Who do you want at Offensive Coordinator next year?

[yellowstreak]

Who do you want at Offensive Coordinator next year?

[4mcruenomore]

See the Kevin Feeney thread.

[yellowstreak]

Eric Koehler takes the early lead

[lakesbison]

Brad Chilldress!!

JEFF HORTON - Gophers Offensive Coordinator

[silkamilkamonico]

Anyone who runs a spread.

[TbonZach]

Tyler Roehl.

[westnodak93bison]

Polasek. Former college QB. Give him the reigns.

[silkamilkamonico]

I was surprised that Vigen was even on that list, and now I think I'm seeing 3 votes for him......LMAO

[ndsubison1]

Anyone who runs a spread.

++++++++++

[TbonZach]

Steve Walker

So what if he's working for an insurance firm?

[IndyBison]

Curious to see Matt Land from Trine on the list. I met him a couple years ago when I worked one of their scrimmages. I don't see any connection to the NDSU program so curious as to why you included him. He's had success at a D3 school in a very small town so he knows how to coach/recruit.

[CAS4127]

Eric Koehler of GVS.

[bri-dog]

Anyone but Vigen-illa.:banghead:

[Dabison]

Anyone who runs a spread.

Yeah!! Cause it really worked for Minnesota....

[BisoninNWMN]

Anyone who runs a spread.

NO WAY!!

Everyone runs it.

West-coast is fine for us.

[westnodak93bison]

NO WAY!!

Everyone runs it.

West-coast is fine for us.

I agree. Spread sucks.

[BadlandsBison]

Coach Polasek anyone? He was a good QB in college and QBs always seem to make the best playcallers.

[bisonmike2]

Charile Weis

[CAS4127]

I agree. Spread sucks.

Yes, "west coast" as a base is fine, but there are plenty of variations thereof that could, should and must be implimented, unless of course you want to go scoreless in your last game of the season against the worst defense in your conference, that, if won, guarantees you a playoff spot.:banghead: :banghead:

[MN_BISON]

Glenn Caruso, head coach at the University of St.Thomas. He was on staff when Babich was here and Bohl brought in his own guys which lead him to USD, then to Macalester and now to St. Thomas. Probably a long shot at best but someone worth looking at to bring back. Very well thought of in the Minneapolis area which wouldn't hurt in recruiting one bit.

[NDSUFan_Sav]

Steve Walker

So what if he's working for an insurance firm?

I don't really think he works tbh with you :D

[Bisonguy]

Glenn Caruso, head coach at the University of St.Thomas. He was on staff when Babich was here and Bohl brought in his own guys which lead him to USD, then to Macalester and now to St. Thomas. Probably a long shot at best but someone worth looking at to bring back. Very well thought of in the Minneapolis area which wouldn't hurt in recruiting one bit.


Wasn't Caruso in charge of the Illinois area for recruiting?

[NDSUFan_Sav]

Charile Weis

I'd like to win and I thought we were trying to get rid of our bad OC the way it is now :D

[HerdBot]

Brent Vigen. He's still young and inexperienced but has the potential. He will learn from his mistakes and become a good coordinator while being a long term coach who can recruit. Other guys will be short term coaches.

[CAS4127]

Brent Vigen. He's still young and inexperienced but has the potential. He will learn from his mistakes and become a good coordinator while being a long term coach who can recruit. Other guys will be short term coaches.

So does my 5 year old daughter, but I don't want to wait that long, although I could likely have her up to Vigen's level by the end of this year, which is kindergarten btw!

[MN_BISON]

Wasn't Caruso in charge of the Illinois area for recruiting?

I'm pretty sure he was, so think Walker, Mays and Drago.

[bisondad]

Pat Perles

[heckler]

Bob Nielson HC of the Duluth Bulldogs

[Dabison]

Brent Vigen. He's still young and inexperienced but has the potential. He will learn from his mistakes and become a good coordinator while being a long term coach who can recruit. Other guys will be short term coaches.

I agree! He's a smart guy and I think you will see in the years to come the offense really come together and be tough to defend.

Can't believe that someone actually brought up Glenn Carusso (However you spell it). He was our OC in 2002. There's a reason he was let go when Bohl came in.

[BisonNeil]

Yes, "west coast" as a base is fine, but there are plenty of variations thereof that could, should and must be implimented, unless of course you want to go scoreless in your last game of the season against the worst defense in your conference, that, if won, guarantees you a playoff spot.:banghead: :banghead:

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[BisonNeil]

Glenn Caruso, head coach at the University of St.Thomas. He was on staff when Babich was here and Bohl brought in his own guys which lead him to USD, then to Macalester and now to St. Thomas. Probably a long shot at best but someone worth looking at to bring back. Very well thought of in the Minneapolis area which wouldn't hurt in recruiting one bit.

Good possibility and probably much more likely to come than a Grand Valley guy.

[NDSUstudent]

While this wouldn't be an OC replacement, I noticed Keith Heckendorf was let go by Western Carolina(he was the OC) and I think he could be a good QB coach.

At the very least I think Bohl needs to bring somebody in that can groom our QBs because they never improve.

[X-Factor]

Sioux Falls coach anyone?!! Seems like a great pick-up if you ask me.

[MN_BISON]

I agree! He's a smart guy and I think you will see in the years to come the offense really come together and be tough to defend.

Can't believe that someone actually brought up Glenn Carusso (However you spell it). He was our OC in 2002. There's a reason he was let go when Bohl came in.

Bohl wanted to get his people in place, there wasn't a lot of Babich's staff held over. Glenn is a solid football coach and has a pretty good resume to go with it. Its not like NDSU is going to bring in some high profile guy from Texas for an OC position if they change direction at all. Who do you think recruited Walker and the rest of the IL guys? I'd take him over a lot of other names on that list that's for sure.

[#1BISONFAN ASHLEY]

Why do we have 8 votes for Vigen????:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[ndsubison1]

What about Kenni Burns?

[ndbj52]

Why was Feeney on the list and not Steve Laqua. Laqua has won two state titles the past two years at Shanley and was already coached at NDSU before that. Why not try bring him back?

[westnodak93bison]

They will be reluctant to fire or demote Vigen imho. Been with the Bison program for a long time making it uncomfortable to make a move.

[BisonNeil]

They will be reluctant to fire or demote Vigen imho. Been with the Bison program for a long time making it uncomfortable to make a move.

You make a very good point. However, if benevolence is the only reason to not let him go, that isn't good enough in my humble opinion.

Upon further review and after discussing this in depth with my son and a friend of mine over beers last night, I personally favor dismissing Vigen and promoting Polasek to QB coach and OC.

I know Tyler Roehl is going to be a grad assistant next year but I still think Bohl should go out and find a RB coach, Tyler will be a great assistant to that person.

Polasek would have to be relieved of special teams coordinating, but I think Brian Ward would probably be someone who could step into that quite nicely, especially since many of his players are on those teams.

[DjKyRo]

You make a very good point. However, if benevolence is the only reason to not let him go, that isn't good enough in my humble opinion.

Upon further review and after discussing this in depth with my son and a friend of mine over beers last night, I personally favor dismissing Vigen and promoting Polasek to QB coach and OC.

I know Tyler Roehl is going to be a grad assistant next year but I still think Bohl should go out and find a RB coach, Tyler will be a great assistant to that person.

Polasek would have to be relieved of special teams coordinating, but I think Brian Ward would probably be someone who could step into that quite nicely, especially since many of his players are on those teams.

This is a strategy I could get behind - everything Polasek has touched has turned to gold, that being RB's and special teams (at least on punting and coverage). We need this guy to be working our offense and saw things with DJ that we didn't see with the QBs - improvement. He had a rather unpolished game after his first two seasons and is now on track to be yet another great NDSU running back. Tim Polasek is our guy.

[westnodak93bison]

You make a very good point. However, if benevolence is the only reason to not let him go, that isn't good enough in my humble opinion.

Upon further review and after discussing this in depth with my son and a friend of mine over beers last night, I personally favor dismissing Vigen and promoting Polasek to QB coach and OC.

I know Tyler Roehl is going to be a grad assistant next year but I still think Bohl should go out and find a RB coach, Tyler will be a great assistant to that person.

Polasek would have to be relieved of special teams coordinating, but I think Brian Ward would probably be someone who could step into that quite nicely, especially since many of his players are on those teams.

Wow, exactly what I've been thinking. This would be a great move imho.

[56BISON73]

You make a very good point. However, if benevolence is the only reason to not let him go, that isn't good enough in my humble opinion.

Upon further review and after discussing this in depth with my son and a friend of mine over beers last night, I personally favor dismissing Vigen and promoting Polasek to QB coach and OC.

I know Tyler Roehl is going to be a grad assistant next year but I still think Bohl should go out and find a RB coach, Tyler will be a great assistant to that person.

Polasek would have to be relieved of special teams coordinating, but I think Brian Ward would probably be someone who could step into that quite nicely, especially since many of his players are on those teams.

Good post.

[EagleBison]

I'm on the Caruso bandwagon, and if you like offense he is a good pick.
Pretty sure he was the Illinois recruiter too.

St Thomas Link (http://www.tommiesports.com/ftbl/coaches/CarusoGlenn.html)

Date Location Result
Nov 20, 2010 UST Univ. of St. Thomas 57, BUFB 10
Nov 06, 2010 UST Univ. of St. Thomas 38, CAR 7
Oct 30, 2010 St.Peter,Minn. Univ. of St. Thomas 43, Gustavus Adolphus 6
Oct 23, 2010 UST Univ. of St. Thomas 10, BU 6
Oct 16, 2010 Univ. of St. Thomas 61, Hamline University 17
Oct 09, 2010 UST/St. Paul Univ. of St. Thomas 55, AUG 17
Oct 02, 2010 Collegeville Univ. of St. Thomas 27, Saint John's Univ. 26
Sep 25, 2010 UST Univ. of St. Thomas 56, CONC 7
Sep 18, 2010 Northfield, Univ. of St. Thomas 49, St. Olaf College 14
Sep 11, 2010 UST Univ. of St. Thomas 27, UWRF 3
9/4/10 De Pere, Wis. Univ. of St. Thomas 40, St. Norbert College 7

[THEsocalledfan]

I am on the SDbison bandwagon. Why has no one else nominated him?:hide:*

*As an FYI, this may be an even bigger waste time than following potential recruits.....

[JustinTyem]

Coach Polasek anyone? He was a good QB in college and QBs always seem to make the best playcallers.Tim Polasek is a "GREAT" coach. He is the man that found Brock Jensen,and really recruited since Tim is from Iola-Scandavania(sp) that is 15 miles north of waupaca. I would be Happy if he took over as the OC.

[IzzyFlexion]

I'm pretty sure he was, so think Walker, Mays and Drago.

Fairburn.....

[BlueBisonRock]

I am on the SDbison bandwagon. Why has no one else nominated him?:hide:*

*As an FYI, this may be an even bigger waste time than following potential recruits.....

He would have to take one hell of a pay cut.

Just sayin'

[yellowstreak]

Anyone who runs a spread.

when did the "run-and-shoot" get renamed the "spread" and why?

[yellowstreak]

Curious to see Matt Land from Trine on the list. I met him a couple years ago when I worked one of their scrimmages. I don't see any connection to the NDSU program so curious as to why you included him. He's had success at a D3 school in a very small town so he knows how to coach/recruit.

Trine has one of the best offenses in DIII. Matt Land knows how to run an offense. Would he be interested in being OC for NDSU??? ...who knows.

[unbison]

I am nominating teh lakesbison......no way he wouldn't be. A success in said position:hide:

[silkamilkamonico]

when did the "run-and-shoot" get renamed the "spread" and why?

The run and shoot has basically evolved into the spread.

The run and shoot was never ever meant to be run out of shotgun, but evolved to it.

The spread utilizes a slot Wr working the middle of the field, where the RnS utilizes the slot WR working deep.

Most importantly the run and shoot is a passing oriented offense designed to throw down the field. The spread is simply disigned to create matchups with speed guys in open places.

This west coast offense NDSU runs is boring as hell and does not work, obviously. I could easily fall asleep watching our offense "trying" to attack.

This offense in place right now is an utter joke.

[EmeraldCityBison]

Watching Boise State-Navada. BSU play calling is phenomenal. Not many audibles and an excellent mix of run/pass plays. I have no idea what play is coming next. I hope Vigen is watching and taking notes...

[westnodak93bison]

The run and shoot has basically evolved into the spread.

The run and shoot was never ever meant to be run out of shotgun, but evolved to it.

The spread utilizes a slot Wr working the middle of the field, where the RnS utilizes the slot WR working deep.

Most importantly the run and shoot is a passing oriented offense designed to throw down the field. The spread is simply disigned to create matchups with speed guys in open places.

This west coast offense NDSU runs is boring as hell and does not work, obviously. I could easily fall asleep watching our offense "trying" to attack.

This offense in place right now is an utter joke.

I'll disagree. It is the exact same offense that we ran in 06 and 07. No way in hell you can convince me that all our QBs are bad players. The play calling is so predictable even a novice like me can predict run or pass.

[BurroBlue]

I'm not taking a stand on whether or not Coach Vigen should be back...but if he isn't, Bob Nielsen at UMD and Lance Leipold are rising stars that keep going up. Coach Nielsen may stick around Duluth, but somebody is going to pay Leipold a lot of money to sell his house pretty soon. He's got great connections in the Milwaukee and Chicago areas - would be a great target to go after.

IF...and I'm not saying that I do (or don't) endorse the retainer (or firing) of Coach Vigen.
http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Everyone%20Else/images-3/switzerland-map.jpg (http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KJket5ag1N5gwALvmjzbkF/SIG=13apmbhav/EXP=1292811257/**http%3a//scrapetv.com/News/News%2520Pages/Everyone%2520Else/images-3/switzerland-map.jpg)

[bisonmike2]

urban meyer. he's available.

[ndsubison1]

brad childress

[DjKyRo]

Wade Phillips.

[Mr. Burgundy]

Reggie Moore. I can't imagine being in the offensive meetings for 2 years with Norm Chow was too bad. Decent development opp for him. Great guy and a great recruiter too....can you imagine him and AJ Cooper both recruiting. Throw in Polasek. Yes please.

[lakesbison]

11 idiots. N

[westriver bison]

Peyton Manning

[ISXBISON]

Lakesbison. He knows everything. Just ask him.

[SDbison]

Does anyone know if Vigen or Bohl makes the decision not to go for it on 4th and 2 from EWU's 32 yard line with a 7 point lead and 2:30 left in the game? Is it Vigen that is in love with and over uses that stupid QB draw? Is it Vigen that has never heard of a QB sneak? In my opinion Vigen is the one holding back the Bison offense while he fumbles around trying to become a success as an offensive coordinator. For this I blame Bohl more than anyone else. If Bohl was such a great coach he wouldn't have an inexperienced rookie at offensive coordinator. Chances are both Bohl and Vigen cost the Bison a couple games this year and they are also the reason the Bison are not in the national championship game.

[ISXBISON]

Does anyone know if Vigen or Bohl makes the decision not to go for it on 4th and 2 from EWU's 32 yard line with a 7 point lead and 2:30 left in the game? Is it Vigen that is in love with and over uses that stupid QB draw? Is it Vigen that has never heard of a QB sneak? In my opinion Vigen is the one holding back the Bison offense while he fumbles around trying to become a success as an offensive coordinator. For this I blame Bohl more than anyone else. If Bohl was such a great coach he wouldn't have an inexperienced rookie at offensive coordinator. Chances are both Bohl and Vigen cost the Bison a couple games this year and they are also the reason the Bison are not in the national championship game.

Do you want a pit stop coach who is short term, leaves after a couple years for greener pastures--causing us to start over again, or do you want one that is going to grow and develop with the team and stick around long term? Constant turnover of coaches doesn't do anyone any good. We need some consistency in order to improve and get to where we want to be.

[ndsubison1]

Does anyone know if Vigen or Bohl makes the decision not to go for it on 4th and 2 from EWU's 32 yard line with a 7 point lead and 2:30 left in the game? Is it Vigen that is in love with and over uses that stupid QB draw? Is it Vigen that has never heard of a QB sneak? In my opinion Vigen is the one holding back the Bison offense while he fumbles around trying to become a success as an offensive coordinator. For this I blame Bohl more than anyone else. If Bohl was such a great coach he wouldn't have an inexperienced rookie at offensive coordinator. Chances are both Bohl and Vigen cost the Bison a couple games this year and they are also the reason the Bison are not in the national championship game.

i would imagine bohl has the final say on the 4th and 2

[westnodak93bison]

I would have went for it on 4th and 2 but I see their point the way our defense was playing. No way any of us could have saw that drive coming especially the lucky catch. It is what it is. If we would have stopped them on that drive many would have said how great a decision it was to pin them deep.

[ndbj52]

Does anyone know if Vigen or Bohl makes the decision not to go for it on 4th and 2 from EWU's 32 yard line with a 7 point lead and 2:30 left in the game? Is it Vigen that is in love with and over uses that stupid QB draw? Is it Vigen that has never heard of a QB sneak? In my opinion Vigen is the one holding back the Bison offense while he fumbles around trying to become a success as an offensive coordinator. For this I blame Bohl more than anyone else. If Bohl was such a great coach he wouldn't have an inexperienced rookie at offensive coordinator. Chances are both Bohl and Vigen cost the Bison a couple games this year and they are also the reason the Bison are not in the national championship game.

Vigen is not the first one to not use a QB sneak it has not been used for a long time or at least I don't remmber seeing it even before Vigen took over.

[ndsubison1]

Vigen is not the first one to not use a QB sneak it has not been used for a long time or at least I don't remmber seeing it even before Vigen took over.

jensen had a qb sneak for a td in bozeman

[WildBill]

when did the "run-and-shoot" get renamed the "spread" and why?

They are not the same offense.

[Bison"FANatic"]

Anyone who runs a spread.

I am happy with the type of offense we run just need to open it up to the wr and te a little more and we can utilize the power running game. I don't think we are anywhere even near having personel to run a spread.

[WildBill]

Personally, after witnessing the revolving door at Minnesota, the Bison would be better off sticking with the status quo. Continuity is great thing especially when dealing with young student athletes.

[MOTBison]

I would like to put myself down as a write in...... "MTBison"
As far as credentials, I used to play high school football and I wanted to be good.

[1bizon1]

Whenever the voting for OC closes, who is going to fire Vigen and make the offer to the new OC? ;) Or should the new OC be offered before the old OC is cut loose so we do not end up without an OC?

[SDbison]

In my book Vigen still sucks........I don't have patience to wait 4 years until he maybe figures it out. Just because some staff left soon doesn't mean someone else wouldn't stay for a while. Those who would stick with someone who sucks just because they fear a competent guy would leave too soon sure don't have a clue. Almost funny to justify that. Wow!

[56BISON73]

Whenever the voting for OC closes, who is going to fire Vigen and make the offer to the new OC? ;) Or should the new OC be offered before the old OC is cut loose so we do not end up without an OC?


There was a time when there were no OCs. The QB actually called all the plays except for special or crucial plays. I would have no problem if we didnt have an OC as long as the QB was groomed to take on the added responsibility.

[SDbison]

Somebody demote Vigen.........actually just replace him with a QB coach that knows something about being a QB and an O-coordinator with experience.

[Trampled]

I'm for sticking with the WCO however I am for any OC that will utilize the talent that is already present! We have never been short of talent here, only lack of utilization. All these players had a much bigger playbook in high school than they are using now even though the actual playbook is huge! Give these players some credit, open it up...for god's sakes who in their right mind would want to be a receiver for the Bison? Number 1 receiver gets 80 percent of throws, then next to nothing for the rest!! As he was shut down because everyone new where the pass was going,then all passing stopped. WTF? When every one of the receivers were recruited we were told they were awesome! Does this lack of confidence in them mean that our coaches turned them into shit? Seldom utilized tight ends or fullbacks out of the backfield. No counters, no quick hitters, no QB sneak, no end arounds. These are just basic plays. No misdirection plays. Wow. Yes a real change is in order on offense. Vigen doesn't show any brilliance at all.

[THEsocalledfan]

I'm for sticking with the WCO however I am for any OC that will utilize the talent that is already present! We have never been short of talent here, only lack of utilization. All these players had a much bigger playbook in high school than they are using now even though the actual playbook is huge! Give these players some credit, open it up...for god's sakes who in their right mind would want to be a receiver for the Bison? Number 1 receiver gets 80 percent of throws, then next to nothing for the rest!! As he was shut down because everyone new where the pass was going,then all passing stopped. WTF? When every one of the receivers were recruited we were told they were awesome! Does this lack of confidence in them mean that our coaches turned them into shit? Seldom utilized tight ends or fullbacks out of the backfield. No counters, no quick hitters, no QB sneak, no end arounds. These are just basic plays. No misdirection plays. Wow. Yes a real change is in order on offense. Vigen doesn't show any brilliance at all.

Agree. Sadly, it seemed like we had a more dynamic passing game when Beechy was running the veer.......(See McDonald and Cahill.....)

[westnodak93bison]

I'm for sticking with the WCO however I am for any OC that will utilize the talent that is already present! We have never been short of talent here, only lack of utilization. All these players had a much bigger playbook in high school than they are using now even though the actual playbook is huge! Give these players some credit, open it up...for god's sakes who in their right mind would want to be a receiver for the Bison? Number 1 receiver gets 80 percent of throws, then next to nothing for the rest!! As he was shut down because everyone new where the pass was going,then all passing stopped. WTF? When every one of the receivers were recruited we were told they were awesome! Does this lack of confidence in them mean that our coaches turned them into shit? Seldom utilized tight ends or fullbacks out of the backfield. No counters, no quick hitters, no QB sneak, no end arounds. These are just basic plays. No misdirection plays. Wow. Yes a real change is in order on offense. Vigen doesn't show any brilliance at all.

Need to spread the ball around imho. Every game should have receptions to the TE, FB, RB and 2-3 WR. No excuse for not using everybody. Need to have run and pass plays out of every formation. Let the QB audible. Get rid of the predictability. It will only help the power running game become more efficient. All these QBs have now been in the "system" for over 2yrs now. Take off the training wheels and put the hammer down.

[Dabison]

Somebody demote Vigen.........actually just replace him with a QB coach that knows something about being a QB and an O-coordinator with experience.

Can't tell by your posts....but I'm gonna guess that you DON'T want Vigen back next year.

[bisonfan08]

I agree that Vigen sucked big time this year and I was not impressed, however let's not forget that everyone was calling for Bohl's head the last couple seasons as well and he turned it around, I say give him one more season and see if he learns and adjusts, if after 5 or 6 games we don't see improvement, fire him and promote from within. I do agree we need to bring in a QB coach that can develop players though, think about it, Mertens had nearly 3 full seasons in the offense before he took over as a starter and he still looked lost out there! We need somebody who can help these kids learn the offense, develop their reads and even address simple fundamental improvements such as dropbacks, moving in the pocket and THROWING THE BALL AWAY! Yeah I'm talkin to you Mohler.

[Bison Dan]

Not sure you can pin all the problems of our O on Vigen. 2 Freshmen linemen and rookie qb's there were hurt more than once during the season. Yes Vigen called some dumb plays. We have to make teams pay that don't play us straight up. He's not going anywhere so you can bitch all you want. The best we can hope for is a new hire on the Offense side that can add to the mix.

[westnodak93bison]

Would it be too much for Polasek to handle RBs, QBs and Special Teams?

[THEsocalledfan]

He's not going anywhere so you can bitch all you want.

Really? You have proof of that? Please give the citation please. If it is an educated guess, I would suggest you more clearly state it as such. Seems to me a recent D coordinator went packing recently, and you never know for sure if they were truly going to a new opportunity, or they started kicking tires hard when they saw the writing on the wall.....

[SDbison]

I agree that Vigen sucked big time this year and I was not impressed, however let's not forget that everyone was calling for Bohl's head the last couple seasons as well and he turned it around, I say give him one more season and see if he learns and adjusts, if after 5 or 6 games we don't see improvement, fire him and promote from within. I do agree we need to bring in a QB coach that can develop players though, think about it, Mertens had nearly 3 full seasons in the offense before he took over as a starter and he still looked lost out there! We need somebody who can help these kids learn the offense, develop their reads and even address simple fundamental improvements such as dropbacks, moving in the pocket and THROWING THE BALL AWAY! Yeah I'm talkin to you Mohler.
Lets all remember that NDSU should get the best recruits available in FCS. Certainly the top 20%. Its what the coaches do with them that counts. I still think Bohl is a failure for picking a guy with relatively little experience and no offensive coordination background. Seems Bohl still makes some questionable decisions on the field and Vigen doesn't have a clue.
With a program that has some of the best facilities, best recruits, and best fans in FCS seems strange that NDSU shouldn't be in the playoffs 3 out of 4 years. I think the players willed themselves into the playoffs this year. Their desire exceeded the incompetence of the coaches. Same thing happened in the 10-1 seasons. I am not so sure NDSU football has a complete set of coaches that can be considered very good to excellent.

[Bison Dan]

Would it be too much for Polasek to handle RBs, QBs and Special Teams?

He did a hell've job on special teams this year. Big change from last year. I think the O coaches should look at a big team FBC team that runs the same offense and breakdown their plays and what works for him against didn't defensive schemes. I think Cal runs the West Coast O. It'd be fun to run Segers in a slot for passing or running plays. I watched Nova run the wildcat against App State and he gave them fits - either running or passing. I think Thorton would be a great wildcater if Jensen starts at qb.

[THEsocalledfan]

Lets all remember that NDSU should get the best recruits available in FCS. Certainly the top 20%. Its what the coaches do with them that counts. I still think Bohl is a failure for picking a guy with relatively little experience and no offensive coordination background. Seems Bohl still makes some questionable decisions on the field and Vigen doesn't have a clue.
With a program that has some of the best facilities, best recruits, and best fans in FCS seems strange that NDSU shouldn't be in the playoffs 3 out of 4 years. I think the players willed themselves into the playoffs this year. Their desire exceeded the incompetence of the coaches. Same thing happened in the 10-1 seasons. I am not so sure NDSU football has a complete set of coaches that can be considered very good to excellent.

SD, you have gone too far on this. All those players who willed themselves to win are Coach Bohl recruits. So no credit for that to coaches? Further, overall, the defense was excellent and the coaches probably had something to do with that. Finally, you may be suffering from MSP syndrome thinking the world revolves around Fargo. Last time a checked, hard to find skill players in the number needed from the ND, MN region, so further out recruiting is needed. (Also the reason a spread offense would be the stupidest thing ever for NDSU.....) Why would many of those kids want to go to a program with nice facilities and a great D2 tradition, when they can play in the Mountians of Montana or in the better weather of Georgia Southern, etc, who also have tradition? Be away from family? Go to the icebox of America (sorry I. Falls, but more wind)?

I agree Vigen is a problem, but Coach Bohl clearly got the ship turned around (hey, I was with you until the playoff run) and the future looks promising. If they tank next year, I'll be right back there with you......

[SDbison]

So you can take out of this Poll that only 13.76% of Bisonville thinks Vigen should be the offensive coordinator next year. Wow! That is significant. In other words...........

86.24% WANT SOMEBODY ELSE AS O-COORDINATOR!

I wonder what Bohl thinks? I also wonder what the players think about Vigens game plan. If they don't believe in it then the team cannot excel. If there was a responsible media out there that really cared about the Bison without sucking up or doing a halfa$$ job these questions would be asked.

So when these mistakes in game plan and preparation cause NDSU to lose 4 games next year and miss the playoffs will all of you 13.76% be happy to wait longer for Bohl to figure it out?

[Bison Dan]

Really? You have proof of that? Please give the citation please. If it is an educated guess, I would suggest you more clearly state it as such. Seems to me a recent D coordinator went packing recently, and you never know for sure if they were truly going to a new opportunity, or they started kicking tires hard when they saw the writing on the wall.....

Vigen was mentioned (by Bohl) at a Teamsmakers lunchen (few weeks ago) about the great job Vigen did calling the two playoff games. Seemed like he was responding to some criticism that Vigen was getting. Vigen is also one of our best recruiters. Pretty hard to let a coach go after going that deep into the playoffs. Your reasons for firing him???

[SDbison]

SD, you have gone too far on this. All those players who willed themselves to win are Coach Bohl recruits. So no credit for that to coaches? Further, overall, the defense was excellent and the coaches probably had something to do with that. Finally, you may be suffering from MSP syndrome thinking the world revolves around Fargo. Last time a checked, hard to find skill players in the number needed from the ND, MN region, so further out recruiting is needed. (Also the reason a spread offense would be the stupidest thing ever for NDSU.....) Why would many of those kids want to go to a program with nice facilities and a great D2 tradition, when they can play in the Mountians of Montana or in the better weather of Georgia Southern, etc, who also have tradition? Be away from family? Go to the icebox of America (sorry I. Falls, but more wind)?

I agree Vigen is a problem, but Coach Bohl clearly got the ship turned around (hey, I was with you until the playoff run) and the future looks promising. If they tank next year, I'll be right back there with you......
Very much disagree with you........plenty of talent in the midwest......much of it better than what is on the coasts. Really hard to believe a recruit wouldn't be swayed to go to NDSU over EWU's facilities? Give me a break. Any kid can tell NDSU has been a winning program in the past and has the potential in the future. Also look at how many of the players here get a shot at NFL.

[Dabison]

Lets all remember that NDSU should get the best recruits available in FCS. Certainly the top 20%. Its what the coaches do with them that counts. I still think Bohl is a failure for picking a guy with relatively little experience and no offensive coordination background. Seems Bohl still makes some questionable decisions on the field and Vigen doesn't have a clue.
With a program that has some of the best facilities, best recruits, and best fans in FCS seems strange that NDSU shouldn't be in the playoffs 3 out of 4 years. I think the players willed themselves into the playoffs this year. Their desire exceeded the incompetence of the coaches. Same thing happened in the 10-1 seasons. I am not so sure NDSU football has a complete set of coaches that can be considered very good to excellent.

It's funny you mention recruiting. Kids don't just come here because. Coaches put a lot of time in the recruiting process and no one does it better than Vigen.

Second, those players are like robots out on the field and the coaches program them what to do. Yes, the players and leadership were a big part of the success this year, but if you think these coaches are incompetent you're an idiot. These coaches are probably the best we've had in years simply because of their passion and commitment to Bison Football. These guys put on more hours than you can imagine. Bohl's still here for a reason, and that's because of the program we have and the coaches and players that make it up.

[Dabison]

So you can take out of this Poll that only 13.76% of Bisonville thinks Vigen should be the offensive coordinator next year. Wow! That is significant. In other words...........

86.24% WANT SOMEBODY ELSE AS O-COORDINATOR!

I wonder what Bohl thinks? I also wonder what the players think about Vigens game plan. If they don't believe in it then the team cannot excel. If there was a responsible media out there that really cared about the Bison without sucking up or doing a halfa$$ job these questions would be asked.

So when these mistakes in game plan and preparation cause NDSU to lose 4 games next year and miss the playoffs will all of you 13.76% be happy to wait longer for Bohl to figure it out?

Bisonville probably makes up 3% of Bison Fans.

A very devoted 3%, but still small amount.

[SDbison]

It's funny you mention recruiting. Kids don't just come here because. Coaches put a lot of time in the recruiting process and no one does it better than Vigen.

Second, those players are like robots out on the field and the coaches program them what to do. Yes, the players and leadership were a big part of the success this year, but if you think these coaches are incompetent you're an idiot. These coaches are probably the best we've had in years simply because of their passion and commitment to Bison Football. These guys put on more hours than you can imagine. Bohl's still here for a reason, and that's because of the program we have and the coaches and players that make it up.
Theres that idiot word........and everyone else says I start the personal attacks........hmmmmm.
Guess you are part of the 13.86% that want Vigen here. Maybe you should justify how the rookie coodinator that doesn't utilize TE's in a west coast offense, doesn't know to use a QB sneak, and is predictable as hell is so great? You are in the minority here fella not me.

[mgbison]

Every program is gonna have its down years. College sports are up and down and good programs with good traditions have more ups than downs. Look at Notre Dame, they should never be bad, but they've sucked for the last 10 years. Miami, Florida, Washington, Nebraska, Texas, Florida State have all had bad years recently. They have 100x the fan support and cash flow that we do. Bad years happen. The schools I listed will all be back near the top shortly because they have great traditions, but everybody is gonna have a bad year or two. The beauty of college sports is that you have to reload every 4 years, and that can be a good or bad thing.

Bohl's record as head coach at NDSU should speak for itself. He's had 2 seasons of 10-1 and made it to the quarterfinals this year. He record against FBS schools is 4-3. How can anybody complain about the job Bohl has done.
If anybody is complaining after this season needs to get some help. He's proven he can take us from rock bottom to being a contender.

Also, he's proven he can deal with internal issues whether it be staffing or player misconduct. I trust Bohl will do whetever is best for the football team and he will put a solid product on the field.

[SDbison]

Bisonville probably makes up 3% of Bison Fans.

A very devoted 3%, but still small amount.
This is the forum where the questions are being discussed. 1 out of about 8 here think Vigen is a good offensive coordinator. Not very good after making the playoffs.........why is that?
I hear Vigen is a great guy.......just think he is in over his head and NDSU football shouldn't be experimenting with the success of the team with a rookie coach.

[Bison Dan]

So you can take out of this Poll that only 13.76% of Bisonville thinks Vigen should be the offensive coordinator next year. Wow! That is significant. In other words...........

86.24% WANT SOMEBODY ELSE AS O-COORDINATOR!

I wonder what Bohl thinks? I also wonder what the players think about Vigens game plan. If they don't believe in it then the team cannot excel. If there was a responsible media out there that really cared about the Bison without sucking up or doing a halfa$$ job these questions would be asked.

So when these mistakes in game plan and preparation cause NDSU to lose 4 games next year and miss the playoffs will all of you 13.76% be happy to wait longer for Bohl to figure it out?

Well that 87% also thought we wouldn't go over .500 this season or that DJ wasn't the right running back. Doesn't mean spit. You and some other posters were so down on this team going into the year that you were saying another 3 win season or worse. Maybe just maybe the young OL and the young qbs limited what Vigen could call? It isn't like we could hit a 10 yard pass whenever we wanted. Either the WR couldn't get free or the qb would miss him. Hard to call plays when you can't do the little things. Even with that we almost made the Championship game. Pretty good year with a young team, first playoff home game. Could it be better? - You bet but hell you could say that about anything. We have a lot to build on. It's Christmas - be happy. NDSU had a hell've fall for all their sports.

[SDbison]

Every program is gonna have its down years. College sports are up and down and good programs with good traditions have more ups than downs. Look at Notre Dame, they should never be bad, but they've sucked for the last 10 years. Miami, Florida, Washington, Nebraska, Texas, Florida State have all had bad years recently. They have 100x the fan support and cash flow that we do. Bad years happen. The schools I listed will all be back near the top shortly because they have great traditions, but everybody is gonna have a bad year or two. The beauty of college sports is that you have to reload every 4 years, and that can be a good or bad thing.

Bohl's record as head coach at NDSU should speak for itself. He's had 2 seasons of 10-1 and made it to the quarterfinals this year. He record against FBS schools is 4-3. How can anybody complain about the job Bohl has done.
If anybody is complaining after this season needs to get some help. He's proven he can take us from rock bottom to being a contender.

Also, he's proven he can deal with internal issues whether it be staffing or player misconduct. I trust Bohl will do whetever is best for the football team and he will put a solid product on the field.
How many wins came against the tougher teams in the conference?
So mgbison and dabison love coach Bohl and Vigen. Who else?

[Bison"FANatic"]

The thing about the playoffs is we were not put in position to have to pass the ball. I don't think we have the ability to win the game at this time that we have to come out and pass against a good team or just about any team for that matter. I remember hearing on the sideline during a playoff game after a good run drive the coaches yelling "thats who we are". That is great and I agree that is who we are but we need to have the capability to throw the ball when need be and those times this year when we had to we couldn't. That is where many on bisonville and myself get frustrated with Vigen. If everything went right and we were running the ball life was good but it seemed there was no plan B to go to if we couldn't run the ball or to open up the run. We need to have the passing dimension of our offense if we want to be a complete team. It doesn't have to be a all out dominating passing game but it has to be there and right now we don't have it and I question if Vigen can deliver it. I hope he can as we are going to need it to get to the level of play most on Bisonville expect. We need to have balance.

[mgbison]

I would take this poll more seriously if Kevin Feeney didn't have almost 20% of the votes.

[mgbison]

hell ya I love Vigen and Bohl.

After this season, why would you hate Bohl? He has been a solid coach. His record speaks for itself. The MVFC was a grind this year and everybody beat everybody. We took care of business at home and went into the backyard of the Big 12 and got a W.

[lakesbison]

11 years and Vigen ain't better. No experience in D1.

THINK IF WE GOT A D1 OFF COORD. WOW,

[mgbison]

Have you seen our QB's throwing the ball this year? If we would have tried to throw the ball more we would have lost another game or two. I'm pretty sure Vigen and Bohl know our passing game was bad and weren't happy about it. If there was an easy button to push, I'm sure it would;ve been pushed after the UNI game.

Look how many passing teams lost to us this year because their QB's would throw ridiculous int's and it cost them the game. Our coaches knew we weren't gonna beat anybody through the air, so why force it. We beat teams by running the ball and playing awesome defense. It won us 9 games this year. It wasn't the prettiest formula, but it worked.

Looking forward, I'm sure Vigen and Bohl's biggest issue in the offseason is to fix the passing game. It all starts with having the oline in place, and finally having receivers to work with this spring. There is a reason Vraa and Gebhart (sp?) were gonna get their redshirts pulled.

[80ALUM]

Bohl did turn this program from 3-8 to 9-5 but he also turned us from back to back 10-1 seasons to 3-8. We lost some games this year that we should have won so do we need some changes? I think so. A new DC this year is the reason for the turn around IMO, so a new OC for next year will make for a better season next year.

[Bison Dan]

How many wins came against the tougher teams in the conference?
So mgbison and dabison love coach Bohl and Vigen. Who else?

A lot of hurt players during that stretch.

[On_the_road]

Have you seen our QB's throwing the ball this year? If we would have tried to throw the ball more we would have lost another game or two. I'm pretty sure Vigen and Bohl know our passing game was bad and weren't happy about it. If there was an easy button to push, I'm sure it would;ve been pushed after the UNI game.

Look how many passing teams lost to us this year because their QB's would throw ridiculous int's and it cost them the game. Our coaches knew we weren't gonna beat anybody through the air, so why force it. We beat teams by running the ball and playing awesome defense. It won us 9 games this year. It wasn't the prettiest formula, but it worked.

Looking forward, I'm sure Vigen and Bohl's biggest issue in the offseason is to fix the passing game. It all starts with having the oline in place, and finally having receivers to work with this spring. There is a reason Vraa and Gebhart (sp?) were gonna get their redshirts pulled.

Excellent points. I think we will all be happier with our passing game next year.

[Bison"FANatic"]

We have been saying the passing game should be better next year for 3 years though.

How many pump and goes or double moves did we see this year? Very few. With all of the short passes we threw when we did throw that seems that it would have worked well or at least been worth a try. You don't have to have great receivers to sit down in the seam of a zone they just have to be coached to recognize the seams and weak spots. All of our passes down the field seemed to be trying to hit a receiver in stride. How many times also when we were in 3rd and 9 did we see our routes ran to 7 yards and we ended up short if we did complete it. Those are a few of the things that just stuck out to me. Just my .02

[THEsocalledfan]

Vigen was mentioned (by Bohl) at a Teamsmakers lunchen (few weeks ago) about the great job Vigen did calling the two playoff games. Seemed like he was responding to some criticism that Vigen was getting. Vigen is also one of our best recruiters. Pretty hard to let a coach go after going that deep into the playoffs. Your reasons for firing him???

He sucks. Any questions?

By the way, if you had an employee who you liked personally and they were being completely being destroyed, you would not support them? This is a political move to keep his coaches happy and in the heat of battle to keep Vigen focused on what is important.

Ever heard of Jerry Burns and Bob Schnelker? If not, do a history lesson and see what happened to Coach Schnelker after the season when Jerry Burn dropped 20 f bombs in an interview defending him (after a game the Vikings one on a safety in overtime and Rich Karlis kicked 7 field goals)....I rest my case.

[CAS4127]

We have been saying the passing game should be better next year for 3 years though.

How many pump and goes or double moves did we see this year? Very few. With all of the short passes we threw when we did throw that seems that it would have worked well or at least been worth a try. You don't have to have great receivers to sit down in the seam of a zone they just have to be coached to recognize the seams and weak spots. All of our passes down the field seemed to be trying to hit a receiver in stride. How many times also when we were in 3rd and 9 did we see our routes ran to 7 yards and we ended up short if we did complete it. Those are a few of the things that just stuck out to me. Just my .02

My 2 cents: Either Vigen gets demoted, we get a new OC, or Vigen had better have his agenda set for self-improvement. Some have mentioned studying other programs with similar offenses and philosophy. That has been a longstanding way of self-improvement for coaches, as is watching film on similar offenses/phylosophies. Another is studying different defensive strategies, and developing a base game plan against each, with adjustments made when that is the defense you will face as your next opponent. The problem, as I see it with Vigen, is that I am just not convinced he has the ability to understand fully what the big picture is.

And then there is the whole creativity thing, which is a completely different animal. You have got to be able to let your mind relax so that you can think in crucial situations, not just impulsively react. I think Vigen needs improvement in this area as well, and, again, I am not convinced he has the intellectual ability to do that, but he had at least better try, and there are ways for coaches to do that as well.

Someone mentioned waiting to see how he does in the first 4-5 games, and if he does not do well, make an internal move. I disagree with that, as that would throw the whole team into a downward spiral mid-season--which could result in a disaster.

Maybe this post is more like my $5 input, but, at least I said what I wanted to say.

[THEsocalledfan]

Have you seen our QB's throwing the ball this year? If we would have tried to throw the ball more we would have lost another game or two. I'm pretty sure Vigen and Bohl know our passing game was bad and weren't happy about it. If there was an easy button to push, I'm sure it would;ve been pushed after the UNI game.

Any who's fault is this? Coaches bare no blame?

My gosh people, is there not middle ground on this subject?

It is NEVER all the fault of the players.

It is NEVER all the fault of the coaches.

Coahes DO bare responsibility for who is on the team and how they play.

Players DO bare responsibility for how they play, interact with coaches and others.

Everything it NOT right with the team Kool-aiders (yes you Gabe and others).

Everything is NOT WRONG (yes, double neg, but SD, come on, man; scapal (yes, one big coaching change) is needed fix things, not a sledgehammer).

For goodness sake, we were one of the last 8 teams standing; how many would kill to be in our spot?

For goodness sake, anyone thinks we will win a national title with that offense is deluding themselves. And it has been bad for YEARS. Changes are clearly needed. I cannot believe that magically things will be fixed without change.

Okay, rant over.

[On_the_road]

Maybe this post is more like my $5 input, but, at least I said what I wanted to say.

Yep $5 and your opinion and you can get a cup of coffee at Starbuck's. :banghead:

We saw improvement. Let's see what next year brings. If Bohl wants a change he will make it. :nod:

[SDbison]

Vigen is the weak point keeping the Bison from being not just a very good team, but a great team. I think most at Bisonville agree. He uses a 6th grade football playbook and I really question his abilities as a QB coach. Players can always play better, but you can't fix stupid when it comes to coaching.

[THEsocalledfan]

Vigen is the weak point keeping the Bison from being not just a very good team, but a great team. I think most at Bisonville agree. He uses a 6th grade football playbook and I really question his abilities as a QB coach. Players can always play better, but you can't fix stupid when it comes to coaching.

Do I think Vigen needs to go, yes, but not because he is stupid. I knew him in college and he never struck me that way, at all.

I think he needs experience elsewhere. Doubt it can be done at NDSU as trust of the players has likely been lost. (See CAS's excellent post.)

[CAS4127]

Yep $5 and your opinion and you can get a cup of coffee at Starbuck's. :banghead:

We saw improvement. Let's see what next year brings. If Bohl wants a change he will make it. :nod:

You are correct, it is just my opinion, but it is also based on what I saw. If you really take a hard look at things, you have to question whether we really saw that much improvement on offense. We went 7-4 in the regular season, which is better that 3-8, I'll give people that, but then you have to take the analysis to the next level, as in, was it really our offense that got us to 7-4? You know what I am talking about.

Then we barely get into the playoffs after a horrible offensive showing at MSU, and play two teams that just could not handle how physical we were, and we threw in one new play against the Cats that our DC offered up.
The EWU loss was with our base offensive package, and, yes, it worked, but there were several plays left on the sidelines that would have worked and possibly won us the game.

So, again, did we really see that much improvement from our offensive this year? If any, it was minimal, unless, of course, you have drank to much Kool-aid.

[Bison Dan]

Any who's fault is this? Coaches bare no blame?

My gosh people, is there not middle ground on this subject?

It is NEVER all the fault of the players.

It is NEVER all the fault of the coaches.

Coahes DO bare responsibility for who is on the team and how they play.

Players DO bare responsibility for how they play, interact with coaches and others.

Everything it NOT right with the team Kool-aiders (yes you Gabe and others).

Everything is NOT WRONG (yes, double neg, but SD, come on, man; scapal (yes, one big coaching change) is needed fix things, not a sledgehammer).

For goodness sake, we were one of the last 8 teams standing; how many would kill to be in our spot?

For goodness sake, anyone thinks we will win a national title with that offense is deluding themselves. And it has been bad for YEARS. Changes are clearly needed. I cannot believe that magically things will be fixed without change.

Okay, rant over.

Rant on because I doubt Vigen is going anywhere. I agree he needs to step up to the plate and improve.

[SDbison]

Do I think Vigen needs to go, yes, but not because he is stupid. I knew him in college and he never struck me that way, at all.

I think he needs experience elsewhere. Doubt it can be done at NDSU as trust of the players has likely been lost. (See CAS's excellent post.)
Chill out socalled.........its just a saying.......can't fix stupid. But really, I don't think Vigen's grasp of what it takes to be an O-coordinator is there. Just too many oddities in his game plan. And you know it really isn't much of a west coast offense when you can't pass high percentage to your TE or RB to pick up 4 or 5 yards. Also need to have a real threat for the deep ball now and then to keep a defense honest. For NDSU a completed mid to deep ball is rare. Funny thing,Vigen touches both parts of the offense that are sub par.

[SDbison]

You are correct, it is just my opinion, but it is also based on what I saw. If you really take a hard look at things, you have to question whether we really saw that much improvement on offense. We went 7-4 in the regular season, which is better that 3-8, I'll give people that, but then you have to take the analysis to the next level, as in, was it really our offense that got us to 7-4? You know what I am talking about.

Then we barely get into the playoffs after a horrible offensive showing at MSU, and play two teams that just could not handle how physical we were, and we threw in one new play against the Cats that our DC offered up.
The EWU loss was with our base offensive package, and, yes, it worked, but there were several plays left on the sidelines that would have worked and possibly won us the game.

So, again, did we really see that much improvement from our offensive this year? If any, it was minimal, unless, of course, you have drank to much Kool-aid.
Great post CAS.......you get it as do most fans of NDSU football. Something just ain't right. You really wonder if Bohl gets it or if Vigen is even being questioned or understands he needs a lot of improvment.

[Bison Dan]

Chill out socalled.........its just a saying.......can't fix stupid. But really, I don't think Vigen's grasp of what it takes to be an O-coordinator is there. Just too many oddities in his game plan. And you know it really isn't much of a west coast offense when you can't pass high percentage to your TE or RB to pick up 4 or 5 yards. Also need to have a real threat for the deep ball now and then to keep a defense honest. For NDSU a completed mid to deep ball is rare. Funny thing,Vigen touches both parts of the offense that are sub par.

I agree we need to hit the 5 to 15 yard passes. Just can't seem to get it done last year. I think with what we have coming back and a little imagination from our coaches our O next year could be exciting.

[Bison Dan]

I wonder who put the bug in Bohls ear last year about the special teams? This year our special teams rocked.

[CAS4127]

Great post CAS.......you get it as do most fans of NDSU football. Something just ain't right. You really wonder if Bohl gets it or if Vigen is even being questioned or understands he needs a lot of improvment.

I think Bohl "gets it", as evidenced by our DC change. I just hope he has the balls to do "something" with Vigen, whether it is changing him out or insisting on improvement through hard off-season work!! My bet is that Vigen stays, but that arrangements have or will be made for some serious off-season "education".

[THEsocalledfan]

Rant on because I doubt Vigen is going anywhere. I agree he needs to step up to the plate and improve.

See my schnelker post. You must have missed that.

[SDbison]

I agree we need to hit the 5 to 15 yard passes. Just can't seem to get it done last year. I think with what we have coming back and a little imagination from our coaches our O next year could be exciting.
I really hope so.......watching this offense for the past 3 years is somewhat disappointing. Yes, a few more bright spots this year, but its the passing game that still HAS to improve by quite a bit. Just think how a good passing game will set up the run even better (higher yards per run, more breakaways). Think about how a few less 3 and outs will give the defense more rest to help finish out a game 100%. Consider how a few more points can help win or put a close game away!
Vigen.....please I beg you, find a mentor in college football who can give you some wisdom to help your QB's and set up better game plans. I want to believe.......

[SDbison]

I wonder who put the bug in Bohls ear last year about the special teams? This year our special teams rocked.
Don't you know.......it was Bisonville.......more specifically Lakes! :D

[Bison Dan]

Don't you know.......it was Bisonville.......more specifically Lakes! :D

I forgot he had Bohl's ear!!!

[BlueBisonRock]

Vigen is the weak point keeping the Bison from being not just a very good team, but a great team. I think most at Bisonville agree. He uses a 6th grade football playbook and I really question his abilities as a QB coach. Players can always play better, but you can't fix stupid when it comes to coaching.

I am actually quite offended by that comment. I used a more complex and successful passing approach that built on the veer and i options when I coached the 6th grade (which btw won its championship :bow: ).






<sarcasm off> for those who may have missed it the first time through this post.

[Dabison]

hell ya I love Vigen and Bohl.

After this season, why would you hate Bohl? He has been a solid coach. His record speaks for itself. The MVFC was a grind this year and everybody beat everybody. We took care of business at home and went into the backyard of the Big 12 and got a W.

:cheers:

What's not to love?:biggrin:

[CAS4127]

hell ya I love Vigen and Bohl.

After this season, why would you hate Bohl? He has been a solid coach. His record speaks for itself. The MVFC was a grind this year and everybody beat everybody. We took care of business at home and went into the backyard of the Big 12 and got a W.

So no one won any conference games??!!:hide:

[westnodak93bison]

So no one won any conference games??!!:hide:

Come on you know what he means. Parody in the MVFC. We may have got lucky to beat Youngstown but should have won at Illinois St. and how we don't score against Misery St. is beyond me.

[THEsocalledfan]

Come on you know what he means. Parody in the MVFC. We may have got lucky to beat Youngstown but should have won at Illinois St. and how we don't score against Misery St. is beyond me.

Yep, better offense would not have helped in those losses. Parody would dictate we lose.

[#1BISONFAN ASHLEY]

Reggie Moore

[Dabison]

Reggie Moore

:rofl:

What?

[mgbison]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Timeout. What has Reggie Moore even done that makes him a great coach? Our receivers have been just as bad as our QB's the past 3 years. I have a hard time believing that a guy has been at UCLA for a couple years and all of a sudden he's a dream OC.

I could be wrong, but isn't Norm Chow the OC at UCLA this year. The one UCLA game I watched against Oregon, UCLA's offense looked more pathetic than ours. All they did was run some type of pistol offense and handed it off to the rb up the gut 70% of the time. Chow's resume speaks for itself, but I goes to show how much easier it's to be a OC when you have the talent. Chow was awesome at USC and so far at UCLA, it hasn't been as pretty. In fact UCLA's offese was terrible, and their QB play was terrible.

[mgbison]

I will agree that Vigen does need to get better. I believe him and the rest of the offensive staff will make the necessary improvements this offseason. CAS does make some good points about improvement, but I'd imagine Bohl and Vigen have already talked about that.

[Dabison]

28 people voted for Eric Koehler from D2 Grand Valley. How is his resume so impressive that he could out coach our entire offensive staff?

Eric Koehler enters his third season on the Grand Valley State coaching staff, but his first as the Laker offensive coordinator. In addition to directing the Laker offense, Koehler will coach the quarterbacks. Prior to arriving at GVSU, Koehler spent six years at Wartburg (Iowa) University, including the final two years as head coach.

I'm sure he's a great coach but isn't much information that says he can out coach our staff.

[56BISON73]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Timeout. What has Reggie Moore even done that makes him a great coach? Our receivers have been just as bad as our QB's the past 3 years. I have a hard time believing that a guy has been at UCLA for a couple years and all of a sudden he's a dream OC.

I could be wrong, but isn't Norm Chow the OC at UCLA this year. The one UCLA game I watched against Oregon, UCLA's offense looked more pathetic than ours. All they did was run some type of pistol offense and handed it off to the rb up the gut 70% of the time. Chow's resume speaks for itself, but I goes to show how much easier it's to be a OC when you have the talent. Chow was awesome at USC and so far at UCLA, it hasn't been as pretty. In fact UCLA's offese was terrible, and their QB play was terrible.

Not to mention that Reggie is now gone from UCLA for whatever reason.

[SDbison]

28 people voted for Eric Koehler from D2 Grand Valley. How is his resume so impressive that he could out coach our entire offensive staff?

Eric Koehler enters his third season on the Grand Valley State coaching staff, but his first as the Laker offensive coordinator. In addition to directing the Laker offense, Koehler will coach the quarterbacks. Prior to arriving at GVSU, Koehler spent six years at Wartburg (Iowa) University, including the final two years as head coach.

I'm sure he's a great coach but isn't much information that says he can out coach our staff.
Sorry fella, doesn't take much to outcoach Vigen. In fact Vigen is a God send to every opposing teams Defensive coordinator due to the vanilla style and stupid play calls.

[SDbison]

I will agree that Vigen does need to get better. I believe him and the rest of the offensive staff will make the necessary improvements this offseason. CAS does make some good points about improvement, but I'd imagine Bohl and Vigen have already talked about that.
mgbison, you could convince yourself that the recession was over and the economy was going gangbusters. Go ahead and "imagine" all the things are happening to make the offense better.
OK to have faith in God, but Bohl is nowhere near that status. As for Vigen all of our questions about him are warranted.

[CAS4127]

mgbison, you could convince yourself that the recession was over and the economy was going gangbusters. Go ahead and "imagine" all the things are happening to make the offense better.
OK to have faith in God, but Bohl is nowhere near that status. As for Vigen all of our questions about him are warranted, and remain standing until answered to at least some degree. Where's that interview of Bohl by Kolpack that is supposed to be forthcoming?[

[Dabison]

Sorry fella, doesn't take much to outcoach Vigen. In fact Vigen is a God send to every opposing teams Defensive coordinator due to the vanilla style and stupid play calls.

Thanks Fella....

but I'd say this is the least Vanilla offense in the last 5 years.

You don't have to respond because I already know that you disagree with me, and I'll even give you one of these. :banghead:

[SDbison]

Thanks Fella....

but I'd say this is the least Vanilla offense in the last 5 years.

You don't have to respond because I already know that you disagree with me, and I'll even give you one of these. :banghead:
All I know is NDSU's defense is the primary reason the Bison made the playoffs and got as far as they did.
If the Defense somehow doesn't get as many turnovers next year and nobody fills in for Gratzek and the guys leaving the secondary it could get ugly (assuming the Offense stays the same).

[mgbison]

I don't understand why everything you post is so negative. It can't be a healthy way to go through life. We made it to the quarterfinals and lost a heartbreaker. We have 18 returning starters next year and its gonna be a fun 3 to 4 years.

Our team has issues (esp offense), but how many teams in college football started 2 true freshman on the oline and had injury issues with the QB position. Its a receipe for a 3 win season. However, our defense stepped up this year and won us some games. Our defense was playing so good that all the offense had to do was take care of the football and win the field position game. It wasn't pretty but it worked.

If the offense is terrible after next year and there isn't any improvement, I'm sure some change will occur. We will have more talent on the offensive side of the ball next year (oline and wr), and more stability at the the QB position. It isn't gonna do any good to fire/demote a OC every other year. Look at the gophers, multiple oc's in the past 4 years and we all know the result in Minneapolis. The grass isn't always greener on the other side

[THEsocalledfan]

I don't understand why everything you post is so negative. It can't be a healthy way to go through life. We made it to the quarterfinals and lost a heartbreaker. We have 18 returning starters next year and its gonna be a fun 3 to 4 years.

Our team has issues (esp offense), but how many teams in college football started 2 true freshman on the oline and had injury issues with the QB position. Its a receipe for a 3 win season. However, our defense stepped up this year and won us some games. Our defense was playing so good that all the offense had to do was take care of the football and win the field position game. It wasn't pretty but it worked.

If the offense is terrible after next year and there isn't any improvement, I'm sure some change will occur. We will have more talent on the offensive side of the ball next year (oline and wr), and more stability at the the QB position. It isn't gonna do any good to fire/demote a OC every other year. Look at the gophers, multiple oc's in the past 4 years and we all know the result in Minneapolis. The grass isn't always greener on the other side


3 years the offense has been very, very bad. How long do we have to wait? 5 years? 7 years? 10 years? We had injuries, but, my goodness, pull you head out and see that injuires happen every year and the passing game was misserable. If the QB's aren't getting it done, who's fault is that? Yes, the players bare responsibility for their play, but what about the game plan? I keep hearing that, well, they had to be vanilla due to their skills, but who recruited them that led to this? Who coached them? Coaching bare no responsibilty?

This is what SD is trying to point out, even if in a very negative way.

Come out of your golly gee Beav world and see the light! Excuses won't cut it anymore. Change is clearly needed. Bohl still has my support, but other changes MUST occur. See CAS's posts; he is 100% on the money. Blind faith may get you heaven, but it will not improve your offense.

[SDbison]

I may be negative about the offense because it is just that .......a negative experience watching it.........for way too long!
As for the things done right I probably don't pay much attention because its working! I give the defense the credit due and glad to see the special team improvement. Now its time to make changes that make the offense work better.....if not, the Bison could slip back to 6-5.

[mgbison]

I will say this goes back to Bohl not recruiting a QB for 2 years after Mertens. We are still feeling the effect of that. All the coaches on the staff are responsible for the players we have on offense. This is what happens when you have 2 back to back bad recruiting classes. You don't notice it for 3 to 4 years down the road.

Bohl has fixed the QB recruiting issue by recruiting QB and getting rid of the coaches on the staff that weren't holding their own on the recruiting trail.

If we would've had a backup for Mertens, the backup would've played in the 6-5 year and we probably/could've had a 7-4 or 8-3 year that year. However, we didn't recruit a QB for 2 years and Jose gets into trouble in the offseason and is suspended during spring and for the first couple games and we are in serious trouble.

Now because we don't have a upperclassman QB we are gonna struggle to find a passing rythem. Also, in the 2 bad recuiting classes, we still got gratzek, anderson out of that bunch. Its receivers leaving that hurt us. Basically the shit storm that happened a couple years ago is still having an effect on the offense. Throw in the JUCOS we got, and the defensive JUCOs panned out better than the offensive ones. Gatlin, wilson, pike are better than Mack.

There isn't a Bison fan out there who would say that our offense doesn't need improvement. However, that fan doesn't consistently complain about everything. I have no problem with people having issues with players, coaches, schemes, etc. Its when they whine and bitch nonstop about them, it gets old.

[Dabison]

I will say this goes back to Bohl not recruiting a QB for 2 years after Mertens. We are still feeling the effect of that. All the coaches on the staff are responsible for the players we have on offense. This is what happens when you have 2 back to back bad recruiting classes. You don't notice it for 3 to 4 years down the road.

Bohl has fixed the QB recruiting issue by recruiting QB and getting rid of the coaches on the staff that weren't holding their own on the recruiting trail.

If we would've had a backup for Mertens, the backup would've played in the 6-5 year and we probably/could've had a 7-4 or 8-3 year that year. However, we didn't recruit a QB for 2 years and Jose gets into trouble in the offseason and is suspended during spring and for the first couple games and we are in serious trouble.

Now because we don't have a upperclassman QB we are gonna struggle to find a passing rythem. Also, in the 2 bad recuiting classes, we still got gratzek, anderson out of that bunch. Its receivers leaving that hurt us. Basically the shit storm that happened a couple years ago is still having an effect on the offense. Throw in the JUCOS we got, and the defensive JUCOs panned out better than the offensive ones. Gatlin, wilson, pike are better than Mack.

There isn't a Bison fan out there who would say that our offense doesn't need improvement. However, that fan doesn't consistently complain about everything. I have no problem with people having issues with players, coaches, schemes, etc. Its when they whine and bitch nonstop about them, it gets old.

+++++

With no QB you're limited in your playbook, and there's only so many run plays you can call. I bet that everytime Jensen went down this year and Mohler went in, our playscript was cut in half.

[SDbison]

I will say this goes back to Bohl not recruiting a QB for 2 years after Mertens. We are still feeling the effect of that. All the coaches on the staff are responsible for the players we have on offense. This is what happens when you have 2 back to back bad recruiting classes. You don't notice it for 3 to 4 years down the road.

Bohl has fixed the QB recruiting issue by recruiting QB and getting rid of the coaches on the staff that weren't holding their own on the recruiting trail.

If we would've had a backup for Mertens, the backup would've played in the 6-5 year and we probably/could've had a 7-4 or 8-3 year that year. However, we didn't recruit a QB for 2 years and Jose gets into trouble in the offseason and is suspended during spring and for the first couple games and we are in serious trouble.

Now because we don't have a upperclassman QB we are gonna struggle to find a passing rythem. Also, in the 2 bad recuiting classes, we still got gratzek, anderson out of that bunch. Its receivers leaving that hurt us. Basically the shit storm that happened a couple years ago is still having an effect on the offense. Throw in the JUCOS we got, and the defensive JUCOs panned out better than the offensive ones. Gatlin, wilson, pike are better than Mack.

There isn't a Bison fan out there who would say that our offense doesn't need improvement. However, that fan doesn't consistently complain about everything. I have no problem with people having issues with players, coaches, schemes, etc. Its when they whine and bitch nonstop about them, it gets old.
So.....u whine and bitch if people don't accept your dream world hype. Look in the mirror dumas.

[BlueBisonRock]

So.....u whine and bitch if people don't accept your dream world hype. Look in the mirror dumas.

Of course you are grouping him with the Dumas and Dumas crowd! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMe3WDmxBEI)

[THEsocalledfan]

However, that fan doesn't consistently complain about everything.

I certainly don't complain about everything. I even praised Vigen for a few games where I felt he did a good job on play calling.

By the way, are you advocating firing Bohl because of the bad QB recruiting and the legal storm that happened? Is it possible that coaches do bare responsibility for the payers they bring in? Just trying to understand you logic, and not trying to be difficult at this point.

[JMB]

Is a Vanilla Offense bad? I think there is something to be said about keeping things simple and executing it well. Our passing game this year was anemic. Even in the Robert Morris playoff game, where many came out praising how much our quarterback play improved, I thought our passing game was executed poorly.

I guess my point is, I believe we have more of an execution issue than a playbook issue. I don't think we need to implement the spread, or add the wildcat formation. We need to work on our timing and accuracy. We need to protect the Quarterback better. We need to identify blitzes at the line of scrimage and make the proper protection and pass route adjustments. These are still Coaching opportunities, I am just not sure a "thicker playbook" is the solution to our problems.

[BisoninNWMN]

Is a Vanilla Offense bad? I think there is something to be said about keeping things simple and executing it well. Our passing game this year was anemic. Even in the Robert Morris playoff game, where many came out praising how much our quarterback play improved, I thought our passing game was executed poorly.

I guess my point is, I believe we have more of an execution issue than a playbook issue. I don't think we need to implement the spread, or add the wildcat formation. We need to work on our timing and accuracy. We need to protect the Quarterback better. We need to identify blitzes at the line of scrimage and make the proper protection and pass route adjustments. These are still Coaching opportunities, I am just not sure a "thicker playbook" is the solution to our problems.


Say it isn't so.......NO WAY!!!

Way too many teams use the spread. Stick with the west-coast and run it to perfection.

You are right with your other points. A healthy QB with a spring practice and summer workouts to improve will definitely help the passing game.

Look at the old Green Bay Packers of the late 50s and 60s; they ran sweep right -- sweep left -- dive right --dive left -- play action and everyone knew they were going to do it, but could not stop them. The Bison have run the west-coast very well in the past and will do it again.

GO BISON

[BisonNeil]

3 years the offense has been very, very bad. How long do we have to wait? 5 years? 7 years? 10 years? We had injuries, but, my goodness, pull you head out and see that injuires happen every year and the passing game was misserable. If the QB's aren't getting it done, who's fault is that? Yes, the players bare responsibility for their play, but what about the game plan? I keep hearing that, well, they had to be vanilla due to their skills, but who recruited them that led to this? Who coached them? Coaching bare no responsibilty?


This, as far as I am concerned, this disproves any logic that there ought to be a change in the OC.

Now, I am no Vigen fan, but he can't be blamed for all three years. Perles was the OC in 2008 when everyone thought the Bison would do some damage in the playoffs coming off of back to back 10-1 seasons and 18 returning starters. Vigen took over in 2009. The 2008 offense was miserable because of some very poor recruiting and the lack of a QB. But that offense wasn't productive. It is all about the recruiting and the lack of game changers. Least we all forget, this season was year three of Bohl having teams built solely by his hand and he is still only .500 (18-18). This past season bailed his ass out because of one good (09) and one great (10) recruiting class.

Lakes can say that Vigen ruined Mertens, and that could be true since Vigen is the QB coach and always has been, but it all comes down to recruiting and Bohl and his staff have sucked recruiting this position. As of yet, there is very little evidence that they know how other than those of us who want to aimlessly grasp onto what we perceive as Jensen's "pocket presence". Until that turns into a >60% passing completion it won't mean squat.

Until the level of talent rises on the offense, it won't matter who the OC is, that is my bottom line. We still need a few more OL, a TE who isn't a pussy, and some WRs who can get separation and then catch the ball. Until that happens, the offense will be painful to watch.

[ndsubison1]

I think Bohl should reassign Vigen to Co-Coordinator and hire a play caller who has some experience with the system

[westnodak93bison]

Say it isn't so.......NO WAY!!!

Way too many teams use the spread. Stick with the west-coast and run it to perfection.

You are right with your other points. A healthy QB with a spring practice and summer workouts to improve will definitely help the passing game.

Look at the old Green Bay Packers of the late 50s and 60s; they ran sweep right -- sweep left -- dive right --dive left -- play action and everyone knew they were going to do it, but could not stop them. The Bison have run the west-coast very well in the past and will do it again.

GO BISON

NO! to the spread. It would take away the Bison identity. Would be a huge mistake imho.

[A1pigskin]

Brad Chilldress!!

JEFF HORTON - Gophers Offensive Coordinator

ROFLMAO:D :D :D :D

[westnodak93bison]

Tim Brewster :eek: We really need an assistant coach that can get our sideline jumping around like a bunch of clowns. You know somebody that can bring some real energy to the team, get them fired up etc.... and maybe provide our players with some real good sound bites in the press conferences.

[THEsocalledfan]

NO! to the spread. It would take away the Bison identity. Would be a huge mistake imho.

Anyone who wants the spread with the type of player that NDSU will always have is delusional; we will never have enough skill guys to run it, further, we would still likely be killed by a team that smashes you in the mouth.

Don't ever leave your strengths. I honestly think NDSU should run less "West Coast" and run more of the old Redskins style offense with two tight ends and one running back. You smash people in the mouth, and then take vertical shots. That was a great offense and what the Viking's basically ran in the 1990's.

[unbison]

Anyone who wants the spread with the type of player that NDSU will always have is delusional; we will never have enough skill guys to run it, further, we would still likely be killed by a team that smashes you in the mouth.

Don't ever leave your strengths. I honestly think NDSU should run less "West Coast" and run more of the old Redskins style offense with two tight ends and one running back. You smash people in the mouth, and then take vertical shots. That was a great offense and what the Viking's basically ran in the 1990's.
I agree .......... if they bring eight in the box......dj has to beat one guy if everyone blocks.....we know he can do this!

[semobison]

The reason we were 4-4 in conference this year was that teams crowded the box and basicly dared us to throw. When was the last time a team without some kind of passing game won a national championship? The trouble with our offense is we have no run-pass balance! In 06-07 we ran the same offense except with Walker, Heck and company we had more balance. If they crowded the box Walker would pick them apart and when they backed off we would run it down there throats. Balance, and keeping defenses guessing is the key to the west coast offense. Its easy to defend when you are as predictable as we have been the last few years!

[unbison]

You only have to keep them guessing if you can't execute or don't have the man power!

[56BISON73]

I agree .......... if they bring eight in the box......dj has to beat one guy if everyone blocks.....we know he can do this!

If they put 8 in the box use a playaction pass to freeze the D then the receivers only have 3 to beat.
So if you have two wideouts a TE and a back coming out of the back field thats 4 against three. I dont see why we cant execute this.

[semobison]

IMO in todays college football keeping a defense off balance is THE key to having success on offense. When was the last time a power running team has won a national championship in FCS or FBS?

[mgbison]

What kind of offense does Alabama run? They seem to pound the ball a lot. I don't follow them closely, but they seem to win games by running the ball and having an awesome defense.

[unbison]

I just think everyone worries about the opponent to much! If you can come out and execute your plays you play your game and make them worry about what your doing

[semobison]

Well, for 3 years we have lined up in the MVFC and said, ok, stop our running game, and they have! We are 10-14 since joining the conference, and have not had a winning season. We have always been power run team, but in 06-07, we had the ability to score quickly with our passing game. We ran a lot more play action on first down! We had more balance and were not predictable! The west coast offense depends on run-pass balance. Having some balance will only make our run game better! Bama was a power run first team, but they could go down the field through air when needed!

[ndsubison1]

What kind of offense does Alabama run? They seem to pound the ball a lot. I don't follow them closely, but they seem to win games by running the ball and having an awesome defense.

pro style.

[HerdBot]

Well, for 3 years we have lined up in the MVFC and said, ok, stop our running game, and they have! We are 10-14 since joining the conference, and have not had a winning season. We have always been power run team, but in 06-07, we had the ability to score quickly with our passing game. We ran a lot more play action on first down! We had more balance and were not predictable! The west coast offense depends on run-pass balance. Having some balance will only make our run game better! Bama was a power run first team, but they could go down the field through air when needed!

I think that came with the experience at the QB position. Steve Walker his Jr/Sr season could do a lot more than he could his Fr/So year. Brock was a freshman. Jose was a sophmore.

[unbison]

Semo.....this team does not execute consistEntly! Stupid penalties....missed blocking assignments ...equals poor execution

[unbison]

Well, for 3 years we have lined up in the MVFC and said, ok, stop our running game, and they have! We are 10-14 since joining the conference, and have not had a winning season. We have always been power run team, but in 06-07, we had the ability to score quickly with our passing game. We ran a lot more play action on first down! We had more balance and were not predictable! The west coast offense depends on run-pass balance. Having some balance will only make our run game better! Bama was a power run first team, but they could go down the field through air when needed!
This conversation started as I was agreeing with running some 2 tightend sets and smashing the ball in there as the redskins used to.......along with a vertical passing game! I am not saying we have controlled the conference and is why I was agreeing with a different offensive strategy....... Being able to throw the deep ball makes 8 in the box a very rare occurrence and when it does happen I was saying with execution dj has one guy to beat....done

[gizmo]

We can dream all we want about running high powered offenses but until we have the right kind of players it isn't going to happen. IMO, time after time when the Bison offense had opportunities to pull off big plays this year it was muffed by the players....bad QB decisions, dropped passes, missed blocks, penalties, etc. Obviously, if the players had done their jobs better in those key situations the Bison could have had 2 or 3 more wins and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I'm not saying I'm a big Vigen fan but at the end of the year somebody on the coaching staff realized that we could beat very good teams with a "vanilla" offense. IOW, they maximized the available talent.

[Facts]

We can dream all we want about running high powered offenses but until we have the right kind of players it isn't going to happen. IMO, time after time when the Bison offense had opportunities to pull off big plays this year it was muffed by the players....bad QB decisions, dropped passes, missed blocks, penalties, etc. Obviously, if the players had done their jobs better in those key situations the Bison could have had 2 or 3 more wins and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I'm not saying I'm a big Vigen fan but at the end of the year somebody on the coaching staff realized that we could beat very good teams with a "vanilla" offense. IOW, they maximized the available talent.

reps ten char

[Bison Dan]

We can dream all we want about running high powered offenses but until we have the right kind of players it isn't going to happen. IMO, time after time when the Bison offense had opportunities to pull off big plays this year it was muffed by the players....bad QB decisions, dropped passes, missed blocks, penalties, etc. Obviously, if the players had done their jobs better in those key situations the Bison could have had 2 or 3 more wins and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I'm not saying I'm a big Vigen fan but at the end of the year somebody on the coaching staff realized that we could beat very good teams with a "vanilla" offense. IOW, they maximized the available talent.

Until we start using the TE in our passing the safeties will support the run. Veldman is the poorest TE I've ever seen running pass patterns. If not for his height a slug could cover him. We need a better short passing game that is consistent. How many pass plays did we hit a reciever over the middle this year? We need to have it so when they cheat we make them pay.

[CAS4127]

We don't need to "change" our overall offensive scheme, we just need to add plays to it in the event they are not already in our playbook, and then have the "team" execute them properly, which includes coaches making the correct calls at the correct time and the players executing them. It really is that simple.

[THEsocalledfan]

We can dream all we want about running high powered offenses but until we have the right kind of players it isn't going to happen. IMO, time after time when the Bison offense had opportunities to pull off big plays this year it was muffed by the players....bad QB decisions, dropped passes, missed blocks, penalties, etc. Obviously, if the players had done their jobs better in those key situations the Bison could have had 2 or 3 more wins and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I'm not saying I'm a big Vigen fan but at the end of the year somebody on the coaching staff realized that we could beat very good teams with a "vanilla" offense. IOW, they maximized the available talent.

And who's fault is it that we don't have players who could do more than a vanilla offense? Why is this ignored? We could have had those 2-3 more wins with better players and been at home for a few games......

[99Bison]

The other funny part is that if we run an even more vanilla offense against EWU (ie. remove the qb backside junk) we win that game too...

[CAS4127]

The other funny part is that if we run an even more vanilla offense against EWU (ie. remove the qb backside junk) we win that game too...

But, as others have pointed out correctly, we can not do that and expect to be consistent winners in the MVFC. The three teams we played in the PO's just weren't as physical as us, and, resultantly, we were able to keep things fairly simple and still win. The last couple of years tell us that we can not expect to physically dominate MVFC teams. Just consider what happened at MSU at the end of the season, and they had one, if not the, poorest defensives in the MVFC, at least statistically speaking.

[A1pigskin]

Rocky is looking for a coaching job.

[aces1180]

Rocky is looking for a coaching job.

Isn't MSU-M? That would actually be a good hire for them.

[Swaghook]

Rocky is looking for a coaching job. He mentioned that he is looking for any coaching job so he doesn't have it set that he need be the HC. I think he would be a good hire for a lot of programs out there.

[99Bison]

But, as others have pointed out correctly, we can not do that and expect to be consistent winners in the MVFC. The three teams we played in the PO's just weren't as physical as us, and, resultantly, we were able to keep things fairly simple and still win. The last couple of years tell us that we can not expect to physically dominate MVFC teams. Just consider what happened at MSU at the end of the season, and they had one, if not the, poorest defensives in the MVFC, at least statistically speaking.

Agree'd 100%, my comment was to those that said there was improvement in play calling. Improvement in the given situation (in the playoffs) would have been to feed the horses straight up after you have wore them down.

[CAS4127]

Agree'd 100%, my comment was to those that said there was improvement in play calling. Improvement in the given situation (in the playoffs) would have been to feed the horses straight up after you have wore them down.

I agree with you on this, but I still can't talk about the EWU game, as I still get a sick feeling in my stomach. Plus it's New Years Eve.

[lakesbison]

We need a D1 OC, PERIOD

[BFKasper14]

How bout Steve Laqua?

[A1pigskin]

MSU-M would be good for Rocky. I think he likes the area and still has friends here.

[99Bison]

MSU-M would be good for Rocky. I think he likes the area and still has friends here.

Don't think he'd take that job, his quotes have all been programs need full support, etc, etc.

[DORMIE]

If you read the article in The Forum on Thursday on Rocky, it mentioned that he had spent this year evaluation the officials in the league that did our EWU game. Must have told them before they left for the game to make sure that they screwed us as he was canned here by Entsion. Kind of doubt it though. Some of you just need more amo. It did have to be the most one sided officiating of a playoff game that I have ever seen, however. Kind of seemed that they didn't want a physical team facing one of theirs in the tournament. Shouldn't be able to officiate a game in those circumstances.

[CAS4127]

If you read the article in The Forum on Thursday on Rocky, it mentioned that he had spent this year evaluation the officials in the league that did our EWU game. Must have told them before they left for the game to make sure that they screwed us as he was canned here by Entsion. Kind of doubt it though. Some of you just need more amo. It did have to be the most one sided officiating of a playoff game that I have ever seen, however. Kind of seemed that they didn't want a physical team facing one of theirs in the tournament. Shouldn't be able to officiate a game in those circumstances.

I am willing to bet my life savings and home that that^ did not happen. Rocky still loves NDSU Football.

[THEsocalledfan]

I am willing to bet my life savings and home that that^ did not happen. Rocky still loves NDSU Football.

Do you keep in contact with him? Do many of his former players?

[CAS4127]

Do you keep in contact with him? Do many of his former players?

Yes, we text and talk, and we were texting after the EWU loss--he was as depressed as I was I think.

[Kermit]

Rocky was at the Spring Game last year! He still had time to chat with random Bison fans like me.

[BadlandsBison]

How cool would that be if Rocky could get involved in NDSU sports again? Or is the answer pretty obvious?

[CivilBison96]

I had Rocky as a PE instructor for 1 semester and he really struck me as a genuine iindividual. I for one would be delighted to have him associated with Bison Football in any capacity again!!

[THEsocalledfan]

How cool would that be if Rocky could get involved in NDSU sports again? Or is the answer pretty obvious?

Considering the recent spat of legal problems for the Bison, and how Rocky ended up leaving the program, yes, the answer is obvious.

[THEsocalledfan]

Did anyone hear the Leslie Frazier press conference today?

To paraphrase, one of the best questions was if he plans to continue to run the West Coast offense.

He basically responded that while he likes that offensive philosophy, he feels it is more important to try to fit the offense to the skills of the personell he has in place......

That, my friends, has been the problem the last three years. How long did it take them to figure out that Mertens was actually a good running QB? Are going going to make the same mistake with Brock if he can't improve his timing/accuracy which are critical for West Coast? Or, are they just praying Thorton can figure it out? (No way Jose can run that offense effectively.....)

So, if Brock starts next year, why not adjust the philosophy a bit toward a Washington Redskins style of two tight ends, one back, and two receivers. Pound, Pound, Pound, and then strike down the field.. That clearly, at least to me, seem to fit what Brock is best at from what I have seen.

Why are we so "tied" to the classic West Coast? No imagination? Nothing could ever be better?

[99Bison]

Did anyone hear the Leslie Frazier press conference today?

To paraphrase, one of the best questions was if he plans to continue to run the West Coast offense.

He basically responded that while he likes that offensive philosophy, he feels it is more important to try to fit the offense to the skills of the personell he has in place......

That, my friends, has been the problem the last three years. How long did it take them to figure out that Mertens was actually a good running QB? Are going going to make the same mistake with Brock if he can't improve his timing/accuracy which are critical for West Coast? Or, are they just praying Thorton can figure it out? (No way Jose can run that offense effectively.....)

So, if Brock starts next year, why not adjust the philosophy a bit toward a Washington Redskins style of two tight ends, one back, and two receivers. Pound, Pound, Pound, and then strike down the field.. That clearly, at least to me, seem to fit what Brock is best at from what I have seen.

Why are we so "tied" to the classic West Coast? No imagination? Nothing could ever be better?

Um, we haven't been tied to classic west coast... Slant, TE, flat are staples of that classically, none of which we used this year.

[tjbison]

Um, we haven't been tied to classic west coast... Slant, TE, flat are staples of that classically, none of which we used this year.

One Slant won us a game I think that may have been the only time it was used

[coloradobison]

One Slant won us a game I think that may have been the only time it was used

If you are referring to the ISU Red game to Howard I think that was more of a slot streak/post than a slant. But to your point, I dont recall many slants.

[tjbison]

If you are referring to the ISU Red game to Howard I think that was more of a slot streak/post than a slant. But to your point, I dont recall many slants.

nope we lost to ISU-R, YSU, not 100% but thought it was a slant

[perthbison]

Did anyone hear the Leslie Frazier press conference today?

To paraphrase, one of the best questions was if he plans to continue to run the West Coast offense.

He basically responded that while he likes that offensive philosophy, he feels it is more important to try to fit the offense to the skills of the personell he has in place......

That, my friends, has been the problem the last three years. How long did it take them to figure out that Mertens was actually a good running QB? Are going going to make the same mistake with Brock if he can't improve his timing/accuracy which are critical for West Coast? Or, are they just praying Thorton can figure it out? (No way Jose can run that offense effectively.....)

So, if Brock starts next year, why not adjust the philosophy a bit toward a Washington Redskins style of two tight ends, one back, could ever be better?

This has been a oft made mistake at NDSU, not adjusting the style of play to the strengths of the players you have. You're right that Mertens may have been sucessful if he'd been used differently. :nod:

[Dabison]

nope we lost to ISU-R, YSU, not 100% but thought it was a slant

Seam Route...... Space out the field and run inside receivers up the hash. Let the QB pull you in the middle. Should've been tackled but the extra effort did it for him.

[SDbison]

This has been a oft made mistake at NDSU, not adjusting the style of play to the strengths of the players you have. You're right that Mertens may have been sucessful if he'd been used differently. :nod:
Keep on deluding yourselves........Mertens accuracy was crap and he wasn't that fast or quick to be a running QB in the college game.

[SDbison]

Vigen needs much improvement for next year.......if not his flaws to this point will become obvious and no playoffs next year. Then Bohl will need to hire someone else. The Defense made the playoffs possible in 2010. The offense is anemic.

[THEsocalledfan]

Keep on deluding yourselves........Mertens accuracy was crap and he wasn't that fast or quick to be a running QB in the college game.

SD, you are missing the point. The only thing Mertens did well was run thus they should have used it even more. Remember, they nearly beat SDSU running Mertens in Fargo. Not saying he was Michael Vick; more like Wade Wilson in his prime who was mobile enough to run for some first downs.

The point is the coaches too often are sticking square pegs in rounds holes.

[CAS4127]

SD, you are missing the point. The only thing Mertens did well was run thus they should have used it even more. Remember, they nearly beat SDSU running Mertens in Fargo. Not saying he was Michael Vick; more like Wade Wilson in his prime who was modbile enough to run for some first downs.

The point is the coaches too often are sticking square pegs in rounds holes.

Mertens is a prime example of why we need at least 3 QB's on the team at all times with all-star athletic resume`s, as some just are not as good as they are billed or look on paper or on the field against the HS competition they are playing. That's why I like that we are bringing in 2 this year, and have 1 on the team currently (Jensen) who could be good, and another (Esley) who appears to be good. We don't know enough about either yet, and we have Mohler as a fall-back.

[semobison]

Sure we had success with a pounding run game in the playoffs! We were not playing against MVFC defenses! Remember when we tried to pound it out against UNI early in the season. Negative rushing yards, sacked 11 times, mostly on 3rd and long! We tried the same crap in our last conference game against Missouri St. Look at those results! Sure we need to take shots down field, but we need more of a run-pass balance in our conference to be successful. A short and mid range passing game is a must. If we dare teams to stop our run game in the Valley, they do! Thats why we were a .500 team in conference!

[bisonmike2]

we are going to have 6 QB's on roster next year. Any chance we can run a multiple QB set? Maybe we could run a quad-lateral offensive scheme?

[coldspot]

we are going to have 6 QB's on roster next year. Any chance we can run a multiple QB set? Maybe we could run a quad-lateral offensive scheme?

or run the option

or would that make the playbook more than 8 plays? :hide:

[#1BISONFAN ASHLEY]

or run the option

or would that make the playbook more than 8 plays? :hide:

He's gotta change that playbook...bigtime...we need it to be more dynamic

[dryash83]

depth of plays grows when your QB is accurate and WR's can hang onto balls. I expect greater diversity of the playbook this coming season.

[LITTLEGUYSINGREEN]

we are going to have 6 QB's on roster next year. Any chance we can run a multiple QB set? Maybe we could run a quad-lateral offensive scheme?

And so far none have proven themselves.

[SDbison]

And so far none have proven themselves.
Vigen has not proven he is worth a shit.

[westnodak93bison]

Vigen has not proven he is worth a shit.

Come on SD tell us how you really feel!