Recruiting Wrong Kind of Quarterbacks

[CaBisonFan]

We're recruiting the wrong quarterbacks. Wrong kind of athletes. We're going after the second-tier pocket quarterbacks (or 3rd)...and we're doing it against about 100 other programs in the north-central region at different levels...including places like Michigan...as in the state of Michigan. Westendorp is one example. Appeared to be an outstanding prospect...but when given a chance...he stayed closer to home, and to play for a throwing program. Simple

FBS programs would like them to walk on...or give them a partial scholarship...if they're demanding a chance at QB. Area FCS programs are going after them hard. Also includes some DII programs that are good. We're leveling the playing field for our competitors.

We should be recruiting FBS caliber athletes who are non-traditional quarterbacks. Forget the tall lanky dudes that can throw a missile. Or at least, don't focus 100 percent on that kid.

Find the FBS caliber athlete who played QB in high school...but is being recruited to play defense by bigger programs. Offer the kid a chance to play QB at NDSU.

Run whatever offense fits the talent. If it's a running, option type offense...then go with it. An outstanding athlete can develop their passing game also.

Find gamers with brains. Don't go after just the prototypical QB. That...is what is going on. SDSU has developed the perception that they are a throwing program. We win most of the recruiting wars at other positions. Use our athleticism and get on with it. Nick Mertens showed flashes of ability when we went 'away' from the traditional throw-first...run-second offense. When he rolled out and was told to look for the run...the defenses had to change their scheme. He threw well out of an option-style play. The 'D' would cheat up on the run...and there it was...a wide open receiver. Nick threw better from that type of play also. The first half against SDSU is the evidence. What we have in Nick Mertens is a non-traditional QB. He's an athlete who happens to play quarterback. Steve Walker types are very, very hard to find. Even the top prototype QB's are a crap shoot. Landing two or three outstanding 'athletes' that played QB in high school is 'not' a crap shoot.

We're known (still) as a running offense...and we're trying to lure throwers into a running program. It'd be like Nebraska going after the top QB in Florida to come up and throw in the snow. Typically...it ain't gonna happen. They're still viewed as a running program. Their reputation precedes them. Doesn't matter what they tell kids.

Rocket science...this is...NOT.

[Hippy Stick]

Like, dude, you're a know-it-all, pompous college coach wannabe with, like, an overinflated sense of, like, self-importance, man.


Just thought I'd, like, point that out, in case, like, no one ever did, like. Sorry, dude, but The Stick calls 'em like he, like, sees 'em.

Other than that, dude, can't wait to meet you at the UNI game, man!



:D :D :D :D

[EagleBison]

We're recruiting the wrong quarterbacks. Wrong kind of athletes. We're going after the second-tier pocket quarterbacks (or 3rd)...and we're doing it against about 100 other programs in the north-central region at different levels...including places like Michigan...as in the state of Michigan. Westendorp is one example. Appeared to be an outstanding prospect...but when given a chance...he stayed closer to home, and to play for a throwing program. Simple

FBS programs would like them to walk on...or give them a partial scholarship...if they're demanding a chance at QB. Area FCS programs are going after them hard. Also includes some DII programs that are good. We're leveling the playing field for our competitors.

We should be recruiting FBS caliber athletes who are non-traditional quarterbacks. Forget the tall lanky dudes that can throw a missile. Or at least, don't focus 100 percent on that kid.

Find the FBS caliber athlete who played QB in high school...but is being recruited to play defense by bigger programs. Offer the kid a chance to play QB at NDSU.

Run whatever offense fits the talent. If it's a running, option type offense...then go with it. An outstanding athlete can develop their passing game also.

Find gamers with brains. Don't go after just the prototypical QB. That...is what is going on. SDSU has developed the perception that they are a throwing program. We win most of the recruiting wars at other positions. Use our athleticism and get on with it. Nick Mertens showed flashes of ability when we went 'away' from the traditional throw-first...run-second offense. When he rolled out and was told to look for the run...the defenses had to change their scheme. He threw well out of an option-style play. The 'D' would cheat up on the run...and there it was...a wide open receiver. Nick threw better from that type of play also. The first half against SDSU is the evidence. What we have in Nick Mertens is a non-traditional QB. He's an athlete who happens to play quarterback. Steve Walker types are very, very hard to find. Even the top prototype QB's are a crap shoot. Landing two or three outstanding 'athletes' that played QB in high school is 'not' a crap shoot.

We're known (still) as a running offense...and we're trying to lure throwers into a running program. It'd be like Nebraska going after the top QB in Florida to come up and throw in the snow. Typically...it ain't gonna happen. They're still viewed as a running program. Their reputation precedes them. Doesn't matter what they tell kids.

Rocket science...this is...NOT.

How about an offensive Juggernaut out of Illinois, maybe by the name of Walker. :p

[Hippy Stick]

. SDSU has developed the perception that they are a throwing program. We win most of the recruiting wars at other positions. .


Yet, lose all the time you play them, like.

[silkamilkamonico]

Run whatever offense fits the talent. If it's a running, option type offense...then go with it. An outstanding athlete can develop their passing game also.

IMHO, that is absolutely the wrong way to go about it.

You're right, it isn't rocket science, but you're mistaken if you think kids can just play a system and forget the cerebral aspects of it. It takes time to integrate a system. It takes certain kinds of players to make certain systems be effective. You start running offenses that fit the talent, you're almost certain to get very good individual players that don't fit up to the talent of the system you're running.

We don't have offensive linemen that can block in a spread offense. We have the kind of OL that want to be physical at the point of attack. You put a spread QB in our west coast offense, is he going to be able to make the quick drop back reads he needs to make, when he's used to letting a play develop and then making a decision?

IMHO you need to recruit guys that fit your system. I just wish NDSU would implement more of a spread offense instead of our west coast. It can be a lot more QB friendly.

[westnodak93bison]

100% wrong IMHO. We dont need the athletic QB. We need a savvy pocket passer that is a leader and can manage the game. Our power running/west coast offense is fine. We need an accurate QB that is smart.
He doesnt need to throw the ball 80yds either.

[rutlandbison]

We need.....http://www.freewebs.com/cregan32/Warren%20Moon.jpg

[bisonmike2]

We need.....http://www.freewebs.com/cregan32/Warren%20Moon.jpg

According to GodBlessDaBison, we're not ready for him.:confused:

[rutlandbison]

According to GodBlessDaBison, we're not ready for him.:confused:
O yes we are!!!

[ndsubison1]

you recruit talent that will fit your system, not the other way around...

[westnodak93bison]

hell yeah, I'd take the next Warren Moon anyday. Minus the domestic abuse issues of course :D

[bisonmike2]

hell yeah, I'd take the next Warren Moon anyday. Minus the domestic abuse issues of course :D

got to keep the pimp, er, I mean throwing hand strong.:hide:

[SDbison]

Give me a break.......with the facilities, coaches fans and tradition at NDSU we should get as good of QB's that are going to the bottom 20% of teams in FBS. Should be no need to go searching for a 5-10 QB that can run when he can't see the receiver downfield.

[BisoninNWMN]

Bison shouldn't have any problem recruiting a QB......we play in a dome.....potential recruits should love that.....no wind.

Recruit for your system.

[Bisonguy]

Bison shouldn't have any problem recruiting a QB......we play in a dome.....potential recruits should love that.....no wind.

Recruit for your system.

Yeah, kickers too. :hide:

[CaBisonFan]

100% wrong IMHO. We dont need the athletic QB. We need a savvy pocket passer that is a leader and can manage the game. Our power running/west coast offense is fine. We need an accurate QB that is smart.
He doesnt need to throw the ball 80yds either.

If that is so...then tell me who they are. Who's on our roster that fits your description?

[CaBisonFan]

Give me a break.......with the facilities, coaches fans and tradition at NDSU we should get as good of QB's that are going to the bottom 20% of teams in FBS. Should be no need to go searching for a 5-10 QB that can run when he can't see the receiver downfield.

Who said 5-10 ?

Isn't that what Jose Mohler was? How tall was Steve Walker? I am about 6-2...and when I visited with him before the WIU game last fall I was looking down at him. 6 ft. at the very most...and that would be a stretch.

Give me a break. Where are the QB's that you are describing?

[CaBisonFan]

Like, dude, you're a know-it-all, pompous college coach wannabe with, like, an overinflated sense of, like, self-importance, man. Just thought I'd, like, point that out, in case, like, no one ever did, like. Sorry, dude, but The Stick calls 'em like he, like, sees 'em. Other than that, dude, can't wait to meet you at the UNI game, man!

One of the mods says you're a nice guy, and that you don't use drugs. I'll take his word for it.

:cool:

[CaBisonFan]

How about an offensive Juggernaut out of Illinois, maybe by the name of Walker. :p

We'd all take another 'Walker.' :nod:

[BisoninHuskerland]

Wierd how possibly missing the playoff by 2 minutes into the last season changes how people feel about the team. I am tired how all of a sudden we can't recruit. Quarterbacks can improve in their final year and I expect Mertens to do well his last year. What mistakes did we make on signing Mertens. You can only look at what he did in HS. He is a stand up guy and has a strong arm. We are a west coast offense and all aspects of offense needs to work. We need to see how our guys work with the new coaches and timing for the new core of receivers.

Are the team getting good practice time with the weather. I look forward to possibly coming up to see the team at the Spring game. I was just at the Nebraska game and there were 77k and I would love to see a great turnout there to support our team.

[unbison]

we can not compare are facilities to fbs... we have a stadium that seats 20,000.... I think that we have qb's that are as good as SD states..... but for cripes sakes... why do we love the coach so much... dont get it.... coordinators fault... qb's fault.... o lines fault....blah bs IMO.... coachs fault!!!!!!!!

[CaBisonFan]

Wierd how possibly missing the playoff by 2 minutes into the last season changes how people feel about the team. I am tired how all of a sudden we can't recruit. Quarterbacks can improve in their final year and I expect Mertens to do well his last year. What mistakes did we make on signing Mertens. You can only look at what he did in HS. He is a stand up guy and has a strong arm. We are a west coast offense and all aspects of offense needs to work. We need to see how our guys work with the new coaches and timing for the new core of receivers.

Are the team getting good practice time with the weather. I look forward to possibly coming up to see the team at the Spring game. I was just at the Nebraska game and there were 77k and I would love to see a great turnout there to support our team.

I think that Nick has talent. Just hasn't been used right. If Brent Vigen figures it out...the sky is the limit.

[BisonNeil]

Wierd how possibly missing the playoff by 2 minutes into the last season changes how people feel about the team. I am tired how all of a sudden we can't recruit.

Missing the playoffs by two minutes? Seriously? Patti made it clear that 7-4 wouldn't have cut it, and history is on her side with only 4, 7-4 teams having made the playoffs since IAA went to the 16 game format. So, I think you are completely off base here. Your thinking that the Bison were playoff bound at 7-4 is nothing more than a Hippy Stick pipe dream.

But back to the most important comment you made. Tell me what evidence there is that Bohl can recruit a DI QB at NDSU? Parsons? Brekke? Mertens? TJack? None of them can be regarded as a legit DI QB, none have performed to that level. When you add to that the fact that Bohl signed NO QB in 06 & 07, the evidence continues to build that the guy can't recruit QBs.

We don't know yet about Mohler or Jenson because they haven't hit the field, but I have said it many times before there is no evidence to date that Bohl can successfully recruit, sign and develop DI QBs. NONE!

[HerdBot]

We're recruiting the wrong quarterbacks. Wrong kind of athletes. We're going after the second-tier pocket quarterbacks (or 3rd)...and we're doing it against about 100 other programs in the north-central region at different levels...including places like Michigan...as in the state of Michigan. Westendorp is one example. Appeared to be an outstanding prospect...but when given a chance...he stayed closer to home, and to play for a throwing program. Simple

FBS programs would like them to walk on...or give them a partial scholarship...if they're demanding a chance at QB. Area FCS programs are going after them hard. Also includes some DII programs that are good. We're leveling the playing field for our competitors.

We should be recruiting FBS caliber athletes who are non-traditional quarterbacks. Forget the tall lanky dudes that can throw a missile. Or at least, don't focus 100 percent on that kid.

Find the FBS caliber athlete who played QB in high school...but is being recruited to play defense by bigger programs. Offer the kid a chance to play QB at NDSU.

Run whatever offense fits the talent. If it's a running, option type offense...then go with it. An outstanding athlete can develop their passing game also.

Find gamers with brains. Don't go after just the prototypical QB. That...is what is going on. SDSU has developed the perception that they are a throwing program. We win most of the recruiting wars at other positions. Use our athleticism and get on with it. Nick Mertens showed flashes of ability when we went 'away' from the traditional throw-first...run-second offense. When he rolled out and was told to look for the run...the defenses had to change their scheme. He threw well out of an option-style play. The 'D' would cheat up on the run...and there it was...a wide open receiver. Nick threw better from that type of play also. The first half against SDSU is the evidence. What we have in Nick Mertens is a non-traditional QB. He's an athlete who happens to play quarterback. Steve Walker types are very, very hard to find. Even the top prototype QB's are a crap shoot. Landing two or three outstanding 'athletes' that played QB in high school is 'not' a crap shoot.

We're known (still) as a running offense...and we're trying to lure throwers into a running program. It'd be like Nebraska going after the top QB in Florida to come up and throw in the snow. Typically...it ain't gonna happen. They're still viewed as a running program. Their reputation precedes them. Doesn't matter what they tell kids.

Rocket science...this is...NOT.


Good post but I respectfully disagree.

It sounds to me that you want us to build the offense around the QB. Bohl seems to build the offense around the team and select a QB that fits it.

The West Coast is tailored to our personel. We have

A) A big pounding offense line that run blocks better than pass blocks
B) We have physical running backs and good pass catchers.
C) We have "west coast" style receivers who do a better job at running short routes. This team does not have a burner.
D) Plenty of depth at the TE and FB position

The West Coast offense is perfect for a team that doesn't have elite pass protection because the QB typically does 3 step drops and gets rid of the ball quickly and those short slant passes will go for big yards, a la Jerry Rice. It takes advantage of the tight ends (we're loaded) and posession recievers who can catch short passes. It also utilizes swing and quick passes to running backs, another area that we're loaded.

I don't think we can argue with the results. This team has been ranked every year since Bohl came along, beat Montana as a D2 team, beat 3 FBS teams, and have been ranked #1 many times. Even last year, our 6-5 record could have easily been 8-3, 9-2, or even 9-1. It took a ballsy 2 point conversion for SDSU to beat us and we lost to Wyoming on a last second field goal. Overall, we lost 4 games by 16 points.

Statistically, we're right there with the rest of the teams in the Missouri Valley and we were only a few hundred yards behind Southern Illinois.

PASSING YARDS
SDSU - 3212
UNI - 2621
SIU - 2241
YSU - 2045
NDSU - 2028
MISSOURI STATE - 2012
ILLINOIS ST - 1894
W ILLINOIS - 1496
INDIANA STATE - 881

We lead the MVC in rushing yards per attempt at 5.4 so we're good at running the ball.

Although here is something that jumps out at me. Our passing attempts are near the bottom but our yards per catch is huge! It looks like we lull the defense to sleep and hit them with a big play more often than other team.

ATTEMPTS / YPC
SDSU - 415 - 7.7
SIU - 348 - 6.4
MSU - 323 - 6.2
UNI - 318 - 8.2
YSU - 308 / 6.6
ILLINOIS ST - 304 -6.2
NDSU - 264 - 13.1
IND - 242 - 3.6
WIU - 225 - 6.6

If you want to make the argument that we should recruit faster players and pass more than I'm all for it because we play on a fast surface in a dome and it's a great way to take advantage of speed and weather conditions. But I'm not sold that we're not recruiting the right kind of QB's.

I think we need to change things up a little but not do an overhaul. Mertens can be a great runner if he's given the chance. But we need a backup in case he gets hurt! :)

[A1pigskin]

We need to recruit for the system. You don't want to be reinventing every year.

[BisoninHuskerland]

IN REGARDS TO MAKING THE PLAYOFFS- I SAID POSSIBLY- NOT THAT WE WOULD AND WE WERE NOT FAR FROM CONSIDERATION. IN REGARDS TO THE ARGUMENT ON THE TYPE OF QUARTERBACK- COACHES DRAFT FOR MANY INTANGIBLES. YOU BROUGHT UP PARSONS FOR EXAMPLE. THE DESCRIPTION OF HIS BACKGROUND FROM SCHOOL WAS AS FOLLOWING 2004 SEASON (REDSHIRT): ... HIGH SCHOOL: All-conference, all-metro, all-KARE 11 and second team all-state for Blaine High School and coach Shannon Gerrety ... Team went 10-1 and reached the state quarterfinals ... Conference offensive MVP ... Ran for 760 yards and 14 TDs and passed for 1,033 yards and nine scores ... Recorded a 60 percent completion ratio ... Two-time all-state performer in the 300 hurdles ...Three-time conference champ in the 110 high hurdles, two-time in the 300 hurdles ... All-conference in the long jump twice ... I SAY HIS UPSIDE WAS VERY GOOD WHEN THE BISON LOOKED AT HIM- FAST AND ACCURATE. I THINK THAT SOME PROBLEMS WERE HIS INJURIES. THE POINT I AM MAKING IS THAT YOU MAY BE RIGHT- WE MAY NOT HAVE RECRUITED THE RIGHT TALENT; HOWEVER, IT COULD BE THAT WE HAVE NOT DEVELOPED THEM, OTHER FACTORS. I DID NOT SEE A STRONG LINE PLAY. I WATCHED AT TIMES WE WOULD HAVE FOUR GUYS BLOCKING THEIR THREE AND THEY FOUND TIMES TO GET TO OUR QB. OUR RECEIVING CORE LAST YEAR WERE SLOW AND DID NOT FIND SEPARATION. OUR RUNNING GAME WAS INCONSISTENT. BREKKE- WHY DID HE NOT TURN OUT, WE WOULD NEVER KNOW SINCE HE LEFT FOR A CHANCE TO PLAY---- WHICH HAPPENS TO ALL TEAMS. LOSING PLAYERS, FIND ONE SCHOOL THAT DOESN'T HAVE THIS ISSUE. IN REGARDS TO MOLER- JUST BECAUSE A PLAYER IS STUPID DOES NOT MEAN HE CAN'T PLAY FOOTBALL (IF WE ARE JUDGING WHAT THEY DID ON THE FIELD). UNI GRAY- DRUG POSSESION DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE NOT CHOSE HIM?

MANY SCHOOLS BRING A LOT OF QBS IN AND I AGREE WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN FOCUSING ON BRINGING IN NEW BLOOD.

I THINK I GET TIRED OF ALL THE NEGATIVE TALK. THIS IS A NEW YEAR AND LETS SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT.

[rutlandbison]

Can I just say something? We have had one bad season with Bohl. To go through a transition that way..... We could not have asked for more. Last year we were praising Taylor, Bohl, Chapman and all the others. Now we have a 6-5 and now the wheels are falling off? Who are we the Yankees? Fire Torre for not making the playoffs one out 10 years or something like that. I say we wait and see what happens. I know things haven't been going so well here lately but lets cool down here. I know we want to win, but lets no go nuts about this.

[rutlandbison]

IN REGARDS TO MAKING THE PLAYOFFS- I SAID POSSIBLY- NOT THAT WE WOULD AND WE WERE NOT FAR FROM CONSIDERATION. IN REGARDS TO THE ARGUMENT ON THE TYPE OF QUARTERBACK- COACHES DRAFT FOR MANY INTANGIBLES. YOU BROUGHT UP PARSONS FOR EXAMPLE. THE DESCRIPTION OF HIS BACKGROUND FROM SCHOOL WAS AS FOLLOWING 2004 SEASON (REDSHIRT): ... HIGH SCHOOL: All-conference, all-metro, all-KARE 11 and second team all-state for Blaine High School and coach Shannon Gerrety ... Team went 10-1 and reached the state quarterfinals ... Conference offensive MVP ... Ran for 760 yards and 14 TDs and passed for 1,033 yards and nine scores ... Recorded a 60 percent completion ratio ... Two-time all-state performer in the 300 hurdles ...Three-time conference champ in the 110 high hurdles, two-time in the 300 hurdles ... All-conference in the long jump twice ... I SAY HIS UPSIDE WAS VERY GOOD WHEN THE BISON LOOKED AT HIM- FAST AND ACCURATE. I THINK THAT SOME PROBLEMS WERE HIS INJURIES. THE POINT I AM MAKING IS THAT YOU MAY BE RIGHT- WE MAY NOT HAVE RECRUITED THE RIGHT TALENT; HOWEVER, IT COULD BE THAT WE HAVE NOT DEVELOPED THEM, OTHER FACTORS. I DID NOT SEE A STRONG LINE PLAY. I WATCHED AT TIMES WE WOULD HAVE FOUR GUYS BLOCKING THEIR THREE AND THEY FOUND TIMES TO GET TO OUR QB. OUR RECEIVING CORE LAST YEAR WERE SLOW AND DID NOT FIND SEPARATION. OUR RUNNING GAME WAS INCONSISTENT. BREKKE- WHY DID HE NOT TURN OUT, WE WOULD NEVER KNOW SINCE HE LEFT FOR A CHANCE TO PLAY---- WHICH HAPPENS TO ALL TEAMS. LOSING PLAYERS, FIND ONE SCHOOL THAT DOESN'T HAVE THIS ISSUE. IN REGARDS TO MOLER- JUST BECAUSE A PLAYER IS STUPID DOES NOT MEAN HE CAN'T PLAY FOOTBALL (IF WE ARE JUDGING WHAT THEY DID ON THE FIELD). UNI GRAY- DRUG POSSESION DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE NOT CHOSE HIM?

MANY SCHOOLS BRING A LOT OF QBS IN AND I AGREE WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN FOCUSING ON BRINGING IN NEW BLOOD.

I THINK I GET TIRED OF ALL THE NEGATIVE TALK. THIS IS A NEW YEAR AND LETS SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT.
Hey, I think you left the caps lock key on.

[TransAmBison]

Can I just say something? We have had one bad season with Bohl. To go through a transition that way..... We could not have asked for more. Last year we were praising Taylor, Bohl, Chapman and all the others. Now we have a 6-5 and now the wheels are falling off? Who are we the Yankees? Fire Torre for not making the playoffs one out 10 years or something like that. I say we wait and see what happens. I know things haven't been going so well here lately but lets cool down here.
Some of the problems were not complained about just this year. Bisonneil has been talking about the qb potential issues for years. (I'll give credit where it is due) People are nervous because there are serious issues right now. These things don't just work themselves out. We had the qb issues last year because of a lack of planning. It is an issue.