Summit League Bracket

[roadwarrior]

#1 Oral Roberts #8 Centenary Sat 6pm
#4 Southern Utah #5 IPFW Sun 6pm
Winners meet monday at 6pm

#2 IUPUI #7 UMKC Sat 8:30pm
#3 Oakland #6 WIU Sun 8:30pm
Winners meet monday at 8:30pm

Conference Championship Tues 6pm ESPN

[NDSUstudent]

My Predictions...

ORU over Cent.
IPFW over SUU
IUPUI over UMKC
Oakland over WIU

ORU over IPFW
Oakland over IUPUI

ORU over Oakland

ORU has a nice draw, I think that will give them an upperhand because they aren't exactly rolling right now but Centenary and IPFW are exactly what they need to get back on track. With that said, I could see Oakland getting hot and taking the title. They probably have the best combination of shooting and athleticism that I have seen in the Summit but can also be inconsistent(they lost to SUU and IPFW at home).

[onbison09]

Is that on Summit TV I'm assuming? (the earlier rounds)

[tjbison]

Yes it is! you can buy single games or the whole thing

[ndsubison1]

How long is Jarvis out?

[lakesbison]

I Heard They Are Gona Gamble And Hold Him Out Til Tuesdays Championship . . .which I Think Is Da Best Plan. . . They Are A Diff Team Without Him

[extremerouge]

if ORU does not win the summit league title will they still go to the NCAA tournament?

discuss

[Mr. Burgundy]

After losing to Creighton and NDSU, I think they are OUT, unless they win the conf tourney. They had an RPI of about 50 prior to those losses....I can't imagine that didn't drop significantly now.

[lakesbison]

yea, burgandy.. I cant see them making it if they lose in summit league.

George Hill is dam good, but I just don't see IUPUI beating Oral... should be a sweet game next tuesday.

Burgandy... maybe have to postponed (LENNON) party at your house tuesday??

[TheDoctor]

Jarvis was limping bad when he walked in the boot on Saturday. They also got two more injured during the game. ORU is banged up folks and they will NOT get in without a tourney campionship. The selection committee takes into account injuries (remember when Cincinati got a 2 seed because KMart was injured in the tournament coampionship game, they didn't even lose). IUPUI took them down at full strength and I believe will take them down at 1/2 strength as well. ;)

[Jdubs21]

no chance in hell they will be in the tourney w/o the championship...the summit league will prolly never send 2 teams to the tourney

[tmh8286]

Good points, guys. I believe ORU is VERY vulnerable at this point. As a seven seed Oakland beat us in the championship three years ago, so anything is possible. There's a good chance we'll struggle against IUPUI, if they make it to the championship. I'm betting they don't.

I THINK NDSUstudent is right, Centenary and IPFW SHOULD be winnable games for us, even if we're short-handed. I worry about our chances in the championship against a full strength Oakland or IUPUI. According to Oakland's board, it is still a question whether Cassise makes the trip to Tulsa. He's given ORU fits in the past, and both of our wins against them this year came when Cassise was out.

ORU was probably never truly a bubble team, but the loss to Creighton sealed any sort of chance that we might be considered for an at-large bid. The loss to NDSU was icing on the cake in that regard. The bright spot for us is that the recent guidelines for the NIT include selecting teams that won their regular season championships, but lost in their conference tournaments. So we should be playing SOMEWHERE, win or lose in the conference tournament.

You guys should be bringing back a great team next year - you had a senior night with no seniors! How about that! I'm looking forward to a great rivalry developing between our programs. Yours is clearly a class program looking to improve and get better, something that not all conference teams have done. Next year your second-year coach may have your team duking it out for the conference championship. That would be pretty amazing, all things considered.

[BisBison]

no chance in hell they will be in the tourney w/o the championship...the summit league will prolly never send 2 teams to the tourney

never is a long time Jdubs

[Jdubs21]

never is a long time Jdubs

it is...but its tougher than one would think...ACC, Big 12, Pac-10, Big East usually have 5-8 teams outta them every year, and i hate to be pessimistic, but it will be a cold day in hell when the summit reaches that level...and to clear that up, im not saying some of our teams cant compete with theirs....but overall our confrence is not strong at all

[TheDoctor]

I am sad we are not allowed to play in the tourney this year. I really feel we have a shot right now. We had IUPUI against the ropes and ORU is banged up. This would be a perfect opportunity. While our ladies finished better in the league then the men, the ladies would lose to SDSU 10/10 guaranteed. We can't say that about the men. We finished strong I guess and thats a nice spring board into next year. We did finish strong last year though and took a 1/2 a season to get warmed up this year. I can tell you this, I am booking my rooms for Sioux Falls next week! CAN'T WAIT! ;)

[Bison bison]

never is a long time Jdubs

i agree.

if ORU would have beaten creighton and ndsu. and lost a nail biter in the final, they would have had a chance.

there rpi would have been in the high 40's, low 50's (no superstar wins though).

[TheBisonator]

i agree.

if ORU would have beaten creighton and ndsu. and lost a nail biter in the final, they would have had a chance.

there rpi would have been in the high 40's, low 50's (no superstar wins though).

I agree. The Bubble Watch columnist at ESPN.com (Jay Bilas??) was talking about ORU's at-large chances if they swept the remainder before losing a tight one to IUPUI in the Summit Championship. But ORU needs the autobid now.

[onbison09]

Courtesy of ESPN.com:Oral Roberts (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/clubhouse?teamId=198) [20-8 (16-2), RPI: 62, SOS: 146] If the last-second BracketBusters home loss to Creighton didn't end this debate, the season-ending loss at North Dakota State :) :) did. The Golden Eagles still don't have a top-50 win and now they have two league losses. ORU beat Oklahoma State, but whiffed on every other big chance in nonconference play (losses to Texas A&M, Arkansas and Texas).
Definitley have to win Summit Tourney.

[Jdubs21]

whats our RPI now?

[Hammersmith]

whats our RPI now?

Officially, 193. The NCAA will release the final RPI after the conference tourneys are over.

[ndsubison1]

I'll take IUPUI over Oral Roberts in the ship

[Mr. Burgundy]

A healthy Oral Roberts rolls to the title. Sidenote, other than Oral Roberts graduating a few key players, it sounds like the other two teams that beat us in the Summit return their core players. Should be interesting next year.

[roadwarrior]

Oral Roberts 84 Centenary 56
IPFW 66 Southern Utah 62

ORU vs IPFW monday at 6pm

IUPUI 69 UMKC 65
#3 Oakland #6 WIU Sun 8:30pm
Winners meet monday at 8:30pm

Conference Championship Tues 6pm ESPN

[SDbison]

Why isn't NDSU in the conference tournament? Sorry, had to post it. Again, got to love the punitive system adopted by the NCAA (yes, for all you who love stupid rules, NDSU agreed to them, what was their option, not move up). So one of the better teams is left out. In fact, NDSU finishing in the top half of the conference means they did more with less. There was no benefits to being a transition team. In fact the odds were against them. Only a few years since competing at a lower level with slower and less talented athletes NDSU over-achieved. Their reward - no post season elligibiity. I don't understand, why can't they participate in the conference tournament, just not be eligible for the NCAA tourney? I guess the NCAA just doesn't want to have to say sorry, you were the best in the conference, you overcame all sorts of disadvantages, did no wrong, yet we can't let you in. Too bad, because the only real loser here is the student athlete that is denied reaching their highest potential
accomplishment. Thanks to you NCAA, you bring out the best, well almost!

[IndyBison]

Why isn't NDSU in the conference tournament? Sorry, had to post it. Again, got to love the punitive system adopted by the NCAA (yes, for all you who love stupid rules, NDSU agreed to them, what was their option, not move up). So one of the better teams is left out. In fact, NDSU finishing in the top half of the conference means they did more with less. There was no benefits to being a transition team. In fact the odds were against them. Only a few years since competing at a lower level with slower and less talented athletes NDSU over-achieved. Their reward - no post season elligibiity. I don't understand, why can't they participate in the conference tournament, just not be eligible for the NCAA tourney? I guess the NCAA just doesn't want to have to say sorry, you were the best in the conference, you overcame all sorts of disadvantages, did no wrong, yet we can't let you in. Too bad, because the only real loser here is the student athlete that is denied reaching their highest potential
accomplishment. Thanks to you NCAA, you bring out the best, well almost!
Not 100% certain but the reason these barriers are there are to prevent just anyone from making the move. There's a lot of money shared at the higher levels regardless of individual team success so if there were no barriers to entry, the Mayvilles and Minots of the world would make the move as well. By adding these barriers, it makes schools think long and hard about making the jump.

[SDbison]

Not 100% certain but the reason these barriers are there are to prevent just anyone from making the move. There's a lot of money shared at the higher levels regardless of individual team success so if there were no barriers to entry, the Mayvilles and Minots of the world would make the move as well. By adding these barriers, it makes schools think long and hard about making the jump.
I call BS. There are plenty of non-punitive (to the student athlete)
barriers that could be placed to prevent just any school from jumping:
1. Require athletic budgets be a certain size (already done, but increase as necessary)
2. Require a higher number of sports are offered (already done, but could require a higher percentage of max scholarships are provided)
3. Place a multi year exemption from being able to share in NCAA tourney revenues once a team moves up.
4. Add other requirements to demonstrate a university is right sized and athletically and academically well positioned prior to granting a bump up.

See there are possible solutions.......ones that would assure another Florida commuter school that doesn't give a rip about academics doesn't become DI overnight. Too bad the NCAA took the old school, simplistic and punitive route.

[BisonBlogger]

IndyBison is correct to bring the money issue into the question about the probationary period. Any win in the NCAA basketball tournament by a team in the conference means a huge pay check for all conference teams. There has to be a reason for hesitation for teams to try to move up. It's brutal being an indepenent.

Just so you know, it hasn't been that many years ago that the probationary period was 13 years instead of the current 5.

I know it is hard for the NDSU players to sit this post season out again this year but the good news is that it is done. It will be ancient history for all the new athletes coming into the program.

[Hammersmith]

I call BS. There are plenty of non-punitive (to the student athlete)
barriers that could be placed to prevent just any school from jumping:
1. Require athletic budgets be a certain size (already done, but increase as necessary)
2. Require a higher number of sports are offered (already done, but could require a higher percentage of max scholarships are provided)
3. Place a multi year exemption from being able to share in NCAA tourney revenues once a team moves up.
4. Add other requirements to demonstrate a university is right sized and athletically and academically well positioned prior to granting a bump up.

See there are possible solutions.......ones that would assure another Florida commuter school that doesn't give a rip about academics doesn't become DI overnight. Too bad the NCAA took the old school, simplistic and punitive route.
And I'm sure some of those are being considered as we speak. That's one of the main purposes of the 4-year moritorium. Also, I believe it was the Summit that excluded us from the conference tourney, not the NCAA. What would've happened if NDSU and SDSU had both made it to the finals(WBB or MBB)? Who would have gotten the autobid? Would they have hastily scheduled a third place game between the semifinal losers? Or what if only one made it to the finals and won it all? Does the autobid go to the loser in the final or the semifinal? They both lost to the champion. Putting teams into the tourney that can't accept the autobid just creates a whole slew of headaches that can't easily be resolved.

As for some of your points, budgets are dangerous to use as benchmarks due to the huge differences it tuition costs between schools. Also, it leads you into repeated debates on the subject because the number would have to be updated every couple years due to inflation. Adding additional sports requirements would have the effect of stretching the non-revenue sports budgets out even further. The NCAA doesn't decide how the BB tourney revenue is distributed to the individual schools; the money is given to the conference, who then divides it among their members. There are ways around every problem I just mentioned, but it would make the already complicated reclassification process all the worse.

[roadwarrior]

Oral Roberts 84 Centenary 56
IPFW 66 Southern Utah 62

ORU vs IPFW monday at 6pm

IUPUI 69 UMKC 65
#3 Oakland #6 WIU Sun 8:30pm
Winners meet monday at 8:30pm

Conference Championship Tues 6pm ESPN

[TheBisonator]

Why isn't NDSU in the conference tournament? Sorry, had to post it. Again, got to love the punitive system adopted by the NCAA (yes, for all you who love stupid rules, NDSU agreed to them, what was their option, not move up). So one of the better teams is left out. In fact, NDSU finishing in the top half of the conference means they did more with less. There was no benefits to being a transition team. In fact the odds were against them. Only a few years since competing at a lower level with slower and less talented athletes NDSU over-achieved. Their reward - no post season elligibiity. I don't understand, why can't they participate in the conference tournament, just not be eligible for the NCAA tourney? I guess the NCAA just doesn't want to have to say sorry, you were the best in the conference, you overcame all sorts of disadvantages, did no wrong, yet we can't let you in. Too bad, because the only real loser here is the student athlete that is denied reaching their highest potential
accomplishment. Thanks to you NCAA, you bring out the best, well almost!

You know who's REALLY to blame for all this?? not the NCAA. It's:

1) L.D. Loftsgard - President 1968-1987 <---He was prez for 20 damn years and did nothing about this??
2) Robert Koob - President 1987-1988
3) J.L. Ozbun - President 1988-1995
4) Thomas R. Plough - President 1995-1998
5) Allan G. Fischer - President 1998-1999
6) Robert Entzion - Athletic Director 199?-2002
7) A few more athletic directors before Entzion whose names I cannot recall

These men couldn't see the shit piling up in front of their own faces. Plough and Entzion saw Moorhead State move into our division in the 90's and it didn't even make a neurological or synapse reaction in their brain. Countless schools abandoned the sinking D2 ship from 1973 to the 90's and none of these men even had any reaction to it. We ended up in playoff games against former NAIA's Pittsburg State and Shippensburg by the 90's and nobody at the top even said, "Hmm, ya know, something's wrong with us playing all these schools that are 1/3 the size of us!!"

No. Blame it on 25 years of shitty leadership. The NCAA was merely the giver of the consequences for having that leadership.

[TheBisonator]

Here's another honest question for you guys. And it probably applies to all of you since you're alums who are older than I am, at least.:) :

When you were going to school at NDSU at least in the 1980's or 1990's, and you saw how our athletic teams did with the crowds they drew and the talent they had, etc., did you ever ask yourself at that time, "Hmm, I wonder why we aren't Division I?" Did you ask yourself why the NCC we were in wasn't a Mid-Major DI conference like the Mid-Con or Missouri Valley??

Think about it.

[roadwarrior]

ORU 84 Centenary 56
IPFW 66 Southern Utah 62

IUPUI 69 UMKC 65
Oakland 80 WIU 66

ORU vs IPFW monday at 6pm
IUPUI vs Oakland monday at 8:30pm

Conference Championship Tues 6pm ESPN

[lakesbison]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's another honest question for you guys. And it probably applies to all of you since you're alums who are older than I am, at least. :

When you were going to school at NDSU at least in the 1980's or 1990's, and you saw how our athletic teams did with the crowds they drew and the talent they had, etc., did you ever ask yourself at that time, "Hmm, I wonder why we aren't Division I?" Did you ask yourself why the NCC we were in wasn't a Mid-Major DI conference like the Mid-Con or Missouri Valley??

Think about it.


NOPE THEY WERE JUST HAPPY TO BE THE BIG DOG in DIV 2.

sad huh... I agree, I remember sitting on campus in mid 90's and thinking, this is ridiculous, lets play Division 1, maybe that's why Im so excited about going to FBS ASAP!!

[lakesbison]

who's watching the games tonight?? any place have them on air? or just tuesday's night game at BW3's huh.

[BisBison]

ORU 84 Centenary 56
IPFW 66 Southern Utah 62

IUPUI 69 UMKC 65
Oakland 80 WIU 66

ORU vs IPFW monday at 6pm
IUPUI vs Oakland monday at 8:30pm

Conference Championship Tues 6pm ESPN

Road, are all the times listed central times?

[NDSUstudent]

Watching the ORU-IPFW game on ESPN Full Court right now and ORU is down by 5 with about 10 minutes to go.

I also have to add that the arena in Tulsa looks pretty cool, probably the perfect type of venue for the tourney.

[NDSUstudent]

ORU is back in control, they are on a 19-2 run and look to be headed to the title game.

[Mr. Burgundy]

any updates on that game? ORU is having some problems scoring?

[NDSUstudent]

any updates on that game? ORU is having some problems scoring?

Jarvis is playing for ORU and looks ok. With that said, they are are shooting poorly. Probably lucky that they are playing IPFW right now in round two and not a team like NDSU or Oakland.

[NDSUstudent]

Fife just got T'd up, ORU is up 10 with a 1:32 left to play. This one is over.

[NDSUstudent]

ORU wins 58-42 over IPFW. Jarvis scored 18 points, with 16 of those 18 coming in the second half.

[Mr. Burgundy]

Fife against Sutton? MY OH MY. I love those guys. Talk about intense. Love that on the bench.

[bisonpride4ever]

wow what a tale of two halves ORU was terrible in the first half. IPFW actually was allowing ORU to stay close in the first half with some poor shot selection in the first half. Jarvis was bad in the first half. ORU finally got going and it was over. that's what a good team does is win when the ugly ones. on to Oakland-IUPUI

[onbison09]

IUPUI vs. Oakland on ESPN 360 for free!!!!!!!! (it should be if you have the right brower or something but it beats paying for it.) (Don't quote me on this b/c I'm not sure) Not sure how. www.espn360.com (http://www.espn360.com) :bow: :bow:

[NDSUstudent]

Just saw some highlights of Woody and Winks and the rest of the All-Summit League 1st team.

[IndyBison]

who's watching the games tonight?? any place have them on air? or just tuesday's night game at BW3's huh.

Both games are on the Fox Sports channel here in Indy. They announced all the affiliates showing the games and they listed one for every team in the conference except the Dakota schools (obviously since they aren't playing). That should be a good sign for next year although I expect a lot of you to make the short trip to Sioux Falls.

I saw the first half of the IPFW-ORU game and ORU couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. They hit two late baskets just to get to 24-17! I didn't see any of the second half because I had to get the kids to bed.

They showed a promotional video for each school during the game and I saw the NDSU video. It's the same one I saw during the UM game and the football games this Fall. Very nice video. It reminded me though that you all talk funny up there. You'll deny it but since I moved away 15 years ago, I've realized we have an accent. While Indiana is relatively south, it is by no means southern but when I'm home people ask me where I got my southern accent. It's all relative.

Go Bison!! I can't wait until next year.

[IndyBison]

Just saw some highlights of Woody and Winks and the rest of the All-Summit League 1st team.

I saw that too. Interesting that only 1 of the highlights was in BSA. They must not have had a lot of footage from games in Fargo.

[onbison09]

What time does the game start?

[NDSUstudent]

I saw that too. Interesting that only 1 of the highlights was in BSA. They must not have had a lot of footage from games in Fargo.

Looked like most of our highlights came from the UMKC game in Kemper. Too bad they didn't get Woody's layup against ORU or Wink's ally-oop dunk against Colorado State.

[onbison09]

Just had highlights of all the women's award winners and had a lot of Lisa Bue on! Pretty fun to see.

[Bisonguy]

Both games are on the Fox Sports channel here in Indy. They announced all the affiliates showing the games and they listed one for every team in the conference except the Dakota schools (obviously since they aren't playing). That should be a good sign for next year although I expect a lot of you to make the short trip to Sioux Falls.

I saw the first half of the IPFW-ORU game and ORU couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. They hit two late baskets just to get to 24-17! I didn't see any of the second half because I had to get the kids to bed.

They showed a promotional video for each school during the game and I saw the NDSU video. It's the same one I saw during the UM game and the football games this Fall. Very nice video. It reminded me though that you all talk funny up there. You'll deny it but since I moved away 15 years ago, I've realized we have an accent. While Indiana is relatively south, it is by no means southern but when I'm home people ask me where I got my southern accent. It's all relative.

Go Bison!! I can't wait until next year.


Hoosier Twang!!!!

[onbison09]

Did ESPN 360 just go funky for anyone else?

[IndyBison]

Hoosier Twang!!!!

We do have our share of red-necks in this state. After all we do border Kentucky! Indiana has earned it's #42 education ranking!! Fortunately my kids' school does much better.

[onbison09]

We do have our share of red-necks in this state. After all we do border Kentucky! Indiana has earned it's #42 education ranking!! Fortunately my kids' school does much better.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Anyways anyone else having trouble with ESPN 360? I click on "go live" and it goes to the beginning.

[NDSUstudent]

37-33 IUPUI at the half.

[onbison09]

Game on 669 on DirecTV!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CarringtonBison]

Pretty weak crowd, I would tend to believe that we would draw more than that....

[NDSUstudent]

Not looking good for Oakland, down by 7 with 3:30

Looks like one of those games for Oakland, shots not falling and poor ball movement on offense.

[NDSUstudent]

IUPUI wins 80-65. Should be a great one tomorrow night on ESPN.

[roadwarrior]

Men's semifinal games:

ORU 58 IPFW 42
IUPUI 80 Oakland 65

Championship today at 6pm on ESPN.

Same teams in both men's and women's final.

[extremerouge]

half an hour til game time...does anyone have any predictions?

[TheBisonator]

Goddammit... I'm here at work until 8pm, stuck in the Memorial Union. I hope the thing's still going on when I get back home. Is there anyway I can see it on free webcast??

[NDSUstudent]

Goddammit... I'm here at work until 8pm, stuck in the Memorial Union. I hope the thing's still going on when I get back home. Is there anyway I can see it on free webcast??

You could try....

http://www.channelsurfing.net/

[TheBisonator]

You could try....

http://www.channelsurfing.net/

The computer I'm on doesn't support the video for the webcast, and this is my boss' computer, so I don't want to mess around with it by changing up stuff...

[Mr. Burgundy]

ORU was favored by 3.5.....and are up 4 at half. Favored by 1.5 in the second half (If you are into that stuff.....). They were up 10 for a while, IUPUI is playing hard. George Hill has two fouls.

Fun to watch though. Oh, the ORU crowd is crap. They are in TULSA....It should be NUTS!!!!! I can't imagine Sioux Falls next year. We will have 90% of the place. It will be crazy. Too bad SDSU won't be playing in the tourney, it would have been fun to dominate them again.

[TheBisonator]

ORU was favored by 3.5.....and are up 4 at half. Favored by 1.5 in the second half (If you are into that stuff.....).

If you're into that stuff, you need to call 211...:D

[Mr. Burgundy]

47-42 ORU. 13:25 to play.

[TheBisonator]

I might close up the office a few minutes early tonight...

[TheBisonator]

Anyone got a score and time? I'm fixin' to get outta here...

[NDSUstudent]

ORU-66
IUPUI-59

1:20 to go

[TheBisonator]

ORU-66
IUPUI-59

1:20 to go

1:20????? F**k, I missed the whole damn thing.

Why did it have to start at 6pm??????

[NDSUstudent]

ORU wins the Summit League Tourney and we'll most likely get a 13 or 14 seed.

[TheBisonator]

ORU wins the Summit League Tourney and we'll most likely get a 13 or 14 seed.

Hopefully a 13. Joe Lunardi has had them as a 13 for a couple months now.

[NDSUstudent]

As of right now he has them as a 13 and going up against Wisconsin.

[Mr. Burgundy]

Win by 7.....Nice. Cheah......

[SlickVic]

Win by 7.....Nice. Cheah......

had the iupui money line parlayed with the under...needless to say i got robbed...how about those commenators talking about how calm cool and composed sutton is tho hahaha those comments were well worth the 2 hundo i lost

[ndsubison1]

Anyone think ORU can pull off 1 or 2 wins in the tourney?

[onbison09]

Win by 7.....Nice. Cheah......
Game was a lot closer than that.