Ndsu Hockey Article!!!

[lakesbison]

http://ushockeymagazine.net/story.php?left_nav=0812&article=hockey-ND-2ndteam-0812&right_nav=normal

"Well, you never know,” he said, admitting to talking hockey with NDSU higher-ups in the past and pitching the idea that a Div. I program could be up and running within five years.



LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[roadwarrior]

The laugh of the day, maybe month, maybe year!!!!

[sambini]

The laugh of the day, maybe month, maybe year!!!!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[GOB1SON]

Must have been a slow day at the ol' USA Hockey office.

[Bisonguy]

Chea, I also head NDSU was going to have a DI downhill ski team in less than five years. They were going to use the mountain down by Bluemont Lakes....


Maybe they meant that there will be a hockey arena in town without a major tenant in less than five years?

[lakesbison]

its getting legs.. my bro at U of Minn just asked me about it!

GO NDSU HOCKEY!

Dean Blais baby!!

[Bison"FANatic"]

You may think it is getting legs but it doesn't have the funding and won't have the funding. I am sure one of your solid sources we hear so much about said it was a done deal.;) :smh: :smh: :smh:

[roadwarrior]

I can't seem to find that dead horse!

It must be buried under the snow somewhere :banghead:

[Bison"FANatic"]

You can't find it because it has been dead so long that the coyotes all ready hauled all the remains away.

[roadwarrior]

You can't find it because it has been dead so long that the coyotes all ready hauled all the remains away.

Are you saying that the University of South Dakota is adding hockey ??

[Civil06]

Are you saying that the University of South Dakota is adding hockey ??

My bro asked me about USD hockey. It's a done deal. :D

/Sorry Lakes, this was wide open.

[lakesbison]

now you guys are being down right mean to me.. *sniff sniff*

[Bison"FANatic"]

Yep done deal Road USD already has the invite into the WCHA and a free pass to the frozen 5 for the first 4 years. That is what the spirit who visited me in the last 5 minutes informed me and you know that must make it true.

[roadwarrior]

now you guys are being down right mean to me.. *sniff sniff*

As long as you come up with these "AREN'T GOING TO HAPPEN" topics, you keep inviting us to reply as we do.:D

[AKBison]

Got your back Lakes, Hockey at NDSU would be awesome! That is after we get the new arena at the dome, a dome expansion for football, a new softball stadium, two football field width indoor practice facility and the BSA up to snuff. Did I miss anything? If all of the above was done and we were fully funded I would love NDSU hockey. Its great to see an article on it though to keep the flame lit on that back burner way in the back.

[d3boys]

I am with you lakes on this one
every time this subject comes up, all you hockey haters sound just like sioux fans
very entertaining

[heckler]

just can't say Title 10 enough...

[lakesbison]

thanks for the support

"rowing on the red river!"

[duluthbison]

What do you guys think about hockey at NDSU with the Urban Plains Center now open. We already have a great 5,000+ seat arena that just opened which would be a great home for NDSU Hockey.

After a couple of years of playing at the UPC building a good team then maybe NDSU could push the hockey arena idea to the town and maybe this time it would pass.


As I recall back in 2000, NDSU wanted an arena before the team, but now we have an arena and I think this idea could work:nod:

[d3boys]

What do you guys think about hockey at NDSU with the Urban Plains Center now open. We already have a great 5,000+ seat arena that just opened which would be a great home for NDSU Hockey.

After a couple of years of playing at the UPC building a good team then maybe NDSU could push the hockey arena idea to the town and maybe this time it would pass.


As I recall back in 2000, NDSU wanted an arena before the team, but now we have an arena and I think this idea could work:nod:

just waiting

[coldspot]

has all this talk been about adding mens AND womens hockey, or just mens? would we have to add womens hockey to meet title IX or could we add womens swimming/diving instead?


(disclaimer: i dont really know anything regarding title IX and its requirments, sorry for my lack of intelligence)

[duluthbison]

If they added mens hockey, they would also have to add womens hockey to meet regulations

[coldspot]

Men's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendance.php

Women's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendancew.php

the men's wcha teams average roughly 6700 a game with an average of 85.1% capacity.
the women's wcha teams average roughley 650 a game with an average of 15.6% capacity.

based off of that math, an ndsu men's team would average about 4255 a game and a women's team would average 780 at the upc. is that enough for a womens game to make it beneficial from a financial standpoint?

i know the typical view of women's hockey is that its a money pit that has to stick around in order for the men's team to exist. but 780 a game is more than what most of the high school hockey games draw at the upc and they seem to be doing fine (cant say i have heard about the high school teams not playing there anymore due to money).

thoughts, comments, concerns, criticisms?

[lakesbison]

You just add womens.diving and swimming (which already has a coference!!)

[duluthbison]

Men's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendance.php

Women's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendancew.php

the men's wcha teams average roughly 6700 a game with an average of 85.1% capacity.
the women's wcha teams average roughley 650 a game with an average of 15.6% capacity.

based off of that math, an ndsu men's team would average about 4255 a game and a women's team would average 780 at the upc. is that enough for a womens game to make it beneficial from a financial standpoint?

i know the typical view of women's hockey is that its a money pit that has to stick around in order for the men's team to exist. but 780 a game is more than what most of the high school hockey games draw at the upc and they seem to be doing fine (cant say i have heard about the high school teams not playing there anymore due to money).

thoughts, comments, concerns, criticisms?


I think this is the best chance NDSU has had in a LONG time to add hockey to its sports.

I personally wouldn't mind going to games at the UPC, its a very nice arena (not close to the ralph, but then again...what is?)
And the attendance figures would fit comfortably inside

[56BISON73]

Men's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendance.php

Women's attendances
http://www.uscho.com/stats/attendancew.php

the men's wcha teams average roughly 6700 a game with an average of 85.1% capacity.
the women's wcha teams average roughley 650 a game with an average of 15.6% capacity.

based off of that math, an ndsu men's team would average about 4255 a game and a women's team would average 780 at the upc. is that enough for a womens game to make it beneficial from a financial standpoint?

i know the typical view of women's hockey is that its a money pit that has to stick around in order for the men's team to exist. but 780 a game is more than what most of the high school hockey games draw at the upc and they seem to be doing fine (cant say i have heard about the high school teams not playing there anymore due to money).

thoughts, comments, concerns, criticisms?

They also dont have to fund scholorships. I dont think you can compare HS and College. Two different ball games when it comes to funding etc. PL

[duluthbison]

But doesn't a good chunk of the scholarships come from donations from team makers?

Maybe with hockey, more alum would donate

[56BISON73]

But doesn't a good chunk of the scholarships come from donations from team makers?

Maybe with hockey, more alum would donate

May be they would but there really isnt a hockey tradition at NDSU. You cant build a program on maybes. The cash infusion to fund two programs would have to be HUGE to be fully funded and be competitive. PL

[BisoninNWMN]

May be they would but there really isnt a hockey tradition at NDSU. You cant build a program on maybes. The cash infusion to fund two programs would have to be HUGE to be fully funded and be competitive. PL




.....UND's hockey program "eats- up" 2 million of their athletic budget???

...thought I read that...could be wrong


I, personally, would enjoy Bison hockey but that would take mucho dinero!!!

[56BISON73]

.....UND's hockey program "eats- up" 2 million of their athletic budget???

...thought I read that...could be wrong


I, personally, would enjoy Bison hockey but that would take mucho dinero!!!

Personally---If NDSU had the funding to do it without infringing on the cash for the other programs I would say go for it. But I dont think there are really big hockey dollars out there. PL

[UTH]

Personally---If NDSU had the funding to do it without infringing on the cash for the other programs I would say go for it. But I dont think there are really big hockey dollars out there. PL


I love hockey - it's the only sport in existence that I can watch an entire game, at almost any level, without even caring which teams are playing. Having said that, I not only wouldn't give financial support toward funding a team, I doubt I'd bother to go to many games. The idea doesn't really blow my skirt up. The bush league stuff (like bismarck bobcats, fargo force, et al.) has a much better atmosphere and works just fine for me. Why go through the bother to establish intercollegiate varsity hockey when these other 'real' teams work just fine, if not better???

[TransAmBison]

I love hockey - it's the only sport in existence that I can watch an entire game, at almost any level, without even caring which teams are playing. Having said that, I not only wouldn't give financial support toward funding a team, I doubt I'd bother to go to many games. The idea doesn't really blow my skirt up. The bush league stuff (like bismarck bobcats, fargo force, et al.) has a much better atmosphere and works just fine for me. Why go through the bother to establish intercollegiate varsity hockey when these other 'real' teams work just fine, if not better???
Too much information my friend. Really glad you did not post a picture for this one.

[UTH]

Too much information my friend. Really glad you did not post a picture for this one.


You must be referring to my days in Her Majesty's Royal Scottish Infantry, back in another life...*


http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff311/indio_rojas/COLSimonWest.jpg**








*man, did that ever cause a $#!t-firestorm. glad to be out of there:hide:
**photoshopped to make it publishable:nod:. sure am glad the deletion is in the picture only:blush:

[BisoninNWMN]

I love hockey - it's the only sport in existence that I can watch an entire game, at almost any level, without even caring which teams are playing. Having said that, I not only wouldn't give financial support toward funding a team, I doubt I'd bother to go to many games. The idea doesn't really blow my skirt up. The bush league stuff (like bismarck bobcats, fargo force, et al.) has a much better atmosphere and works just fine for me. Why go through the bother to establish intercollegiate varsity hockey when these other 'real' teams work just fine, if not better???


If you love hockey, at any level, why wouldn't you enjoy Bison hockey??

I like watching FSN high school hockey games......Bison hockey would be great!!!! NHL has gotten better with the rule changes.

IMO...too expensive to fund w/o taking away from other sports.....we need a "ralph".

[aces1180]

If you love hockey, at any level, why wouldn't you enjoy Bison hockey??

I like watching FSN high school hockey games......Bison hockey would be great!!!! NHL has gotten better with the rule changes.

IMO...too expensive to fund w/o taking away from other sports.....we need a "ralph".

Plus, you have to add a women's sport to offset Title IX...Not a cheap ordeal. However, I think it would be cool to have a hockey team at SU.

[UTH]

If you love hockey, at any level, why wouldn't you enjoy Bison hockey??

I like watching FSN high school hockey games......Bison hockey would be great!!!! NHL has gotten better with the rule changes.

IMO...too expensive to fund w/o taking away from other sports.....we need a "ralph".


I'd enjoy it - I just wouldn't get too excited about it. I'd go to a game once in a while, if I'm in town at the time. I think the biggest difference is the difference in atmosphere between college hockey vs. AHL/USHL/NAHL/NHL... College games just feel a little sanitized to me - can't explain why - oh well. Given a choice, I'll take one of the HLs over college any day of the week.

And I agree - there's no way it would even be credibly considered without a "ralph". People can talk, but anybody who believes it just isn't being hones with himself.

[BisoninNWMN]

I'd enjoy it - I just wouldn't get too excited about it. I'd go to a game once in a while, if I'm in town at the time. I think the biggest difference is the difference in atmosphere between college hockey vs. AHL/USHL/NAHL/NHL... College games just feel a little sanitized to me - can't explain why - oh well. Given a choice, I'll take one of the HLs over college any day of the week.

And I agree - there's no way it would even be credibly considered without a "ralph". People can talk, but anybody who believes it just isn't being hones with himself.


The ECHL team that was in Beaumont, Texas the last few yrs....since moved to Ca, was great entertainment. ECHL, double AA hockey, was fun to watch....probably the fighting aspect for me. College players get kicked out of the game and suspended for the next one for fighting. Fighting is common place in ECHL and the players "bust their ass" to try to make the jump up to the AHL or NHL.

Hockey is a great sport and I would love for the Bison to have a team but the $$$$$$$$ aspect makes it too costly....right now!!

But you're right....hockey at any level is fun to watch!!:nod: :nod:


Side note: At every Texas Wildcatters game there were Fighting Sioux jerseys in the crowd....a lot of "transplants" from up north.....but UND hockey is very popular, I have to admit!!

[turbo700]

If they can pull it off I would be all behind it. Recruit local have it Americans (ndsu) vs Canada (und), or just go steal there recruits Im sure they would rather live in fargo with 3 colleges then in Grand Forks where nothing goes on.

[onbison09]

If they can pull it off I would be all behind it. Recruit local have it Americans (ndsu) vs Canada (und), or just go steal there recruits Im sure they would rather live in fargo with 3 colleges then in Grand Forks where nothing goes on.
That won't happen. :hide: They have a badass hockey program, gotta admit.

[lakesbison]

NDSU club hockey is alive.. I saw them play Oklahoma a few weeks back

they play SDSU in a few weeks??


DEAN BLAIS... GET US HOCKEY!!

[tony]

IMO: The only way hockey should happen at NDSU is if the student body demands it and agrees to raise student fees to cover the annual operating costs*. Even then, that's only a first step as start-up costs and facilties would be a huge issue, but in my view student support for hockey is a sine qua non (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sine_qua_non) hockey-wise. I sure don't think there is any meaningful support from the alumni for hockey.

* If hockey makes money, I figure that they'd get some sort of return on their investment.

[WYOBISONMAN]

No way.....

I got one word for you all.....

Basketball!

[lakesbison]

UP CENTER AND A COACH are in place.


Coach Blais knows the junior A teams inside and out, I guarantee he could whip a .500 team together in a year.

you play in the CCHA and you average 4,000 fans at UP center. Done Deal.


then add Women's swimming and diving.

[Bison55]

I agree. I would love to go to a Bison hockey game at the UP center. If they could get into the CCH, that place would be rockin'.

[WYOBISONMAN]

We could add this women's sport.........

http://teamscrew.com/pics/beer%20drink%20contest.jpg

[coldspot]

We could add this women's sport.........

http://teamscrew.com/pics/beer%20drink%20contest.jpg

women's nip slipping?

[BlueBisonRock]

We could add this women's sport.........

http://teamscrew.com/pics/beer%20drink%20contest.jpg

Don't you mean bring back this women's sport? :D

[UTH]

Don't you mean bring back this women's sport? :D


When has it not been sport?

[56BISON73]

[quote=BlueBisonRock;254032]Don't you mean bring back this women's sport? :D[/quote

Where do I send my check????:p :D

[UTH]

We could add this women's sport.........




Might want to give a NSFW warning if you're going to hotlink from websites like that.* I'm not saying. I'm just saying.:hide:









*i thought you could only find trannies under cars:o

[heckler]

Might want to give a NSFW warning if you're going to hotlink from websites like that.* I'm not saying. I'm just saying.:hide:









]*i thought you could only find trannies under cars:o [/B]


I don't get it :confused:

[4mcruenomore]

Had some UND people asking us at work about said article. I had no clue, never heard of it, til I saw this thread.

[turbo700]

Had some UND people asking us at work about said article. I had no clue, never heard of it, til I saw this thread.

they are scared we will take some recruits away. But they don't take any MN or ND players so we have nothing to lose. There's enough talent in MN, ND to compete against those Canadians!

[lakesbison]

turbo!! welcome to the bisonville!! LETS DO THIS!!

[turbo700]

turbo!! welcome to the bisonville!! LETS DO THIS!!

Just get the buzz out. I know that Hockey would work especially if we can start to compete with UND in next 5 years we can became dominate like every other sport we are in! Like I said there is enough talent floating around Fargo within 400 mile radius to compete :hungry:

[roadwarrior]

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[WYOBISONMAN]

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

To steal a line from Sambini...........

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++

[turbo700]

Hockey is a growing sport. Like I said we can compete at a high level in all sports. We have the base of talent just around us. 2 years ago the Stanley cup came to Fargo twice both those players grew up here. . The foundation is here we just have to expose it.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?columnist=frei_terry&id=3905895

They Naysayers are the ones who don't even know what the blue line is!

[tony]

They Naysayers are the ones who don't even know what the blue line is!

Quite possibly true since I'm pretty sure that most ND-born alumni of NDSU came from a HS that didn't have a hockey team when they attended.

The push (and cash) for hockey is going to have to come from the student body.

[ndsubison1]

yawn......

[4mcruenomore]

After hearing about this, I decided to do a bit of research on my own. I decided to chat with a couple of big donors that I know, some of you may know the Rocky Hager thread, so....well, I pretty much got the NOT INTERESTED response, especially b/c the FB team needs to do SOMETHING first and foremost. End of story as far as I'm concerned, cash needs to come from somewhere..not gonna happen. Not that I know everybody that donates big cash, or the real deal makers, but I was just getting some opinions of some folks that do donate some serious cash. Maybe their opinions will change, who knows.

[roadwarrior]

There are many more big projects to get done before even thinking about hockey:

Football practice field
Basketball Arena
BSA
Softball Field

[4mcruenomore]

There are many more big projects to get done before even thinking about hockey:

Football practice field
Basketball Arena
BSA
Softball Field


Agreed, a FB championship would help if you ask me, kind of like mission accomplished, let's move on.

[turbo700]

There are many more big projects to get done before even thinking about hockey:

Football practice field
Basketball Arena
BSA
Softball Field


I agree with that but that going to cost alot of money. The Rink is already built just buy some sticks N skates N go or just move the club team up from it's ranks do a slow build. :hungry:

[unbison]

cant do that..... then we would want to play the team to the north

[90 BISON]

I agree with that but that going to cost alot of money. The Rink is already built just buy some sticks N skates N go or just move the club team up from it's ranks do a slow build. :hungry:

So are you telling us that:
A) sponsoring hockey scholarships is going to be cheap, or
B) we should have DI hockey without the scholarships?

[turbo700]

So are you telling us that:
A) sponsoring hockey scholarships is going to be cheap, or
B) we should have DI hockey without the scholarships?

A. sponsoring hockey won't be as expensive as building a 10-20 million dollar building
B. There is enough talent around here to field a competitive team you don't have to go to canada look at UMD or Mankato, Bermidji.


C. after doing some research Forget the whole thing. UND is going to make sure we will not have DI Hockey team there is to much money that comes out of Fargo (2000 season ticket holders) and they are going to put Bermidji state in the WCHA so that will close the door on this whole argument because if we don't get to play against MN, ST. cloud or any other team in upper midwest it won't be worth it.

UND will eventually be the University of Michigan in DI AA that what sucks about the whole thing. Narrow minded will cost us.

[lakesbison]

AMEN BRO.

thats why we get a team NOW, with DEAN BLAIS HEADING IT!!

[cvbison1]

A. sponsoring hockey won't be as expensive as building a 10-20 million dollar building
B. There is enough talent around here to field a competitive team you don't have to go to canada look at UMD or Mankato, Bermidji.


C. after doing some research Forget the whole thing. UND is going to make sure we will not have DI Hockey team there is to much money that comes out of Fargo (2000 season ticket holders) and they are going to put Bermidji state in the WCHA so that will close the door on this whole argument because if we don't get to play against MN, ST. cloud or any other team in upper midwest it won't be worth it.

UND will eventually be the University of Michigan in DI AA that what sucks about the whole thing. Narrow minded will cost us.

Because Michigan sucks in everything right?

[UTH]

Because Michigan sucks in everything right?


Pretty much.

[BisoninNWMN]

A. sponsoring hockey won't be as expensive as building a 10-20 million dollar building
B. There is enough talent around here to field a competitive team you don't have to go to canada look at UMD or Mankato, Bermidji.


C. after doing some research Forget the whole thing. UND is going to make sure we will not have DI Hockey team there is to much money that comes out of Fargo (2000 season ticket holders) and they are going to put Bermidji state in the WCHA so that will close the door on this whole argument because if we don't get to play against MN, ST. cloud or any other team in upper midwest it won't be worth it.

UND will eventually be the University of Michigan in DI AA that what sucks about the whole thing. Narrow minded will cost us.


I would love hockey at NDSU.......some of those 2000 season tx holders for UND, in Fargo, would definitely "come home" to the Bison.

Agree....that there is plenty of talent in the area....go to USCHO.com and look at the rosters of other DI teams....a lot of Minnesota boys......

$$$$$$$...is the only problem.......we need a Ralph for hockey to get going at NDSU....maybe not 100 mill but some big $$$.

[Bison101]

At least we have hockey.......... :D

[onbison09]

How's the club team (yes there still is one) doing?

[fargocyclone]

I think they come down to Iowa State coming up pretty soon. It said something about it in the Daily (Newspaper). I think ISU is #2 in the CSCHL. I don't know about NDSU though.

[westnodak93bison]

If NDSU cant fund a DI Hockey program how in the world can Bemidji or
Moorhead State?
http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/236535/

[HerdBot]

If NDSU cant fund a DI Hockey program how in the world can Bemidji or
Moorhead State?
http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/236535/

A state owned Minnesota college playing college in North Dakota? Talk about an idiotic idea. I would be pissed if I paid taxes in Minnesota.

They should build the new dome addition with a hockey arena option.

[bisonmike2]

A state owned Minnesota college playing college in North Dakota? Talk about an idiotic idea. I would be pissed if I paid taxes in Minnesota.

They should build the new dome addition with a hockey arena option.

I was wondering about that. Of course the alternative is to have MSUM build a new arena and I suppose at first the more cost effective way to start a new program is to just rent a local facility, even if it is in a different state. If the program takes off then they could look at building their own arena in Moorhead. Makes me wonder what a home game against UND would be like. Do you think we would see a game with MSUM vs. UND completely overtaken with Bison fans who only came to cheer against the Sioux?

[17>1]

I don't think so. At least I would'nt be one. I look at it like my favorite teams. The Vikings, and whoever is playing the Packers. The Twins, and whoever is playing the Sox and Indians. NDSU Football and whoever is playing the Sioux. NDSU hockey and whoever is playing the Sioux.....err wait, we don't have hockey, so being from ND, I'll cheer for them before I cheer against them and cheer for some team across the river that I could really really care less about.

[lakesbison]

Here's waht pisses me off .,and.ill name names.... mike bullinger + randy thorson had this NDSU hockey thing done.in 1997! but.the old farts in.this town turned it down.

i sat with glen sonmor at minn vs holy cross (my.first and LAST time at da ralllllph)

glen said.in hockey circles, NDSU would be SCSU in 2 years, cuz there,is a model there.

the COACH 'blais' is here, the arena is built. women get.equestrian or swimmin to offset title ix.

DONE DEAL!!

[bisonballs33]

I don't think so. At least I would'nt be one. I look at it like my favorite teams. The Vikings, and whoever is playing the Packers. The Twins, and whoever is playing the Sox and Indians. NDSU Football and whoever is playing the Sioux. NDSU hockey and whoever is playing the Sioux.....err wait, we don't have hockey, so being from ND, I'll cheer for them before I cheer against them and cheer for some team across the river that I could really really care less about.


Just because NDSU's hockey team plays in the ACHA doesn't mean they don't have a team. Just because they aren't under the athletic umbrella doesn't mean they don't have a team. Is a youth hockey "B" team not a team because it's not an "A" team. If people want to ever see a D1 hockey team at NDSU, people like you need to get out and support the current ACHA team.

[56BISON73]

Here's waht pisses me off .,and.ill name names.... mike bullinger + randy thorson had this NDSU hockey thing done.in 1997! but.the old farts in.this town turned it down.

i sat with glen sonmor at minn vs holy cross (my.first and LAST time at da ralllllph)

glen said.in hockey circles, NDSU would be SCSU in 2 years, cuz there,is a model there.

the COACH 'blais' is here, the arena is built. women get.equestrian or swimmin to offset title ix.

DONE DEAL!!

Lakes
WHY do you wany hockey??? YOU yourself said its nothing more than a regional sport and the frozen four is a joke. So why considering your past statements do you want NDSU to participate in a crap sport?????????

[17>1]

Just because NDSU's hockey team plays in the ACHA doesn't mean they don't have a team. Just because they aren't under the athletic umbrella doesn't mean they don't have a team. Is a youth hockey "B" team not a team because it's not an "A" team. If people want to ever see a D1 hockey team at NDSU, people like you need to get out and support the current ACHA team.

Are you serious ? No athletic umbrella...that's exactly why I wouldn't want to go watch it. It's a "B" team at an "A" college. A D1 team playing for a national championship, where they are recruited scholorship players, and a high paid coach, and rivalries is what I want. Not a bunch of kids who played in highschool, and never got their shot, playing on a thursday night in front of 50 people isn't what I had in mind. Am I out of line with this thinking ?

[bisonballs33]

Are you serious ? No athletic umbrella...that's exactly why I wouldn't want to go watch it. It's a "B" team at an "A" college. A D1 team playing for a national championship, where they are recruited scholorship players, and a high paid coach, and rivalries is what I want. Not a bunch of kids who played in highschool, and never got their shot, playing on a thursday night in front of 50 people isn't what I had in mind. Am I out of line with this thinking ?

Yes, you are. NDSU actually has a start, but no one is interested in getting it going. It isn't just the school, it is the people that would support it. I know for a fact if a thousand people showed up to cheer on the NDSU ACHA team, that would spark interest under the athletic umbrella. Don't throw these kids under the bus either. There are plenty of kids that could have played D3 and one that was going to play D1 before he got hurt. These kids play the game because they love it. Each kid had to PAY 600 bucks to play on the team this year. That is love of the game. You should come watch and see some of the rivalries that have been built with Minot State, St. Cloud, and SDSU. No, it isn't high level hockey. It isn't D1. It isn't even D3 level yet. However, there are kids that can play the game and kids that were successful in high school. These are kids that thought an education was more important than a game...albeit a beautiful game. If NDSU wants a D1 hockey team, they need to see financial support and fan support for their current ACHA team so they can see it grow. The top level ACHA teams are pretty damn good. I don't care if you aren't behind the idea of NDSU "Club" hockey. Most aren't, but you are out of line to throw these kids under the bus like this. Support is what this team needs.

[lakesbison]

Gene & Joe have listened to ERV INNIGER the whole time in regards to hockey.

Erv doesn't want to sell donors on hockey... he just wants to stick with his bread and butter of basketball.

this is a real shame folks, the ARENA IS THERE!!

the MONEY is there.

ERV has Gene and Joe convinced that he can't do it. sad actually.

[roadwarrior]

lakes, its not going to happen, and its not Erv stopping it. Might as well get your MSUM hockey jersey (not that this deal is really going to happen).

[DORMIE]

D1 Hockey... do you think that anyone really gives a shit in Portland ,OR?

[Shawn-O]

D1 Hockey... do you think that anyone really gives a shit in Portland ,OR?

About as much as anyone in the midwest gives a shit about the rose festival, so what of it.

[56BISON73]

Yes, you are. NDSU actually has a start, but no one is interested in getting it going. It isn't just the school, it is the people that would support it. I know for a fact if a thousand people showed up to cheer on the NDSU ACHA team, that would spark interest under the athletic umbrella. Don't throw these kids under the bus either. There are plenty of kids that could have played D3 and one that was going to play D1 before he got hurt. These kids play the game because they love it. Each kid had to PAY 600 bucks to play on the team this year. That is love of the game. You should come watch and see some of the rivalries that have been built with Minot State, St. Cloud, and SDSU. No, it isn't high level hockey. It isn't D1. It isn't even D3 level yet. However, there are kids that can play the game and kids that were successful in high school. These are kids that thought an education was more important than a game...albeit a beautiful game. If NDSU wants a D1 hockey team, they need to see financial support and fan support for their current ACHA team so they can see it grow. The top level ACHA teams are pretty damn good. I don't care if you aren't behind the idea of NDSU "Club" hockey. Most aren't, but you are out of line to throw these kids under the bus like this. Support is what this team needs.

Well said.!!!!!!

[bisonballs33]

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=500291665&v=feed&story_fbid=76746319467#/group.php?gid=88619326352&ref=nf

[bisonballs33]

Folks, I urge you to email North Dakota State Athletic Director Gene Taylor at

Gene.Taylor@ndsu.edu

Please say a few words that help him see how important hockey is around here and that he should reconsider basically turning down the WCHA. Please. I urge you all to do this, even if it is just a line or two.

[cvbison1]

Folks, I urge you to email North Dakota State Athletic Director Gene Taylor at

Gene.Taylor@ndsu.edu

Please say a few words that help him see how important hockey is around here and that he should reconsider basically turning down the WCHA. Please. I urge you all to do this, even if it is just a line or two.

boooooooo, let the man do his job. leave him alone. hes been great. get a life

[17>1]

Still not seeing how I'm throwing any of them under the bus. They came to NDSU ( over some D3 schools ) to get an education, great decision. They get to play hockey a couple of nights a week on top of that, nice. Education #1, Hockey #2. Not the other way around which is definitely the case when a kid chooses UND (D1 hockey) over anyone else to play hockey and get to the NHL, and get an education while he's there. And another thing, how can Bison fans get behind a club team that no one knows nothing about ? I'll admit, I don't really know to much about the club team, so maybe I'm just talking out of my butt, but they don't do to much to promote this thing that we're supposed to be all supportive of. It just seems to much like intermurals to me. And apparently, by sheer attendance and lack of support, I'm not the only one that thinks this is the case.

[17>1]

Folks, I urge you to email North Dakota State Athletic Director Gene Taylor at

Gene.Taylor@ndsu.edu

Please say a few words that help him see how important hockey is around here and that he should reconsider basically turning down the WCHA. Please. I urge you all to do this, even if it is just a line or two.

This seems like a better way of showing support than going out and watching the club team. IMO.

[bisonballs33]

boooooooo, let the man do his job. leave him alone. hes been great. get a life

The man can certainly still do his job. There is no reason that people can't help shed some light on the idea for him. He is from the south and has never lived or worked in a hockey rich area. I am guessing he isn't fully aware of all things. There is no reason people can't send him a word of encouragement on the hockey front. If you don't want to, don't.

[bisonballs33]

Still not seeing how I'm throwing any of them under the bus. They came to NDSU ( over some D3 schools ) to get an education, great decision. They get to play hockey a couple of nights a week on top of that, nice. Education #1, Hockey #2. Not the other way around which is definitely the case when a kid chooses UND (D1 hockey) over anyone else to play hockey and get to the NHL, and get an education while he's there. And another thing, how can Bison fans get behind a club team that no one knows nothing about ? I'll admit, I don't really know to much about the club team, so maybe I'm just talking out of my butt, but they don't do to much to promote this thing that we're supposed to be all supportive of. It just seems to much like intermurals to me. And apparently, by sheer attendance and lack of support, I'm not the only one that thinks this is the case.


The NDSU Club team is not given the funds to promote. I do totally understand everything you say here and agree fully. I will do my best to keep word up on here. As far as the emailing being a better way to go...I believe many people will share your opinion and I hope they choose to go that route. I know there are plenty of ney sayers, but walk around campus and look at all the hockey apparel. There are fans of hockey all over that campus.

[lakesbison]

I think this move by moorhead st. is a way to get the fire goin under ndsu's ath. dept's butts!!!!

lets light this candle gene!!!!

email him people, i know he gets asked the question alot.

we have a sweet arena, and DEAN BLAIS to start it, ill get glen sonmor and lou nanne to help out....i promise u.that!!!

[unbison]

Ok Gene taylor does probably get asked this question often lakes..... problem it is by the same 2 or 3% of people that want this to happen..
If you didnt send him 33 emails a day asking this question how often do
you really think he would get asked?

OOh yeah bisonballs wrong side of river to be hockey rich area..... when one thinks north dakota they dont think awesome local hockey talent.... maybe only exception is grafton

[roadwarrior]

For all those that want hockey so bad, I've got Teammaker membership and upgrade forms. We'll need several new 1/2 scholarship members to fund the hockey and equestrian scholarships. lakes, you in??? PM me!

[TheDoctor]

Are you saying that the University of South Dakota is adding hockey ??

Would make sense since they are travel partners and all.............interesting! ;)

[Shawn-O]

For all those that want hockey so bad, I've got Teammaker membership and upgrade forms. We'll need several new 1/2 scholarship members to fund the hockey and equestrian scholarships. lakes, you in??? PM me!

Don't forget Dean's compensation package. He's expensive.

[bisonmike2]

My views on NDSU hockey are pretty clear, I think our money is spent better elsewhere. Anyone seriously wanting NDSU to add hockey should not be anyone on this board yelling how hockey is a regional sport and nobody outside of the upper midwest cares about hockey. Also, you shouldn't be one of the people who are consistently ripping UND for following in our footsteps, not stepping up into D-1 until after we did. Because if we did add hockey, that's exactly what we'd get thrown back in our face. "We had hockey first, what took you so long? Finally started to step up with a real D-1 sport, etc, etc." And last but not least, it would take an insane amount of money and success for us to get out of underneath UND's hockey shadow. They have, what, nearly a century of hockey tradition, dozens of conference championships, and several NC's. NDSU can't compete with that. My opinion is we have two options. We can bring back culture of NDSU being the little brother of UND by starting a hockey program, or we can forge the new culture of NDSU being the leading institution by devoting the money and support to our football and b-ball programs.

[56BISON73]

Still not seeing how I'm throwing any of them under the bus. They came to NDSU ( over some D3 schools ) to get an education, great decision. They get to play hockey a couple of nights a week on top of that, nice. Education #1, Hockey #2. Not the other way around which is definitely the case when a kid chooses UND (D1 hockey) over anyone else to play hockey and get to the NHL, and get an education while he's there. And another thing, how can Bison fans get behind a club team that no one knows nothing about ? I'll admit, I don't really know to much about the club team, so maybe I'm just talking out of my butt, but they don't do to much to promote this thing that we're supposed to be all supportive of. It just seems to much like intermurals to me. And apparently, by sheer attendance and lack of support, I'm not the only one that thinks this is the case.

If you dont support the club team why would you support a start up team? I say support the club team. SHOW there is an interest in hockey. If you really love hockey why wouldnt you go see them play????

All the school sees is some people talking out of both sides of there ass of how hockey isnt shit and its only regional yada yada yada yada and then they are saying they want hockey etc.
Support the team you have. Show there is a TRUE interest. Just because they dont advertise it doesnt mean you cant support it.

[Shawn-O]

My views on NDSU hockey are pretty clear, I think our money is spent better elsewhere. Anyone seriously wanting NDSU to add hockey should not be anyone on this board yelling how hockey is a regional sport and nobody outside of the upper midwest cares about hockey. Also, you shouldn't be one of the people who are consistently ripping UND for following in our footsteps, not stepping up into D-1 until after we did. Because if we did add hockey, that's exactly what we'd get thrown back in our face. "We had hockey first, what took you so long? Finally started to step up with a real D-1 sport, etc, etc." And last but not least, it would take an insane amount of money and success for us to get out of underneath UND's hockey shadow. They have, what, nearly a century of hockey tradition, dozens of conference championships, and several NC's. NDSU can't compete with that. My opinion is we have two options. We can bring back culture of NDSU being the little brother of UND by starting a hockey program, or we can forge the new culture of NDSU being the leading institution by devoting the money and support to our football and b-ball programs.

I think NDSU will pour those resources into the extra 22 football schollies and beefed up basketball facilities. If the tables were turned, that's what I'd be supporting. I've laced up skates enough times to count on one hand in my lifetime, but hockey just becomes a part of your DNA when you go through UND. It would take NDSU generations to attain this type of tradition. I also think you'd differentiate yourselves with FBS football. UND would not follow, IMO. It's all probably what, ten years down the road? If Troy could do it, I can see NDSU pulling it off as well.

[aces1180]

I think NDSU will pour those resources into the extra 22 football schollies and beefed up basketball facilities. If the tables were turned, that's what I'd be supporting. I've laced up skates enough times to count on one hand in my lifetime, but hockey just becomes a part of your DNA when you go through UND. It would take NDSU generations to attain this type of tradition. I also think you'd differentiate yourselves with FBS football. UND would not follow, IMO. It's all probably what, ten years down the road? If Troy could do it, I can see NDSU pulling it off as well.

That's a great point, Shawn-O...I would much rather see NDSU go FBS than start a hockey team which won't even be close to being successful in a generation.

[ndsubison1]

Folks, I urge you to email North Dakota State Athletic Director Gene Taylor at

Gene.Taylor@ndsu.edu

Please say a few words that help him see how important hockey is around here and that he should reconsider basically turning down the WCHA. Please. I urge you all to do this, even if it is just a line or two.

it comes down to money...all of our resources/money are being put into basketball/football right now. why take the risk on hockey? hockey is a big money killer and it will take us decades to become a legit D1 hockey program... in essence, it's not worth it... can we please just focus on basketball as our main winter sport...

[lakesbison]

Shawn-O. - You guys dont want NDSU to have hockey.
That's UND's Biggest Fear and that is why RALPH E. and the UND "ADMIN CREW" got together to have that arena. so they could hold something over NDSU's head forever.

Well Played on that front.

HOWEVER, to BISON Fans, look at your University NOW compared to 1985-1990 and before.

its what, 65-70% Minnesota? NDSU is a REGIONAL school and a BIG one, and HOPEFULLY BIGGER ONE!

those Minnesota kids (& 90% of the Athlete's are minnesotan's I would guess) GREW UP with the Minnesota State Hockey Tourney and teams at their HS's.


NDSU Hockey would work, you got the FACITITY & COACH already!!
(plus according to Red Baron, we made the 2006 WCHA Frozen Five, ha ha)

[56BISON73]

I think NDSU will pour those resources into the extra 22 football schollies and beefed up basketball facilities. If the tables were turned, that's what I'd be supporting. I've laced up skates enough times to count on one hand in my lifetime, but hockey just becomes a part of your DNA when you go through UND. It would take NDSU generations to attain this type of tradition. I also think you'd differentiate yourselves with FBS football. UND would not follow, IMO. It's all probably what, ten years down the road? If Troy could do it, I can see NDSU pulling it off as well.

Shawno
Great post.

[bisonmike2]

Shawn-O. - You guys dont want NDSU to have hockey.
That's UND's Biggest Fear and that is why RALPH E. and the UND "ADMIN CREW" got together to have that arena. so they could hold something over NDSU's head forever.

Well Played on that front.

HOWEVER, to BISON Fans, look at your University NOW compared to 1985-1990 and before.

its what, 65-70% Minnesota? NDSU is a REGIONAL school and a BIG one, and HOPEFULLY BIGGER ONE!

those Minnesota kids (& 90% of the Athlete's are minnesotan's I would guess) GREW UP with the Minnesota State Hockey Tourney and teams at their HS's.


NDSU Hockey would work, you got the FACITITY & COACH already!!
(plus according to Red Baron, we made the 2006 WCHA Frozen Five, ha ha)

$$$$

You're like my son when I take him to the toy section in Target. "I want that! I want that! I need that! Oh come on can I have that?" It comes down to money. Do you want NDSU to spend money improving aspects of sports we already are established at or do you want them to start pouring money down a hockey hole that will probably never be a large money maker? And Lakes you can give me all the formulas that show 4500 tickets sold $25 for 20 games you want but in the real world you also would have to show me how much money our women's hockey team would also make. Right now we are in a great position. We can really make huge strides to advance our football and basketball programs. With the financial strain of hockey there's no way we could add hockey and improve our football and b-ball facilities.

[tjbison]

I think NDSU will pour those resources into the extra 22 football schollies and beefed up basketball facilities. If the tables were turned, that's what I'd be supporting. I've laced up skates enough times to count on one hand in my lifetime, but hockey just becomes a part of your DNA when you go through UND. It would take NDSU generations to attain this type of tradition. I also think you'd differentiate yourselves with FBS football. UND would not follow, IMO. It's all probably what, ten years down the road? If Troy could do it, I can see NDSU pulling it off as well.

EXACTLY!!!!!! not bashing Hockey but screw it let UND have it they put LOTS into getting a program like they have, NDSU doesn't need it if MSUM wants to start it go for it. I want a BB all Arena:ranting: and yes some day i the future FBS football!!!!!:p

[NDSUstudent]

If you add hockey you are looking at an extra 3-4 million onto the athletic budget and I'm not even talking about the start up costs. It is an absolute money pit.

Plus there are a ton of teams around here, competition is already pretty fierce.

If you look at basketball, Minnesota has one DI program within its borders, and the state produces a ton talent. Tell me people what sport should we focus on? NDSU could be an elite mid-major with a new arena and 3-4 million sunk into the basketball programs. We know women's basketball can sell tickets when they are good, women's hockey not so much.

[bisonmike2]

If you add hockey you are looking at an extra 3-4 million onto the athletic budget and I'm not even talking about the start up costs. It is an absolute money pit.

Plus there are a ton of teams around here, competition is already pretty fierce.

If you look at basketball, Minnesota has one DI program within its borders, and the state produces a ton talent. Tell me people what sport should we focus on? NDSU could be an elite mid-major with a new arena and 3-4 million sunk into the basketball programs. We know women's basketball can sell tickets when they are good, women's hockey not so much.

Well said. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

[WYOBISONMAN]

Man I wish this hockey stuff would just go away.......we need our resources going to BB and FB!!!

[AKBison]

I love Hockey and would love for NDSU to have it. However, there is one truth that always keeps me at bay. We are a football school and the pie in the sky dream is FBS, not Hockey. FBS (WAC, MWC) > Hockey (WCHA)

[lakesbison]

THEN HAVE GENE/JOE come out and give us a "VISION" for FBS in 5 years.

until then. its NDSU hockey for me and Women's Equestrian at Fargo Horse Park.

[17>1]

If you dont support the club team why would you support a start up team? I say support the club team. SHOW there is an interest in hockey. If you really love hockey why wouldnt you go see them play????

All the school sees is some people talking out of both sides of there ass of how hockey isnt shit and its only regional yada yada yada yada and then they are saying they want hockey etc.
Support the team you have. Show there is a TRUE interest. Just because they dont advertise it doesnt mean you cant support it.

Don't people see the frikkin' difference between a club team and a scholarship program with D1 caliber athletes, future NHL players, opponents like UND, Minnesota, BC, Boston U, Notre Dame, and playing in a nice 5+ thousand seat building ??? The club team is intermurals. If NDSU had a start up team with all the afforementioned things, don't you think that would be a hot ticket ??? Go sit on I-29 on nights the Sioux are playing and watch how many cars head north from Fargo. There is an interest in D1 hockey in Fargo. And I don't think all those cars are full of UND alums, but true North Dakotans cheering for the only D1 hockey school in ND. Their #1 team to root for would be NDSU if we had hockey (D1).

[56BISON73]

Don't people see the frikkin' difference between a club team and a scholarship program with D1 caliber athletes, future NHL players, opponents like UND, Minnesota, BC, Boston U, Notre Dame, and playing in a nice 5+ thousand seat building ??? The club team is intermurals. If NDSU had a start up team with all the afforementioned things, don't you think that would be a hot ticket ??? Go sit on I-29 on nights the Sioux are playing and watch how many cars head north from Fargo. There is an interest in D1 hockey in Fargo. And I don't think all those cars are full of UND alums, but true North Dakotans cheering for the only D1 hockey school in ND. Their #1 team to root for would be NDSU if we had hockey (D1).


Of course we know the difference. The point is about support for a local team. Which would show the powers that be that there is interest.
But NDSU hockey is a pipe dream for now. FB is the big dog and BB needs a new home. I dont see money being diverted from those programs to chase hockey.

[17>1]

I agree. I'm all for getting our FB and BB programs better and putting the money there. I would love to see hockey there also but I love Bison football more than anything in the state, and I'd hate to see that suffer because we're pouring money into hockey. I understand your point about support, but the product to base the amount of support on just isnt a realistic gauge. Not sure if I worded that the way I'm thinking, but oh well.

[RedRiver]

Don't people see the frikkin' difference between a club team and a scholarship program with D1 caliber athletes, future NHL players, opponents like UND, Minnesota, BC, Boston U, Notre Dame, and playing in a nice 5+ thousand seat building ??? The club team is intermurals. If NDSU had a start up team with all the afforementioned things, don't you think that would be a hot ticket ??? Go sit on I-29 on nights the Sioux are playing and watch how many cars head north from Fargo. There is an interest in D1 hockey in Fargo. And I don't think all those cars are full of UND alums, but true North Dakotans cheering for the only D1 hockey school in ND. Their #1 team to root for would be NDSU if we had hockey (D1).

Don't forget that the majority of games would be against DII & DIII colleges such as MN Duluth, Michigan Tech, St. Cloud, Mankato St, Bemidji St, Colorado College, maybe Moorhead St and so on........... Hockey is a minor sport in the DI world but it does have its fans and regional interest. However, NDSU should continue to focus on the major college sports of football and basketball, along with all of their other successfull minor sports!!

[bisonballs33]

NDSU CLUB HOCKEY IS SO FAR FROM INTRAMURALS.

Take a fricken look at it. You do your research on everything else. Why can't you take a look at that?

[17>1]

I totally understand who we would be playing but I guess my point of naming those marquee names is that the interest would be there for sure if those teams were coming to play NDSU. The buzz around the Gopher football game, the Kansas State BB game, the Kansas BB game was unbelieveable. To say in the same sentence that NDSU was playing any of those teams was surreal, and if Minnesota or UND hockey came to town, a sell out would happen for sure. Playing those other teams from D2 and D3 colleges on a regular basis means we'd probably be in the WCHA, which is one of the best conferences in college hockey...I could live with that. Pipe dream, yes, lack of support a possibility, I doubt it.

[17>1]

NDSU CLUB HOCKEY IS SO FAR FROM INTRAMURALS.

Take a fricken look at it. You do your research on everything else. Why can't you take a look at that?

Well I did mention in a previous post that I didn't really know much about the club team, and I'm not going to research it either. So maybe "intramurals" wasn't the best descriptive term to use, but would JV work, or B team ??

[lakesbison]

i PERSONALLY COULD FILL THE UP CENTER FOR NDSU HOCKEY.

MOORHEAD, ALEXANDRIA , FERGUS FALLS, & FARGO = 5000/GAME.

[rustywallace]

I could def. see UND being a "prick" and not schedule us just cuz we wont schedule them in football. I dont see why we would want to schedule them in hockey anyways though. They would beat us like they beat harvard 10-1.

[lakesbison]

rusty.

all you gotta do is get 15 CANADIANS!!

thats all they do each year. its not that hard!

[rustywallace]

it would be a lot easier if we had dean blais hahahaha


hammer was speculating scott oliver but thats a long shot to coach MSUM


Personally, i say bring dean in, Woog is too old and washed up

[unbison]

Maybe you could get one of there former players to coach the team for a little insult to injury.... I mean we are dreaming hockey at NDSU.... big enough budget for FBS football.... so here is the short list of canidates for NDSU hockey coach......Tony Hrkac, Ed Belfour,Phil Sykes

[tjbison]

Maybe you could get one of there former players to coach the team for a little insult to injury.... I mean we are dreaming hockey at NDSU.... big enough budget for FBS football.... so here is the short list of canidates for NDSU hockey coach......Tony Hrkac, Ed Belfour,Phil Sykes


Wayne Gretzky would be my pick:D :D

[TheDoctor]

I could def. see UND being a "prick" and not schedule us just cuz we wont schedule them in football. I dont see why we would want to schedule them in hockey anyways though. They would beat us like they beat harvard 10-1.

If we added hockey it would only be with a guaranteed in with the WCHA and then UND would have no choice. The conference would schedule it. ;)

[UTH]

Wayne Gretzky would be my pick:D :D


Michel Therrien is currently unemployed.*:D :D







*there's a reason for that, though. good riddance.:hide:

[bisonmike2]

i PERSONALLY COULD FILL THE UP CENTER FOR NDSU HOCKEY.

MOORHEAD, ALEXANDRIA , FERGUS FALLS, & FARGO = 5000/GAME.

Could you also fill it for NDSU Women's hockey? Because you can't have mens hockey without the womens hockey. So now all the money you are making on the men side is being eaten up by the womens hockey, and where does that leave the university? Plus you have to worry about fan fatigue. You say you can get 5000K to a hockey game but what will that do to the B-ball support? They don't even get 5K now, during a season where it was our first in D1 and we all had the goal of going to the big dance. So you're magically going to conjure up 5000 additional NDSU fans to support hockey on a frequent basis and while also increasing support for NDSU b-ball. Also your expecting the city and NDSU to build a new arena. You are crazy. Lakes, please put your enthusiasm for NDSU to better work and start generating more support for basketball and football. Don't waste your time on hockey.

[Shawn-O]

Could you also fill it for NDSU Women's hockey? Because you can't have mens hockey without the womens hockey. So now all the money you are making on the men side is being eaten up by the womens hockey, and where does that leave the university? Plus you have to worry about fan fatigue. You say you can get 5000K to a hockey game but what will that do to the B-ball support? They don't even get 5K now, during a season where it was our first in D1 and we all had the goal of going to the big dance. So you're magically going to conjure up 5000 additional NDSU fans to support hockey on a frequent basis and while also increasing support for NDSU b-ball. Also your expecting the city and NDSU to build a new arena. You are crazy. Lakes, please put your enthusiasm for NDSU to better work and start generating more support for basketball and football. Don't waste your time on hockey.

There are several schools that don't sponsor women's hockey, Denver, Colorado College, and the MAC schools such as Miami, Western Michigan, and Bowling Green to name a few. You'd need to add women's athletic scholarships somewhere, but there's nothing saying it would have to be hockey. Sounds like a great opportunity to get the wheels in motion on that women's wrestling program. :D

[tjbison]

There are several schools that don't sponsor women's hockey, Denver, Colorado College, and the MAC schools such as Miami, Western Michigan, and Bowling Green to name a few. You'd need to add women's athletic scholarships somewhere, but there's nothing saying it would have to be hockey. Sounds like a great opportunity to get the wheels in motion on that women's wrestling program. :D

Yeah i was wondering where people were getting that you HAVE to have a womens team along with a mens, you can add any sport for women right??

[bisonmike2]

Yeah i was wondering where people were getting that you HAVE to have a womens team along with a mens, you can add any sport for women right??

You have to add women's scholarships somewhere and it's a fact that women's athletics don't generate money. So even if it isn't a womens hockey team it's scholarships that will cost money in a sport that won't generate enough income to pay for themselves. So in the end it will be a financial liability. Add swimming, lacrosse, bull riding, whatever, the highest cost to adding any women's program is going to be the scholarships. Also add a coach, assistant coaches, training facilities/programs/trainers. Or we could not add a hockey program and therefore not have to pay for the mens and the womens additional scholarship cost plus all the extra's.

[99Bison]

You need to meet Title IX requirements, there are basically 3 "methods" to meet the requirements. Each school chooses to meet the requirements in one of the 3 ways.

So, if you add say 18 scholarships for men's hockey, generally speaking and depending on how you are meeting the Title IX requirements you need to come up with either 18 scholarships for women's sports or spend near equivalent on women's sports... again depending on how you are meeting title IX.

[Shawn-O]

You have to add women's scholarships somewhere and it's a fact that women's athletics don't generate money. So even if it isn't a womens hockey team it's scholarships that will cost money in a sport that won't generate enough income to pay for themselves. So in the end it will be a financial liability. Add swimming, lacrosse, bull riding, whatever, the highest cost to adding any women's program is going to be the scholarships. Also add a coach, assistant coaches, training facilities/programs/trainers. Or we could not add a hockey program and therefore not have to pay for the mens and the womens additional scholarship cost plus all the extra's.

The same set of issues exists if you add say 22 football scholarships, so I take it you are not a supporter of that right now either.

[bisonmike2]

The same set of issues exists if you add say 22 football scholarships, so I take it you are not a supporter of that right now either.

not right now but we'll get there eventually. I would much rather have the problem of adding the 22 schollies to an existing sport such as football(and 22 for an unnamed woman's program), then to try and build a hockey program from the ground that will always be second best when compared to UND. Football has its' foundation fully entrenched, facilities and coaches are already in place. Adding hockey would kill us financially and I think many are underestimating the toll it would take on our other winter sports. Regardless of what kind of economy we are in not every family in Fargo/Moorhead can afford to go to Bison home b-ball games. And the same people interested in b-ball are going to be the same fans that you are asking to support hockey. Lots of people not named Lakes are going to choose one event or the other. I feel that hockey would cannibalize the other sports. To think that you can add one and not affect the attendance of the other is foolish.

[lakesbison]

womens swimming or equestrian.

done deal.

quit coming up with excuses NOT to have NDSU hockey!

you sound like ERV inniger talking to GENE taylor!!

[coldspot]

adding hockey right now would take a lot of interest away from our basketball programs and an already barely followed wrestling program. lets get a few years under our belts at D1 before we think about adding another sport/s. give it until 2012 and if the idea comes up again and there is interest and people willing to donate large sums of money to help start the program/s, then go forward with it. plus we gotta get that new bball arena first.



/im working on winning the lottery. would help pay for the bball arena, mens hockey, womens swimming, indoor baseball facility, etc. gotta spend that money so i dont go into depression and commit suicide.

//wishful thinking :blush:

[bisonmike2]

womens swimming or equestrian.

done deal.

quit coming up with excuses NOT to have NDSU hockey!

you sound like ERV inniger talking to GENE taylor!!

you should get a show on the Vegas strip lakes. You'd be the best magician there.

Come see the Amazing Lakesbison!!

Main act. The ability to produce 5,000 extra NDSU fans overnight willing to go to 20 home hockey games a year. But that's not all. Lakes will also increase NDSU basketball attendance to fill the brand new basketball arena.

Second act. Lakes will get TeamMakers to raise an additional $3.5 million a year to pay for it all

Encore - NDSU will move from FCS to FBS in 5 years.

[sambini]

you should get a show on the Vegas strip lakes. You'd be the best magician there.

Come see the Amazing Lakesbison!!

Main act. The ability to produce 5,000 extra NDSU fans overnight willing to go to 20 home hockey games a year. But that's not all. Lakes will also increase NDSU basketball attendance to fill the brand new basketball arena.

Second act. Lakes will get TeamMakers to raise an additional $3.5 million a year to pay for it all

Encore - NDSU will move from FCS to FBS in 5 years.

++++++++++++++++++++++

[roadwarrior]

I have no idea when or if this is going to ever happen, but it is FAR more likely that NDSU will add 22 scholarships to get to the FBS level of football than adding hockey.

[TheDoctor]

Could you also fill it for NDSU Women's hockey? Because you can't have mens hockey without the womens hockey. So now all the money you are making on the men side is being eaten up by the womens hockey, and where does that leave the university? Plus you have to worry about fan fatigue. You say you can get 5000K to a hockey game but what will that do to the B-ball support? They don't even get 5K now, during a season where it was our first in D1 and we all had the goal of going to the big dance. So you're magically going to conjure up 5000 additional NDSU fans to support hockey on a frequent basis and while also increasing support for NDSU b-ball. Also your expecting the city and NDSU to build a new arena. You are crazy. Lakes, please put your enthusiasm for NDSU to better work and start generating more support for basketball and football. Don't waste your time on hockey.


Mike,

I agree. GF is NOT a large enough community to support both basketball and hockey. They will never become a power in basketball because of this. Do we want to sacrifise the sport world renown or a sport that isn't even acknowledged outside a 7 state radius. I'll take basketball. It's extremelt entertaining and cheap (in comparison to hockey)!

[Shawn-O]

Mike,

I agree. GF is NOT a large enough community to support both basketball and hockey. They will never become a power in basketball because of this. Do we want to sacrifise the sport world renown or a sport that isn't even acknowledged outside a 7 state radius. I'll take basketball. It's extremelt entertaining and cheap (in comparison to hockey)!

100% disagree. There is precedent here, UND had great success in both sports during the late 70's and again in the early 90's, so it can be done, and it will be done again.

Yes, college basketball is more popular than college hockey in the US, it's no comparison. But once you start talking about the professional ranks in North America or globally, I'd say it's about a draw.

[tjbison]

You have to add women's scholarships somewhere and it's a fact that women's athletics don't generate money. So even if it isn't a womens hockey team it's scholarships that will cost money in a sport that won't generate enough income to pay for themselves. So in the end it will be a financial liability. Add swimming, lacrosse, bull riding, whatever, the highest cost to adding any women's program is going to be the scholarships. Also add a coach, assistant coaches, training facilities/programs/trainers. Or we could not add a hockey program and therefore not have to pay for the mens and the womens additional scholarship cost plus all the extra's.


I understand all that I was just saying you do not need to add womens hockey which is expensive from what i understand. Some posters have made it to seem like if you add a mens HOCKEY team you also needed a womens team;) ;)

[tjbison]

100% disagree. There is precedent here, UND had great success in both sports during the late 70's and again in the early 90's, so it can be done, and it will be done again.

Yes, college basketball is more popular than college hockey in the US, it's no comparison. But once you start talking about the professional ranks in North America or globally, I'd say it's about a draw.


:confused: Seriously?? NHL hockey can barely get a tv contract, and NBA is on all the damn time, i doubt NBA and NHL are at par for viewership, and until Hammer brings out the statistics i'll say no:D

[Shawn-O]

:confused: Seriously?? NHL hockey can barely get a tv contract, and NBA is on all the damn time, i doubt NBA and NHL are at par for viewership, and until Hammer brings out the statistics i'll say no:D

Both abyssmal, but I see your point. With the distribution contracts in place, the NBA should be trouncing them by a lot more. Your right, the NBA is on all the damn time, but the numbers are close.

http://sportsmediawatch.blogspot.com/2009/01/nbanhl-numbers-game.html

[unbison]

where oooh where is the money going to come from? Road if we go FBS football and add 22 scholarships..... does that not mean we add 44 cuz we would need to add 22 for women as well.... very expensive and we better get competitive at this level first

[Hammersmith]

where oooh where is the money going to come from? Road if we go FBS football and add 22 scholarships..... does that not mean we add 44 cuz we would need to add 22 for women as well.... very expensive and we better get competitive at this level first

We don't necessarily need to add 22 women's scholarships to balance FBS out. NDSU operates under the interests and abilities prong of Title IX, not the proportionality prong.

[unbison]

Well they would have to add something

[Bison bison]

http://legacy.inforum.com/pdfs/HOCKEY11.pdf

[aces1180]

http://legacy.inforum.com/pdfs/HOCKEY11.pdf

What the hell?

Is this real?

Wow!

[TheDoctor]

http://legacy.inforum.com/pdfs/HOCKEY11.pdf

Was there an article to accompanied this pdf??? Like maybe April Fools!!!!!!!!!!!!? ;)

[aces1180]

Was there an article to accompanied this pdf??? Like maybe April Fools!!!!!!!!!!!!? ;)

http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/236793/

I found it.

[TheDoctor]

Ok, I found it. Urban Plains apparently wants to get out of the USHL business because not only did they send a proposal to Moorhead State which included Blais as the coach, but they sent it to NDSU as well. In other words, that proposal was NOT written by NDSU, but rather Midwest Sports Foundation. This makes 100% more sense and firms up NDSU's stance on NOT adding hockey by the fact that they are not even acknowledging the proposal while Moorhead State is holding press conferences to "discuss" the potential move. To me it sounds like they are taking advantage of the free pub. Free pub that we don't need. Read the article:

http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/236793/

"The 14-page plan NDSU received is titled, “North Dakota State University Men’s and Women’s Division I Hockey Plan.” It’s dated March 25."

"To view the proposal given to NDSU and for updates from MSUM’s news conference, go online to www.inforum.com."

[TheDoctor]

:rofl: We both found it! :rofl:

[lakesbison]

NDSU needs to step up and AT LEAST talk to us publicily about this, and not hide.

[TheDoctor]

NDSU needs to step up and AT LEAST talk to us publicily about this, and not hide.

I wouldn't call it hiding, I'd call it not waisting their time on unimportant issues. ;)

[tjbison]

Wjy do they want to crap on the USHL team already???? I'm not Following were the games that bad i thought I heard how they were well attended and now in their first year are in the Playoffs WTF is going on???:confused:

[rustywallace]

I think dean misses the big time and the bigger crowds and the intenisty.

[ndsubison1]

wow i made one little comment on there on how NDSU doesnt need hockey and it would hurt funding for bball/football and now I'm getting attacked left and right about it...

[sambini]

I wouldn't call it hiding, I'd call it not waisting their time on unimportant issues. ;)+++++++++++++++++++++++

[bisonmike2]

I wouldn't call it hiding, I'd call it not waisting their time on unimportant issues. ;)

could not have said in any better. bravo.

[lakesbison]

If no hockey...THEN.U.BETTER.GIVE ME FBS FOOTBALL.,,!!!!

NO EXCUSE!!

[TransAmBison]

If no hockey...THEN.U.BETTER.GIVE ME FBS FOOTBALL.,,!!!!

NO EXCUSE!!
Blah, blah, blah. Let's win at FCS first.

[coldspot]

If no hockey...THEN.U.BETTER.GIVE ME FBS FOOTBALL.,,!!!!

NO EXCUSE!!

you sound like the UND people with their crazy talk about jumping straight to BCS because no conference wants them and their problems.

[lakesbison]

IF NDSU (*Erv/Amy*) are going to turn down GIFT money, ARENA & COACH for Hockey.

Then you better show me FBS Soon!!!

If we're taking the road that Football & Basketball is all we are at NDSU, then LETS STEP IT UP!

SHOW ME!

[Hammersmith]

From the article, I think they approached Concordia as well. The only reason it hasn't been confirmed is because Concordia isn't subject to freedom of information requests like NDSU and MSUM are.

I haven't read through the entire proposal, but I don't think MSF is bailing on the Force. I think, after one year of data, they feel they need TWO major tenants in order to make a decent profit. Trading USHL for a DI program would just put them back where they are right now. Also, I'm getting the impression that Blais is the type of coach that prefers building a program to maintaining one. I think he loves the challenge of creating or rebuilding a team and is somewhat bored after that job is done. Look at his recent past: He rebuilt the Sioux and moved on, he tried the NHL and didn't like it, he's been building the Force and appears to be happy, and he's apparently interesting in building a DI team from scratch in a couple years. By the time MSUM is ready to hire him, the job of building the Force will be finished and he can hand them off to a coach better suited to running the team over the long haul.

As for NDSU, I'm glad Taylor isn't taking the easy way and is doing it the right way instead. The people pushing for hockey aren't large in number, but they are very, very vocal. Rather than giving in to the squeaky wheel, Taylor is standing firm and doing what is best for the long-term health of the athletic department. I can't be the only one that realizes that NDSU is in an extremely vulnerable position right now; probably more vulnerable than we were at the start of the transition.

I see us near the top of the first large hill. We've come a long way, but we haven't made it over the summit. If we slack off at all, we slide right back down to where we started from. That would be devastating. We need to solidify what we have before we can move on. In football, that means several conference championships, nearly annual showings in the playoffs, and at least a couple national championships. In men's basketball, it also means several conference championships plus appearances in the dance with a couple wins and a new arena. All that will take some time. I don't see hockey as even an option until all that is accomplished.

Football and basketball have acted like soldiers advancing on a defended position since the start of transition; one laying down covering fire, while the other advances. It was the football tradition that allowed the raising of the needed funds through priority football seating(Team Makers) to fully fund the basketball program(including a full slate of assistant coaches). That allowed the basketball program to be successful enough to get us into the Summit. Getting into the Summit is what convinced the MVFC that we were in a stable enough position to take a chance on(they wouldn't answer our phone calls before that - slight exaggeration, but mostly true). It will be basketball again that will open up the next door. Adding hockey now will only hurt that progression.

[roadwarrior]

SHOW ME!

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[lakesbison]

Road. I know you know what you know.

BUT maybe the public or the rest of us, WANT TO HEAR OUR LEADERS get in front of a microphone and say something. or BETTER YET.

say "hey teammakers, we aren't pursuing hockey, so are next dream is BBALL arena AND FBS football"

that's not too much to ask.

[roadwarrior]

Our leaders aren't going to announce anything until they are ready to act on it.

[roadwarrior]

I guess I was wrong!

This was posted on the Bison media blog! It has to be true!


NDSU is not interested in developing a hockey program. NDSU is not interested in moving to FBS football at this time but that would happen sooner than D1 hockey on the priority scale.

Posted by: Gene and Joe on 4/10/2009 10:53 AM

[lakesbison]

wrong wrong.

[duluthbison]

Has anyone looked at this article at the forum??? It is NDSU's business/marketing plan for 2009/2010 to bring NDSU into the WCHA and use the Urban Plains Center as its arena.

http://legacy.inforum.com/pdfs/HOCKEY11.pdf

[duluthbison]

Has anyone looked at this article at the forum??? It is NDSU's business/marketing plan for 2009/2010 to bring NDSU into the WCHA and use the Urban Plains Center as its arena.

http://legacy.inforum.com/pdfs/HOCKEY11.pdf

Ok so I got a little ahead of myself....I didn't realize that this was a plan PRESENTED to NDSU and not a plan that our athletics department came up with on their own.

I personally think that NDSU should move up into D1 hockey with MSUM, we would just have to figure out the whole arena situation...

[WYOBISONMAN]

It isn't happening......not in my lifetime......

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q313/therreid1/stop_posting.jpg

;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

[DIBISON]

Road. I know you know what you know.

BUT maybe the public or the rest of us, WANT TO HEAR OUR LEADERS get in front of a microphone and say something. or BETTER YET.

say "hey teammakers, we aren't pursuing hockey, so are next dream is BBALL arena AND FBS football"

that's not too much to ask.

Hey Lakes, read The Forum on Saturday.

Gene Taylor explains why NDSU will not be getting into college hockey.

Once again, without Gene and Joe NDSU would be led down a path of self-destruction.

I agree as I have no interest in NDSU starting hockey to play all of those DII & DIII colleges.

[BisonKent]

While I agree that NDSU needs to sure-up other areas first, I think hockey needs to be part of the long term package. I don't think Moorhead will ever get their program going.

Just doing a little research, DI hockey has the following make-up for their core sports.

35 play DI sports
17 play DII sports
6 play DIII sports

Of note, 13 of DI teams play FBS football and 15 play FCS football. The seven remaining DI's do not play football at all.

Of the DI's, they include state universities like Maine, New Hampshire, Colgate, Holy Cross, and Massachusetts--all of which have made the FCS football playoffs over the past 5 years.

Again, I think this is not the right time to look for hockey but there will be a time in the future as Fargo is right in the midst of a great hockey area.

[ndsubison1]

i seriously cannot stand reading some of the comments on the Forum website anymore... it is so full of NDSU haters and no matter what the article is about NDSU comes up somehow and nearly every one is somehow mocking or bashing NDSU... some ppl need to get a clue...

[unbison]

that might have to do with lakes commenting all over against gophers sioux and who know who else

ps bisonkent fargo is right next to great hockey not in the midst of

[Bisonguy]

Things NDSU has to do before adding hockey:

1) Remodel the BSA
2) Build a BB arena (either Fargodome arena or at the BSA)
3) Indoor practice facility for football, soccer, softball, baseball, etc.
4) Gain membership into the MoValley
5) Move to FBS with the MoValley
6) On-campus golf course
7) Skywalk to connect all buildings from Albrecht to University


Then, finally, build a hockey arena with a velodrome surrounding the rink and start a DI hockey program.

[beatle76]

A comprimise we can all agree on:
1. Move the football program up to FBS
2. Create a women's hockey program to satisfy the uneven scholarship problem AND give NDSU D1 hockey (I assume nobody on Bisonville is sexist and wants a women's hockey team as well)
3. Rebuild Taco Bell on 19th Ave North to twice the original size



Okay so only one of those options would really satisfy everyone's needs.

[ndsubison1]

A comprimise we can all agree on:
1. Move the football program up to FBS
2. Create a women's hockey program to satisfy the uneven scholarship problem AND give NDSU D1 hockey (I assume nobody on Bisonville is sexist and wants a women's hockey team as well)
3. Rebuild Taco Bell on 19th Ave North to twice the original size



Okay so only one of those options would really satisfy everyone's needs.

amen... :cheers:

[tony]

A comprimise we can all agree on:
1. Move the football program up to FBS
2. Create a women's hockey program to satisfy the uneven scholarship problem AND give NDSU D1 hockey (I assume nobody on Bisonville is sexist and wants a women's hockey team as well)
3. Rebuild Taco Bell on 19th Ave North to twice the original size and connect it to campus by light rail.



Okay so only one of those options would really satisfy everyone's needs.

Quoted for embellishment.

[BisonAccountant44]

Things NDSU has to do before adding hockey:

1) Remodel the BSA
2) Build a BB arena (either Fargodome arena or at the BSA)
3) Rebuild Taco Bell on 19th Ave North to twice the original size.
4) Indoor practice facility for football, soccer, softball, baseball, etc.
5) Gain full membership into the MoValley
6) New FB stadium to support increased attendance for FBS move.
7) Move to FBS with the MoValley
8) Skyways to connect all buildings from Albrecht to University and 12th to 19th including tunnels to Taco Bell, BWW, the Turf.
9) On-campus golf course.
10) Any other pipe dreams.

Then, finally, build a hockey arena with a velodrome surrounding the rink and start a DI hockey program.

Here's how my list would look :D ;) :nod:

[duluthbison]

:offtopic::offtopic:
R.I.P. Taco Bell 19th Ave North :(

[ndsubison1]

Quoted for embellishment.

lol, that would be a dream come true

[tony]

:offtopic::offtopic:
R.I.P. Taco Bell 19th Ave North :(

Still off topic: According to the City of Fargo site, the Taco Bell folks have started the permit process for rebuilding.

[roadwarrior]

:offtopic::offtopic:
R.I.P. Taco Bell 19th Ave North :(

More off topic: the walls are going up on the replacement.

[TheDoctor]

More off topic: the walls are going up on the replacement.

replacement walls for the Colliseum? Essentially a right off campus hockey arena for NDSU hockey? :banghead: Oh great! I never ever thought we'd see the day that NDSU adds hockey and now Road is breaking the news that the walls are being constructed. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: ;)

[unbison]

I thought he was talking about taco bell

[TheDoctor]

I am sure the story will be up on the inforum shortly. You heard it here first folks, the great RoadWarrior broke the news today. NDSU WILL be adding hockey and the off campus issues of an arena have been solved. The dated and troubled Colliseum located a couple blocks from the BSA has been demolished and the walls of the replacement arena have begun to be constructed, whitnessed today one Road Warrior! Finally this thread is BACK on topic! :rofl: ;)

[unbison]

well... as i have stated before that is the normal transgression of a conversation to wonder on and off topic

[TheDoctor]

well... as i have stated before that is the normal transgression of a conversation to wonder on and off topic

I know...I know....just having a little fun with those to get bent out of shape about the derailment of a thread. ;)

[TheBisonator]

The new Taco Bell should be completed by this fall, I believe.

JUST IN TIME FOR FOOTBALL SEASON!!!

[skolbrother]

This thread irritates me. To those who say support club hockey first. I will tell you that many of us remember the late 80's & NDSU club hockey drawing a sold out coliseum for most games.

Additionally, I hear a number of people say scholarships, its not fiscally workable, its all about the money. Fine, lets use those paramenters. Is wrestling sustaining itself? How about baseball?
Oh? They're not? Really? Cut them, then.
To which the response becomes emotional "oh, you can't do that to Bucky."
Huh... I thought this was all about the fiscal argument? Help me.

Some of you hate and quite possibly, RESENT hockey. Many love the speed and excitment. Either way try to remain logical. The facts are regionally hockey is huge. Globally it trails only soccer. Nationally it lags. It is obvious what my opinion is but please have your facts be accurate and arguments be consistent.

[56BISON73]

The new Taco Bell should be completed by this fall, I believe.

JUST IN TIME FOR FOOTBALL SEASON!!!

WOW Now thats something to celebrate and look forward to.:D

[DIBISON]

WOW Now thats something to celebrate and look forward to.:D

Almost everybody has had a taco but very few have been to a college hockey game!!

[NDSUstudent]

This thread irritates me. To those who say support club hockey first. I will tell you that many of us remember the late 80's & NDSU club hockey drawing a sold out coliseum for most games.

Additionally, I hear a number of people say scholarships, its not fiscally workable, its all about the money. Fine, lets use those paramenters. Is wrestling sustaining itself? How about baseball?
Oh? They're not? Really? Cut them, then.
To which the response becomes emotional "oh, you can't do that to Bucky."
Huh... I thought this was all about the fiscal argument? Help me.

Some of you hate and quite possibly, RESENT hockey. Many love the speed and excitment. Either way try to remain logical. The facts are regionally hockey is huge. Globally it trails only soccer. Nationally it lags. It is obvious what my opinion is but please have your facts be accurate and arguments be consistent.

Pretty sure hockey trails basketball globally by a long shot, maybe even baseball as well.

I like hockey and I think a mens program could do ok here, but if the team isn't a winner it has the potential to negatively affect the entire athletic department. Sports like baseball and wrestling don't need the type of budget hockey needs to survive. Both of those sports also don't require the most worthless and expensive program around to be added, womens hockey.

[ndsubison1]

college hockey would be a huge money drain, yeah you can give me the "UND makes money" argument, but it will take decades for us to do that. With title ix and the economy right now it would not be a smart idea... plenty of other sports need funding (see basketball facilities)... bball is on the rise and has the most potential of any college sport. That's what we're trying to build right now. Also, we already have these other minor sports in place... why get rid of them to add hockey, something we dont already have? College hockey even lags behind college baseball in terms of exposure and popularity... might as well add a lacrosse team if we add hockey... we're one of a few D1 college baseball programs here in the upper midwest, unlike D1 hockey. We already have a phenomenal facility for our baseball program and ND/MN field some pretty decent baseball talent. Recruiting would be tough to start with the other schools up here and one of the best hockey programs not far from here. When we talk money that's exactly what we mean... things cost money and that's virtually what it comes down to... hockey could be good for our school, but not in 2009 or even the near future... Just how I feel

[TheDoctor]

Bucky's program is almost fully endowed. He did just incase the funding for wrestling was ever nonexistant. ;)

[56BISON73]

Almost everybody has had a taco but very few have been to a college hockey game!!


:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: