First & Third Down Play Calling...Very Few Surprises

[CaBisonFan]

When the defense 'knows' that we're running up the gut on most first downs...then it's pretty easy to be in the backfield. Tyler Roehl's senior year was wasted, in part, because of this scenario. Happened in Brookings in '07 also. They knew exactly when & where he was coming. I say that the film of the SDSU game that year became very popular with opposing defensive coordinators. It was entitled...'How to Give the Bison 2 Downs vs. 3.'

Our offensive line needs work...but they've also been set up by the predictability of the play calling. We don't get into the heads of the opposing defense. They know what's coming. Until that changes...we can't evaluate our running backs or offensive line.

What I've seen is 2nd & long as a pattern. Another nauseating situation is 3rd & short. Defending us is easy. With a great back like PP it wasn't quite as simple...but minus that great back...well...

The teams that are winning the ball possession game are the ones that pass on running downs...and vice versa. Once the confusion is established...then you can run whatever the hell you want.

It's called putting the opposing D on their heels. We don't. Seems as though Brock Jensen understands the problem. I wouldn't even bother sending in a play for him. Maybe just tell him the trends that they're seeing in the booth. He seems to get 'it.'

Yup...I'm a fan. Didn't take long to see the savy that he has under pressure.

Message to Bohl: Play the kid. Give him the ball. Tell him to win.

[RunDMc34]

Yep might as well just like Brock call his own plays... He scored a couple of TD's vs Morgan St. lets not blow this out of proportion here!!

I hope you are right CA but nothing brock has done at any time i have seen him play has me feeling like he is a great qb yet.

[KTF]

According to Bohl on Bison feedback tonight, they aren't predictable, just working within the scheme of the players ability... I say BS... A different caller asked about why Mertens was never allowed to run the playbook they are right now as it would have suited him the best.

I honestly think the recruiting errors made in the past are finally catching up to Bohl. I don't see the team pulling out of it for a year or two. At that point they should dominate...

[CaBisonFan]

Yep might as well just like Brock call his own plays... He scored a couple of TD's vs Morgan St. lets not blow this out of proportion here!!

I hope you are right CA but nothing brock has done at any time i have seen him play has me feeling like he is a great qb yet.

It's an opinion. I realize that Morgan State wasn't as good as some of our upcoming opponents...but there was something new happening on the field after Brock got it going.

But also understand that we weren't doing much until he hit the field. He was calling some audibles that worked. It helped to change things up.

The plays from the OC make us predictable. That's the main point. When was the last time you saw the Bison create some real confusion for a defense?

[99Bison]

According to Bohl on Bison feedback tonight, they aren't predictable, just working within the scheme of the players ability... I say BS... A different caller asked about why Mertens was never allowed to run the playbook they are right now as it would have suited him the best.

I honestly think the recruiting errors made in the past are finally catching up to Bohl. I don't see the team pulling out of it for a year or two. At that point they should dominate...

"they aren't predictable, just working within the scheme of the players ability" - Really? How would anyone know since the last 2.3 years the players haven't had the opportunity to do anything beyond very safe plays in games or despiration time? From practice? With that attitude Steve Walker would even have played QB... Or recruiting was so horrible we had safety's playing qb apparently.

Agree with CA's original post too, the obvious play calling sets up the o/oline for failure.

[HerdBot]

When the defense 'knows' that we're running up the gut on most first downs...then it's pretty easy to be in the backfield. Tyler Roehl's senior year was wasted, in part, because of this scenario. Happened in Brookings in '07 also. They knew exactly when & where he was coming. I say that the film of the SDSU game that year became very popular with opposing defensive coordinators. It was entitled...'How to Give the Bison 2 Downs vs. 3.'

Our offensive line needs work...but they've also been set up by the predictability of the play calling. We don't get into the heads of the opposing defense. They know what's coming. Until that changes...we can't evaluate our running backs or offensive line.

What I've seen is 2nd & long as a pattern. Another nauseating situation is 3rd & short. Defending us is easy. With a great back like PP it wasn't quite as simple...but minus that great back...well...

The teams that are winning the ball possession game are the ones that pass on running downs...and vice versa. Once the confusion is established...then you can run whatever the hell you want.

It's called putting the opposing D on their heels. We don't. Seems as though Brock Jensen understands the problem. I wouldn't even bother sending in a play for him. Maybe just tell him the trends that they're seeing in the booth. He seems to get 'it.'

Yup...I'm a fan. Didn't take long to see the savy that he has under pressure.

Message to Bohl: Play the kid. Give him the ball. Tell him to win.

I think we can run on 1st down but we may need to try some different runs. What ever happened to the toss play we used to run Roehl on? Just a simple pitch to the right and he runs between the tackles. We used to run it all the time on first and we would get 4 yards a clip. Its disapeared. How about the bubble screen or a quick hitch just to keep them off balance. The bubble screen used to be our bread and butter. Yeah we ran it once last week but didnt run it again.I thought the west coast was supposed to kill a team with little 4 yard passes. Who cares if we only get 2 yards. Its the same as a bad run except it keeps the defense guessing. I can't figure out why we don't run more quick slants to get holloway running in the open field since he has some serious speed.

[westnodak93bison]

How about 4 wide as a change of pace or an 8 man front just for $hits and giggles.

[CaBisonFan]

I think we can run on 1st down but we may need to try some different runs. What ever happened to the toss play we used to run Roehl on? Just a simple pitch to the right and he runs between the tackles. We used to run it all the time on first and we would get 4 yards a clip. Its disapeared. How about the bubble screen or a quick hitch just to keep them off balance. The bubble screen used to be our bread and butter. Yeah we ran it once last week but didnt run it again.I thought the west coast was supposed to kill a team with little 4 yard passes. Who cares if we only get 2 yards. Its the same as a bad run except it keeps the defense guessing. I can't figure out why we don't run more quick slants to get holloway running in the open field since he has some serious speed.

Couldn't agree more.

[Dabison]

Since when has everyone become offensive coordinators? Jensen, Walker, Mohler and any qb in the system isn't going to make play calls unless shown when to audible. Yes, Walker lead the team down the field in 2 minute situations but it wasn't like he was drawing plays in the dirt. Coaches are going to set em up for good situations. Draw up any play on paper it should work. What it comes down to is execution.

I agree with Bohl. The staff works all day on this stuff and we spend a few hours discussing it on a message board. I'd put the play calling in their hands. Have a little faith.

Not throwing any stones yet.

[56BISON73]

Since when has everyone become offensive coordinators? Jensen, Walker, Mohler and any qb in the system isn't going to make play calls unless shown when to audible. Yes, Walker lead the team down the field in 2 minute situations but it wasn't like he was drawing plays in the dirt. Coaches are going to set em up for good situations. Draw up any play on paper it should work. What it comes down to is execution.

I agree with Bohl. The staff works all day on this stuff and we spend a few hours discussing it on a message board. I'd put the play calling in their hands. Have a little faith.

Not throwing any stones yet.

You are correct. EVERY play will work if its executed correctly. Even if the opposing team knows what the play will be.

[bisonranch]

I wonder what the coaches think when they read this stuff. Wonder if it's

Great idea, why didn't I think of that?!

or

$&%@*# idiots, if you're so smart why don't you try it

Either way, doesn't change the fact that play calling has been predictable for a long time.

[CaBisonFan]

I wonder what the coaches think when they read this stuff. Wonder if it's

Great idea, why didn't I think of that?!

or

$&%@*# idiots, if you're so smart why don't you try it

Either way, doesn't change the fact that play calling has been predictable for a long time.

I'd bet on #2......:D

Or maybe #3...meaning, ignore bisonville. Good one...:nod:

[HerdBot]

You are correct. EVERY play will work if its executed correctly. Even if the opposing team knows what the play will be.

Execution helps but there is still a chess match going on. If its 1st and 10 and the defense guesses run and brings more players to the line of scrimmage than the defense they will stop them every time.

[56BISON73]

Execution helps but there is still a chess match going on. If its 1st and 10 and the defense guesses run and brings more players to the line of scrimmage than the defense they will stop them every time.

Execution helps? Execution is the number one priority. If you execute properly they cannot stop you. Period.

[SDbison]

Yep might as well just like Brock call his own plays... He scored a couple of TD's vs Morgan St. lets not blow this out of proportion here!!

I hope you are right CA but nothing brock has done at any time i have seen him play has me feeling like he is a great qb yet.
Brock doesn't have to be great QB at this time, just better than Jose. Don't worry, Brock will become a great Bison quarterback in time. Heck, he hasn't even played an entire game yet and has 3 TD passes. Future's so bright, I'm wearin sunglasses! :D

[HerdBot]

Execution helps? Execution is the number one priority. If you execute properly they cannot stop you. Period.
The same argument can be made for the defense. If they execute perfectly they can stop them every time. And unless the qb is in on the running play the defense has 1 more player involved in the play.advantage defense.

[56BISON73]

The same argument can be made for the defense. If they execute perfectly they can stop them every time. And unless the qb is in on the running play the defense has 1 more player involved in the play.advantage defense.

Then you tell me why when we would tell there D where the play was coming and they couldnt stop us.

[HerdBot]

Then you tell me why when we would tell there D where the play was coming and they couldnt stop us.

Because the defense didn't execute... im just f-ing with ya!

[CaBisonFan]

Execution helps? Execution is the number one priority. If you execute properly they cannot stop you. Period.

You have a point. But perfection seems a bit down the road. A great team does what it wants...when it wants...and how it wants. But I also know exactly what you're saying.

How's the fishing been this year?

[CaBisonFan]

Seems like we've entered an age where the design of an offense supercedes the fundamentals. Get an amazing athlete at QB and let it fly.

[56BISON73]

You have a point. But perfection seems a bit down the road. A great team does what it wants...when it wants...and how it wants. But I also know exactly what you're saying.

How's the fishing been this year?

Didnt get out till June because of the hip replacement. So it was alittle slower than what Iam used to. But did catch a bunch and had a good time.

[56BISON73]

Because the defense didn't execute... im just f-ing with ya!

You got me.:D Drat!!!!

[TransAmBison]

Since when has everyone become offensive coordinators? Jensen, Walker, Mohler and any qb in the system isn't going to make play calls unless shown when to audible. Yes, Walker lead the team down the field in 2 minute situations but it wasn't like he was drawing plays in the dirt. Coaches are going to set em up for good situations. Draw up any play on paper it should work. What it comes down to is execution.

I agree with Bohl. The staff works all day on this stuff and we spend a few hours discussing it on a message board. I'd put the play calling in their hands. Have a little faith.

Not throwing any stones yet.
I believe there was a game that happened...twice in a row...to the tune of a last second victory.

And also, you mentioned a dirty word...audible. Oh no, now I said it! Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dabison]

I believe there was a game that happened...twice in a row...to the tune of a last second victory.

And also, you mentioned a dirty word...audible. Oh no, now I said it! Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you're talking about SHSU game what drive was amazing and it takes a special group and special QB to pull those victories off. The last TD to win was the same as the previous play. The play before was the same but Walker under threw Wurz down the middle. Ran it again and the Safety stayed over the top and Heckendorf ran an adjustment route.

Great game! Hope that's the one you mean.

[thundarsdaddy]

I have to agree in theory with the predictability of the offense. Not just this year, but in years past also.
Now this isnt restricted to the Bison Offense, as it seems to have taken over football in general!!
In an age where teams have literally hundreds of plays to call, most coach's seem to limit themselves to just a few, and then they become predictable!!
I live in Rugby, NoDak, so when we watch a Bison team on offense, we naturally focus in to see if #80 is in the game and what he does!!
Reed Duchscher plays at a receiver position, and gets into the games once in a while.
Some games he plays more than others.
As a receiver, he almost always lines up as a wide-out.
Yet, both last year, and again this year, whenever Reed comes into the game, its on a running play, usually run to HIS side of the field!
We notice this!
But I cant help but think that the other teams will notice this also!!
Especially when they get game film and have the chance to go over and over this film when preparing for a Bison Game??
What kind of tendencies do other teams see in the Bison offense, and play calling that WE dont see?
After all..these people get PAID a great deal of $$$ to gain this possible advantage!
And I will agree that these tendencies also existed several years ago, as was pointed out with Tyler Roehl??

Everyone knows that defenses can KEY on a certain player...but when it seems the defense knows exactly how to defend the Bison, it really makes you wonder!!!

[bisontwice]

In case anyone wonders or cares....Back in the day with Steffes, Roehl, etc. we ran 40 power about 30 percent of the plays it was just run out of a different formation. The play and the scheme was the same as now just the execution was different.
If anyone really has the time why don't you look at the tape and do a real breakdown. I know the coaches scout themselves as well as the other team looking for trends and tells.

[steelbison]

Agree about the predictability, but I think once we get the o-line working together as a unit we will become an entirely different offense.


I also believe with Jensen at QB the field will open up a lot more.

Talk to me three games down the road. If were still looking like the past three games we will have a problem.

I'm hoping with time we will come together.

[Dabison]

In case anyone wonders or cares....Back in the day with Steffes, Roehl, etc. we ran 40 power about 30 percent of the plays it was just run out of a different formation. The play and the scheme was the same as now just the execution was different.
If anyone really has the time why don't you look at the tape and do a real breakdown. I know the coaches scout themselves as well as the other team looking for trends and tells.

This is very true! When Perles was calling run plays his script was probably 10 plays long. Those teams fit the play calls. I remember teams pointing out the hole and we'd still run over them.