes effect."

[SamsRams]

Nick Mertens - lakes

Just sayin'.

Dont forget Mohler, great kid, good work ethic, but far from the gurantueed 3 years starter our boy predicited

[NDSUmulligan]

Kolpack must have read this thread I started, because if you check out the Bison Media Blog he pretty much calls this thread out about Hallstrom's 2008 class analysis, haha.

Kolpack's analysis of this class is pretty good. Plus he, like I did (see Star of this class thread) had Derek Lee the TE from Kansas as #1.

Every time I look at this class I like it more and more...

[lakesbison]

Sincerest form of flattery.....something something....

[tony]

Good work, Tony, but your forumula is obviously incomplete because it fails to account for the "Lakes effect."

D'oh!

Step 5: Divide by number of capitalized words and exclamations points used by Lakesbison in posts describing the recruit.*

* Disclaimer: Probably should do the same if I ever use capitalized words or exclamation points to describe a recruit.

[Bison"FANatic"]

Nnnnnnnnooooooooo

Lakes never talked about me as a recruit. You are forcing me to divide by zero.

[tony]

Nnnnnnnnooooooooo

Lakes never talked about me as a recruit. You are forcing me to divide by zero.

D'oh again... I'll have to add a 1 to Step 5 before doing the division.

[rutlandbison]

When will we know who signed and who didnt.

[lakesbison]

USUALLY by 2pm all signed faxes will be in

[Mr. Burgundy]

most faxes are in ASAP in the morning. They could be all in right now, but we wouldn't know. Other schools would, but we wouldn't.

[SDbison]

most faxes are in ASAP in the morning. They could be all in right now, but we wouldn't know. Other schools would, but we wouldn't.
Can Road like call somebody he has connections with and they can give him the info to report here at Bisonville?

[BadlandsBison]

Can Road like call somebody he has connections with and they can give him the info to report here at Bisonville?

I think that would be kinda funny if Bisonville were the first to know. Funny, but sad.

[lakesbison]

Just talked to a coach. No surprises, but "its not 2 yet" I'vye heard 2pm a couple time now, that's when they are doin the press release and press conference